Jedi Guardian Changes - Game Update 2.5

[JonnyMadDog]

Lez try n get back on topic here plz.

 

Vig JK Grds need buffs to alot of stuff, to sum up, plz B-Ware respond to this thread and implement some of r ideas and buff alot of stuff, thx!

[rpeplins]

I didn't make it through the whole thread, I lack the time right now but I wanted to make sure I got this in, in case no one else suggested it. If it's been brought up before, sorry.

 

How about making Ravage/Master Strike mobile for Juggernauts/Guardians? Instead of rooting our opponent, make us able to move around while channeling it. That seems more in line with the Guardian/Juggernaut class style (cc immunity after leap, Force Choke/Force Stasis differences, etc) but still gives us a bit of an advantage with staying on target and making a MS/Rav more likely to finish appropriately.

 

Just my thought of a way to change it. Don't get me wrong, I love the root, it's my favorite thing on my Marauder, but I'd like to see something different for Juggernauts and Guardians.

[GregAlia]

I didn't make it through the whole thread, I lack the time right now but I wanted to make sure I got this in, in case no one else suggested it. If it's been brought up before, sorry.

 

How about making Ravage/Master Strike mobile for Juggernauts/Guardians? Instead of rooting our opponent, make us able to move around while channeling it. That seems more in line with the Guardian/Juggernaut class style (cc immunity after leap, Force Choke/Force Stasis differences, etc) but still gives us a bit of an advantage with staying on target and making a MS/Rav more likely to finish appropriately.

 

Just my thought of a way to change it. Don't get me wrong, I love the root, it's my favorite thing on my Marauder, but I'd like to see something different for Juggernauts and Guardians.

 

It has been brought up but don't worry about it bud. I like/don't know if I like this idea. Lol. It certainly would be unique to us. I feel like Bioware won't go for it. Because master strike is so powerful I don't think they want us mobile. Well they are giving us a root you say, well there are so many root immunities over all the specs this still provides a lot of escape for other classes, which I feel is as intended. But hey it isn't a bad idea.

[ArenCordial]

It has been brought up but don't worry about it bud. I like/don't know if I like this idea. Lol. It certainly would be unique to us. I feel like Bioware won't go for it. Because master strike is so powerful I don't think they want us mobile. Well they are giving us a root you say, well there are so many root immunities over all the specs this still provides a lot of escape for other classes, which I feel is as intended. But hey it isn't a bad idea.

 

I think the biggest hurdle for that is for the animators to be able to get that done, which is why everyone had to resort to things like reduced channel times as an idea instead. And of course once you make one channel moveable everyone will want there's to get the same treatment.

 

 

And yes our most powerful attack at the moment is Master Strike, I would like it to not be. The fights they're designing now require us to be mobile. Increase Zen Strike sure, go for it. Master Strike should be filler, when it procs it's a nice boost but only a slight boost. I doubt we'll see armor pen since that's in the Focus tree already.

 

Honestly I agree. There's so many mobile fights and they only seem to be increasing that myself and a few other I know have turned to Focus spec. Boss fights with adds only improve Focus so Vigilance, once considered the PvE spec, is struggling to find a place in the game outside the Operations Dummy.

 

Frankly because I do think for whatever reason BioWare is afraid Master Strike/Zen Strike and because as much as those two abilities are the class' biggest strength, they also create a horde of problems, it would be best to have our primary ability be something we could rely on more than hoping we get a ton of static Nefra like fights.

 

What if instead we had a hard hitting ability with a short cooldown? A new ability something more like a Merciless Slash (not to make us more Sent like but just as a comparsion - instant, hard hitting, 6 second CD but with little to no resource cost). Throw a burn on it because that's Vig's thing so the class would gain a extra burn or two per rotation. It still hits hard, we could use it more often with a short cooldown. They could even animate after the old KotOR Flurry animation, so it maintains Master Strike's flair of a multi-hit attack. Just move Shien to be a regular Guardian skill.

 

I think that might solve a lot of whats holding us back. Anyway just an idea I figured I'd throw out for discussion while we are brainstorming.

Edited November 3, 2013 by ArenCordial

[Kaidensareno]

I didn't make it through the entire thread either, just the first few pages.. but I've seen making MS mobile several times. How about instead of making MS mobile, we give Vigi Guardians a talent that turns MS into an instant and delivers all of its DMG in one go, similar to the Tanking tree giving Force Stasis that nature.

