Time to brainstorm some questions

[Gyronamics]

12:18:23.807 Mari activates High Impact Bolt.
12:18:23.807 Mari loses Ionic Accelerator.
12:18:23.987 Mari gains 8 energy.
12:18:25.356 Mari activates Incendiary Round.
12:18:25.356 Mari spends 16 energy.
12:18:26.848 Mari activates Charged Bolts.
12:18:28.354 Mari spends 16 energy.
12:18:28.356 Mari activates Charged Bolts.
12:18:29.849 Mari spends 16 energy.
12:18:30.743 Mari activates Charged Bolts.
12:18:32.264 Mari spends 16 energy.
12:18:32.264 Mari gains Ionic Accelerator.

 

So what do you make of this? 2 Charged Bolts and more than 6 seconds had passed after IA was used and no proc.

 

I make of it the same thing as ghost GCD where you hit an ability and you get a GCD and no ability.

 

Two rolls of 45% is 69.75% unless crazy maths is talking in which case you think it's 90%.

 

No one capable of parsing long periods is seeing a 30% fail rate in procs let alone a 10% fail rate.

 

A failed proc doesn't get ignored, you really see it because it just screwed your ammo and the flow so you remember it. So who is seeing this gigantic fail rate to confirm this "cumulative" theory.

 

You have a failed proc, I agree, but what is anyone meant to say about that aside from asking for more data.

Edited March 19, 2014 by Gyronamics

[Gyronamics]

Is the difference between Pyro and Assault going to prevent a Commando from contributing enough to down content in a situation where a Merc still would?

 

No and yes.

 

Find an extreme enough example like... oh... who can whack off the dummy faster to top the leaderboard and the commando is at an impossible disadvantage when infinite tries are allowed. This is because my theory is that offhand railshots refresh CGC for a DOUBLE refresh in the same milisecond on top of all cast abilities having (up to) double hits which increase proc chance of a burnt out CGC dot.

 

Still levelling a merc to prove it to myself.

 

For raid content? No, extremely destructive and competitive with any other high damage class, biggest variables in output are who AOE's adds the most, who gets the easiest dps job with least movement and who gets targeted with dps griefing mechanics like lava chasing you.

Edited March 19, 2014 by Gyronamics

[cashogy_reborn]

If Demo Round auto-critted the target if the Gravity Vortex debuff was present, it would certainly help close the gap but it's not going to add 500 DPS. But then this would most likely cause PvP imbalance if you had a guaranteed 10k+ hit every 15 seconds with no real setup.

 

A Demo Round auto-crit would be hugely overpowered in PvP.

 

I dont see a way to bridge the 500DPS gap without overbalancing Gunny for PvP at the same time. I think a more likely situation would be to bring it up 200-300 DPS so its more middle of the road, but still viable in all encounters.

 

No and yes.

 

Find an extreme enough example like... oh... who can whack off the dummy faster to top the leaderboard and the commando is at an impossible disadvantage when infinite tries are allowed. This is because my theory is that offhand railshots refresh CGC for a DOUBLE refresh in the same milisecond on top of all cast abilities having (up to) double hits which increase proc chance of a burnt out CGC dot.

 

Still levelling a merc to prove it to myself.

 

For raid content? No, extremely destructive and competitive with any other high damage class, biggest variables in output are who AOE's adds the most, who gets the easiest dps job with least movement and who gets targeted with dps griefing mechanics like lava chasing you.

 

The bolded is what I was looking for, and what I was assuming.

[AngelFluttershy]

Okay, I'm going to respond to the general thread before I start quoting anyone and responding to sub-topics.

 

First, please don't use a question in asking for an ammo counter. I'm very positive BioWare is aware of the player base desiring an ammo counter (I really want one), but asking when we'll be getting one is a waste of a question. They'll "eventually" get to it, and that's probably the answer you'd get from them anyway.

 

I think a good question to go off of that would be enlightening for Assault and Gunnery DPS is the negative effect alacrity has on our DPS. With Ionic Accelerator, and now Curtain of Fire since it's guaranteed proc every 8 seconds, the effect alacrity has on our GCD and cast times can cause players to receive delayed procs, reducing DPS and hurting ammo regeneration in the case of Assault. Since the Commando trees are full of passive alacrity boosts and procs (Weapon Calibrators, First Responder, Rapid Recharge, Cell Capacitor) it seems that BioWare intended Commados to make use of alacrity similar to Sages. My question to them would be something like; seeing how Commando trees provide plenty of alacrity bonuses for the player, what can be done to reduce or remove the negative effects alacrity has on damage output and ammo regenerative proccing talents like Curtain of Fire and Ionic Accelerator? That's clearly a rough draft, but you all get the idea.

