Dogfight??? Where???

[-Streven-]

I've yet to run into a problem with Bombers in Deathmatch, but I haven't run into a team full of them either. I could see where multiple Bombers working in concert with Gunships could be troublesome.

 

I do agree in Domination they are bit overtuned. Even one Bomber (especially when piloted by a skilled pilot) takes way too much team effort to dislodge from a satellite. I say that as someone who flies a Minelayer explicitly built to single-handedly hold a node against multiple attackers.

 

I do wish BioWare had just started with the Minelayer ... it's still very effective, but it's a bit less "noisy". And mines take a bit more skill (not a huge amount) to use than drones but are also more easily countered. I think it would've been less disruptive to introduce Minelayers first... balance them ... and then possibly dip a toe in with Dronecarriers.

 

I still wish they had taken our beta feedback and made all drones support debuffers/buffers, instead of drones doing direct damage. That way drones could also have had shorter cooldowns and been less all-or-nothing in terms of their effectiveness.

 

Sounds like you had pretty good advice.

[Yndras]

I still wish they had taken our beta feedback and made all drones support debuffers/buffers, instead of drones doing direct damage. That way drones could also have had shorter cooldowns and been less all-or-nothing in terms of their effectiveness.

 

More drones like interdiction( - the laser cannon) and the repair drone would be better balanced. Being snipe'd by 4 rail-gun sentry drones makes for a short match.

 

Unless all roles are available for all players, teams without or do not like that play style of the ships needed means that they will be unbalanced.

 

Each ship needs to be able to stand on its own against any of the other ship types. Currently this is not how it is.

[Applejacxs]

Did my weekly on one of my imps today. The other teams were full of gunships/bomber combo and one or 2 strikes/scouts in death match today. All i could think of was this thread lol Edited February 12, 2014 by Applejacxs

[Zoom_VI]

My issue with bombers is that the minelayers can drop two mines at the same time (one of each type) and instantly kill any one around them

 

As a scout I can deal with dronelayers, it requires some skillful approaching but its easily doable. But minelayers? I just leave and go elsewhere. MINES NEED A ARMING TIMER, they shouldn't ever be able to detonate immediately after being dropped.

 

Also what idoit gave mines 100% shield penetration?

Edited February 12, 2014 by Zoom_VI

[Delta_V]

Also what idoit gave mines 100% shield penetration?

 

Honestly, Bombers have too much shield piercing in general. Ignoring the shield piercing on Heavy Lasers, Concs, and ProTorps (since these aren't really the focus of the Bombers anyway), too many of the mine/drone options have some form of shield piercing.

 

On the Minelayer, Seismic Mines (Secondary Slot) do damage directly to hull, while in the Systems slot, Interdiction Mines also do damage directly to hull, while Concussion Mines have 20% shield piercing. The only mine options that don't have shield piercing are Seeker Mines and Ion Mines.

 

On the Dronecarrier, both the Missile Drone and Railgun Drone get 20% shield piercing (bonus points for the Railgun Drone also having an Armor Ignore upgrade option). The only drone w/out shield piercing is the Interdiction Drone.

 

So yeah, of all the mine/drone options available to bombers, over half have shield piercing.

[Zharik]

Honestly, Bombers have too much shield piercing in general.

 

Ok, but think of it this way... a bomber get to preplace a few mines/drones total, right? The CD for placing those items are ridiculously slow. After say 3 mines attack the same target... what does the minelayer have?!? If the attacker is not dead after that, he's done. Without shield piercing, a minelayer cannot get past an attacker's shields since they'll regenerate before they can lay another mine/drone/whatever.

 

Imagine if your <Insert Laser Weapon of Choice Here> only fired 5 times before being depleted for 15 seconds... Without appropriate shield piercing, would anyone EVER die?

[Armonddd]

Imagine if your <Insert Laser Weapon of Choice Here> only fired 5 times before being depleted for 15 seconds... Without appropriate shield piercing, would anyone EVER die?

 

No, but at the same time, that laser should be rebalanced.

 

The problem is exasperated by the fact that the AI controls the mines and drones, not the player.

[Itkovian]

My issue with bombers is that the minelayers can drop two mines at the same time (one of each type) and instantly kill any one around them

 

As a scout I can deal with dronelayers, it requires some skillful approaching but its easily doable. But minelayers? I just leave and go elsewhere. MINES NEED A ARMING TIMER, they shouldn't ever be able to detonate immediately after being dropped.

 

Also what idoit gave mines 100% shield penetration?

 

But that's precisely the point. Bombers are the counter to scouts. If they're making you go elsewhere and hunt down something else, then mission accomplished.

 

The heyday of scouts being the ultimate fighting machine are gone, now you have to focus on what the Scouts are good for: mobility and dogfighting. Go hunt down the gunships, strikes, and other scouts, and leave the bombers to the Gunships and Strikes,

 

Or load up some longer range weaponry (quads) and just watch your range. Quads and rockets work great against bombers, just break off before you get too close.

[Itkovian]

More drones like interdiction( - the laser cannon) and the repair drone would be better balanced. Being snipe'd by 4 rail-gun sentry drones makes for a short match.

 

Unless all roles are available for all players, teams without or do not like that play style of the ships needed means that they will be unbalanced.

 

Each ship needs to be able to stand on its own against any of the other ship types. Currently this is not how it is.

 

Firstly, I do agree I would have preferred the dronelayer to be a support ship more than anything else. Things definitely get wonky when you start stacking dronelayers.

 

But as for the game balance, clearly the devs are NOT taking the approach that "each ship needs to be able to stand on its own against any other ship types". The implementation of the bomber pretty much put a nail in the coffin of that idea.

 

Rather, the way balance works is: Scouts->Gunships->Bombers->Scouts, with strikes smack in the middle of the circle (being able to take on every role, but not being as good against a role as the specialists). Also, all roles ARE available to all players, you just need to buy them. And by default everyone has a Strike, which is decent against everything.

 

Personally I much prefer the current game balance over pre-2.6: everything has a counter, and the game definitely got more tactical IMO.

 

That said, it is true that things get funky when a team spams a specific role, but that's not really any different from the way it was before such as when a team boated gunships. The opposite team had to adapt its tactics and ships to counter the spamming... and if it couldn't, it was screwed. That's just the nature of the game.

 

Either way, rock/paper/scissor looks like it's here to stay. If you like a specific role, just be sure to cultivate another role that counters your favourite role's counter in case the enemy spams that counter (or strikes... wonlt be as effected as the pure counter, but its more versatile).

 

Thank you.

 

Itkovian