[GregAlia]

I didn't make it through the entire thread either, just the first few pages.. but I've seen making MS mobile several times. How about instead of making MS mobile, we give Vigi Guardians a talent that turns MS into an instant and delivers all of its DMG in one go, similar to the Tanking tree giving Force Stasis that nature.

 

16k in one shot! Hell yeah talk about burst lol! People would go insane!

Edited November 3, 2013 by GregAlia

[GregAlia]

In reality though that would leave us with giant gaps in our rotation.

[Kaidensareno]

16k in one shot! Hell yeah talk about burst lol! People would go insane!

 

Yeah, that's a little overkill. Maybe make it an ability that once every <?> seconds you dump MS as an instant to avoid OPness.

[JonnyMadDog]

Hey ey've contributed, eph off w/ tellin mself to leave, ey've made several long posts w/ new ideas ey've thought up, or modded others', or just reiterated and summed up wat's been said to improve readability for devs/readrs in general. Ey can be clas rep, ey know alot of this spec been it since prelaunch, saw wat looked like a bunch of peopl bickering and insultin each othr and simply said should get back on topic, which of course there's nothin wrng w/ mentioning tnking/def spec here but it IS about '2.5' which has 1 Grd change and it's mainly about Vig spec and the bulk of these comments are about improving Vig spec as it's underappreciatd and many ops grps r prejudice against it for several dang rasons. The main thing is that r spec needs more improvements/abilities that will make ops grps want r spec more as cool as a root for p v P is for mastr strik, that does nothing for ops as thos targets are chmpion/platnum ranked and move. p v P r spec is eh, semi-alright/good enuff for now at least, ey rly think the focus needs to be on the ops effectiveness/efficiency mroe so then a p v P improvement.

 

With that being said about boses moving, in addition to a root coming, mastr strik being a mobile channel would b cool and has a slight chance at being implemented, but the backlash would be other builds would want one...but eh, some builds' abilities could probly use one as well, ey don't think they'll completely rule it out, but some of the above postrs are correct, it may be awhile/take alot for em to add that to it...

 

Making mastr strik not a channeled ability is likely a pipe-dreem and would be OP and scru r rotation up, but nice idea.

 

Ey support an offensive guard of some sort for Vig/offensive JK Grds, hey to make it more balanced, as ey am sure other hybrid tnk/deeps specs would want one, they may get one as well w/ this, but hey some, like Vgrd deeps, are in a similar boat and if it means r build gettin somethin if it takes them to get the same thing as well, so be it, at least r spec gets somethin cool even if it's not unique, ey think it will be implemented some time, or should be at least, but if so, likely will not be unique....Tho, they could tweak each offensive guard in gam to be implemented so each build that has one has a slightly diff effect, that'd be an interesting conundrum for gilds/grps to think about when deciding who/wat to bring for what.

 

Ey support the incoming root of course, p v P for all, but for p v E ey don't think it's been elaborated on and devs should address it, will it root wat typs of enemies if any in p v E? All non-chmpion/plat ranks? That'd be cool/feel balanced/right. Non-chmpion ranked enemies in p v E are treatd similar to p v P enemies, what w/ stuns n stuff, so what works in p v P should work on non-chmpion opponents, think it should be kept in line w/ the system in place.

 

Of course plas brand needs to be reworked completely, it could use another debuff or two and a severe base/whit dmg increase.

 

Mastr strik needs a whit/base dmg increase and rng improvement and CD on it reduction.

 

Another brn or two and/or bettr ones could be added to r spec.

 

Ey just simply, to reiterate mey last post, said wat's been said n suggested already for r spec pretty much covers evrything and feel most good ideas that could be added r already suggested and problems r spec has have been mostly addressed enuff to say, what ey was tryn to say, the bottom line is this thread is vitrually-'complete' meaning it just is waiting on dev response and addressing in an update, and evryone can likely go comment on other stuff at this pointm but hey, if got some cool idea to suggest still or problem to address still go for it. Just sayn.

 

Thx for readn!

[Riivan]

Whatever that was

 

Just no. No.

