rklontz Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 That's because two threads, in the Begeren Colony server forums that this thread post is copying, have been "deleted" by Customer Service as violations to forum policies. Which, by "deleted", I mean moved to a separate section of the forums only accessible and viewable by administrators in order to keep the post count the threads bring. I mean, if you want to believe I made up that post above, then go right ahead. I can't really convince CS to unlock a thread to prove you wrong, but if you read into Almar's posts in relation to me, you can tell he's already had an extensive argument with me with his "I'm done arguing with this Zoo guy". And since you don't really see him extensively and directly arguing with me in this thread, how can he be tired of arguing with me if this is the only place that I, apparently, argued the issue? Oh, and another point, when a redirection tells you "You do not have permission to access this thread", that means there is a thread that exists. The redirect would be completely different if I had just made it up. Finally, this isn't "meaningless banter". I'm sorry you find being wrong to be an attack or insult, but it's not my fault you choose to argue with emotion instead of reason. Because last time I checked, "you're not being harassed", "you are violating the ToS yourself by responding with insults", and "you're the problem if a troll is so successful" relates to the original post where the person is trying to gain sympathy for being "bullied" by another guild. I read the thread in the BC forum and like here you were the one that instantly went on the attack. How exactly am I wrong when I just simply pointed out facts? You obviously did not read the first post in this thread or the one in the BC thread and are the one responding with emotion. I had no emotional involvement with my post just simple reading, comprehension and basic observation skills was used. If what the OP was saying is true he was indeed being harassed, the people that were doing the harassing were indeed violating the ToS (which EA talked to them about). The only factual statement that you have made that relates to this thread is "you're the problem if a troll is so successful". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rklontz Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 This person presented evidence in the first thread, detailing whispers being shared with the "offending party" where they were responding with just as much childish banter and trash talking to them. Personally, after reading the comments and the manner of demanding CS attention in a public server forum along with it being presented in multiple areas now, I have no pity. As: -You are not being harassed. Inescapable conduct is not being proven by evidence regarding the offending party, you've actually shown screenshots in the first thread detailing your members fighting back. -You claim that they alone should be punished, refusing to acknowledge the point that you are also breaking the very same rules of "don't insult other members" as if the ToS states "you are not allowed to insult other members, but you can do it if someone else starts insulting you first." -You are making a matter that should be expressed in a well written and private ticket to Customer Service in the open server forums, attempting to present your case to the public as if your guild is a victim of another's. -You are attempting to argue on the thread in the BC forums that cyber bullying causes very negative repercussions, when it actually doesn't unless a personal connection IRL is being exploited or the "offending party" is attempting to make one, which warrants immediate CS intervention. In addition to your one support's attempt to compare the actions of the "offending party" to that of the completely different concept that is known as rape, I really hope CS deletes this thread as well as the others. Get some thick skin, stop being overly sensitive, and be mature. Follow the process they outline, and if they step over the line, then CS will handle it. Until then, you have to treat the matter with a mature attitude. The only reason why they are actually so invasive in your actions is because your reaction gains them entertainment. If you stop feeding them attention, they'll eventually grow tired and bored of it and leave you alone. The last 2 paragraphs are the only things relating to this thread the rest is conjecture and hearsay with no factual evidence to validate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZooMzy Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 (edited) I read the thread in the BC forum and like here you were the one that instantly went on the attack. How exactly am I wrong when I just simply pointed out facts? You obviously did not read the first post in this thread or the one in the BC thread and are the one responding with emotion. I had no emotional involvement with my post just simple reading, comprehension and basic observation skills was used. If what the OP was saying is true he was indeed being harassed, the people that were doing the harassing were indeed violating the ToS (which EA talked to them about). The only factual statement that you have made that relates to this thread is "you're the problem if a troll is so successful". Lol, because you didn't point out any facts? You stated that because you can't access the first thread, somehow, it doesn't exist. The thread you read on BC was a duplicate of the original deleted thread, only this time, the OP realized he made his guild look childish with screenshot evidence of whispers between one of their members and the other party. Thus, decided to leave them out the second and with this thread, third time around. Again, I'm sorry I can't get CS to unlock the thread just to prove you wrong, and if you want to believe that you're undeniably correct in your ignorant assumption, then go right ahead. It still doesn't change the fact you actually have a point that is wrong based on the context of the text from each party in that former thread indicating the discussion had taken place before, and proof that the CS backed my argument that they were violating the forum policy again by recreating and revisiting a topic they deemed inappropriate, having deleted the thread where you could see said context being repeated on both sides. Sorry you