Hardmode queue time!

[tekhiun]

What do you suggest they do? Force Tanks and Heals to queue up at least 5 times a day or face account suspension?

 

Let's make this happen !

[ArielaKnight]

I am a gunslinger DPS and I don't have any problems finding a group to run things with but of course I am not crazy enough to use group finder either.

 

I just ask my guild or friends if we can do a flashpoint and then of course I don't act like I know everything.

 

If it is something I don't know, I ask questions and I also listen to their advice.

 

No one can force a tank or healer to que in group finder. I can understand why a lot don't want to.

[AdrianDmitruk]

Well speaking as a healer who 1) finally got around to levelling his guardian to 55, 2) is currently leveling up a powertech, and 3) spent a couple months dabbling around in HM flashpoint queues around 2.3, I figured I'd offer my two cents on the subject:

 

There's simply no point in queueing as a tank. For many reasons.

 

First off, the gear itemization. Yes I understand that there should be a grind to optimize gear, but when I was a healer the itemization was absolutely HORRIBLE. Nearly everything had high endurance and crit; I ended up buying some SITH WARRIOR gear just to get a power/alacrity enhancement (or was it power/surge? Don't quite remember) for my SORC. Yes we should have to buy more than 1 piece per slot to get everything optimized, but we should at least be able to do that from the vendors that sell items from our class. Healers shouldn't have to go looking for enhancements off the smashmonkey vendor. And of course, tanking is even WORSE because of the whole two sets of gear problem. Whereas if you're a healer, you can get away with only a single set for both healing and DPS.

 

Contrast that to PVP (where I spend most of my time), where I can itemize my gear properly. (And, for that matter, still get set bonuses. A PVP set bonus is still better than none, at least until you reach a level of PVE that can't be done with full top-tier, min-maxed PVP gear--which HM FPs are not.) The PVE itemization is so terribad that even as a healer I spent lots of time wondering if the 69s I was getting with the comms were actually an upgrade over my fully min-maxed 65s, with the exception of mainhand/offhand (due to the force power upgrade, that's harder to argue with). And that simply shouldn't happen. Yes PVE itemization should take longer due to lockouts, comm caps, and the like. But it should be reasonably possible. Currently it's so atrocious that I won't bother. I'll just wait for PVP gear to reach 69s (i.e. wait for gear inflation to allow PVP gear to catch up to expected item level) and queue up in my PVP gear, at best. At worst, I'll bypass GF PUGs entirely and inquire of the PVP guilds who also PVE on the side if they're interested in having me run with them (with the understanding that they'll need to teach me the fights, but they will have a general idea of my capabilities from PVP).

 

Second, as a healer I had some leeway to disclose that I come from PVP and hadn't done flashpoints in more than a year. Usually people were understanding and the only wipes I ever had were either DPS not managing their threat or cooldowns pulling off the tank (very rarely a tank problem, think I had 1 bad tank over 2 months or so of queuing), or DPS not meeting enrage timer. I did wipe a couple times by missing a jump that the group wanted to make to take shortcuts through the flashpoint and I can take responsibility for that--I suck at jumping but then again jumping ain't healing. Dealing with this as a tank? Forget it. The person who explained fights to the haven't-done-PVE-in-a-year healer was usually the tank. If I'm a learning tank (and healers and tanks need to be aware of some very different things), who else would explain to me? The DPS who already pulled the boss? LOLOL. I know it would not be wise to go there. So I stay out of the queue.

 

Now I know PVErs want PVPers to stay out of their PVE but when those same PVErs complain about long queue times for want of healers/tanks but then whine to Bioware to set up huge barriers to entry to keep would-be PVErs from PVP out of their PVE...um yeah. Isn't that basically why set bonuses were removed from FP drop gear? Sure give me even less incentive to queue as healer or tank--or for that matter queue at all.

Edited December 8, 2013 by AdrianDmitruk

[EvangelionSG]

Call me stupid - I re-geared my Sith Assassin from dps to tank precisely for the shorter waiting time / higher demand for tanks.