[JonnyMadDog]

YES!YES!YES! -d bry and mself.

 

Now there was no need for that rudeness, eph off w/ it, either contribute to the thread or get out, hypocrit, tryn to call mself out on not contributing wat was that last post then? Back to yr bridge w/ the rest of the peopl who r meen to mself on the servrs ey've been on and forums ey've visited, yr so big hidin behind yr comps insultn mself, pathetyc.

Ey've made nothin but contributive posts on thsi thread and yrself doesn't know mself, again get back on topic.

[Riivan]

Spell your words correctly and use decent grammar, then I might pay attention to what you say. Everyone has to decipher what you say and most of it is just ra ra BS. You have contributed nothing that hasn't already been stated. And no way will you be the Guard rep unless we all have a very twisted sense of humor.

 

Back on topic though. Are there any other ideas for a utility skill? So far we have the offensive guard, alacrity buff, and aoe dmg reduction/inc heal received.

[JonnyMadDog]

Ey can typ or refuse to typ certain words correctly or not if ey want to, don't start w/ the grammr nazeing, sik of that buls- in gam, no need to bring it to forums. It's decipherable, yew rly think yew speak for the whole pop? Yr just a rude persn. Yew obviously r givin merit to mey posts if yew keep responding to them, and how can yew know all of wat ey've suggested if yew admit yew haven't read or can't read wat ey suggest? And it's not up to yew who picks clas reps, yr not the ruler of this gam. Would say pick on someon else but nah shouldn't pick on anyone, contribute or 'move alon'.

 

Back on topic, that's not all the utility that's been suggested either by mself or others, whether or not ey've reiterated them. Ey've discussed how 2 offensive grds would work and that other builds may need to get one if r spec gets one, which no one else seemed to share that presumption, some things r spec may get, another may get as well, at least some variation of said ability, but that's not necessarily a negativ thing.

 

Am on the fence about an alacrity buff for grps, it's rly not much nor needed, ey concur w/ the one postr above who said they're not big on it, unless said alacrity buff is the op-wide focus/energy buff from combat focus (ey suggested first on this thread), either that ability as it is, or it modified/used in a combo with another ability or after an event has passed for said op-wide buff to occur OR an entirely new ability like combat focus only for the op not just the indiv., however it'd be implemented, would be cool utility to have and be r spec's inspiraton, like Sentls have.

 

Ey've suggested simply taking Inspir away from Sentls and givin it to r build, as it does seem weird for the pure deeps clas w/ bettr totl deeps already w/o it to have it, it seems not only in name but in its effect something r build would have, but will c on this, may not be needed as it'd take a bit of reworking on their part and a nrf to them isn't necessarily a buff to r spec plus they already have the nrf of only needing one in grp for it and it being op-wide soon coming, so think would rather have the op-wide energy boost instead. Think of this...VIGILANCE...VIGILANT...ALWAYS-READY...BY HAVING A TON OF ENERGY available at a moments notice.

Plas brand has aleady been suggested to have not just more dmg as does all/mastr strik mainly needs to have but more/stronger effects, a slow/trauma w/ it.

Here's an idea...overhed slash x 2 can grant x2 stacks of making blad strm crit next use maybe add a buff by an ability to make mastr strik crit as well?

The idea of making mastr strik a mobile channel again is cool but other builds will want some form of mobile channel...

Ey'v suggested mastr strik's incoming root for p v P be usable in p v E on all non-chmpion ranked enemies, as is usual for p v P abilities do have an effect on.

Shield from area attaks other tnk buidls have r spec doesn't been suggested...

Hey, here's something...maybe an armor increase/mitigation increase for whole op/grp up to heavy rank lvls for a temporary period of time?

 

 

Will be back latr, late atm, plz if yew have somethin contributive to add don't hesitate to do so, save r spec!

Edited November 4, 2013 by JonnyMadDog
Edit typo.

[Alec_Fortescue]

Dunno, never seen an Operation Boss in PvP gear

 

But again, I don't think that Defensive Abilities are the key to our DPS problem : we're not Off Tanks, we're DPS. Else we'll see the Nerf Chainsaw really Soon™ as Shadow did

 

Nope. You're right that they're both two different stories. It's just that Juggernaut dps looks very poor compared to other dps classes when it comes to defense.

