Thank you for killing GSF for me, Bioware - I was having too much fun playing it.

[Highborne]

I refer, of course, to the 2.7 patch changes, which amount to renaming gunships as "missile bait". Any halfway-competent strike fighter can now eat a railgun shot or two, close to range and use their burst-laser cheese (which, I note, did not get nerfed at all despite being the single most OP thing in the matches) and keep missile-locking me until I die, because you essentially removed my ability to evade lock.

 

But like I said: I was having too much fun playing GSF. Thanks, Bioware!

 

*cancels subscription*

 

EDIT: I'd also like to note that not everyone can run in premade groups full of burst-laser cheese. But every single change you've made has favoured premades, who already have a huge advantage over non-premades. So, yeah. Later.

Edited April 9, 2014 by Highborne

[Armonddd]

Yeah, I'm finding that gunships squish too easily now. This encourages walls of gunships protected by bombers, which is still problematic.

 

Also, BLC is definitely a bit overtuned, but it's nowhere near as bad as "lol 60 energy drain per shot" was.

[tunewalker]

any one else find it ironic he is complaining about strikes AND burst lasers..... to my knowledge no strike fighter has burst lasers. You know what does though..... gun ships.... . Edited April 9, 2014 by tunewalker

[Morgrid]

I refer, of course, to the 2.7 patch changes, which amount to renaming gunships as "missile bait". Any halfway-competent strike fighter can now eat a railgun shot or two, close to range and use their burst-laser cheese (which, I note, did not get nerfed at all despite being the single most OP thing in the matches) and keep missile-locking me until I die, because you essentially removed my ability to evade lock.

 

But like I said: I was having too much fun playing GSF. Thanks, Bioware!

 

*cancels subscription*

 

EDIT: I'd also like to note that not everyone can run in premade groups full of burst-laser cheese. But every single change you've made has favoured premades, who already have a huge advantage over non-premades. So, yeah. Later.

 

Excuse me while I try to find a care to give...

 

...

 

...

 

...

 

...

 

Nope, I can't find any.

 

Before you were able to Distortion Field out of one lock, barrel roll out of the next lock and rinse and repeat until your chaser ran out of engine power and you could snipe them.

 

YOU ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO HAVE THAT KIND OF MOBILITY.

[Verain]

The barrel roll nerf seems a bit overdone, but I suspect you'll need to use LOS heavily. IMO gunships were too strong prepatch, but EVERYONE used barrel roll.

 

I don't think this is worth quitting over at all, and I think if you can rail them twice you should win.

[DeputyConvict]

If you are quitting because of this well then its your own dam fault for exploiting something that was OP and not learning how to play.

[MaximilianPower]

The barrel roll nerf seems a bit overdone, but I suspect you'll need to use LOS heavily. IMO gunships were too strong prepatch, but EVERYONE used barrel roll.

 

I don't think this is worth quitting over at all, and I think if you can rail them twice you should win.

 

Re: the bolded - I'm sure you're exaggerating a bit for effect, but certainly the vast majority of GS pilots have barrel rolled their way through the first few months of GSF.

 

However, I recently learned that the single best GS pilot on my server (at least, that I know of - his name strikes fear in the hearts of all who see it) uses the freaking weapon power converter component. I literally thought nobody used that. He has never used barrel roll. I can't even process that; I'm having trouble imagining playing without barrel roll even post-nerf (which is certainly still useful). But I have to force myself to try some of the other choices, converter included.

 

On topic: silly reason to unsub, OP.

Edited April 9, 2014 by MaximilianPower

[Gavin_Kelvar]

any one else find it ironic he is complaining about strikes AND burst lasers..... to my knowledge no strike fighter has burst lasers. You know what does though..... gun ships.... .

 

I did and was rather amused how he seems to be implying that strikers are using BLC against him.

 

But anyway don't GS still have distortion field? Can't they still use that to break missile locks?

 

I have very little sympathy for GS pilots that relied on barrel roll to basically outrun everything other than scouts until their enemy ran out of engine power and then turn and snipe them.

[Altheran]

I have very little sympathy for GS pilots that relied on barrel roll to basically outrun everything other than scouts until their enemy ran out of engine power and then turn and snipe them.

 

Nobody did, i think. It was clearly abusing a broken mechanic.

[Verain]

Nobody did, i think. It was clearly abusing a broken mechanic.

 

Funny that the scouts and strikes had the same nerfs then.