 

I like the PvE discussion about Gunnery going on as parsing 3.5k in Gunnery is very difficult still even with the PTS changes. I haven't put much thought into it, but I still feel like ammo management for the spec is pretty difficult just from the handful of parses I did on the PTS. A further cost reduction on HiB or some mechanic similar to Gunslinger's Smoking Barrels in the Sharpshooter tree (reducing the cost of the next two abilities by a certain amount after a particular ability) would be a good starting discussion point.

 

Ok, so 3.5k DPS is the low end, and 4k is the high end. What kind of changes would you suggest to increase Gunny's DPS output t be competitive with Assault?

 

What if there was something to increase crit rate of Full Auto and/or Demo Round?

I'd probably start by increasing the critical chance and damage of Full Auto and Grav Round. It's difficult to say a good way to increase damage without over-powering burst as Gunnery uses so few abilities in their core rotation. If BioWare doesn't want to keep bumping up stats they could always doing something akin to Jedi Knights' Heightened Power in the Focus tree. It'll boost burst damage while spreading it out a bit. Increasing Demo Round or HiB crit rate or damage is dangerous in terms of PvP balance as they're already very powerful abilities that can be used back-to-back.

[cashogy_reborn]

Yeah the lack of synergy with Alacrity and proc ICDs has always been a problem. I wonder if they could make alacrity lower ICDs at the same rate they lower everything else.....

 

And I also think that Full Auto is going to have to be where some of this damage is made up. Just throwing an idea around here, but what if Curtain of Fire were to have some kind of PvE specific effect added to it? Along the lines of 'Full Auto critical hit chance against NPCs is increased by 100%', or an additional flat % increase when attacking NPCs.

Edited March 19, 2014 by cashogy_reborn

[DaftVaduhhh]

Not looking to derail the topic at hand, but has a similar check been done to compare Sniper & Gunslinger parses? Or did they actually balance the issue there.

 

Back on topic:

 

- Energy Cell count

 

- Minor ammo regen capabilities for Combat Medic/Bodyguard

 

- Revert stacking lockout for Trauma Probe (this makes no sense with the current rate limit)

 

- Consider a further buff to FA/Unload for Gunnery/Arsenal (perhaps make it a 2s channel when talented with Rotary Cannon, Charged Launcher or Curtain of Fire, kinda like SS/MM)

 

- Halve the CD, duration and damage of Electro Net, and consider decreasing the duration to 3s due to the fact that some melee have no counter to this ability, at all (notably Knights/Warriors).

 

- Consider changing Alacrity so that it also decreases CDs/ICDs and DoT/HoT durations so that it fits in better with rotations (note: class abilities, not biochem etc.)

[Kinslayer]

This is because my theory is that offhand railshots refresh CGC for a DOUBLE refresh in the same milisecond on top of all cast abilities having (up to) double hits which increase proc chance of a burnt out CGC dot.

 

Still levelling a merc to prove it to myself.

 

This was proven quite a while ago and is the main reason why Merc's cylinder uptime is much higher than Mando's.

Edited March 19, 2014 by Kinslayer

[DaftVaduhhh]

- Consider a further buff to FA/Unload for Gunnery/Arsenal (perhaps make it a 2s channel when talented with Rotary Cannon, Charged Launcher or Curtain of Fire, kinda like SS/MM)*

 

* - Please note that this implies a nerf to the base damage of TM/GR & FA/UL which additionally hinders the possibility of hybrid builds that outperform a pure spec, so... win/win? Without the nerf this would be up to a 300-550 DPS increase.

Edited March 19, 2014 by DaftVaduhhh

[cashogy_reborn]

Lets see if we can narrow down the PvE question a bit. I am not going to ask about the disparity between Assault and Pyro, and I feel like asking about the Ammo counter is a waste of a question. I can touch on the ammo counter briefly in the hopes that the devs actually implement it finally, but it really should be a Yes or No answer.

[AngelFluttershy]

Yeah the lack of synergy with Alacrity and proc ICDs has always been a problem. I wonder if they could make alacrity lower ICDs at the same rate they lower everything else.....