 

And you guys don't even dare commenting on Johnny's grammar.

Edited November 4, 2013 by Alec_Fortescue

[Keleus]

No, Johnny Boy there needs to go, like yesterday he needs to be gone.

 

Moving on from that:

 

Instant cast Master Strike? lolNOPE, be way too powerful. 10k (Not crit)-20k (Most often lol) in an instant, you have any idea how beastly broken that would be in anything? Although, I will say that it's interesting thought given to using more stronger single hit moves instead of a channeled ability.

 

New Proposal(s) (?): Keep our Armor Pen idea, that stuff will come in handy with what is about to be written by me/read by you. 20% passive armor pen from Narrowed Focus, this way all of our moves that are white damage just became that much more effective.

 

Master Strike used to not be the core of our rotation let alone our class' DPS, but this was also when we kind of sucked as a DPS class entirely. If we were to go back to that point, BioWare would have to completely redo our class in a sense, remake the rotation and it's moves set entirely, possibly add in a new type of strike as a few of you had proposed already. While not impossible and not exactly a bad idea, keep in mind that this is not the path of least resistance and is an immensely difficult thing for any designer to do.

 

That said, let's say we took/are given that path. Master Strike is completely redesigned to no longer be a channeled ability. Insanity ensues! But only temporarily because while it is not an instant cast ability, it's damage has to be lowered considerably or else it becomes just way too damn strong. In it's stead however since we are now left with a rather noticeable gap in our rotation from the lack of a channel, we need a move in it's place. Something that either A) Hit's like a truck while offering absolutely zero utility to it's death dealing abilities, or B) Simply hits with a moderate amount of damage and well, does something else, like increase the damage of whichever move comes next or leaves one hell of a burn/refreshes burns, something. My advice? Take the strike that does utility. This way, you're basically making it that Master Strike does 60% of it's former damage while this move does the other 40% or even ramped up 50%.

 

The next big issue is finding room on your action bars for it, and whether or not you need to remove other moves such as Force Sweep (granted to us by Effluence) for this move and what exactly would our numbers have to be afterwards to make it all balanced in a PvP standpoint as well.

 

Either way, I'm feeling very bored so well, here- Oh and sorry for this, I know I'm pretty much ranting and rambling at this point but somebody woke me up hours before I usually do soooooo yeaaaaaaaa sorry again. If anything useful comes from this let me know XD:

 

Narrowed Focus - In addition to it's previous effect, this talent now also grants the user to have all attacks ignore 20% of the enemy's armor while Shien Form is active.

 

Plasmabrand - Skill has been reworked: Direct Damage has been increased and the DoT time has been shortened from 12 seconds to 9 (DoT Damage has not been lowered), and while target's are affected by Plasmabrand, all elemental damage dealt by you and your allies is increased by 5% and refreshes all burns (friendly included) on the enemy target.

 

Keening - DoT Damage increase has been upped to 12% (Up from 9%)

 

Master Strike - Ability has been reworked: Master Strike is no longer a channeled abiltiy but is now instant cast and it's animation has been changed to suit it. It's damage has also been greatly reduced (down roughly 40%) and it's Cooldown has been lowered to 20 (15 maybe?) Seconds (Keep in mind Zen Strikes and all the other talents still work for refreshing this move) and the move still costs 0 Focus to use.

 

Effluence has been removed.

 

Warrior's Slash (Guardian)/Reaver's Blow (Juggernaut) - This talent replaces Effluence, making Force Sweep strictly a Defense and Focus Guardian only standard. We would still have access to it for AoE Purposes, but seeing as how AoE, real AoE I should add comes rarely for us, and even then it's uh, rather lack luster, this shouldn't be that much of a lost/missed trait for us, thus we would become a single target powerhouse DPS Spec.

 

Warrior's Slash - Deals X - Y Amount of damage to enemy target, and heals all nearby allies in the Guardians Party for 25% of the damage dealt instantly. In addition, Warrior's Slash has a 30% chance to grant Justice, which increases the damage of all melee moves by 10% for the next 10 Seconds (This is easily argued for the effect, so have at it gents, I know you want to). 10 Second Cooldown, costs 5 Focus (also argued easily, Damn it Jim, I'm a Gamer, not a Dev!)

