Dye Hard With a Vengeance

[CosmicKat]

Oh Bioware. You kooky nuts, you.

 

Just when the MMO world thought you had reached the lowest of possible depths by finally introducing a sit emote... and then charging for it, you go and prove everyone wrong by charging $10 and $20 for single use items.

 

Let's start out this rant with some facts for the graphically illiterate:

- A White/White dye involves the highly complicated procedure of one of your minions moving the RGB sliders to max... twice, since it is 2 dyes in one. Egads! What wizardry!

- A Black/Black dye is much more complicated. It requires that minion to move those RGB sliders all the way to zero!

- That's it. There is no more labor involved.

 

Now let's look at some of the facts of why White/White and Black/Black dyes are popular:

- Most of your Dye color combos look like they were picked by Stevie Wonder.

- Most of your armors come in bizarre and/or just plain ugly colors, but can be made to look good with muted colors, like white or black.

- Because they are rare. Of course, they are not rare like gold, oil, or even a McRib is rare... they are rare because you intentionally make them rare, apparently because they are popular and pleasing your customers is a concept that is entirely foreign to your company.

 

Now let's look at the message charging your paying customers an exorbitant price for something that literally costs you nothing sends to the consumers out there:

- You have set a price for a service that, if extrapolated to another feature you may add, based on similar rates of cost to the consumer vs. your investment of resources, will set the price of the mythical SSSP at roughly... $43 trillion dollars.

 

Thank you very much for finally breaking my stubborn hope that one day this game might amount to something. The 60 day time card I just bought will be the last money EA/Bioware ever receives from me. I don't care if your SSSP turns out to be the greatest thing of all time, I'm done with your ridiculous disdain for your customers. I would call you pond scum but that would be a terrible injustice to pond scum.

 

P.S. As you can see, I added smiley faces, which I have learned from rhymeswithPariah, excuses all insults and any belittling comments.

[Reno_Tarshil]

You don't have to buy it, you know.

[SammuelSK]

You don't have to buy it, you know.

 

Yes, and since I havn't now you have to buy two to make up for revenue lost. Three if you count the OP, 4, 5, and 6 if you count the people who havn't said a thing in the forums yet. So.. Enjoy your $120.00 dye purchase.

 

Just, you know, so you know.

[EAJ-FromTheAshes]

I can't see any sane rationalisation for the price, either. It's up there with having to pay more CC to unlock one speeder in collections over another functionally identical speeder. Or charging a considerably higher price for a companion unlock than access to a daily area that includes a companion (Treek vs Section X + HK).

 

I know it's all optional, but the fact it's apparently considered okay to do that is what irks me. And as much as I love Star Wars, I don't think I'll be hanging on in here for all that much longer, given the trend. I'll take my money elsewhere.

[Reno_Tarshil]

Yes, and since I havn't now you have to buy two to make up for revenue lost. Three if you count the OP, 4, 5, and 6 if you count the people who havn't said a thing in the forums yet. So.. Enjoy your $120.00 dye purchase.

 

Just, you know, so you know.

 

I disagree with the price myself and because I do, I'm not purchasing it. No where in this game states that I "have" to buy anything off the cartel market, because it's all fluff.

[Nickious]

Ok, this is my first MMO thus I don't fully know the crowd. is it odd for subs to cancel there subs over something as trivial as dying there armor a different color or is it the norm? MMO players are a peculiar creature it seems. Edited September 5, 2013 by Nickious

[SammuelSK]

I disagree with the price myself and because I do, I'm not purchasing it. No where in this game states that I "have" to buy anything off the cartel market, because it's all fluff.

 

Very well then. Since we're talking about money to be used to fund future content, a reasoning from a previous thread, the next person down the line is now responsible for $140.00 worth of dye pack purchases. Money, and customers, are a finite resource. Treating them like garbage behind the justification, because that is all it is, that its fluff just hurts you long term.

 

This has stalled whatever momentum they had gained from the future content reveal and given further ammunition to an already fairly hostile community when it comes to swtor.

 

Colour me disappointed Bioware.

 

EDIT:

Ok, this is my first MMO thus I don't fully know the crowd. is it odd for subs to cancel there subs over something as trivial as dying there armor a different color or is it the norm? MMO players are a peculiar creature it seems.

 

Nobody, as far as I've seen anyway, has said they are canceling their subs. A lot, me included, however have said that going forward they are much less likely to spend money in the cash shop. Not particularly peculiar in my opinion, as its my money and I can choose to spend it as I see fit. I can instead by the items from the Auction House, which is constantly flooded with things from each pack with pretend currency that has little to no real world value, and I have an excess of.

