StarMagus Posted October 12, 2013 Author Share Posted October 12, 2013 . . . was kind of weird, but more a result of what the folks at Bioware thought would appeal to whoever they see as their main demographic than an accurate sample of what romances for force users would be like according to lore. But hey, lore doesn't materialize out of nothing, so who knows. *shrug* That's why I ask. I mean you find out about a universe because of how things are presented to you. Even if they don't say "This is how things are" you assume that the traits you shown by characters and organizations in a story are the traits of the organization unless other wise pointed out. I mean we all think of wookies as being strong because Chewbacca was strong ((just from the first 3 movies)). If suddenly we go to his homeworld and every one of that race isn't strong but instead are shown to be weaker than normal humans and speak perfect English we'd have a moment of... "Err.. what the... " before having to align the new information with what was shown before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshlaBoga Posted October 12, 2013 Share Posted October 12, 2013 I think no matter how you play the Warrior, you just break something inside of her head. So if I break more things inside LS Jaesa psyche , will she sleep with me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarMagus Posted October 12, 2013 Author Share Posted October 12, 2013 So if I break more things inside LS Jaesa psyche , will she sleep with me? Dear Love Doctor, They tell me you're an expert in the ways of peoples heart and as a Sith I don't have many people in the Empire that I can turn to to ask such questions. So I consider myself less evil then most Sith, in fact I have even flirted with the light side. Enough so that when I turned a Padawan from the Jedi, she stayed true to the Light when she began following me. All is good right? Wrong. Despite being her master and having her follow my lead and learn from my example she won't sleep with me! Is there a way for me to mentally break her enough so the idea of sleeping with me isn't so against her belief structure that she looks ill every time I put the moves on her? Yours... High and Dry with the Light. Dear High and Dry with the Light. You are as much a sicko as the rest of the Sith. If I could have you arrested before you tried to force yourself on this girl I would. The Love Doctor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VitalityPrime Posted October 12, 2013 Share Posted October 12, 2013 (edited) I always thought that this: JK romances his current/former Padawan JC romances his current Padawan SW romances his current apprentice, a former Jedi Padawan (but only after driving her insane) SI romances a former Jedi Padawan (not sure if she becomes his apprentice?) . . . was kind of weird, but more a result of what the folks at Bioware thought would appeal to whoever they see as their main demographic than an accurate sample of what romances for force users would be like according to lore. But hey, lore doesn't materialize out of nothing, so who knows. *shrug* I mean, if someone writes a novel where all of the romances are between a male teacher and a young female student, it doesn't really matter why he wrote it that way. Maybe he wrote it that way because he thinks that the people who will read his novel are young men that will find the idea of a young female student as a love interest appealing. Maybe he has a thing for that sort of romance himself. Or maybe he had some complex, unique social system in mind that he wanted to portray. Who knows? Regardless, the result is that relationships between a male teacher and a young female student are not uncommon in the "lore" of the world that the writer created, at least not in the eyes of the readers. The JK and Kira definitely do not belong in that list. The Knight and Kira are really just two Knights...not really Master and Apprentice...definitely not teacher and student. You meet her and kickass with her way before she is even asigned as your padawan. Also, her being asigned as your padawan is simply just a technicality because Kiwiks is not around. The JK and Kira really walk the same path at the same level. If Kira and Kiwiks were not sent to Coruscant by Satele, Kira would be there with you getting the rank of Knight for saving Tython. To use an analogy...if the Jedi were a sports team...it wouldn't be a Coach/Player relationship like you make it out to be...it would be more of a Team Captain/Teammate relationship. Edited October 12, 2013 by VitalityPrime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarMagus Posted October 12, 2013 Author Share Posted October 12, 2013 (edited) The JK and Kira definitely do not belong in that list. I disagree, she's clearly called his Padawan multiple times and by multiple people in game, out of game even Bioware calls her his Padawan. Also, her being asigned as your padawan is simply just a technicality because Kiwiks is not around. And at that time she's not ready to be a Knight, so she's not at the same level as you are. Which is why your character is the Knight, and she's the Padawan. Her background in the story suggests she wasn't brought into the Jedi order until she was an "adult" so despite her looking to be the same age as most people do when they are ready to become a Knight, she doesn't have anywhere near the training. Edited October 12, 2013 by StarMagus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwena Posted October 12, 2013 Share Posted October 12, 2013 (edited) ^ Nicely put, StarMagus! The JK and Kira definitely do not belong in that list. Hi there, thanks for the summary! ^^ My Knight does not have Kira (yet!) so I tried not to mention any details of the Knight/Kira relationship when making my post. I do not believe it is incorrect, however, to state that Kira is at one point in the story the Knight's