 

Preparation has been removed

 

In Preparation's stead we have Graceful Inspiration: Reduces the Focus cost of Warrior's Slash by 3 and whenever Master Strike, Overhead Slash, and Warrior's Slash deals damage, all Raid and Party Members gain Graceful Acts, increasing their Alacrity by 1% for 10 Seconds. Stacks 3 Times. (Because contrary to popular belief, alacrity helps other classes with stuff a good bit. Not a whopping amount, but a little certainly doesn't hurt and this is a tad more useful then preparation's current "Convenience"). In addition, whenever Overhead Slash deals Damage, there is a 20/40% Chance that Warrior's Slash becomes Instant Cast (meaning it ignores the GCD). This would still be a 2 Point Talent.

 

Mind you gentlemen (and possible ladies) that this is all just stuff spewing from my over-stewed brain, but I think some of these could be implemented, some right now actually without changing a damn thing. A simple ramp up in damage with the instant use moves we already have would be pretty useful and quite possibly fix the majority of what's wrong. This was done in fun and pretty much good spirit.

 

But hey,

 

 

If it works,

 

If this is doable and is better then what we have now,

 

Feel free to take it XD

Edited November 4, 2013 by Keleus

[Keleus]

Addendum* OH DEAR GOD NEARLY FORGOT!

 

With the change in pace for us our threat would be through the roof! We'd be hitting as hard as trucks but as fast as jets, so how do we fix that?

 

Focused Defense - Skill has been slightly reworked: Threat Decrease has been greatly increased, and no longer costs any Focus to use.

 

 

XD Sorry.

[VitalityPrime]

Addendum* Focused Defense - Skill has been slightly reworked: Threat Decrease has been greatly increased, and no longer costs any Focus to use.

XD Sorry.

 

Please no. Never make this change.

 

Dropping threat to save yourself goes against everything a tank/guardian is/should be...in my opinion.

 

To be honest I would rather the threat decrease be completely removed...and the cost reduced to 2 focus. (just so that the Focus tree skill still has value)

Edited November 4, 2013 by VitalityPrime

[Keleus]

So wait, let me get this straight (Granted I might have nixed a name or two here) But you as a DPS -Do Not- want anything that lowers/instantly wipes the amount of threat you make? So say you pull aggro from doing an amazing job with your DPS and/or your tank is terribad, you don't want something that can in an instant lower the amount of threat you previously did?

 

 

Rest of the Forums want to comment on this? Because uh, I'm having a hard time believing this guy.

 

To be fair, I could see Focused Defense being a very useful tank talent if the threat part wasn't there, so how about we make it that while in Soresu Form Focused Defense does not lower one's threat.

 

 

EDIT* I went and looked at the Focus Tree and I see what you mean, and holy crap that's an oversight. At the moment I don't quite have a legitimate idea for a replacement and thankfully I'm not a Dev so one doesn't have to worry too much. However you could also make an argument for having that talent be reworked so that Focused Defense grants you additional Percentages Healed per skill point spent on it.

Edited November 4, 2013 by Keleus

[VitalityPrime]

So wait, let me get this straight (Granted I might have nixed a name or two here) But you as a DPS -Do Not- want anything that lowers/instantly wipes the amount of threat you make? So say you pull aggro from doing an amazing job with your DPS and/or your tank is terribad, you don't want something that can in an instant lower the amount of threat you previously did?

 

 

Rest of the Forums want to comment on this? Because uh, I'm having a hard time believing this guy.

 

To be fair, I could see Focused Defense being a very useful tank talent if the threat part wasn't there, so how about we make it that while in Soresu Form Focused Defense does not lower one's threat.

 

Yeah, I guess I should mention I'm coming at this topic from a Soresu/tank perspective.

 

Dropping the threat decrease while in Soresu is a great idea...because I can definitely see why a non-tank would want the threat decrease...but dropping threat to survive as a tank is an idea I will never be able to get behind.

Edited November 4, 2013 by VitalityPrime

[Keleus]

Nor should you, although I remember why that move was created in the first place; Specifically for Vigilance to drop threat for the few that were really good at doing it at the time. However to keep up with the times and make sure everyone is given a gift on Christmas, I could easily see Soresu Form not dumping threat for Focused Defense being a thing.