Edited September 5, 2013 by SammuelSK

[Fixiooo]

You don't have to buy it, you know.

 

So, because it's optional people do not have a right to voice their complaint? This part was edited out because some people might take it the wrong way and too seriously.

 

As for the whole dye situation. I agree the price is absurd, let's make that absurd in bold. Personally, I don't buy dyes from the CM but I get why a lot of people are frustrated about it. It's not only the whole dye situation, there are other things aswell that have me boggled. You won't see me making posts about it though. Raising a complaint to Bioware is like talking to a brick wall in my opinion.

 

If people support the price of the dyes and the possible direction Bioware is headed with the prices, and buy the products, all power to them. Who am I to tell them otherwise, but if people do not appreciate the prices they have a right to voice their opinion and/or disgust about it.

Edited September 5, 2013 by Fixiooo

[Reno_Tarshil]

Not to beat a dead horse but it has to be beaten once more.

 

Fluff is just fluff, it has no impact on your game nor is it required to play your game. Your subscription funds content. Stuff you buy on the CM is just extra change they can pick up along the way if someone buys something.

 

If the items in question were Pay2Win or required to play the game, you might have an argument. But Dye Modules are just fluff and not required to be bought by anyone.

[ikinai]

So, because it's optional people do not have a right to voice their complaint? Why stop here? Why don't you tell people that hate their life to end themselfs, after all, living is optional.

 

As for the whole dye situation. I agree the price is absurd, let's make that absurd in bold. Personally, I don't buy dyes from the CM but I get why a lot of people are frustrated about it. It's not only the whole dye situation, there are other things aswell that have me boggled. You won't see me making posts about it though. Raising a complaint to Bioware is like talking to a brick wall in my opinion.

 

If people support the price of the dyes and the possible direction Bioware is headed with the prices, and buy the products, all power to them. Who am I to tell them otherwise, but if people do not appreciate the prices they have a right to voice their opinion and/or disgust about it.

 

Did you really just equate telling someone to commit suicide to telling someone that they didn't have to buy a digital trinket in a video game? Talk about absurd.

[Fixiooo]

Did you really just equate telling someone to commit suicide to telling someone that they didn't have to buy a digital trinket in a video game? Talk about absurd.

 

It was a little far fetched, wasn't it? And completely optional nonetheless!

[Reno_Tarshil]

So, because it's optional people do not have a right to voice their complaint? Why stop here? Why don't you tell people that hate their life to end themselfs, after all, living is optional.

 

As for the whole dye situation. I agree the price is absurd, let's make that absurd in bold. Personally, I don't buy dyes from the CM but I get why a lot of people are frustrated about it. It's not only the whole dye situation, there are other things aswell that have me boggled. You won't see me making posts about it though. Raising a complaint to Bioware is like talking to a brick wall in my opinion.

 

If people support the price of the dyes and the possible direction Bioware is headed with the prices, and buy the products, all power to them. Who am I to tell them otherwise, but if people do not appreciate the prices they have a right to voice their opinion and/or disgust about it.

 

Because it's easier and faster to not buy it at all and way less of a hassle to come to a forum that represents a small portion of the game inhabitants btw to voice your opinion. If Bioware saw no one buying the dye en masse they would think something is up, but if you post a complain thread about it, it's likely to get skimmed over and ignored.

[SammuelSK]

And not to further beat a dead horse, arguing that is fluff is a straw man argument. You are choosing to ignore the basis of the complaint, which is that for $20.00 a single use dye is a ridiculous item to be selling. It being fluff does not make it any less ridiculous, nor does it take away from the original complaint.

[Reno_Tarshil]

And not to further beat a dead horse, arguing that is fluff is a straw man argument. You are choosing to ignore the basis of the complaint, which is that for $20.00 a single use dye is a ridiculous item to be selling. It being fluff does not make it any less ridiculous, nor does it take away from the original complaint.

 

But it does, because it's fluff, it's optional, it's not "mandatory". There are several different ways to aquire said dye anyways if you really want it that badly.

 

I agree with the complaint that 20$ for a single dye module is silly but it's not a big deal because it's fluff that doesn't impact your gameplay at all and you don't have to buy it if you don't agree with it.

[Fixiooo]

But it does, because it's fluff, it's optional, it's not "mandatory". There are several different ways to aquire said dye anyways if you really want it that badly.

