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A year 1/2 later, come back pvp still sucks


Kryptfox

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Just came back, and the CC hell is still there and melee classes still get owned pretty easily.

 

Compared to other games, this pvp is pretty sub-par. Now, I do love the variety of maps and pvp modes.

 

But have to say that, I've expected better after a long span of being away.

 

Are there any plans to make melees turn on their own when you atk, and to reduce/balance out the CC ?

For crying out loud, reduce the CC n let people fight it out. Resolve is suppose to help but does squat.

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Melee Classes?

 

You mean Sith or Jedi classes? When 80% percent of the people playing are those classes, don't look for

 

a lot of improvements from patches. If anything Bw may improve the other classes so more people will start

 

playing them.

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adjusting resolve would go a long way to improving the amount of CC we have.

 

1.4 brought a change that actually increased the amount of time you could be CC'd, in order to minimize mistakes made by bads (bioware sad almost exactly that when describing the reason for the change). not a good direction imo.

 

start by reverting that change. it would be good for everyone.

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Yea, I really don't like the progress of pvp. I played on release for 4 months. PvP was crap then, mostly because everyone is lumped together instead of 10-19, 20-29, etc....

 

Melee damage for jedi/sith was lacking in comparison to the dmg output of a ranged class.

 

Melee characters stop atk'g if not facing their target instead of auto turning to face them.

 

CC was out of control. Ranged classes have more CC than melees. ( i may be wrong)

 

BUT, the duration is just retarded. Why should a CC in PvE of 9 seconds last 9 seconds in pvp?!

CC in pvp should be more than about 2 seconds. Especially when all of the CCs stack, and the

resolve function is useless.

 

 

If they fixed these things then pvp would be more fun as a jedi or sith. But it seems no attempt to balance out the above has been made in the last year and a half.............

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It's fun how people feel different from each other, The only thing that makes me coming back to this game every day, or almost, is PvP. I think Resolve is good and the numbers of CC's as well. All classes have a CC breaker and many classes have some sort of immunity to them. Sage has even two breaks when you count the Force Barrier who breaks anything. healing Sorc/Sage also has immunity while Force Speeding away. While other classes like Shadow/Assassin and Vanguard/Powertech/Commando/mercenary has Hold the Line which is immune to everything except Stun or CC plus the regular breaker. Only if not used or familiar with the Resolve system, or maybe just not that good yet you will still complain about it. The resolve system is fine. The PvP is fun and very entertaining while playing it on a more skilled level. Of course you will hate it if you're using your CC Breaker as fast as you've been stunned or slept.

 

There are far more important matters BioWare should be adressing in PvP than the Resolve system. For example 4v4 Arenas and also getting some sort of Team Rating that actually matters. Balance out the Healers so not everyone are rerolling Scoundrels/Operatives who are overpowered atm.

 

PvP does not suck. That is purely your opinion. If PvP sucked so much when you started playing why give it a try 18 months later? What a huge mistake. It's like trying to drink russian Vodka and vomit because of the taste and then doing the same mistake 18 months later. Or perhaps not. But you get the ****.

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It's fun how people feel different from each other, The only thing that makes me coming back to this game every day, or almost, is PvP. I think Resolve is good and the numbers of CC's as well. All classes have a CC breaker and many classes have some sort of immunity to them. Sage has even two breaks when you count the Force Barrier who breaks anything. healing Sorc/Sage also has immunity while Force Speeding away. While other classes like Shadow/Assassin and Vanguard/Powertech/Commando/mercenary has Hold the Line which is immune to everything except Stun or CC plus the regular breaker. Only if not used or familiar with the Resolve system, or maybe just not that good yet you will still complain about it. The resolve system is fine. The PvP is fun and very entertaining while playing it on a more skilled level. Of course you will hate it if you're using your CC Breaker as fast as you've been stunned or slept.

 

There are far more important matters BioWare should be adressing in PvP than the Resolve system. For example 4v4 Arenas and also getting some sort of Team Rating that actually matters. Balance out the Healers so not everyone are rerolling Scoundrels/Operatives who are overpowered atm.

 

PvP does not suck. That is purely your opinion. If PvP sucked so much when you started playing why give it a try 18 months later? What a huge mistake. It's like trying to drink russian Vodka and vomit because of the taste and then doing the same mistake 18 months later. Or perhaps not. But you get the ****.

 

I think you're off your rocker if you think the amount of time someone is white barred even remotely justifies the amount of CC it takes to get there. nobody, to my knowledge, has 2 full breakers. I know a lot of snare and root breakers were added for 2.0, along with a speed increase for every class in the game (lame).

 

CC is a vital part of the game. it has to be. the game was built around it. healers would never die w/o it. that's poor game design. why does almost every class have interrupt immunity of some kind? how about more effective interrupts and less stun? how about more difficult resource management for healing scoundrels? how about not giving taunts to any dps that happens to be in a tankable AC?