 

And I also think that Full Auto is going to have to be where some of this damage is made up. Just throwing an idea around here, but what if Curtain of Fire were to have some kind of PvE specific effect added to it? Along the lines of 'Full Auto critical hit chance against NPCs is increased by 100%', or an additional flat % increase when attacking NPCs.

 

The main problem would be the ICD being reduced by the alacrity like everything else would result in a DPS increase unless adjusted for which would require a lot of balancing techniques (base damage, projected alacrity amount on player, etc). Full Autos could also have a proc added to them (a 100% one tied to the second tick) that increases the damage of next Grav Round or makes it free, something like that. My fear of just boosting base damage is then BW will look to pull back in other areas reducing burst for some sustained, which may turn Gunnery into a lesser Assault.

 

Not looking to derail the topic at hand, but has a similar check been done to compare Sniper & Gunslinger parses? Or did they actually balance the issue there.

 

Back on topic:

 

- Energy Cell count

 

- Minor ammo regen capabilities for Combat Medic/Bodyguard

 

- Revert stacking lockout for Trauma Probe (this makes no sense with the current rate limit)

 

- Consider a further buff to FA/Unload for Gunnery/Arsenal (perhaps make it a 2s channel when talented with Rotary Cannon, Charged Launcher or Curtain of Fire, kinda like SS/MM)

 

- Halve the CD, duration and damage of Electro Net, and consider decreasing the duration to 3s due to the fact that some melee have no counter to this ability, at all (notably Knights/Warriors).

 

- Consider changing Alacrity so that it also decreases CDs/ICDs and DoT/HoT durations so that it fits in better with rotations (note: class abilities, not biochem etc.)

In order:

 

-Do you mean increasing the ammo pool by talent or set bonus, or do you mean regeneration?

-In what manner? Baseline or talented?

-I don't think we need faster channels that do less damage.

-Don't think PvPers would go for this.

-Again, balancing issues around this stat when you bring in ICDs and DOT/HOT durations. Reducing CDs could also be dangerous territory.

[DaftVaduhhh]

In order:

 

-Do you mean increasing the ammo pool by talent or set bonus, or do you mean regeneration?

-In what manner? Baseline or talented?

-I don't think we need faster channels that do less damage.

-Don't think PvPers would go for this.

-Again, balancing issues around this stat when you bring in ICDs and DOT/HOT durations. Reducing CDs could also be dangerous territory.

- Regeneration, just something on hammer shot would probably do the trick

 

- Trauma Probe needs to back to a rate limit of one per person per caster

 

- It was more to make the 8s ICD more useful, and I'm thinking that you could potentially leave FA/UL unchanged, but grav round would need to be nerfed. They're already thinking about this by installing the 8s ICD (or they're trying to encourage a rotation that waits 0.5s for ICD for optimal damage).

 

- 9 seconds kicks the crap out of Knight & Warrior output if they're already isolated from the current skirmish; all the other classes have the ability to output decent damage while recovering (though I can't remember if it locks out Guardian Leap/Intercede)

 

- You'd need to nerf the alacrity coefficient, but I don't see the issue otherwise.

Edited March 19, 2014 by DaftVaduhhh

[TACeMossie]

I think a good question to go off of that would be enlightening for Assault and Gunnery DPS is the negative effect alacrity has on our DPS. With Ionic Accelerator, and now Curtain of Fire since it's guaranteed proc every 8 seconds, the effect alacrity has on our GCD and cast times can cause players to receive delayed procs, reducing DPS and hurting ammo regeneration in the case of Assault. Since the Commando trees are full of passive alacrity boosts and procs (Weapon Calibrators, First Responder, Rapid Recharge, Cell Capacitor) it seems that BioWare intended Commados to make use of alacrity similar to Sages. My question to them would be something like; seeing how Commando trees provide plenty of alacrity bonuses for the player, what can be done to reduce or remove the negative effects alacrity has on damage output and ammo regenerative proccing talents like Curtain of Fire and Ionic Accelerator? That's clearly a rough draft, but you all get the idea.

 

PTs/VGs have covered Alacrity on Assault/Pyro in our questions, so wait to see what the devs say about that before commenting there.

 

As for gunnery, Curtain of fires new 8 seconds ICD means you can get 12.5% alacrity before it hurts the procs on Curtain of Fire, so by design it allows quite a bit of alacrity. The perfect alacrity point however, would most likely be 10%, as this gives 1 more cooldown between High Impact Bolts/Rail Shots or Grav Rounds/Tracer Missiles.