[Vid-szhite]

The barrel roll nerf seems a bit overdone, but I suspect you'll need to use LOS heavily. IMO gunships were too strong prepatch, but EVERYONE used barrel roll.

 

I don't think this is worth quitting over at all, and I think if you can rail them twice you should win.

 

Unless you're running away from someone, Barrel Roll really doesn't need to be used more than once every 20 seconds. Scout pilots like myself aren't even noticing its increased CD. Gunships with BR could seriously get to middle sats in Domination before a Scout that didn't have it, and they could run away indefinitely. Guess what, now you have to learn to shoot in close range too. It's not like you instantly die when someone gets in range, and if that person that catches you is a scout, you can one shot them with BLCs. It's forcing GS pilots to actually learn to dodge, weave, and dogfight, and it's about time.

 

The problem isn't that railing someone twice would win the fight, the problem is that railing someone once was often enough to drain what little energy they had left, and that's with easy lovetaps. That person would then have no way to get in range to fight back. Now imagine 4 people on the other team have it and are all hitting people at the same time. You can't fight that. You literally can not. You can float there until one of them switches to Sluggers to finish you, but that's it.

[Altheran]

Funny that the scouts and strikes had the same nerfs then.

 

It was as broken for them.

It wasn't a particular issue with gunships.

 

You hadn't it, you could never catch that guy who has it, let a lone lock something on him.

The nerf is deserved for everyone.

Edited April 9, 2014 by Altheran

[Verain]

It was as broken for them.

It wasn't a particular issue with gunships.

 

You hadn't it, you could never catch that guy who has it, let a lone lock something on him

 

That last sentence seems sort of confused.

 

 

I don't think BR was broken enough to need a 20 second cooldown. I think it has changed the pacing of the game. I mean, I ran BR on every ship except bombers, and now, of course, I don't- but Gunships and Pikes don't really have great alternatives. Was this really the only way they could give us this? Of course not. Is it the best way? I'm still out on that one. The missile game has really ramped up, as has the space rock circling game.

 

I feel a 15 or 17 second CD would have been more than enough to incentivize the use of the other components. It's also annoying on the gunship as the class has engine components that are entirely worthless- those definitely need buffs, and always have.

 

 

I dunno. It's a close call. I don't want to come down too harshly on this change until I spend at least a couple dozen more games in there. The big deal is that this nerf changed EVERYTHING- almost every good opponent ran this too, after all.

Edited April 9, 2014 by Verain

[Altheran]

That last sentence seems sort of confused.

 

 

I don't think BR was broken enough to need a 20 second cooldown. I think it has changed the pacing of the game. I mean, I ran BR on every ship except bombers, and now, of course, I don't- but Gunships and Pikes don't really have great alternatives. Was this really the only way they could give us this? Of course not. Is it the best way? I'm still out on that one. The missile game has really ramped up, as has the space rock circling game.

 

I feel a 15 or 17 second CD would have been more than enough to incentivize the use of the other components. It's also annoying on the gunship as the class has engine components that are entirely worthless- those definitely need buffs, and always have.

 

 

I dunno. It's a close call. I don't want to come down too harshly on this change until I spend at least a couple dozen more games in there. The big deal is that this nerf changed EVERYTHING- almost every good opponent ran this too, after all.

Maybe the CD could have been a bit shorter, and they maybe went a bit overboard, I'll give you that.

 

But the energy cost improvement is undoubtfully right. Now it can't be used as an eneregy-neutral boost, which was IMO the most problematic part, as someone would spend more energy to chase the roller, than the roller himself.

[Llama-Eight]

Unless you're running away from someone, Barrel Roll really doesn't need to be used more than once every 20 seconds.

Depends how many missile locks you're getting.

 

Gunships with BR could seriously get to middle sats in Domination before a Scout that didn't have it, and they could run away indefinitely.

This surprises me. when I'm being chased I'm usually using my barrel roll & boost to keep away from someone which drains your engine power relatively quickly & given that I still take damage every so often during that time, I'm guessing the ships coming after me are using their boost/barrel roll as well.

 

Guess what, now you have to learn to shoot in close range too.

Already do thanks, there's not much more amusing than killing a scout with my BLC when they're trying to dogfight with me (granted, that probably says more about them being a bad scout pilot than me being a good gunship pilot).

 

It's not like you instantly die when someone gets in range, and if that person that catches you is a scout, you can one shot them with BLCs.