[Tsillah]

The biggest problem for the gf has always been the incredible amount of stupid you run into doing random FP's.

 

Sure there are some tanks who don't use taunts and healers that are cluelessly dps'ing while others die but the biggest problem of all is the DPS corner. Most DPS think that when they shoot stuff they are doing their part. They have no idea about moving out of circles or not runing into them, they have no clue about cc or kill orders and cause all kinds of havoc for the rest of the party.

 

And then there is the point that this is an MMO. Gearing up is part of it. For the love of whoever you pray to, go to Oricon first to get at least the 66 gear they hand you there for doing some basic quests. Of course if you are clueless you will not be able to solo those quests and therefore you may conclude that you should stay away from group play until you understand how to beat those quests.

 

You don't have to be Albert Einstein to understand mechanics and such in this game. But a decently geared tank is not going to waste his time in FP's where he ends up dying 4 times, costing him more credits than he makes in that FP because there are too many players who don't want to learn and just want to be carried.

 

And then there is the other side of it. Why on earth do FP's at all? There are plenty of 16 man story mode operations happening where you can get more credits and better gear and commendations. FP's are pointless these days when it comes to rewards. Dailies with basic comms and sm operations are much better for gearing up than those FP's.

 

It used to be that I would only tank premade guild groups. Now I don't even do FP's at all anymore. They've become obsolete if you really look at it.

[Ruskaeth]

Tune the future and old flash points to require three dpses instead of two.

 

I am sure this has been suggested before but that would be pretty easy solution.

 

Huge QoL update for a massive group of players.

[CKHelseth]

Tune the future and old flash points to require three dpses instead of two.

 

I am sure this has been suggested before but that would be pretty easy solution.

 

Huge QoL update for a massive group of players.

 

This doesn't work. WoW had 40 man ops with a DPS ratio around 3:1 over the healers and tanks combined (and just two tanks!). I did nothing to stop the overpopulation of DPS players. More slots for DPS just means more DPS characters rolled.

 

The solution to this is in the hands of the players. Join guilds or play classes that are in demand. There is no fix the Devs can make to overcome the mentality of the player community in this regard. They have been trying for a decade over dozens of MMOs and the results are always these threads...

[DarthTHC]

Tune the future and old flash points to require three dpses instead of two.

 

I am sure this has been suggested before but that would be pretty easy solution.

 

Huge QoL update for a massive group of players.

 

This is the worst idea ever. This increases the likelihood of getting a bad DPS in your group by 50%.

 

Since bad DPS are the primary reason for tanks not doing flash points (please read this thread!), this is exactly the opposite of what we want to do to get more groups to happen.

 

It would be better to tune them to 1 tank, 1 heals, and 1 DPS. At least then you're cutting your chances of getting a bad DPS in half.

 

Also, it is not an easy solution. They would have to tune every fight in every flash point. That's a lot of hours that could be spent creating new flashpoints doing nothing of value in the old ones. I prefer new content, please.

 

DPS can either figure out how not to suck or roll tanks... which would actually help them figure out how not to suck.

 

/rant

[CKHelseth]

Since bad DPS are the primary reason for tanks not doing flash points (please read this thread!), this is exactly the opposite of what we want to do to get more groups to happen.

 

I don't think that is the reason most tanks don't queue. Its not my reason at least or that of the other tanks I know. We don't queue because we have guilds and there is no benefit in joining a random GF group or running more than three a week. Now I am sure some tanks hate getting poor DPS but I don't think it is the primary reason.

[DarthTHC]

I don't think that (bad DD's) is the reason most tanks don't queue. Its not my reason at least or that of the other tanks I know. We don't queue because we have guilds and there is no benefit in joining a random GF group or running more than three a week. Now I am sure some tanks hate getting poor DPS but I don't think it is the primary reason.

 

Then you need to re-read this thread. Most tanks. Some tanks have different reasons, sure. But most of the tanks who have responded in this thread, myself included, say that horribad DD's are the primary contributing factor to us not queuing or not queuing more often.

[Mallorik]

Tune the future and old flash points to require three dpses instead of two.

