Vengence Jugg!!! The king of solo que!

[AlrikFassbauer]

you suck because you have a brain tumor

 

You seemingly have NEVER met someone who has this in RL !

[GregAlia]

Can you guys care to explain? Vig/Veng has a home on arena teams? I don't understand. I feel like being one of the most useless and most underpowered team member when playing in arena against a bunch of smash monkeys, snipers and stealthers. I could do well in regular warzones ya. In arena, however, i die way too quickly and have difficulty putting out similar damage to other classes unless the fight drags on. Are you guys hybrid? Or do you know any secret survival strategies?

 

Again I can't explain to you why you would feel squishier than a smash jugg. That just isn't the case. Ven/vig has many talents that make them much harder to kill. Vs every comp I can't say how you will fair, the random team selection isn't always fair. But on a full qued group working as a team, vengeance, though not nearly as bursty, has plenty of single target damage, and a lot of cc immunity. As an off tank I don't think you are very good given how rage starved vengeance can be and the fact that while in the other tank stance you building even less rage. I personally did not call vengeance the king of Arena's, however I have been doing quite well. You will never do as Much damage as a smash jugg because of their huge smash. But not having to guard nodes and stand around as much their devastation is far less dangerous because team mates don't need to bunch up as much. It isn't bad. It fairs better than most classes.

[Kainozorva]

Nerf!!! +op+mara

[ishbindeinvater]

@op

 

just one question, because i dont know better, but how are you be able to have 180k healing with a veng jugg??

 

and why are you talking about arenas and then putting off numbers from warzones??

[SOULCASTER]

@op

 

just one question, because i dont know better, but how are you be able to have 180k healing with a veng jugg??

 

and why are you talking about arenas and then putting off numbers from warzones??

 

180k healing is viable on a vengence jug in an 8man warzone. Its not really common to go to the gas. ESPECIALLY in the solo rated queue. The numbers he is posting are not numbers you will be putting up in 90% of the arena matches. 180k healing (because of the heal set piece bonus for vindicators when interceding) is in fact do-able in full 15min 8 man warzones. Not so in arenas.

 

Arena matches are typically 1minute to 3 minutes long per round. That would result in anywhere between 9k total healing and about 30k healing per round. And that's assuming your hitting interceded every time it is off cooldown....LOL which you will not be doing unless you are a tank. In which case, you wont be putting up 500k dmg

 

BUT to be fair, his title of this thread is "solo queue" and his 3rd validation point says the word "WZ". So technically no where in his original post does he say or refer to ARENAS.

 

IF he did mean arenas, he's basically BSing you with warzone stats, and implying he does them in arenas. Typical forum argument maneuver. Nothing to see here.

Edited October 8, 2013 by SOULCASTER

[ishbindeinvater]

180k healing is viable on a vengence jug in an 8man warzone. Its not really common to go to the gas. ESPECIALLY in the solo rated queue. The numbers he is posting are not numbers you will be putting up in 90% of the arena matches. 180k healing (because of the heal set piece bonus for vindicators when interceding) is in fact do-able in full 15min 8 man warzones. Not so in arenas.

 

Arena matches are typically 1minute to 3 minutes long per round. That would result in anywhere between 9k total healing and about 30k healing per round. And that's assuming your hitting interceded every time it is off cooldown....LOL which you will not be doing unless you are a tank. In which case, you wont be putting up 500k dmg

 

BUT to be fair, his title of this thread is "solo queue" and his 3rd validation point says the word "WZ". So technically no where in his original post does he say or refer to ARENAS.

 

IF he did mean arenas, he's basically BSing you with warzone stats, and implying he does them in arenas. Typical forum argument maneuver. Nothing to see here.

 

ok i was mislead, because of a not arena thread nowadays ;-)

 

that a veng jugg is a viable class is nothing new and especially in pugs, because its a good allrounder.

 

but still, 189k healing is a bit off and its just self healing, so?!

 

a darkness assassin on the other hand could probably pull that numbers off. a jugg ... no

[UndyingHadyn]

You guys are all fukkin drunk.

[SOULCASTER]

ok i was mislead, because of a not arena thread nowadays ;-)

 

that a veng jugg is a viable class is nothing new and especially in pugs, because its a good allrounder.

 

but still, 189k healing is a bit off and its just self healing, so?!

 

a darkness assassin on the other hand could probably pull that numbers off. a jugg ... no

 

In rated 8v8s, I would often have over 200k healing on my tank guardian. Its honestly not that unachievable in 8man warzones. High hitpoints + intercede/guardian leaping non stop adds up.

[Kerensk]

I love juggs in arenas. I always target them or Marauders with my electro net first, in the 2-3 GCDs they stand dumbstruck trying to leap the three of us have them dead. Most of the time their healer is 1-2 GCDs behind realizing we attacked a jugg rather than rushing the healer and they can't save them. Then, 4-6 seconds into the fight we're a 4 on 3 balance burning down the healer.

 

The hardest part is convincing the pug to ignore the healer for the first few seconds, it goes against all convention. But usually the smashers run to the front and the healer hangs back anyway so we can kill on the run and barely break a step rushing through the line to the healer.