Last I checked, even an un-upgraded scout had more shield/hp than the ~980 - ~1100 damage that a BLC does at minimum range (Novadives have 910 shield/950 hull, Flashfires/Skybolts have 1040/1026) & that can increase a fair bit with the relevant armour/shield choices & upgraded. So unless the scout is already reasonably damaged you're not going to one shot him, even with a crit. Unless you have damage overcharge.

 

It's forcing GS pilots to actually learn to dodge, weave, and dogfight, and it's about time.

Something that gunships aren't designed to do & should generally try & avoid doing 'cause the odds shift a fair way in the scout/strike fighter's favour then, but I'm not really getting the impression that you necessarily want balance other than to force the odds in your favour when you go up against a gunship ("it's about time that a particular ship class that can kill my scout easily on their terms is more easily forced into fighting on my terms now").

[Kuciwalker]

Yeah, I'm finding that gunships squish too easily now. This encourages walls of gunships protected by bombers, which is still problematic.

 

Almost as if this is exactly what I've been predicting for weeks.

 

A gunship piloted 100% perfectly being chased by a merely competent scout could hold off the scout more or less indefinitely at the cost of achieving nothing offensively ever. This was reasonable (especially since scouts could EASILY do the reverse to gunships). Now, even the perfectly piloted gunship will die, and reasonably quickly.

 

A gunship flying 100% defensively should be able to avoid being killed.

[Kuciwalker]

It's forcing GS pilots to actually learn to dodge, weave, and dogfight, and it's about time.

 

I do that all the time. It's a great way to kill bad pilots. Good pilots will not let a gunship kill them in a melee barring very unlucky rolls.

 

A T2 scout has the same weapon a GS has, plus a missile, plus a system, plus massively more efficient thrusters, plus massively higher turn rate.

Edited April 9, 2014 by Kuciwalker

[mudmobile]

Unless you're running away from someone, Barrel Roll really doesn't need to be used more than once every 20 seconds. Scout pilots like myself aren't even noticing its increased CD. Gunships with BR could seriously get to middle sats in Domination before a Scout that didn't have it, and they could run away indefinitely. Guess what, now you have to learn to shoot in close range too. It's not like you instantly die when someone gets in range, and if that person that catches you is a scout, you can one shot them with BLCs. It's forcing GS pilots to actually learn to dodge, weave, and dogfight, and it's about time.

 

The problem isn't that railing someone twice would win the fight, the problem is that railing someone once was often enough to drain what little energy they had left, and that's with easy lovetaps. That person would then have no way to get in range to fight back. Now imagine 4 people on the other team have it and are all hitting people at the same time. You can't fight that. You literally can not. You can float there until one of them switches to Sluggers to finish you, but that's it.

Are you really serious? Have you ever really flown a GS before? They are not dogfighters period nor will they ever be, sure they have blasters but unless you sit right in front of them and don't move the basters are useless. GS are slow and cant turn, weave or dodge, in the time it takes them to turn around any fighter can circle them 5 times. All they had of any use was the railgun and a quick escape, the armor and shields are a minor (this is a generous term) delay. So now they have a one time burst for escape which means nothing since for some time now many fighter jockeys have been obsessively chasing GS across the entire maps, which made the 15 second CD to long already.

[Jasa]

Well I didn't really have that much of problem chasing gunships with barrel roll. I actually feel like all my other ships were hurt more with this and other evasive moves nerfs than gunship due to having to fly closer to missile range. With gunship I need to save barrel roll now for emergiencies, but that's same for every ship class. I don't mind having to be little more careful with my gunship.

 

I don't see why someone sees bursts as a problem... like has been said before on this thread there is not any on strikers and even then gunship is only ship I use them with. I have tried fully upgrade ones on flashfire and they were ok, but I still prefer light laser cannons. I don't see alot of people using them on my server anyways. I'm not saying my builds are most effective ones mathwise, but I like them.

Edited April 9, 2014 by Jasa

[SammyGStatus]

After playing like 10 games last night as a GS and having an entire team say to go for me [Thank you TS with someone in the VoIP on the other side to let me know], I realize I'm going to die a lot more against GOOD pilots. Against the newbs, well they will still go down quickly. First match made contact with 40/50 points in TDM and died twice. Against Callem / Shayd on TEH, I had my highest death count at 6 (he came over and apologized for targetting me, but it made sense cuz as he said, I would've had more kill count than him). I get barraged with multiple missiles sometimes, which is frustrating, but it's just going to take getting used to / coordination.

 

TBH, the only OP aspect of the GS before was the ion's energy depletion. The BR was meh, but now survivability has been mitigated to require even more skill to survive when you have 3-4 pilots on you. Ahhh, I just want to play more!!