 

I am sure this has been suggested before but that would be pretty easy solution.

 

Huge QoL update for a massive group of players.

 

This would have the biggest most immediate improvement. heck they could make 8 man fps and cut wait times 90%

[Idunhavaname]

Then you need to re-read this thread. Most tanks. Some tanks have different reasons, sure. But most of the tanks who have responded in this thread, myself included, say that horribad DD's are the primary contributing factor to us not queuing or not queuing more often.

 

I support this. I stopped doing GF after having just recently done a FP with a sentinel with 21k HP in 55 HM FP who decided he is a capable tank. Really not worth the headache so I just que with guildies/friends now.

[CKHelseth]

Then you need to re-read this thread. Most tanks. Some tanks have different reasons, sure. But most of the tanks who have responded in this thread, myself included, say that horribad DD's are the primary contributing factor to us not queuing or not queuing more often.

 

No I read the threads, but I also know that it represents only a small portion of the game population, so I balance what I hear in the threads with what people say in game. With that in mind I find your statement of the "primary reason" being poor DPS incorrect or at least unsupported in my experience. Since we can only state our opinions, your are welcome to yours, but really after a while the "DPS suck" argument comes of as an overly nasty generalization and a cheap shot more than anything else. Certainly nothing constructive or positive comes from it and I doubt the Devs read more than a word of any of those response before moving on.

 

Now better gear itemizations, rewards that pull players who have moved beyond the existing ones back in the GF and encouragement to join guilds and communities to support your desired play style are all good topics for discussion when it comes to this issue. Positive encouragement to roll more desirable class is also an effective angle.

 

The "DPS suck" is a dead end line of discussion that doesn't need to be beaten to death every time these threads pop up.

 

If you can't say anything nice... well I am sure you've heard the rest.

[DarthTHC]

No I read the threads, but I also know that it represents only a small portion of the game population, so I balance what I hear in the threads with what people say in game. With that in mind I find your statement of the "primary reason" being poor DPS incorrect or at least unsupported in my experience. Since we can only state our opinions, your are welcome to yours, but really after a while the "DPS suck" argument comes of as an overly nasty generalization and a cheap shot more than anything else. Certainly nothing constructive or positive comes from it and I doubt the Devs read more than a word of any of those response before moving on.

 

Now better gear itemizations, rewards that pull players who have moved beyond the existing ones back in the GF and encouragement to join guilds and communities to support your desired play style are all good topics for discussion when it comes to this issue. Positive encouragement to roll more desirable class is also an effective angle.

 

The "DPS suck" is a dead end line of discussion that doesn't need to be beaten to death every time these threads pop up.

 

If you can't say anything nice... well I am sure you've heard the rest.

 

None of those bribes will get me to queue any more.

 

You know what would make me queue more? If every time I got a flashpoint, the DD's (and to a much lesser extent, the healers) were skilled, considerate, and did the right things. And if they didn't know the flashpoint, if they spoke up so I could tell them the right things. And then they actually attempted to do those right things.

 

If I had that happen 70% of the time or more, I'd queue all the time. I love doing flashpoints. When they're right. Not when they're destroyed by horribad DD's.

 

I've gone beyond "DD's suck". I've explained why they suck, what they do that leads me to say they suck, and what they should do to fix it. So while I'm being accurate (cram your "not nice" schtick - accuracy is accuracy), I'm also offering constructive advice for DD's to improve their lot in life.

 

DD's suck isn't a dead end. It's the beginning. The sooner they realize that they are the reason they are not getting faster queues, the sooner they get to start fixing that issue. It's like AA. The first step is admitting you have a (are the) problem.

 

Edit...

 

And another thing, I've recently rolled a pure DD and taken it through some flash points. Before, I would always queue as Heal/DD or Tank/DD and sometimes I'd get DD. But on this character, I don't have the "I can just Tank/Heal if it goes badly" option.

 

You know what I've found on that pure DD? That DD's queue a lot as tanks or healers when they haven't a clue how to do it. Now that wasn't as bad when I was queuing on characters who can tank or heal because I can just take up the slack. As a DD, I can't. I'm bound to that horribad DD trying to tank or heal or to try to convince the rest of the group to boot them so we can maybe get a competent replacement. Not a good situation to be in.

