RIP Jedi Covenant

[oldaquarian]

Explanation of what's going on in this thread, for those not versed in the JC nightmare progression scene: (Focusing mostly on the facts of the situation.)

 

OP, as well as the two others who support him on the first page of the thread, were part of the supergroup/pug that downed NiM Brontes server 1st (and still only) / world 9th. Good for them.

 

They subsequently have joined (or, in some cases, were already in) guilds on Harbinger and Pot5, and had notable success in those guilds. Again, good for them.

 

Some of this group enjoy trolling in various ways, and the OP seems largely to be a troll post, in part bragging about still being the only Brontes kill on the server. The other part: There is somewhat less progression going on, and rather less camaraderie, on JC now; more on this below.

 

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JC Progression scene recently:

 

With their leaving, JC lost the pug/supergroup plus some guilds they left have dissolved or been set back. Also, before all this, another guild with many server firsts fizzled out due to people leaving and hasn't participated in progression.

 

Some of the supergroup/pug were prime movers in the hard mode pug scene prior to 2.7, though by 2.6 or so they stopped pugging as much outside their clique and also many more people were capable of pugging HM by that point. Still, with their leaving, there's less pugging going on.

 

Still, there's some decent progression going on, though not truly top level stuff (as in, no further Brontes kills yet):

 

Off the top of my head I can count 5 guilds that have downed through Corrupter Zero NiM plus 2 more who have downed through Grobthok NiM (and possibly Corrupter Zero by this point; not sure) and are still actively progressing and playing on the server.

 

Further, I know of at least 4 more guilds on republic side that are working on Draxus NiM and have nearly got it (possibly some of these have downed Draxus by this point). I'm sure there are more of this sort that I just don't know about.

 

There is less communication in the progression scene now.

 

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Comparison with other NA servers re Brontes (as far as I know):

 

Harbinger: 4 guilds have downed Brontes (though 1 of these was not the 1st time for any of the members)

Pot5: 3 guilds have downed Brontes

Shadowlands: 2 guilds have downed Brontes

Bastion: 1 guild has downed Brontes

Jedi Covenant: 1 guild has downed Brontes (though most members have left the server)

Ebon Hawk: 0 guilds have downed Brontes

Begeren Colony: 0 guilds have downed Brontes

 

Hard to compare the pre-Brontes progression as some of those groups don't post their progress and I don't know the scene on the other servers.

 

-------

 

So, yes, JC progression is suffering some. There's still some decent activity, though not as much and not truly top tier. Also, communication / camaraderie isn't great.

 

Anyway, for all those posting in this thread, that's what this is really about.

 

Im pretty sure it was world 8th - anyway as you pointed out without that group that left they are in the same progression as the 2 RP guilds hence my idea to turn JC into an RP server - why everyone is hating on RP servers - and wants to RP on a PVE server i don't understand.

[Chemmie]

First of yes they need to do something about that guy on fleet, and when I brought it to his guild's attention they thought it was funny. Someone said they though they were trying to fund their guild ship that way.

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Second my guild alone on JC has 3 8-man groups farming 1st boss in nmDF and been attempting the rest. So the whole "no raiders on JC" thing is ridiculous. We got 5 8m raid groups running 2 days a week each. I know SEVERAL other guilds just on imp side doing the same thing. And our guild has been here since release and not going anywhere with no interest in wildstar.

 

Also when the buff is removed I think its actually gonna be almost too easy for a lot of guilds.

 

If you are having issues with raiding I suggest perhaps looking for a new guild that is running nm? There are about 6 we named off the top of our heads just on Imp side. The forums have a great guild finder application too.

Edited May 19, 2014 by Chemmie

[cxten]

Im pretty sure it was world 8th - anyway as you pointed out without that group that left they are in the same progression as the 2 RP guilds hence my idea to turn JC into an RP server - why everyone is hating on RP servers - and wants to RP on a PVE server i don't understand.