didn't have access to the same material I did. Next time, you should make sure you get your research in before you start assuming I'm making stories and points up. Because they are still relevant to the topic at hand, considering this is a continuation of the original complaint thread. The last 2 paragraphs are the only things relating to this thread the rest is conjecture and hearsay with no factual evidence to validate it. How about the factual evidence regarding the topic's multiple deletion indicating that their post actually isn't really a reputable subject? Haven't seen you try to argue against that. Maybe you should try countering that point instead of questioning anecdotal evidence in a philosophical type argument as if you're going to prove something other than the fact that you have no idea what you're even debating about or, perhaps, who you are defending? Edited June 1, 2014 by ZooMzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subach Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 You're aware what "LARP" means, right? By definition, it's impossible to do in a computer game. Seriously, though...how silly of them to try to RP in an MMO*****RP*****G. Especially on a designated ****RP SERVER****. Yeah, that's right. Hide behind your little letters and genre classifications. See where that gets you in life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlrikFassbauer Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Yeah, that's right. Hide behind your little letters and genre classifications. See where that gets you in life. Hiding behind genre classifications ? Are you living behind the moon ? Or did you never play any offline game ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horrorfaneightys Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Yeah, that's right. Hide behind your little letters and genre classifications. See where that gets you in life. They're not hiding behind letters, just pointing out facts. Like you can't live-action role play in a video game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superman_AZ Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 (edited) I'm sorry Superman but the OP did in fact break several rules. This thread is reincarnation of two separate threads one that was posted in the CS forums and on the Bergen Colony forum. The one in the CS had screenshots including several names which is a direct violation of forum rules. It was removed. You have only seen this thread so you are actually not in a position to say if he did or did not commit any wrong doing. But I will say that you passive aggressive attack on another player is also unnecessary. That player simply pointed out that the whole situation is filled with drama and that their are tools to deal with it. One other thing, that is NOT mod complex. That is simply informing of what the necessary tools are. So TWO other threads violated the rules, but this one did not. I would say I am spot on since this thread is the only one I mentioned. Also, there is nothing passive aggressive about being blunt. I would love to tell her exactly what I think of her, but it would just be an unnecessary repeat of last summer when I went off on another female player who loved to shove her opinion down the throats of others as well. Edited June 1, 2014 by Superman_AZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theUndead Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 (edited) So TWO other threads violated the rules, but this one did not. I would say I am spot on since this thread is the only one I mentioned. Also, there is nothing passive aggressive about being blunt. I would love to tell her exactly what I think of her, but it would just be an unnecessary repeat of last summer when I went off on another female player who loved to shove her opinion down the throats of others as well. No you are in fact not spot on, not even close. If you don't like said player which obviously you don't then tell them in private. But the fact that you simply have to be so rude on the open forum says more about you then them. Oh and you make it sound it's female players only that make you resort to such bluntness but I digress.The fact remains if you want to let a player know how you feel about them do so privately not here. That is viewed as a personal attack and can get you into serious trouble. By the way the other player you are referring to, I would agree was an absolute pain. They deserved punishment but laying waste to their character is not something I think is the best course of action. Again be as blunt as you want but do so privately. Edited June 1, 2014 by theUndead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sangrar Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 (edited) So TWO other threads violated the rules, but this one did not. I would say I am spot on since this thread is the only one I mentioned. Also, there is nothing passive aggressive about being blunt. I would love to tell her exactly what I think of her, but it would just be an unnecessary repeat of last summer when I went off on another female player who loved to shove her opinion down the throats of others as well. really? Are you really going to start this insulting crap now? She was not shoving her opinion down anyones throat, she disagreed, and all of a sudden you started going off. These are gaming forums way to overreact, thats not being blunt thats just being a jerk on the internet because she disagreed on something and stated her honest opinion. I did not see her shoving her opinion down anyones throat or anything, again, too much hostility and too much of an overreaction. and before you say it please do not go with the "but she started it" crap. Edited June 1, 2014 by Sangrar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drayvis Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 Yeah, that's right. Hide behind your little letters and genre classifications. See where that gets you in life. So, lacking a strong retort to the statement, your only resort is to make some senseless babble reply? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scratcha Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 (edited) Off topic much? This thread has become nothing but a pile rotting horseflesh, kept on life support only by misplaced egos and would-be white knights. Definitely way past time to put this thread out of its misery and move on to some other train wreck of a thread where you can troll and flame one another. Some of you people really need to get a grip on reality; SWTOR is only a freaking game, not exactly the kind of thing where rational individuals should be trying to legitimize their life's worth. God almighty, what a sorry lot you are. Edited June 2, 2014 by scratcha grammar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superman_AZ Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 She was stating her opinion only, not treating it as the final say. Please settle down. You're making something out of nothing. Spoken like someone else with a Mod complex. Settle down. I was simply expressing MY opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reno_Tarshil Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 Spoken like someone else with a Mod complex. Settle down. I was simply expressing MY opinion. No need to get upset little buddy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillshock Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 Extortion or coertion - afaik even using virtual goods - is a crime. Yes a real crime. So contact the police and or legal department of Bioware/EA. However - if they do roleplay it and are a bunch of scoundrels and or bountyhunters or agents playing double agents)... in that case you are out of luck and will have to find more creative ways around it - maybe even 'roleplay' something. Seriously: How often do you get presented with a full on roleplay-conspiracy-extortion-double-agent-infiltration plot? What you need is an 'inner circle' of people whom you can trust. A secret innner circle, even. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superman_AZ Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 (edited) No need to get upset little buddy. You taught me, none of it is personal I'm just being blunt... like you, cause none of this is really important. No emotion involved at all. Edited June 2, 2014 by Superman_AZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiddenRogue Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 hmm...I've found that through my times people take their characters way too personal, I play the game to escape from drama not get more of it lol. But, just do what I do OP and just ignore them and pretend they don't exist and they will leave after a while. Looks like these people want to get under your skin and they have by you obviously spilling this drama onto SWTOR's forums for everyone to see. So take a deep breath hit the ignore button and move on and have fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theUndead Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 You taught me, none of it is personal I'm just being blunt... like you, cause none of this is really important. No emotion involved at all. The problem is, not everyone is as blunt as crass as you. And in this forum it can get you into trouble. But I would like to point out that no one has a mod complex. Just saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeeyyMagzz Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 -You are attempting to argue on the thread in the BC forums that cyber bullying causes very negative repercussions, when it actually doesn't unless a personal connection IRL is being exploited or the "offending party" is attempting to make one, which warrants immediate CS intervention. While I agree with most of the stuff you posted in reply to this thread, this area is incorrect. No real life connection needs to be made to have a cyber bullying case. I'm not really sure where you found that, but you are absolutely 100% wrong. The, "personal connection IRL," being exploited is how the person(s) being bullied feel about the harassment. If someone feels they are being bullied in the game and they have sufficient evidence to prove that, then in my opinion, Bioware should take every precaution they can to protect their shareholders money. If the OP or someone in the OP's guild need counseling for instance, that may end up being paid for by Bioware shareholders. And, I'm sure the gentleman/lady that dismissed the CS complaint would be receiving a worthless severance package. I'm not saying it will ever come to that, but the potential is there; to dismiss someone's "feelings" in today's day and age is crazy. Trust me, I don't really care about this one way or another, and I certainly don't care about anyone's feelings, but don't pretend to tell someone that is clearly upset with the support they received the best avenue to take when they have already attempted the path of least resistance. OP - My opinion towards your problem is that you are going to have a rough time convincing anyone it is harassment; the sole reason being that you are on a RP server. However, if this is truly bothering you, I am 100% for your right to pursue your current course of action. Good luck, sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZooMzy Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 (edited) While I agree with most of the stuff you posted in reply to this thread, this area is incorrect. No real life connection needs to be made to have a cyber bullying case. I'm not really sure where you found that, but you are absolutely 100% wrong. The, "personal connection IRL," being exploited is how the person(s) being bullied feel about the harassment. If someone feels they are being bullied in the game and they have sufficient evidence to prove that, then in my opinion, Bioware should take every precaution they can to protect their shareholders money. If the OP or someone in the OP's guild need counseling for instance, that may end up being paid for by Bioware shareholders. And, I'm sure the gentleman/lady that dismissed the CS complaint would be receiving a worthless severance package. I never stated a RL connection has to be there in order for a cyber bullying case to exist. My post is in regards to one being serious without a RL connection, which it isn't unless there is one. Take a look at every case of cyber bullying in the news in regards to recent events, the only ones that resulted in a situation came from cases with suicides and deaths regarding how anonymous people would threaten others based on things such as personal appearance, personal actions, preferences, race, and other matters that are directly related to your character. If you are being bullied in a manner described above, that