 

I agree with the complaint that 20$ for a single dye module is silly but it's not a big deal because it's fluff that doesn't impact your gameplay at all and you don't have to buy it if you don't agree with it.

 

Take a look at the big picture. If this becomes successful I'll guarantee you that it won't end with dyes being a one-time use expensive item that cannot be added to your collection. So what do you do, you raise your voice and hope for like-minded individuals who think about it the same way as you do and will also raise their voice and complaint.

 

Do not forget there are likely people out there right now who saw the price and went completely bananas and just outright quit the game but did not voice their concerns on the forums, feedback page or whatsoever.

Edited September 5, 2013 by Fixiooo

[SammuelSK]

I agree with the complaint that 20$ for a single dye module is silly but it's not a big deal because it's fluff that doesn't impact your gameplay at all and you don't have to buy it if you don't agree with it.

 

And I disagree because at $20.00 it creates a new narrative for the game, and does little but alienate the player base. You are right, nobody needs to buy it. However, by giving their player base less of a reason to buy anything going forward they are creating a problem for themselves.

[Reno_Tarshil]

And I disagree because at $20.00 it creates a new narrative for the game, and does little but alienate the player base. You are right, nobody needs to buy it. However, by giving their player base less of a reason to buy anything going forward they are creating a problem for themselves.

 

If they see no one is buying it they will hopefully reason to rethink their pricing or ideas.

 

Now if you'll excuse me I wish to go watch some t.v. with my family, laters taters.

[AndasKastor]

Honestly I have a hard time getting worked up about anything in the CM. It is all fluff.

 

I'm afraid that I am one of those "it doesn't affect me so I don't see a problem" sort of people. I have only bought a couple of things (mostly inventory unlocks) and still have about 7000 CC from just being a sub.

[Kamansus]

Finally, a cosmetic feature that will actually have some rarity. I tried to think of another MMO with a dye system that didn't make black and white dyes incredibly expensive but I failed.

 

Unless you'd rather they put them back into packs?

[manchusabre]

Lol. Cosmic for cartel market rep.

[AshlaBoga]

This thread reminds me of the monocles in EVE.

[SammuelSK]

Finally, a cosmetic feature that will actually have some rarity. I tried to think of another MMO with a dye system that didn't make black and white dyes incredibly expensive but I failed.

 

Unless you'd rather they put them back into packs?

 

Welcome to the discussion, we have already spoken on the matter you have brought up earlier. But I will repeat it so you can catch up.

 

Black dye costing $20.00 = O.K.

 

Black dye costing $20.00 and requiring you to buy a new one each time you change your look = Not O.K.

 

As an example, see GW2 for a system that works like SWTOR, yet does not leave players feeling ripped off. Dyes are unlocked on use, remain ridiculously expensive, and can be applied to all your armor going forward once acquired. This also bears repeating, GW2 is a B2P game with no monthly subscription that lives entirely off of cash shop purchases. It should be extremely easy to see why players feel a bit ripped off by this.

[Felkroth]

I hate the "You don't have to buy it" crowd.

 

 

You allow a company like Bioware to do stupid **** by excusing their bad behavior. It is bad form to charge 20 bucks for a freakin dye.

 

 

Bioware, your probably the most money hungry mmo company i've experienced....its disgusting the depths you go to gouge your community!

Edited September 6, 2013 by Felkroth

[hadoken]

Did you really just equate telling someone to commit suicide to telling someone that they didn't have to buy a digital trinket in a video game? Talk about absurd.

 

That is one great thing about the dye 'controversy'. All the hilarious analogies. I liked the Ferrari one yesterday.

[CosmicKat]

Finally, a cosmetic feature that will actually have some rarity. I tried to think of another MMO with a dye system that didn't make black and white dyes incredibly expensive but I failed.

 

Unless you'd rather they put them back into packs?

 

Well, not a dye system per say, but a F2P player can change the color of every piece of armor (their costume) to any color they wanted, dozens of times, all for ingame currency (gold, credits, etc) they receive as a reward from running a single mission in Champions Online.

 

And also let's clarify "rarity" here. Dyes are rare entirely due to manufactured scarcity.

They are NOT rare due to any of these reasons, which would all be legitimate reasons in a game, btw.

 

A) They do not drop from any mob, ever. There is no rare spawn, no challenging fight or quest.

B) They do not require any ingame resource, schematic, or player-based skill. As a matter of fact, they require NO real resource, skill, or magic act for Bioware to create them.

C) They do not require any effort of any kind from any player, or from the creator of them (Bioware).

 

They are rare simply because Bioware has decided they are rare.