 

So before wasting a question on Alacrity, I'd wait for the PT/VG questions to be answered.

 

Anyway, my quick draft of topics for the 3 questions, based on my limited experiences with a merc:

 

PVE - Gunnery does significantly less sustained damage in PvE, and its utility over assault (armor debuff) is provided by favourites like Guardian Tanks (and now DPS as well), as well as Gunslingers. Even with the reliability of its procs being fixed in 2.7, testing has shown the only change is moving it from only beating assasins to beating assasins and vanguards. What are the plans to help this spec in PvE, so you aren't gimping yourself by not going assault?

 

PvP - Combat Medic is still heavily prone to Interrupts, and while the unlimited trauma probe targets and 1 minute Tech Override help, People still are preferring scoundrel healers despite the nerfs to emergency medpack. Are there any more plans to help the Combat Medic spec in PvE, through reducing time standing still to cast things and/or improving interrupt resistance available to the spec?

 

Wildcard - Base this on assault spec IF they dont announce changes for Ionic Accelerator/Prototype Partice Accelerator or Alacrity in the spec in general from the PT/Vanguard questions. However if they don't, I got nothing.

 

EDIT - I got something for Assault/Pyro. PvP Viability. Mention how the other succesful PvP DoT specs (Balance Sages, Lethality Snipers, Assault VGs) have some level of cleanse protection or obscene mobility, where assault mandos have large ramp-up times and are easily shut down from anyone who isn't a boss scripted to spend as much time as possible hitting the guy doing the least damage. And ask about this situation.

Edited March 19, 2014 by TACeMossie

[AMightyKnight]

Ok, so 3.5k DPS is the low end, and 4k is the high end. What kind of changes would you suggest to increase Gunny's DPS output t be competitive with Assault?

 

What if there was something to increase crit rate of Full Auto and/or Demo Round?

Acutally its the auto attacks in our rotations that hurt our sustained dps the most. We are forced to use pretty much 2 Hammershots for every 3 CoF procs, meaning Mando ammo management is still to tight for Gunnery.

I'd suggest just giving us our free HiB back. It wont matter that much on the dummy but will help tremendously in raids.

[ArchangelLBC]

Not looking to derail the topic at hand, but has a similar check been done to compare Sniper & Gunslinger parses? Or did they actually balance the issue there.

 

The thing with Gunslinger/Sniper is that there are no procs to even worry about. Plasma Cell/CGC is a DoT applies off of ranged attacks, whereas all the Lethality/DF DoTs have to be deliberately applied.

 

Cash, after some thinking I would make the PVE question about gunnery. Specifically the part about the very low DPS compared to other ranged specs in return for not really much utility, and indeed much much worse energy management, even in 2.7, compared to the other two turret burst specs (Energy management is a breeze in SS/MM and there's no point even discussing force management for Lightning/TK. A TK sage has effectively infinite force as long as they're just DPSing). I don't know how to really increase damage though. Curtain of Fire making FA a 2.1 second channel, like SS does for speed shot (which btw does not lower the damage of the ability, you just deal the full damage in 2.1 seconds) is, I think, a perfectly valid idea, and would make the 8 second ICD make a lot more sense to me personally. Or even just flat out reducing the ICD to 6 seconds.

 

Keep in mind we don't actually need to be making up 500 DPS. It's not necessarily about bringing the same damage as Assault/Pryo, especially because there's all the possibility in the world that those two specs are over performing due to their proc, and the general wisdom is that sustained DoT specs should outperform burst specs. However the disparity between Gunnery and SS/MM or Lightning/TK IS worth talking about. TK got all their procs guaranteed (and one got a MUCH MUCH higher effective proc rate) without a single change to the ICD (though the double TK Wave dipping was fixed). Given that, and while I understand that FA, even on live, is a much larger part of our damage, the change in the ICD to me seems just off. Why not 7 seconds?

 

Making the ammo management a lot easier is also something to consider. Again one of the balancing trends you see with other classes, particularly the other two ranged classes, is that the DoT specs have tougher energy management while the burst specs never have to worry about energy.

 

Another possibility, and maybe one which would not overtly affect PVP too much, is adding Grav Round to the 30% crit multiplier bonus. I'm not sure how much DPS that would add, and it might send things over the top, but Grav Round crits a LOT due to the PVE set bonus.