 

EDIT: BLC's on a scout need to go next

Edited April 9, 2014 by SammyGStatus

[Zharik]

A gunship flying 100% defensively should be able to avoid being killed.

 

This explains a lot about how you think...

[Kuciwalker]

Given that a scout can do so with ease, a gunship should at least be able to do so with difficulty.

[Highborne]

Unless you're running away from someone, Barrel Roll really doesn't need to be used more than once every 20 seconds.

 

And when two scouts or strike fighters are constantly missile-locking you?

 

Scout pilots like myself aren't even noticing its increased CD.

 

Bully for you.

 

Gunships with BR could seriously get to middle sats in Domination before a Scout that didn't have it,

 

Who'd have thought it? Something meant to give you lateral speed....gave you lateral speed over people who took something else for an engine option.

 

The horror!

 

and they could run away indefinitely.

 

Bzzt. No, no we couldn't. Gunship engine power depletes significantly faster than scout or strike fighter engine power (speaking from experience with all three types of ships, although mostly GS and scout). I could lead a scout a merry chase for some time, but if I evaded one, it was by LOSing him until he gave up and looked for easier prey or out-piloted him and induced him to crash due to pilot error trying to follow me, not by outrunning him.

 

Guess what, now you have to learn to shoot in close range too.

 

Except that I'm fighting something tougher, stronger, faster and more maneuverable than myself. And yes, even a scout is tougher than a gunship.

 

Gunships suck at close quarters - inherently. It's not a bug, it's a feature - they're supposed to suck at close quarters. If you're a gunship and scoring CQ kills off other ship types, either you got lucky, you set it up to have a *big* advantage going into knife-range or they're piloted by bads.

 

It's not like you instantly die when someone gets in range,

 

Speaking as someone who is very tired of getting two-shotted by #@$@ing strike fighters, I beg to differ.

 

and if that person that catches you is a scout, you can one shot them with BLCs.

 

Aheheheheh.....no.

 

It's forcing GS pilots to actually learn to dodge, weave, and dogfight, and it's about time.

 

In a ship that maneuvers like a pig. A lazy pig. Seriously - unless you're under engine thrust (which depletes a GS' engine power pool really quickly), a gunship makes Yertle the Turtle look like a world-class acrobat.

 

The problem isn't that railing someone twice would win the fight, the problem is that railing someone once was often enough to drain what little energy they had left, and that's with easy lovetaps. That person would then have no way to get in range to fight back. Now imagine 4 people on the other team have it and are all hitting people at the same time. You can't fight that. You literally can not. You can float there until one of them switches to Sluggers to finish you, but that's it.

 

A valid criticism. So why not nerf the energy-drain effect on ion cannons instead - keep them as a shield depleter, but with only a minor energy drain attached? That'd address the problem, without turning gunships into large, slow, fragile targets. I'd have no problem with that - it would address the problem that is making people call gunships OP, without unduly penalizing those of us who do well by different tactics.

[Highborne]

Re: the bolded - I'm sure you're exaggerating a bit for effect, but certainly the vast majority of GS pilots have barrel rolled their way through the first few months of GSF.

 

However, I recently learned that the single best GS pilot on my server (at least, that I know of - his name strikes fear in the hearts of all who see it) uses the freaking weapon power converter component. I literally thought nobody used that. He has never used barrel roll. I can't even process that; I'm having trouble imagining playing without barrel roll even post-nerf (which is certainly still useful). But I have to force myself to try some of the other choices, converter included.

 

On topic: silly reason to unsub, OP.

 

It's the "last straw" effect in action. I only re-subbed for GSF, having unsubbed before due to Bioware's appalling tokenism of same-gender romance arcs (among other problems with its - lack of - storyline development). Why stay when the one reason I did so is no longer valid?

[Highborne]

IBut anyway don't GS still have distortion field? Can't they still use that to break missile locks?

 

And when the lock time for cluster missiles (with shield penetration and armour piercing) is, what, three seconds? Four seconds? - how much does that help then?

 

I have very little sympathy for GS pilots that relied on barrel roll to basically outrun everything other than scouts until their enemy ran out of engine power and then turn and snipe them.

 

Except that we always ran out of engine power first. Having played both scouts and gunships a lot, gunships' engine pool depletes about twice as fast as scouts' do. And it also depletes faster than strike fighters' engine pools, although I've played those less.

Edited April 9, 2014 by Highborne