 

More horribad DD behavior. Rolling as a DD made me realize how poorly behaved (or poorly socialized?) DD's are.

 

No bribes BWEA can put into the game will fix that. It's a player problem, not a tech / features / itemization problem.

Edited December 10, 2013 by DarthTHC

[lordspyder]

I recently rolled a new tank and started doing low level FP's hoping I could educate some of the lower LVL DD's on how to play. Maybe head of their arrogance once they hit end game. Every time I make a spot correction they get so bent out of shape. "It's just a game" "this isn't end game" "who cares, just play" is all I get in response. they don't want to do better, they just want to get carried and it's infuriating.

Why would I queue for HM's if this is the attitude I get? No thank you.

[Zooze]

None of those bribes will get me to queue any more.

 

You know what would make me queue more? If every time I got a flashpoint, the DD's (and to a much lesser extent, the healers) were skilled, considerate, and did the right things. And if they didn't know the flashpoint, if they spoke up so I could tell them the right things. And then they actually attempted to do those right things.

 

If I had that happen 70% of the time or more, I'd queue all the time. I love doing flashpoints. When they're right. Not when they're destroyed by horribad DD's.

 

I've gone beyond "DD's suck". I've explained why they suck, what they do that leads me to say they suck, and what they should do to fix it. So while I'm being accurate (cram your "not nice" schtick - accuracy is accuracy), I'm also offering constructive advice for DD's to improve their lot in life.

 

DD's suck isn't a dead end. It's the beginning. The sooner they realize that they are the reason they are not getting faster queues, the sooner they get to start fixing that issue. It's like AA. The first step is admitting you have a (are the) problem.

 

Edit...

 

And another thing, I've recently rolled a pure DD and taken it through some flash points. Before, I would always queue as Heal/DD or Tank/DD and sometimes I'd get DD. But on this character, I don't have the "I can just Tank/Heal if it goes badly" option.

 

You know what I've found on that pure DD? That DD's queue a lot as tanks or healers when they haven't a clue how to do it. Now that wasn't as bad when I was queuing on characters who can tank or heal because I can just take up the slack. As a DD, I can't. I'm bound to that horribad DD trying to tank or heal or to try to convince the rest of the group to boot them so we can maybe get a competent replacement. Not a good situation to be in.

 

More horribad DD behavior. Rolling as a DD made me realize how poorly behaved (or poorly socialized?) DD's are.

 

No bribes BWEA can put into the game will fix that. It's a player problem, not a tech / features / itemization problem.

 

Probably the best post yet nicely put. The biggest thing that annoys me is when people say they know the tactics and clearly don't, in addition to DD's trying to be tanks, Sentinals/Marauders are the biggest culprits here. Let the tank tank, and understand your role.

 

I hate it when a marauder goes in first and wipes because the healer is focused on the tank, and then the healer picks up all the agro trying to heal the marauder. What normally happens then is the DD blames the healer and tank lol typical.

[DarthTHC]

DarthTHC's Rules for Not Sucking in Flashpoints

 

It's really not that hard...

 

1. Queue only for roles for which you are properly geared, specced, and knowledgeable in executing. You don't have to know the fights, but you do have to know what the right skills are for the role and when and how to use them. Example: If you queue as a Shadow Tank, you should have and frequently use Kinetic Ward, you should know who to Guard (bonus for why), and how to taunt.

 

2. If you do not know the instance or fights, speak up instead of waiting to be asked. There are mechanics capable of wiping an on-level, properly geared team in every flash point. If something is unclear, ask for clarification. It's better to type and read a few lines of text than to wipe and then type and read a few lines of text when everyone is angry with you.

 

3. Only the tank pulls / starts fights.

 

4. Only the tank breaks CC. Sometimes this means you should not use Area of Effect skills.

 

5. Roll Need only on items that are immediate upgrades for you. "Immediate upgrade" means you will equip it or strip the mods and equip them right now. Note that this precludes rolling Need for gear for Companions unless they are right there in the instance with you. (Companions can be appropriately geared for a few thousand credits on GTN every 4 levels. It's not worth angering your Powertech tank to roll Need on that pretty orange Aim chestpiece for Kaliyo.)