 

Okay, 8th. Or 10th if we're including 16 I guess. I totally averaged them is what I'm saying. Because that clearly makes sense.

 

Anyway, I'm pretty sure there's less nightmare progression (in the not-yet-killed-brontes scene) on the two RP servers than on JC, from discussion with some people who raid there. And the servers are bigger (so much lower concentration of progression).

 

But really the whole RP thing is just a troll, and we both know it. The merge with Shadowlands idea is much better than that, though I don't think we're there yet.

 

Are the people left on the server unhappy? I mean, those doing their not-quite-top-tier-progression thing, if someone is looking for that there are various groups running that can take more. You yourself aren't really looking for a group on JC, I imagine, unless you're trying to weirdly straddle several guilds on several servers, which is its own problem.

Edited May 19, 2014 by cxten

[Sidenti]

It's a game, and different people have fun doing different things. Some enjoy relaxing & chatting. Some enjoy amassing credits. Some enjoy killing bosses. Some enjoy killing bosses before other people have killed those bosses. Some enjoy roleplaying. Some enjoy gearing out their characters. Some enjoy the story. Some enjoy casual pvp. Some enjoy seeing their pvp rating go up. Some enjoy challenging pvp matches. Some enjoy completing achievements. Some enjoy parsing on the dummy. Some enjoy cool mounts or pets. Etc.

 

So, what you're telling me is that some people enjoy putting in a fantastic amount of work and productive effort (organization, teamwork, practice, the actual runs, etc.) as a hobby?

 

Huh. I thought that was only on EvE. Live and learn! -bp

[CecilPaladin]

So, what you're telling me is that some people enjoy putting in a fantastic amount of work and productive effort (organization, teamwork, practice, the actual runs, etc.) as a hobby?

 

Huh. I thought that was only on EvE. Live and learn! -bp

 

Some people like to play sports and others like to watch from the stands. I take you you're a bleacher type of person aren't ya?

[Infernixx]

OP is desperately trolling with the 'rp' comment, as if it's an insult.

 

What's funny is that no one's risen to take the bait even after 13 pages and a couple of day's worth of attention.

 

It was a nice little try, though.

[SnickerJew]

OP is desperately trolling with the 'rp' comment, as if it's an insult.

 

What's funny is that no one's risen to take the bait even after 13 pages and a couple of day's worth of attention.

 

It was a nice little try, though.

 

Err'body look, its Captain Obvious!

[TrillOG-]

Explanation of what's going on in this thread, for those not versed in the JC nightmare progression scene: (Focusing mostly on the facts of the situation.)

 

OP, as well as the two others who support him on the first page of the thread, were part of the supergroup/pug that downed NiM Brontes server 1st (and still only) / world 9th. Good for them.

World 8th*

A lot of us moved on to better things because if I'm going to be spending time playing a game I'm going to make sure its worth it. If an opportunity comes up to move on to bigger better things I'm going to take it. If my pug group is doing better than my guild which has spent nearly 10x as much time on the fight then there is a problem. Especially when some of the people in said guild are not willing to do things such as spec into things that make the fight easier, swap specs or take constructive criticism its just not worth my or anyone elses time.

Edited May 19, 2014 by TrillOG-

[oldaquarian]

OP is desperately trolling with the 'rp' comment, as if it's an insult.

 

What's funny is that no one's risen to take the bait even after 13 pages and a couple of day's worth of attention.

 

It was a nice little try, though.

 

Once again this is not a troll thread i honestly don't want my server to die. Whether the answer is to change it to an RP server or combine the 2 east coast servers or just watch the inevitable and watch the game die and not just my server there is nothing i can do about it - that's up to bioware but they seem to be trying to gauge whatever is left of this game instead of trying to prolong it. Again i ask you and your friend to leave the thread as you add nothing to it.

[Reno_Tarshil]

JC isn't all Bad, I got my Interstellar Blaster Rifle Dorn for 325k there where it was trying to go for 600k on harbinger SMDH.