 

imo, only a couple of classes should be able to lockdown someone: stealth. and that's partly because they're stealth and partly because they (should be) very soft melee. their defense should be control. instead, you get VGs running around with 2 stuns, a pull, 2 taunts and a box of grenades. and yes, I do understand how to use CC. it's woven into the fabric of the game play. but tbh, a VG will always have something up. it's kind of a joke. Smashers are doing 20k dmg in one good (4m) hit with a 4-7k single target follow-up and, oh btw, 2 taunts for the jugs an aoe mezz and a box full of grenades. cc should be an art, but the fact of the matter is that it's virtually spammable, and resolve tics away so quickly that its consequences can be ignored in just about every situation of every map. even in hb, the only time full resolve is a problem is beyond the first fire pits. otherwise, it'll tic away so fast, it just doesn't matter.

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I think you're off your rocker if you think the amount of time someone is white barred even remotely justifies the amount of CC it takes to get there. nobody, to my knowledge, has 2 full breakers. I know a lot of snare and root breakers were added for 2.0, along with a speed increase for every class in the game (lame).

 

CC is a vital part of the game. it has to be. the game was built around it. healers would never die w/o it. that's poor game design. why does almost every class have interrupt immunity of some kind? how about more effective interrupts and less stun? how about more difficult resource management for healing scoundrels? how about not giving taunts to any dps that happens to be in a tankable AC?

 

imo, only a couple of classes should be able to lockdown someone: stealth. and that's partly because they're stealth and partly because they (should be) very soft melee. their defense should be control. instead, you get VGs running around with 2 stuns, a pull, 2 taunts and a box of grenades. and yes, I do understand how to use CC. it's woven into the fabric of the game play. but tbh, a VG will always have something up. it's kind of a joke. Smashers are doing 20k dmg in one good (4m) hit with a 4-7k single target follow-up and, oh btw, 2 taunts for the jugs an aoe mezz and a box full of grenades. cc should be an art, but the fact of the matter is that it's virtually spammable, and resolve tics away so quickly that its consequences can be ignored in just about every situation of every map. even in hb, the only time full resolve is a problem is beyond the first fire pits. otherwise, it'll tic away so fast, it just doesn't matter.

 

I do agree with a few things you've said and that is ac's that aren't spec'd into the actual tank spec shouldn't get taunt and the "full white bar" is waaaaay too short compared to the amount of cc you take prior.

 

However, stop spreading misinformation. Smasher's aren't doing 20k in a single hit. 9k at best vs a fully geared Sage/Sorc and have the armor debuff up on them. Second, no one in this game has a spammable cc. Every cc has a long cd associated with it. Just because people stack their long cd cc on you isn't the same thing as spammable cc. This game doesn't have spammable cc. There are a few classes with shorter cd's compared to other classes but that's a far cry from the spammable cc like polymorph/cyclone/fear in WoW.

Edited by Selout
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However, stop spreading misinformation. Smasher's aren't doing 20k in a single hit. 9k at best vs a fully geared Sage/Sorc and have the armor debuff up on them. Second, no one in this game has a spammable cc. Every cc has a long cd associated with it. Just because people stack their long cd cc on you isn't the same thing as spammable cc. This game doesn't have spammable cc. I guess there are a few classes with shorter cd's compared to other classes but that's a far cry from the spammable cc like polymorph/cyclone/fear in WoW.

taking things a bit too literal, don't you think. ok. spammable should have been able to use indiscriminately because there's always a stun off cd or coming off cd. 20k is a meager 5k even distributed amongst 4 ppl. one 9k hit means three 4k or less hits more than covers 20k. i know what I'm talking about. tyvm.

Edited by foxmob
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taking things a bit too literal, don't you think. ok. spammable should be been able to use indescrimately because there's always a stun off cd or coming off cd. 20k is a meager 5k even distributed amongst 4 ppl. one 9k hit means three 4k or less hits more than covers 20k. i know what I'm talking about. tyvm.

 

Lol, then say that instead of trying to push an agenda. Also, there will never be an instance where you have 4 low-armor targets with the armor debuff standing right next to each other when you have your trinket proc and after you force charge. Just unrealistic. And if you are upset about 5k per person, why aren't you more upset about Shrap Bomb/Corrosive grenade? That is a dot that does waaaaaaaaay more dmg than that over the time it is on and has a splash dmg component just like sweep/smash. It also has zero cd and is relatively low energy cost AND from ranged. Also, I guess you haven't PvP'd in other MMO's because spammable cc means to most MMO players, something that has no cooldown. Thus, spammable cc in this game would be for instance, flash grenade not having a cooldown.

 

Not to detract from your original post because you absolutely are right about white bar being too short and tank-capable ac's while spec'd dps getting taunt is bs. While we are at it, lets throw in field respec being disabled in any PvP zone (i.e. WZ's and the new arena's) and tone down Scound/Op heals. IF those 4 things are done, then I think this game's PvP will be pretty damn close to being balanced.

Edited by Selout
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Lol, then say that instead of trying to push an agenda. Also, there will never be an instance where you have 4 low-armor targets with the armor debuff standing right next to each other when you have your trinket proc and after you force charge. Just unrealistic. And if you are upset about 5k per person, why aren't you more upset about Shrap Bomb/Corrosive grenade? That is a dot that does waaaaaaaaay more dmg than that over the time it is on and has a splash dmg component just like sweep/smash. It also has zero cd and is relatively low energy cost AND from ranged..