 

5a. If the item is an appropriate upgrade for you but over your level, Need is only OK if nobody else who can equip it right now has rolled Need.

 

6. Kill order for DD's is weakest to strongest unless otherwise directed.

 

7. Avoid stuff on the ground that the mobs put there.

 

8. Never yell, "GO GO GO!" at the tank. The tank sets the pace. If you want to set the pace, learn how to tank. If the tank is consistently moving painfully slowly, someone else will speak up before too long.

 

9. Run to the tank or the group if you get aggro. Running away makes it much harder to peel aggro off you and ensures whatever is chasing you will kill you.

 

10. Never use a skill that repositions mobs unless it is guaranteed to take them out of the fight. Doing this makes the tank's job of gathering and holding aggro much more difficult.

 

Extra Credit

 

Do these things consistently and you are certain to land on the friend lists of competent tanks and healers. Get on enough of these and you are virtually guaranteed an instant queue.

 

1. If the healer gets aggro and the tank doesn't immediately address it, peel that mob off the healer. Even if it kills you. A healer can't heal anyone else if he's getting destroyed. A good healer will realize what you did and increase priority on healing you for the rest of the instance.

 

2. If there's a lull due to an AFK or something, stand still instead of running and jumping about like a Mexican Jumping Bean on a speedball. Make pleasant conversation. This demonstrates patience and maturity, two social qualities that are highly desired but woefully lacking in players of online games.

 

3. Mark your own CC targets if you know the fight.

 

4. If you know the instance well, ask at the beginning if anyone is new to it. If they are, say you'll stop and explain the fights with important mechanics before the fights, then do so. If you know skips or easy ways to complete puzzles (I'm looking at you, Collocoid War Games), offer it up ahead of time but don't demand it.

 

5. If the tank and/or healer were good, whisper them at the end telling them so. Citing something they did exceptionally well or something you learned from them is a big plus, if applicable. Ask if they would mind you putting them on your friends list. Social Skills 101.

Edited December 10, 2013 by DarthTHC

[morfius]

DarthTHC's Rules for Not Sucking in Flashpoints

 

It's really not that hard...

 

1. Queue only for roles for which you are properly geared, specced, and knowledgeable in executing. You don't have to know the fights, but you do have to know what the right skills are for the role and when and how to use them. Example: If you queue as a Shadow Tank, you should have and frequently use Kinetic Ward, you should know who to Guard (bonus for why), and how to taunt.

 

2. If you do not know the instance or fights, speak up instead of waiting to be asked. There are mechanics capable of wiping an on-level, properly geared team in every flash point. If something is unclear, ask for clarification. It's better to type and read a few lines of text than to wipe and then type and read a few lines of text when everyone is angry with you.

 

3. Only the tank pulls / starts fights.

 

4. Only the tank breaks CC. Sometimes this means you cannot use Area of Effect skills.

 

5. Roll Need only on items that are immediate upgrades for you. "Immediate upgrade" means you will equip it or strip the mods and equip them right now. Note that this precludes rolling Need for gear for Companions unless they are right there in the instance with you. (Companions can be appropriately geared for a few thousand credits on GTN every 4 levels. It's not worth angering your Powertech tank to roll Need on that pretty orange Aim chestpiece for Kaliyo.)

 

6. Kill order for DD's is weakest to strongest unless otherwise directed.

 

7. Avoid stuff on the ground that the mobs put there.

 

 

Extra Credit

 

Do these things consistently and you are certain to land on the friend lists of competent tanks and healers. Get on enough of these and you are virtually guaranteed an instant queue.

 

1. If the healer gets aggro and the tank doesn't immediately address it, peel that mob off the healer. Even if it kills you. A healer can't heal anyone else if he's getting destroyed. A good healer will realize what you did and increase priority on healing you for the rest of the instance.