[cxten]

World 8th*

A lot of us moved on to better things because if I'm going to be spending time playing a game I'm going to make sure its worth it. If an opportunity comes up to move on to bigger better things I'm going to take it. If my pug group is doing better than my guild which has spent nearly 10x as much time on the fight then there is a problem. Especially when some of the people in said guild are not willing to do things such as spec into things that make the fight easier, swap specs or take constructive criticism its just not worth my or anyone elses time.

 

I'm not going to fault you for that. As I said, I was summarizing the facts.

 

But it's pretty obvious that the current situation is a result of that. Each of the other servers have had just a few Brontes kills. The same sort of thing could've happened on another server if a few members of each of those guilds [the ones that have now downed Brontes] had left.

 

So you can see why Abs (and you & yolo, in various threads) coming and trolling re Brontes is unwelcome.

 

I mean, if your point is to have fun trolling people who haven't downed Brontes yet, and you've found an easy population to single out in JC because nobody there except your group has done it, then I guess that's some efficient trolling.

 

But there are still some reasonable guilds on JC --- as I said I can count 7 that are still active and are at least 3/5 (with most of those 4/5), with at least 4 more pub side making decent progress on draxus.

 

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If the problem is that you guys have trouble coming back and finding pug groups or something (though you haven't really been pugging all that widely on JC for a while, and I don't really think you guys are interested in that), that shouldn't be super surprising. I doubt it's much of an indication that pug groups are actually hard to find.

Edited May 19, 2014 by cxten

[Empire_Ruler]

World 8th*

A lot of us moved on to better things because if I'm going to be spending time playing a game I'm going to make sure its worth it. If an opportunity comes up to move on to bigger better things I'm going to take it. If my pug group is doing better than my guild which has spent nearly 10x as much time on the fight then there is a problem. Especially when some of the people in said guild are not willing to do things such as spec into things that make the fight easier, swap specs or take constructive criticism its just not worth my or anyone elses time.

 

Maybe you missed my post but you are proving my concerns with that statement, sadly.. I really don't like where this thread is going. I would still like people to think about bigger concerns or at least the aftershocks of such acts. The Group Concept, even the Progression Concept, is really, what is in crisis in the game. That's the only RIP I see in the short term. I would like people to be respectful of others, I think there is a lot at stakes and that Guild Membership, requirements and even the achievements themselves should be reviewed.

 

Link to to my previous post, in case you missed it : read it carefully, I don't take sides, i'm just trying to identify something that the Devs could actually understand without being within, something way more important going on, as you read this post and that they could work on to improve the game we play.

 

You may not care about others or what is left behind (the presence of this thread is proving that you do ask for a change of the system, IMO) but claiming that all is left is RP, is pretty offtopic, as many pointed out already. I'm also open to have real discussions about it, so please at least sign your forums posts if you wanna troll/play so we can argue.

 

If I may ask, what is the survability of such ''guilds''? Clearly, the only thing that holds people together is clearing ASAP instances and then? It dies. Yep. That's the sad part and as the official progression threads are proving as well, is that by everyone stacked pugging everyone, no new/different players get things done. Isn't competition about competing WITH/AGAINST other people? What's the point of progression if all is already set? What incentives are there for new people to work or step up their game to an higher level? What is also quite shocking, is that both (new and the actual great players, all servers combined) will eventually burn out/lose interest and who will be there to compete?

 

Please think again, it's already to late anyway, but be more conscious of your actions, in the future, if you want not only this game but also its people, to leave for good.

 

Thank you.

Edited May 19, 2014 by Empire_Ruler

[SnickerJew]

...I killed Brontes 5 times this week do I get a cookie?

[cxten]

...I killed Brontes 5 times this week do I get a cookie?

 

Not according to this guy:

 

...so, do progressionists get money or something

 

Though, if you did, maybe he'd be interested.

Edited May 20, 2014 by cxten

[Icebergy]

Yeah, but recently there's been no PvE to do. People are bored on all servers. .