 

We also still lack a meaningful DPS cooldown that increases DPS for a brief amount of time. No I don't count recharge cells.

 

I dunno just spitballing.

 

The PVP question should probably be about continued utility woes in PVP, particularly for assault, and interrupt vulnerability for Combat Medic. I would also work the disengage question in here.

 

After some thinking, I do think we need to use the wildcard question asking about the disparity between Assault and Pyro. That kind of thing just should not be in the game, but I understand if you leave it out because lets face it, it's going to result in a Pyro nerf. I also think that, just as with the Merc questions, we should work in the ammo counter in at the end. You don't have to make a whole question dedicated to it, but considering that way back in September it was supposedly something which "shouldn't be too hard to do", they're sure taking their sweet time about it, and after playing my VG all this past weekend I really missed knowing exactly what my ammo was at, especially having played PT, and especially when tanking given how easy it is to dig a hole you can't get out of on VG tank without Energy Blast. Frankly it's a little annoying that they could be so flippant when the Mercs asked, and then almost half a year later we still don't have it, and don't look to have it anytime soon.

Edited March 19, 2014 by ArchangelLBC

[Uber_the_Goober]

In PvP scenarios - Gunnery has some "useless" skills.

 

Charged bolts? Only usable as a backup when grav round gets interrupted - but the damage isn't higher enough than hammer shots to justify the lack of mobility.

 

Pulse Cannon? What fool is going to stand in that ability for it's full duration?

 

Explosive Round? Ammo cost is ridiculous compared to the damage increase over hammer shots. Only benefit is the splash damage for a stop-cap when you have enough time before dying for ONE instant cast ability. Pretty limited usefulness...

 

Question is: Is there anything that can be added to these abilities that would make them more useful in a PvP environment, like a slow or root? Since we're a turret, the enemy has to come to us, or at least not get away...for us to be effective.

[ML_DoubleTap]

Depends. It's looking like Draxus Nightmare could be a DPS check to rival pre-pre-nerf Nightmare Dread Guard. If that is indeed the case, then yes, the difference between Pyro and Assault will be noticeable and may cause some Republic side raid groups to struggle more with the fight where identically-composed Empire groups will get a clear.

 

Kind of a bad example since this is like the one fight that many people go Arsenal/Gunnery for

[ML_DoubleTap]

In PvP scenarios - Gunnery has some "useless" skills.

 

Charged bolts? Only usable as a backup when grav round gets interrupted - but the damage isn't higher enough than hammer shots to justify the lack of mobility.

 

Pulse Cannon? What fool is going to stand in that ability for it's full duration?

 

Explosive Round? Ammo cost is ridiculous compared to the damage increase over hammer shots. Only benefit is the splash damage for a stop-cap when you have enough time before dying for ONE instant cast ability. Pretty limited usefulness...

 

Question is: Is there anything that can be added to these abilities that would make them more useful in a PvP environment, like a slow or root? Since we're a turret, the enemy has to come to us, or at least not get away...for us to be effective.

 

Charged Bolts - still procs CoF so it's not totally useless when GR gets interrupted.

 

Pulse Cannon - agreed, but I do occasionally use it if people are bunched and near me. It's not unprecedented that a shared base class ability is fairly useless to one of the advanced classes though...Double Strike for sages?

 

Explosive Round - this is actually great for stopping caps with it's splash damage; in arenas, I'd agree

[speedyMCMLXXXV]

Yeah the lack of synergy with Alacrity and proc ICDs has always been a problem. I wonder if they could make alacrity lower ICDs at the same rate they lower everything else.....

 

I still believe that they shouldn't have made that change with the alacrity system after the 2.0 patch.

 

Anyway..to fix the ICD of abilities like Ionic Accelerator with 'alacrity based system' without screwing anything else (and make alacrity more valuable) is really easy: change the ICD from a 'seconds based lockout' to a 'GCDs lockout'.

 

Ionic Accelerator: '..this effect cannot occur more than once every 6 seconds'

change it into '..this effect cannot occur more than once every 4 GCDs'

 

About Gunnery..well..i tested on pts server and I don't really like it too much..8 seconds is an awful ICD and a free HiB wouldn't solve ammo issues..I'd like to see something like they did with Vigilance Master Strike: some ammo back when Curtain of Fire procs..what do you think about this?

Edited March 19, 2014 by speedyMCMLXXXV

[Gyronamics]

After some thinking, I do think we need to use the wildcard question asking about the disparity between Assault and Pyro. That kind of thing just should not be in the game, but I understand if you leave it out because lets face it, it's going to result in a Pyro nerf.