 

2. If there's a lull due to an AFK or something, stand still instead of running and jumping about like a Mexican Jumping Bean on a speedball. Make pleasant conversation. This demonstrates patience and maturity, two social qualities that are highly desired but woefully lacking in players of online games.

 

3. Mark your own CC targets if you know the fight.

 

4. If you know the instance well, ask at the beginning if anyone is new to it. If they are, say you'll stop and explain the fights with important mechanics before the fights, then do so. If you know skips or easy ways to complete puzzles (I'm looking at you, Collocoid War Games), offer it up ahead of time but don't demand it.

 

5. If the tank and/or healer were good, whisper them at the end telling them so. Citing something they did exceptionally well or something you learned from them is a big plus, if applicable. Ask if they would mind you putting them on your friends list. Social Skills 101.

 

Just to add - weak/normal mobs in large trash groups or as ads most of time are DPS jobs, as tank I am not always in position to get them all for long or as DPS I have seen best result just nuking them hard as they run/shot to healer.

After all this is not WoW and AOE agro is limited ... LOS helps some time but still.

Just nuke those weak / normal ones that tend to hit healer - they die so fast that you are not going to miss your big numbers on stronger ones.

[DarthTHC]

Just to add - weak/normal mobs in large trash groups or as ads most of time are DPS jobs, as tank I am not always in position to get them all for long or as DPS I have seen best result just nuking them hard as they run/shot to healer.

After all this is not WoW and AOE agro is limited ... LOS helps some time but still.

Just nuke those weak / normal ones that tend to hit healer - they die so fast that you are not going to miss your big numbers on stronger ones.

 

That's the reason for #6 in the first list.

[morfius]

That's the reason for #6 in the first list.

 

There will be weak ones in main group and some times some (one) running to healer - it had to burn first if weak or cc/stun if not ... no matter what.

Simple rule that I tend to follow ... never failed me in FP on my DPS ones.

[DarthTHC]

Let me tell you a story about a brilliant tank I had this weekend.

 

I wanted to run through the Agent story again because of how awesome it is, so I rolled an Operative healer. I'm leveling it via flashpoints and planetary missions, completely skipping the class missions because I want to do them all back-to-back-to-back for the best view of the story.

 

Anyway, I queue into Cademimu as a healer and off we go.

 

Straight away, the tank does not guard me (or anyone else - the OP operative would have been a good choice too). Instead he leaps right into that first fight even before the last DPS has fully zoned in. In that first fight, the tank leaps right to the droid (that I kept trying to CC) and stays on it, forsaking all other targets. Luckily enough, we had a very competent operative DPS with us.

 

So the tank is focusing on the droid and his health is dropping like he's standing in acid or something. Those things have a lot of health, but they hit like catatonic kittens. Health dropping like that should not be happening.

 

I heal the group through it and inspect his gear. Here we are in Cademimu, a high-20's / low 30's flashpoint and he has some level 17 greens on him. Also, as a Juggernaut, he has a Willpower earpiece. Oh joy.

 

I mentioned in party that with his gear, he might want to exercise caution in his pulls. He responded by insulting me.

 

Now let me give you some advice. If you are an under-geared, under-skilled tank, the very last thing you should ever do is insult your healer. It will never lead to a positive experience for you. Never.

 

I informed him that I would only be healing him if he was able to hold aggro, and that healing priority would be on everyone else otherwise.

 

Once we get to the bottom of the elevator and the tank leapt into the middle of everything and ran around like a headless chicken on a speedballl pulling everything, I decided I was completely done healing him. Due to awesome DPS, we survived the fight (but the tank did not).

 

The DPS and I shared some conversations in whispers. I told the assassin DPS to pull aggro as much as he could and told the Operative DPS to go as wild as he wanted and promised they would not die as long as I stayed up. (A promise I kept, sometimes by the skin of my health bar.)

 

They asked me if I wanted to boot the tank. I told them, no, I wanted to see how many times he would die before learning his lesson.

 

He never left the flash point. I think he broke 10 deaths. I don't think he learned anything.