is harassment and warrants CS attention. Why? Because it's inescapable; you can't turn off the game and then expect that type of negativity to stop as it is a direct attack on you, a personal connection having being made. However, in this game, there is nothing you can do without forming a direct personal connection with another player that results in a case of serious cyber bullying, not even a connection to their "avatar". "Bullying" in the game results in OW PvP, "bullying" in game results in guild rivalries and the drive for motivation to clear progression content in PvE in game. There are some positives to take from actions that many seem to view so with hostility and misplaced arrogance. And what sort of negativity does it bring? None, only the negative opinions and emotional turmoil that people inflict on themselves because they want the connection to be personal. They want to believe people are their neighbors and friends, not hiding behind avatars and monitors where in this virtual reality, no one knows your name or identity and no one really has a right to know unless you are daring enough to make that information public. Again, welcome to the Internet. Where on this game, bullying isn't a problem because of the fact that the only harassment that exists is the one you subject yourself to, even if someone randomly starts insulting you. Because at the end of the day, the only thing you have to do to get away from internet abuse such as the stuff you see in the game is to turn off your computer and go live a normal, healthy life. And since that is the only measure of will needed to undo the damage, any internet abuse that has no personal connection is very minor in severity, especially not enough to compare with the cyber bullying that has resulted in suicides. Edited June 3, 2014 by ZooMzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subach Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 So, lacking a strong retort to the statement, your only resort is to make some senseless babble reply? Umad bro? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superman_AZ Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 The problem is, not everyone is as blunt as crass as you. And in this forum it can get you into trouble. But I would like to point out that no one has a mod complex. Just saying. People who state how or what others should or should not post is armchair moderation. If I told you that this thread was a great topic however __________, ___________, and ____________. have all made posts which are unwarranted and violate the ToS, I am not just making an "observation", I am making a Mod assumption. People will KNOW if things violate the posting rules. Calling out, or Naming/Shaming about a supposed ToS posting violation is ALSO against the rules. So rather than sit in judgement about the postings of others if you feel they violate the rules, simply report the post as a violation and move on. Telling people what they may and may not post, or should/should not post, is the work of a Moderator, and people with a Mod-complex. I've been guilty of it in the past, which is how I recognize it. With that, I will go back to being blunt and honest and reminding people it is just a forum, a forum about just a game. A game that is intended for entertainment purposes only. Everyone should lighten up a bit. Offer opinions, not moderation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zexterian Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 (edited) Perhaps they're just RP'ing as villains and instigators? I was thinking the same thing. It does suck, but the truth is is there's a lot of s****y people out there. These guys are representing that group. Edited June 3, 2014 by Zexterian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZooMzy Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 I was thinking the same thing. It does suck, but the truth is is there's a lot of s****y people out there. These guys are representing that group. Doesn't have to be RP. I've often found myself sitting on an open world, mercilessly farming an accidently flagged pub or flagged group of pubs coming out of their base as a means to incite a massive open world PvP battle. Maybe the group is just looking for conflict, a form of entertainment in a virtual reality. Considering almost every mission and PvP match you do is a reflection of that, I wouldn't hold them to such a negative viewpoint for the desire to fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superman_AZ Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Doesn't have to be RP. I've often found myself sitting on an open world, mercilessly farming an accidently flagged pub or flagged group of pubs coming out of their base as a means to incite a massive open world PvP battle. Maybe the group is just looking for conflict, a form of entertainment in a virtual reality. Considering almost every mission and PvP match you do is a reflection of that, I wouldn't hold them to such a negative viewpoint for the desire to fight. Role play conflict is one thing. Being mean to the point of making people want to quit playing via harassment is quite another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZooMzy Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 (edited) Role play conflict is one thing. Being mean to the point of making people want to quit playing via harassment is quite another. I don't see the harassment. I want to PvP, and if they're stupid enough to keep their flag on, I will mercilessly smash them and farm them for kills and taunt them the entire time. Not my fault they subject themselves to punishment for my amusement. There is nothing I can do in game that will force a player to ultimately deem that the only solution is to quit the game forever. As long as I treat the game as a game, everything I do is legal and allowed under Bioware's rules. As I am not harassing anyone unless I take the step of personal connection to them; relentlessly farming people and stomping them into the dirt is not and never will be harassment, just as taunting with emotes isn't. People should have at least a small level of tolerance in game. Would like to see that encouraged over people arguing that everyone should make sure they don't step on anyone. Edited June 4, 2014 by ZooMzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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