 

This. I'm a progression raider and NiM bores me. I don't want to run the same instance for 6-8months and then have the difficulty moved up a notch so I can run it for a few more months.

[Haggardbr]

As a former Canderous Ordo that merged into Jedi Covenant and being here for almost 2 years as well, I too think the server is kinda boring.

 

I don't know if it's me who's burnt out a bit or the community that reached a "boring" status.

 

That being said... I'm really considering to move to the Ebon Hawk and try some role-play.

[Cronosword]

Reading this thread is like watching 5 year olds argue.

 

Emp is the only one to make a valid discussion to this topic and everyone is here just bickering amongst themselves about nonesense.

 

To add to the discussion. This is in all my opinion anyways and in no way saying is the be all and all for everyone else, but to me raiding is for the enjoyment of the group. I'd rather attempt to clear something over a course of 3 months with my group rather than forming with random individuals and clear it in 1 day. Some guilds look to want to share that sense of accomplishment with their group and dont necessarily care about clearing it ASAP.

 

The individuals who left (you know who you are and i disagree with what you did heavily) only left for their own sense of self accomplishment, and in the process, brought down 2-3 guilds who were incredibly competent in clearing content and are essentially dead or back to square one. Leaving your respective guilds to do what you wanted to do in the process hurt the server as a whole and are a core problem of why this topic exists.

 

There are a few up and coming guilds that are going to be clearing this content soon(Crimson Sky, House Stark, Chosen Order to name a few, im sure there are more), and they will have done this as a GROUP. Groups that have done everything together from day 1.

 

Anyways, you may think we're "bads" and sure we're not as elite as you guys, but hey, we get things done at our own pace and dont burn ourselves out and complain that there isnt any content because you've done everything as quick as possible.

 

Those are my two cents, take it or leave it

[SnickerJew]

lol so like 4-5 people leaving the server apparently blows the server up? gg thanks or playing.

[Reno_Tarshil]

lol so like 4-5 people leaving the server apparently blows the server up? gg thanks or playing.

 

It's so dire!!!!

[Cronosword]

lol so like 4-5 people leaving the server apparently blows the server up? gg thanks or playing.

 

When those 4-5 people were the people keeping their respective groups together in their guild together, yes. I'm not denying you guys are not skilled players, you obviously are seeing how far you've gotten. I've played with all of you guys who left at points and there is no denying you guys were good. But when the most skilled players leave their guilds high and dry, yea its a huge blow to those guilds. Especially when those guilds, at the time, were the only guilds clearing things at a decent pace.

 

But anyways, hopefully you guys stick together and clear stuff on whatever servers you're on now, good luck

[Bonizo]

Reading this thread is like watching 5 year olds argue.

 

 

The individuals who left (you know who you are and i disagree with what you did heavily) only left for their own sense of self accomplishment, and in the process, brought down 2-3 guilds who were incredibly competent in clearing content and are essentially dead or back to square one. Leaving your respective guilds to do what you wanted to do in the process hurt the server as a whole and are a core problem of why this topic exists.

 

t

 

I chuckled and laughed a great deal because of this statement and the irony of it coming from someone in Chosen Order.

 

That said individuals are going to do what they want in order to achieve the goals that they have. No one signs a lifetime contract when they join a guild and the fact is if a group of folks got together and decided that they all liked playing together that is well within their rights to leave and join up together. If that means moving to a different server together then that is also within their rights. As those looking from the outside we can have our viewpoints regarding it but in the end the opinion that matters is those that are within the group. They choose what they wanted to do and what they felt was best for them. It is unfortunate for those left behind and it may not be fair but in the end the majority of people will act in a way that serves their interest.

 

That said the server is fine and while it may take a while for it to recover, there are talented folks that will eventually get to the point that they can clear progression content. The server is fine, the sky isn't falling, it just means that some guilds are going to have to take a moment to retool or figure things out. If they have strong leadership and a good core then they will reconstruct themselves and get back to content that they are used to doing. It will just take time as they get folks together, teach them what is needed and then of course in some cases gearing them up so that they can handle the content.