 

But 2 DPS and I got a fun flashpoint story out of it so I guess that's a win?

Edited December 10, 2013 by DarthTHC

[DarthVengeant]

When is Bioware going to address this? It is silly that a DPS have to sit 30-45min in a queue for a hardmode, and 50% of the time the tank leave the party, and you have to requeue.

 

I have sat for 2 hrs in que just to test it. Not one single pop. I quit even trying months ago now. It's not worth it. The only time I do FP's now is with guildies in a group. Ohh, and good freakin luck getting the CZ Flashpoints done for the weekly in a que!!!! Not going to happen. The only way that happens is with guildies.

[MillionsKNives]

5a. If the item is an appropriate upgrade for you but over your level, Need is only OK if nobody else who can equip it right now has rolled Need.

 

I disagree with this. If you're running through the instance and it's an upgrade for you then you have every right to need on it, no matter your level.

 

8. Never yell, "GO GO GO!" at the tank. The tank sets the pace. If you want to set the pace, learn how to tank. If the tank is consistently moving painfully slowly, someone else will speak up before too long.

 

Is you telling the tank to go faster any different than waiting for someone else to tell the tank to go faster? Either one requires someone to tell the tank to go faster.

 

10. Never use a skill that repositions mobs unless it is guaranteed to take them out of the fight. Doing this makes the tank's job of gathering and holding aggro much more difficult.

 

Unless you're trying to group them up for AOE. It's the spreading them out that's a pain in the ***.

 

2. If there's a lull due to an AFK or something, stand still instead of running and jumping about like a Mexican Jumping Bean on a speedball. Make pleasant conversation. This demonstrates patience and maturity, two social qualities that are highly desired but woefully lacking in players of online games.

 

I don't really see the problem here. I jump around because it's something to do with my hands when I have nothing better to do. It's no different than absent mindedly playing with a desk toy or twiddling my thumbs. It's not about being impatient or mature. If you watched my character during most of my officer meetings I'd be circling the fleet and/or jumping around aimlessly. That's because I'm too busy concentrating on the meeting, but at the same time keeping my hands busy with nothing. I've occasionally happened to get into a loop with one of the other officers around the fleet too.

 

 

Other than that I agree with your list.

[DarthTHC]

I disagree with this. If you're running through the instance and it's an upgrade for you then you have every right to need on it, no matter your level.

 

It is bad form to take an item that you cannot equip away from someone who can equip it.

 

Is you telling the tank to go faster any different than waiting for someone else to tell the tank to go faster? Either one requires someone to tell the tank to go faster.

 

Yes, because you aren't being the impatient jerk. Let someone else do that.

 

Unless you're trying to group them up for AOE. It's the spreading them out that's a pain in the ***.

 

Fair point.

 

I don't really see the problem here. I jump around because it's something to do with my hands when I have nothing better to do. It's no different than absent mindedly playing with a desk toy or twiddling my thumbs. It's not about being impatient or mature. If you watched my character during most of my officer meetings I'd be circling the fleet and/or jumping around aimlessly. That's because I'm too busy concentrating on the meeting, but at the same time keeping my hands busy with nothing. I've occasionally happened to get into a loop with one of the other officers around the fleet too.

 

Appearances. We're trying to get DD's onto tank & healer friend lists.

[CommanderKeeva]

DarthTHC's Rules for Not Sucking in Flashpoints

 

8. Never yell, "GO GO GO!" at the tank. The tank sets the pace. If you want to set the pace, learn how to tank. If the tank is consistently moving painfully slowly, someone else will speak up before too long.

 

Sometimes you really get these tanks who stop before every trash mob for a minute, offer a carefully detailed tactical analysis of the situation and mob composition, meticulously mark every single mob for CC (even ones that die just by looking at them), predetermine a kill order and dutifully trigger a ready check to make sure that the pull does not happen unexpectedly.

 

A few times I've seen tanks do exactly this. I can understand if they want to stop to allow some vital skills to come off cooldown but some tanks really take this to extreme levels of preparation for a 3-second fight.

Edited December 10, 2013 by CommanderKeeva