 

It seems like such a backassward plan but it pays off so amazingly well to take advantage of player's over confidence.

[danielswann]

@op

 

just one question, because i dont know better, but how are you be able to have 180k healing with a veng jugg??

 

and why are you talking about arenas and then putting off numbers from warzones??

 

with the conq set bonus you get 8% healing per leap to team player + enemy. You also have enraged defense or w/e it is called that heals for % health. Also, I'm using the broken relic that absorbs dmg (which will proc if you are guarding someone and they get dmged it will mitigate the dmg you would receive and counts as healing). So combined with all 3 of these i am putting up huge healing numbers.

 

Also, just to clarify, I do not just sit in tank stance...... I'm full fledge smashing faces 80% of the wz unless the healer is just getting tunnelled really hard.

 

Also, I have played both smash jugg and veng and If i setup my combo i can kill/burst people down just as fast as with smash + i get all of the utility of the vengence tree. Do you comprehend how many cc's are wasted right after a jugg/maurder leaps? Too good too good..

[snaplemouton]

This thread is so full of crap.

 

Switching to Soresu as a vigilance/vengeance is worthless as you will:

1. Remove any kind of pressure you put on people with your damage.

2. Have litteraly no focus/rage to do anything at all.

3. You can save your healer with awe/intimidating roar and/or taunts and/or intercede and/or AE slow, which can all be done in Shien form.

4. You loose all your focus/rage.

5. The mitigation it gives you is near to none.

6. You lose unstoppable making any non retarded opponent laugh at you while you are perma CCed.

7. You have to not only switch form but also guard the healer, loosing so much time it's useless to do it and you would help a good healer in a much more efficient way by simply using anything mentioned in #3.

 

The only positive point about switching to Soresu is to guard to spread the damage but the negative points mentioned above will hurt both you and your team much more.

 

And 500k damage in a warzone where you did 180k healing? That's extremely low for a DPS spec.

Without switching to Soresu, you should be able to aim for 100k protection just from taunts and guardian leap/intervene.

And the best way to protect your team is by having dead enemies. 0 health enemies = 0 damage/ 0 healing from them.

Leave the defense job to full specced tanks who got all the tools to fulfill that job.

 

And that is exactly why everyone complains about healers. Because nobody understand what DPSING means.

Edited October 8, 2013 by snaplemouton

[TonyDragonflame]

Guardians in vigilance or soresu form cannot solo kill good operative healer, only focus can. But focus way too squishy for Arenas.

 

Indeed, only one spec avaible on Arenas for guardians - its defence with full tank gear. End of story.

[snaplemouton]

Guardians in vigilance or soresu form cannot solo kill good operative healer, only focus can. But focus way too squishy for Arenas.

 

Indeed, only one spec avaible on Arenas for guardians - its defence with full tank gear. End of story.

A focus can't kill a good operative healer either.

Knight/Warrior is the only class which DPS spec doesn't have a non-channeled hard stun.

Hence all the massive QQ about operatives since the majority of players plays knights/warriors and none of them think about choking/stasis under 30% health for someone else to get the killing blow.

 

Personally, I'm having such an easy time violating healers in vigilance/vengeance even with my channel hard stun I simply can't stop laughing at how much QQ there is about thoses crappy heals.

Edited October 9, 2013 by snaplemouton

[ishbindeinvater]

with the conq set bonus you get 8% healing per leap to team player + enemy. You also have enraged defense or w/e it is called that heals for % health. Also, I'm using the broken relic that absorbs dmg (which will proc if you are guarding someone and they get dmged it will mitigate the dmg you would receive and counts as healing). So combined with all 3 of these i am putting up huge healing numbers.

 

Also, just to clarify, I do not just sit in tank stance...... I'm full fledge smashing faces 80% of the wz unless the healer is just getting tunnelled really hard.

 

Also, I have played both smash jugg and veng and If i setup my combo i can kill/burst people down just as fast as with smash + i get all of the utility of the vengence tree. Do you comprehend how many cc's are wasted right after a jugg/maurder leaps? Too good too good..

 

ok thx that explains a lot.

 

but with intercede you can only leap to friendly target not to enemies, or am I wrong?

[Zoom_VI]

ok thx that explains a lot.

 

but with intercede you can only leap to friendly target not to enemies, or am I wrong?

 

You are correct

[GregAlia]

I love juggs in arenas. I always target them or Marauders with my electro net first, in the 2-3 GCDs they stand dumbstruck trying to leap the three of us have them dead. Most of the time their healer is 1-2 GCDs behind realizing we attacked a jugg rather than rushing the healer and they can't save them. Then, 4-6 seconds into the fight we're a 4 on 3 balance burning down the healer.

 

The hardest part is convincing the pug to ignore the healer for the first few seconds, it goes against all convention. But usually the smashers run to the front and the healer hangs back anyway so we can kill on the run and barely break a step rushing through the line to the healer.

 

It seems like such a backassward plan but it pays off so amazingly well to take advantage of player's over confidence.

 

That's great bro cause I love mercs in arena. They are the easiest class to kill.