[LilCthulhu]

That said individuals are going to do what they want in order to achieve the goals that they have. No one signs a lifetime contract when they join a guild and the fact is if a group of folks got together and decided that they all liked playing together that is well within their rights to leave and join up together. If that means moving to a different server together then that is also within their rights. As those looking from the outside we can have our viewpoints regarding it but in the end the opinion that matters is those that are within the group. They choose what they wanted to do and what they felt was best for them. It is unfortunate for those left behind and it may not be fair but in the end the majority of people will act in a way that serves their interest.

 

That said the server is fine and while it may take a while for it to recover, there are talented folks that will eventually get to the point that they can clear progression content. The server is fine, the sky isn't falling, it just means that some guilds are going to have to take a moment to retool or figure things out. If they have strong leadership and a good core then they will reconstruct themselves and get back to content that they are used to doing. It will just take time as they get folks together, teach them what is needed and then of course in some cases gearing them up so that they can handle the content.

 

I so totally agree with what Bonzio is saying here.

 

Whether you decide to have a commitment to one guild or decide to be a mercenary ready to guild hop to serve your interest first is your choice. You can recruit the best mercenaries around to clear the hardest content, but do not expect them to be loyal to your guild unless they indeed become loyal. Loyalty is earned through friendship, blood and sweat. It's a brotherhood. It's logging in every week to clear the content with people you like running with and not being yelled at for the mistakes you may have done.

 

Guild hoppers, although sometime either bad or good player are there to serve their interest. Reconstructing a guild is part of any MMOs, players will come and go. Guild will fall apart and rise again. Summer is near, people are waiting for new content and hopefully the galactic stronghold will provide what people look forward to, before 3.0 is released.

 

Unfortunately, JC (like other servers) suffers from exhaustion and being burned out on running the same content for the past 8 months. The hard mode OPs are exactly what a vast majority of "good-but-not-awesome" players are looking forward too, we like running with our groups and have fun doing it. We badly need new OPs. Nightmare is what Nightmare should be and I'm glad Bioware finally came up with harder nightmare ops but they should be released at the same time as HMs.

 

Let's be honest here, and I've been talking to a lot of players lately about these issues. A vast majority of them feel like they haven't got what they have expected from this game from the start. We're looking at a game that is 2.5 years old but I feel like we only got 1.5 years of content in it. Galactic Starfighter was nice for a while, but we're talking about something that was expected at launch. We only have a glimpse of what Galactic Stronghold will have, however most of it was expected more than a year ago : Guild Flagship, Legacy Bank, etc. Hopefully, the planet conquest will be based on open PvP and not daily farming.

 

The only expansion we really had in the 2.5 years are : EC, TFB, SNV, DF and DP + Makeb. The rest was expected at start. The latest PvP maps are not as good as the originals. The Ancient Hypergate is not fun and the latest Huttball, although original, is not that entertaining. The PvP queue system would need improvement. The Bolster system for Story Mode operation is a joke and will provide gear to people who have no clue of mechanics. The content can be farmed too quickly now by any guild. EV, KP and EC should have been boosted to 55 with harder mechanics. The OPs should be a mandatory progression for any alts. Yet, people can level to 55 and jump in DF and DP SM right away without grinding the previous ops.

 

Flashpoints, although quite nice, are of no real interest to hardcore raiders. The Cartel Market is a nice money grab, but frankly, a lot of what raiders are looking forward to is new operations with challenging fight mechanics.

 

Turning JC to RP would be a huge mistake as there is not a single Role-Player on this server. The only ones is probably JMD, who's trolling and role-playing you guys like a BOSS !

 

What this server needs is animosity, it needs challenges, it needs open PvP, it needs new OPs. Oricon should be open-pvp !