[JonnyMadDog]

Dunno if the 'don't dare bash mself' comment is legit or not, if no thx for support. And no ey don't need to go.

 

Back on track. Concerning this new discussion about tnkers being able to drop thret, dunno if def-speccd Grds get focusd defense ability, if so, it has it's uses, even for tnkers, disagree with yaz on that, but agree it's mainly for ot's/tertiary tnkers not so much mt's, it does spend focus to recover so if a tnk if good in a certain situation for extra heals since they're nto doing much dmg anyways, if they have good skill w/ tants/several tants off cd, go ahead if they can get thret back feel free to drop thret for a split sec, yes agree it's not preferable for hi-end content but for say a Vig/deeps Grdian queued as a tnker as well or just a tnker for 50 fps or maybe an ot, if there's several, or one needs to take their place after awhile/a debuff stack limit reached, disagree with yaz, focusd def has it's place w/ tnking specs, it makes sense, mean,why wouldn't a tnker spec NOT have a thret release? And it goes w/o sayign why deeps should have and do have thret releases, dunno the hayt focusd def is gettin w/ the last few posts.

 

Anyways be back altr to check on if any mods/devs give this thread a response, it needs at least one, feel threads w/ the most chance/that end up getting implemented, idea-wise, are commented on by devs first, even if they have a question regarding an idea, feel free to ask r help devs, if it means balancing the gam both sides want to help w/ making bettr cause all like it, do it. Save r spec! Have...VIGILANCE!

[Riivan]

Narrowed Focus - In addition to it's previous effect, this talent now also grants the user to have all attacks ignore 20% of the enemy's armor while Shien Form is active.

 

I don't see this change being implemented. But the theory crafters can have at it.

 

Plasmabrand - Skill has been reworked: Direct Damage has been increased and the DoT time has been shortened from 12 seconds to 9 (DoT Damage has not been lowered), and while target's are affected by Plasmabrand, all elemental damage dealt by you and your allies is increased by 5% and refreshes all burns (friendly included) on the enemy target.

 

One of the problems that I think a lot of people are running into is attaching too many extra bits to skills. I don't think the last two bits of this is necessary the last part in particular. This change only serves to up our burst which isn't amazing, but isn't terrible. Keep the dot at 12 seconds. I would increase the length of our other dots to 9 though.

 

Keening - DoT Damage increase has been upped to 12% (Up from 9%)

 

I'd probably leave this at 9 and get the gains from the abilities themselves.

 

Master Strike - Ability has been reworked: Master Strike is no longer a channeled abiltiy but is now instant cast and it's animation has been changed to suit it. It's damage has also been greatly reduced (down roughly 40%) and it's Cooldown has been lowered to 20 (15 maybe?) Seconds (Keep in mind Zen Strikes and all the other talents still work for refreshing this move) and the move still costs 0 Focus to use.

 

I rather like the way it is if it were moved to the filler roll that it has in the Sent priority system.

 

Effluence has been removed.

 

Noooooooo! Just because we aren't depended upon for our AoE doesn't mean we should nerf it. Plus sweep was a good filler.

 

Warrior's Slash (Guardian)/Reaver's Blow (Juggernaut) - This talent replaces Effluence, making Force Sweep strictly a Defense and Focus Guardian only standard. We would still have access to it for AoE Purposes, but seeing as how AoE, real AoE I should add comes rarely for us, and even then it's uh, rather lack luster, this shouldn't be that much of a lost/missed trait for us, thus we would become a single target powerhouse DPS Spec.

 

Warrior's Slash - Deals X - Y Amount of damage to enemy target, and heals all nearby allies in the Guardians Party for 25% of the damage dealt instantly. In addition, Warrior's Slash has a 30% chance to grant Justice, which increases the damage of all melee moves by 10% for the next 10 Seconds (This is easily argued for the effect, so have at it gents, I know you want to). 10 Second Cooldown, costs 5 Focus (also argued easily, Damn it Jim, I'm a Gamer, not a Dev!)

 

I really don't think we need a heal ability, especially one that is this powerful. This ability is basically Combat and Watchmen sents mixed into one ability. We want to be less like them haha not more.