Padawan, and that she is thus his former Padawan later in the story. Of course, the details and nuances of a relationship are easily lost when given such a simple label, but that makes said label no less true. If they wanted to, I'm sure that Bioware could have chosen to write it so that Kira and the Knight were never officially Master and Padawan -- but they didn't, which was why I mentioned it. Mind you, I wasn't calling out every one of those relationships as necessarily bad or predatory or anything, I was simply pointing out the trend. Edited October 12, 2013 by Gwena Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VitalityPrime Posted October 12, 2013 Share Posted October 12, 2013 I disagree, she's clearly called his Padawan multiple times and by multiple people in game, out of game even Bioware calls her his Padawan. I'm not saying that she is never the JK's padawan by saying they don't deserve to be on that list. My point is that they are not the teacher/student relationship that the list tries to make them out to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarMagus Posted October 12, 2013 Author Share Posted October 12, 2013 (edited) I'm not saying that she is never the JK's padawan by saying they don't deserve to be on that list. My point is that they are not the teacher/student relationship that the list tries to make them out to be. She was his student, he was her Teacher. You can start flirting with her while she's still your student. Sure it's got some.. "I see, but...." to it, but I have no problem considering it as part of the how common are apprentice/master relationships in the SWTOR time question. It definitely gets a qualifier "By the time anything happens she is no longer your apprentice...." however. I still refer to my high school teachers as my teacher when they haven't been my teacher for almost 20 years. Edited October 12, 2013 by StarMagus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VitalityPrime Posted October 12, 2013 Share Posted October 12, 2013 (edited) She was his student, he was her Teacher. You can start flirting with her while she's still your student. Sure it's got some.. "I see, but...." to it, but I have no problem considering it as part of the how common are apprentice/master relationships in the SWTOR time question. It definitely gets a qualifier "By the time anything happens she is no longer your apprentice...." however. I think you two are just too solely focused on the superficial label of master/padawan...and not the actual story or people involved in the relationship. I would never view their relationship as a teacher/student one. To each their own I guess. Edited October 12, 2013 by VitalityPrime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarMagus Posted October 12, 2013 Author Share Posted October 12, 2013 I think you two are just too solely focused on the superficial label of master/padawan.... Considering the entire question asked by me to start this thread was to get an idea of how common such relationships were... Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianDavion Posted October 15, 2013 Share Posted October 15, 2013 saying DS Jaesa has a lot to make up for is a good description of the situation. She's spent her whole life hiding her desires, and supressing them etc. and now suddenly she's basicly told "nah don't need to do that." She's basicly making up for lost time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshlaBoga Posted October 15, 2013 Share Posted October 15, 2013 saying DS Jaesa has a lot to make up for is a good description of the situation. She's spent her whole life hiding her desires, and supressing them etc. and now suddenly she's basicly told "nah don't need to do that." She's basicly making up for lost time. Hence her rampant orgies:p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niv_Dralshya Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 I would like to point out some things about the Master/Apprentice relationship that may de-squick some things. Padawan and apprentice are both ranks and titles that can be held by fully competent adults even when they first get them. I'd like everyone to remember in KOTOR Both Revan, AND Bastila Shan (and if memory serves even Jolee Bindo) were only Padawans, And every companion except Mandalore, the droids, Kreia, and Hanhar could be trained as either Jedi or Sith by the Exile, and most of them romanced. The master apprentice relationship can be a partnership, which can become romance, it can be a brotherly relationship, a father son, mother daughter, father daughter, mother son relationship, uncle nephew like relationship. there's really no limit or one archetype for the bond between teacher and student here and it's not at all like what most people are used to most of the time, when they think "Student"and "teacher" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarMagus Posted October 17, 2013 Author Share Posted October 17, 2013 (edited) Sure, for example Kira is most certainly an adult and actually has more real world experience then the Jedi Knight. Grell however is represented as being young enough that she hasn't left home yet on the other hand. Still even if they are both adults, the problem isn't just an age thing (( or an age thing at all)) it has to do with the entire teacher/student ((of any age)) thing. Like most martial arts dojos frown on teachers dating students ((at least the ones I've been to)) and most businesses don't like the idea of bosses dating their employees. All that said the thread wasn't started as a "this is creepy" but just to get an idea of how common it was in the lore, because the game represents it being very common 4 out of 4 male force users have an option to date their students/former students. Edited October 17, 2013 by StarMagus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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