 

Heck no. It's a bug not something to blow a question on.

 

It's exactly the same bug as double ammo regen for mercs on railshot but it's double dot refresh damage which they didn't notice and didn't fix when they fixed the regen.

 

I've finished levelling a merc up and I have the data I need, I'll make a bug report on forum and we just need to poke it til we get some yellow writing in there.

 

Nerf be dammed. Commando Assault has had nothing good since game release until this PVE damage, we do not need it ruined by the Merc mirror having a bug on top of using a non-pushback tree to parse over 4k on the dummy and attracting grief.

 

I'm not in favour of any questions regarding damage because Gunnery is no worse than average plus useful secondary talents while Assault is carrying all its weaknesses through sheer PVE damage.

 

And yes, on Brontes Gunnery does shine brighter than Assault for several reasons.

[Uber_the_Goober]

Charged Bolts - still procs CoF so it's not totally useless when GR gets interrupted.

Didn't realize that...still feels unusable by me. Guess I'll have to modify my playstyle to try and take advantage of it.

Pulse Cannon - agreed, but I do occasionally use it if people are bunched and near me. It's not unprecedented that a shared base class ability is fairly useless to one of the advanced classes though...Double Strike for sages?

Is it even that useful for vanguards...? It's conal AOE...with poorly defined boundaries...and nobody EVER eats the whole thing. May as well just hammershot the enemy. If I'm stuck in place, why can't my target be?

 

Explosive Round - this is actually great for stopping caps with it's splash damage; in arenas, I'd agree

I see we agree on this...nothing to add

[Gyronamics]

Here's my bug report, do not waste a question on it: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=730133

[ML_DoubleTap]

Is it even that useful for vanguards...? It's conal AOE...with poorly defined boundaries...and nobody EVER eats the whole thing. May as well just hammershot the enemy. If I'm stuck in place, why can't my target be?

 

It's pretty vital to their middle tree and comes with a slow plus huge damage bonuses. Tanks get a proc that make it free and faster to channel so it's usable for them as well.

[ArchangelLBC]

Heck no. It's a bug not something to blow a question on.

 

It's exactly the same bug as double ammo regen for mercs on railshot but it's double dot refresh damage which they didn't notice and didn't fix when they fixed the regen.

 

I've finished levelling a merc up and I have the data I need, I'll make a bug report on forum and we just need to poke it til we get some yellow writing in there.

 

Nerf be dammed. Commando Assault has had nothing good since game release until this PVE damage, we do not need it ruined by the Merc mirror having a bug on top of using a non-pushback tree to parse over 4k on the dummy and attracting grief.

 

I'm not in favour of any questions regarding damage because Gunnery is no worse than average plus useful secondary talents while Assault is carrying all its weaknesses through sheer PVE damage.

 

And yes, on Brontes Gunnery does shine brighter than Assault for several reasons.

 

OK fair enough, you made the bug report. What do you suggest for the wildcard?

 

I'd say Gunnery IS below average though and that's one of the problems, and no the additional utility isn't enough, considering that all sniper specs can provide the armor debuff and all sage DPS specs have built in good AoE damage. On the other hand it's not that far below average (comparing to pyro is where the huge disparity is) so something like lowering the ICD to 7 seconds or decreasing the channel time during CoF proc should be sufficient (though changing the channel time without providing some sort of boost to ammo regen will just give us more energy problems) . The weaknesses of assault can be folded into the PvP question, unless you want the armor rend to be baseline, in which case that's a fair point. Tie it to charged bolts, remove grav round/tracer missile and tie all the effects related to it to charged bolts, and then make the tier 3 talent in Gunnery something more useful to address the damage concerns.

[cs_zoltan]

The weaknesses of assault can be folded into the PvP question, unless you want the armor rend to be baseline, in which case that's a fair point. Tie it to charged bolts, remove grav round/tracer missile and tie all the effects related to it to charged bolts, and then make the tier 3 talent in Gunnery something more useful to address the damage concerns.

 

Eh definitely do not want, no way I would want to trade a tech attack for a ranged one in PVP.

[Uber_the_Goober]

It's pretty vital to their middle tree and comes with a slow plus huge damage bonuses. Tanks get a proc that make it free and faster to channel so it's usable for them as well.

 

Well good to know somebody's getting benefit from it.