 

Preparation has been removed

 

In Preparation's stead we have Graceful Inspiration: Reduces the Focus cost of Warrior's Slash by 3 and whenever Master Strike, Overhead Slash, and Warrior's Slash deals damage, all Raid and Party Members gain Graceful Acts, increasing their Alacrity by 1% for 10 Seconds. Stacks 3 Times. (Because contrary to popular belief, alacrity helps other classes with stuff a good bit. Not a whopping amount, but a little certainly doesn't hurt and this is a tad more useful then preparation's current "Convenience"). In addition, whenever Overhead Slash deals Damage, there is a 20/40% Chance that Warrior's Slash becomes Instant Cast (meaning it ignores the GCD). This would still be a 2 Point Talent.

 

I applaud the attempt. You are at least thinking outside the box and offering up a solution that doesn't put everything on Master Strike.

[Keleus]

For being half asleep when I wrote that I'm surprised you didn't ream me like the usual Internet Based Forums lol

 

I would prefer to shorten the timer on Plasmabrand and add something into it because the move itself really is lack luster dude, look at it then compare it to other classes abilities while taking into account their move set. Ours is by far one of the worst I have ever seen in a game.

 

As for the self heal, yea ok I get that, I really do, but last I checked sentinels as a whole only healed themselves, not the entire raid group, (by group I mean the 3 people stuck with the guardian, not the whole thing, that'd be nuts). As for the move itself, I rather like the idea, idky, but I do, and I really think we'd benefit from something of the sort.

 

The DoTs themselves and Keening, well, I still think one of the two needs an increase in their damage. Not a stellar high amount, but something to buffer it up a little. Master Strike, like I mentioned, can't really be changed all that much. We can, but not the move itself because Knights as a whole rely on that move. What I can propose in lieu of EVERYTHING here is simple skill/stance stacking like somebody mentioned earlier, i.e each move does something extra depending on which stance you take, i.e Riposte does the threat building and is usable only after a successful defensive check in Soresu, but becomes a completely different power hitting move in Shi-Cho, and Slash hits harder and costs 0 Focus in Shien. Guard lowers threat and protects an opponent in Soresu, but Buffs Damage and healing in Shien, etc etc, I believe you my friend are smart enough to get the idea.

 

This way we avoid skill bloating, too much talent tree rework, and can solve a few of the issues currently presented to us. Also, I actually kind of like the idea I presented with changing Preparation to Graceful Inspiration minus the Warrior's Slash stuff. And if I may ask, why would it be so much for them to give us 20% armor penetration for shien form via Narrow Focus?

 

EDIT* I almost forgot to address the Effluence thing. Force Sweep is good filler as of now. If the above changes were ever made, or if any changes to our class not being dependent upon master strike were made, we'd have to completely let FS go in lieu of stronger, harder hitting abilities that didn't hinder our newly constructed rotation.

Edited November 4, 2013 by Keleus

[ArenCordial]

 

As for the self heal, yea ok I get that, I really do, but last I checked sentinels as a whole only healed themselves, not the entire raid group, (by group I mean the 3 people stuck with the guardian, not the whole thing, that'd be nuts). As for the move itself, I rather like the idea, idky, but I do, and I really think we'd benefit from something of the sort.

 

This is incorrect. Watchman Sentinels heal themselves and their group when they hit Zen. That's where the comments of the heals being too Sent like come from.

 

@Riivan I think were both on the same page that we'd like to see Master Strike just really become filler and remove the problems around it and Zen Strike, but what are you thinking will pick up the dps slack? I like the idea of extending the burns but we'd need a whole lot more dps added in to make up for less Master Strikes. Or did I misunderstand? (Genuinely curious on what you'd like to see done).

Edited November 4, 2013 by ArenCordial

[Riivan]

@Kel My reasoning for keeping it at 12 was to keep it from affecting our burst too much. When you factor in the proposed increased damage on the initial hit and our dots it could get sticky real quick. Watchmen do heal others in their party. I'm not opposed to it, but we get dangerously close to Sentinel territory if we start that one up. Also not opposed to buffing Keening. They might put that in there, it just feels clunky to basically have 2 identical skills or effects in both dps trees. No reason to kill our free force sweep. It's good filler and it's better than cyclone slash.

 

@Aren I'm not entirely sure. Buffing the dots is one way. Maybe having dispatch be more of a go to skill.