[RiVaN_]

Some in this thread have been very strong in their critique of the player base on JC, I personally find it to be pretty good. My guild runs 16 man PUG groups every Friday & Saturday as a recruiting method and we never have to wait long to fill up our group. We do Imp and Pub side raids, we do the Dread Ops and we do old content too. It never fails, we get good PUG's, we clear the Op and we usually pick up at least 1 recruit in a weekend. Folks who want to do the content, but have only ever met elitists who demand they have specific gear or are able to parse a specific # to get in a guild or even an Op with these folks. We don't care, we will help the folks get the gear and we will help them learn their class so that they can get closer to a good parse. Yeah we lose folks who want the elitist stuff, but oh well we have still cleared all the HM content in the game and are progressing NiM DF too, so we must not be to bad...

 

I don't think that the Server is doomed and dying. There certainly aren't enough Role Players on JC to classify it as a Role-Playing server. As a matter of fact JMD is really the only person I have ran into the past 2 years that "pretends to be a character" in the game and even he isn't much of a "role player," more of a "troll-player."

To say that we should become an RP server makes me wonder if you understand what it means to "role play."

There are plenty of people on the game lvling alts, running content and progressing through stuff that they have never experienced. There are several instances of Fleet every night and I even noticed 7 instances of DF last night.

Just because many raid teams and or guilds don't advertise their progression doesn't mean no one is doing it. Just because some folks don't see the need to update the World Progression Tracking doesn't mean people haven't been progressing. Tracking progression isn't a requirement, it is a tool of competition; a way of measuring yourself against others.

 

Honestly NiM content is only a "measuring tool", not new content. It is a way for the elitists to say "my junk is bigger than yours because I got DF down before the Nightmare Buff expired." That is all NiM difficulty (or it's equivalent) is in any game.

 

Some folks have jobs that they work at for 8 to 14 hours a day. They come home to their families and they have responsibilities, things in real life that have to get done. Then, when their day is truly over they may have 3 hours or so to play a little SWTOR. Casual Players actually make up the majority of every games player base, not just MMO's and not just SWTOR. So yes there are a lot of casual players in SWTOR. The truly "hardore" players typically have nothing else to do or they are young or both. They can afford to be hardcore raiders because they don't have any other responsibilities. I would venture to bet that most SWTOR players have many other responsibilities in their daily lives.

JC is actually one of the most active servers in the game as far as I can tell. I have toons on 5 servers and JC always seems to have more people on than most of the others. Naturally because we have a higher population we are going to have more casual players.

 

 

I think the server community we have is doing pretty good and I think we have some good folks, who cares if people wanna leave because their opinion is the opposite. Let them go, let them find the community they were hoping for. One day they may see that JC is pretty awesome, or they may not. Oh well. If they are elitists then good-bye and good luck. In my experience Elitists are rarely happy for very long…

A little competitiveness is always a good thing, but when it gets out of hand you just gotta wish those folks good luck. Nice people will be ready to help them back up when they fall, d-bags will point and laugh.

[XiamaraSimi]

Last week, the guildies formed up on Fleet, in the GTN area and started mass-suiciding over the railing. When asked, finally, by the bystanders, they told them that they were grinding for a new title, 'The Lemming' which you get by dying on Fleet a thousand times.

 

They managed to get people suiciding over the ledge for about 45 mins before the all-caps rage posts finally convinced the gullible ones to stop killing themselves for no reason.

 

Please say someone quoted Bugs at least once!

[Drox]

I play on JC, and I really don't get what the OP is talking about. I see plenty of pug groups being formed in fleet chat throughout the week. Of course when it comes to progression it's mostly gonna be guilds that keep to themselves, there is no reason to involve pugs when you're having fun with buddies in a guild.

 

I've also played on other servers, it seems to be the same formula of how people operate. This idea that JC is doomed because every progression guild isn't slinging their e-peen in fleet chat is a little much. Granted I'm sure the OP is one of our resident trolls in JC, so this is probably just bait.

Edited May 21, 2014 by Drox