 

because I was talking about DPS classes pumping out monster DPS and then getting all of this huge utility, the utility which makes CC a must have to get anything done. why are you turning my rant into QQ about smashes?

Edited by foxmob
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because I was talking about DPS classes pumping out monster DPS and then getting all of this huge utility, the utility which makes CC a must have to get anything done. why are you turning my rant into QQ about smashes?

 

I am not. But, people try to misrepresent the actual state of the game in their own rants. I have a problem with that. Like I said, you are right about the two points. I just don't feel you are correct on the rest. It's a forum. Be prepared to defend your statements or don't make them imo.

Edited by Selout
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Just came back, and the CC hell is still there and melee classes still get owned pretty easily.

 

Compared to other games, this pvp is pretty sub-par. Now, I do love the variety of maps and pvp modes.

 

But have to say that, I've expected better after a long span of being away.

 

Are there any plans to make melees turn on their own when you atk, and to reduce/balance out the CC ?

For crying out loud, reduce the CC n let people fight it out. Resolve is suppose to help but does squat.

 

LOL. Let's see...

 

Easy to wreck people on my Shadow and SIn? Check.

 

Easy on my jug and guard(diff specs)? Check.

 

Easy (but less skilled, personally) on my Operative and Scoundrel? Check.

 

Am I missing something? I'm pretty sure those are melees.

 

Auto-turn is a pve ideal, by the way.

 

As if it isn't already a pain in the arse to kill healers, try doing so without any stuns... Your idea of letting people fight it out, means letting people not die whatsoever, because healers will keep them alive without breaking a sweat.

 

In short, you've been gone, and now that you're back - it's safe to say - you have no idea what you're talking about.

Edited by ShatteredVision
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I am not. But, people try to misrepresent the actual state of the game in their own rants. I have a problem with that. Like I said, you are right about the two points. I just don't feel you are correct on the rest. It's a forum. Be prepared to defend your statements or don't make them imo.

 

why is 20k such a difficult stat for you to fathom? I very clearly said when it hits 4m (getting the crits/procs is implied). as for this is a forum blah blah blah, I'm not going sit around for 30m to compose my reply. sorry. spammable was what came to mind. deal with it.

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I am not your fan and your truth is wrong, you just cannot see it. You are not the only person who is like that though Lol. I am sure that 90% of pvper suck guy is here somewhere, and those merc is fine people from 1.7.

 

Yep. We're usually lured by the stench of n00bness your type tends to drip all over.

 

**pshaw** Like, you're the one who can't do it in actual combat, argues its impossible, argues some classes are just got-gifted while others are damned.... and what? Its us -- the people who actually overcome those problems and raise solutions -- that people should not listen to?? :rolleyes:

 

We don't really need anyone to listen to us anyway, because those ascend above your pitiful PvP level already know what we say is true. That's how they get there in the first place -- stops the whining, and starts the trying.

Edited by kweassa
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Yep. We're usually lured by the stench of n00bness your type tends to drip all over.

 

**pshaw** Like, you're the one who can't do it in actual combat, argues its impossible, argues some classes are just got-gifted while others are damned.... and what? Its us -- the people who actually overcome those problems and raise solutions -- that people should not listen to?? :rolleyes:

 

We don't really need anyone to listen to us anyway, because those ascend above your pitiful PvP level already know what we say is true. That's how they get there in the first place -- stops the whining, and starts the trying.

 

Bioware isn't listening to you. The powertech mega nerf and the merc buff is evidence of that. They nerfed pt way too hard but it still shows you are in the small minority and usually way off base. Just reading through the pvp section shows that people don't agree with learn2play as the solution for everything, people want the game as balanced as possible.

Edited by MarkXXIV
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Lol, then say that instead of trying to push an agenda. Also, there will never be an instance where you have 4 low-armor targets with the armor debuff standing right next to each other when you have your trinket proc and after you force charge. Just unrealistic. And if you are upset about 5k per person, why aren't you more upset about Shrap Bomb/Corrosive grenade? That is a dot that does waaaaaaaaay more dmg than that over the time it is on and has a splash dmg component just like sweep/smash. It also has zero cd and is relatively low energy cost AND from ranged.

 

You are the one exaggerating. It does 3-6k over 21 seconds. It's spamable but it is pointless re-applying it on targets before it wears off. Force Sweep can be done almost twice in that amount of time. DoT's aren't as threatening as instant burst damage not too mention it can be cleansed before it does the damage.

 

Foxmob is right about a lot of things. Stealth classes should be the among the only classes that can lock people down. Too many ACs have too many stuns. PvP would be a lot better with less stuns, better interruption mechanics and healing debuffs. Tank ACs not in tank spec shouldn't have the AoE CCs or the taunts.

Edited by Gren-Aluren
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Melee definitely has a roll to play. Maybe people want more versatility in their classes but it seems like most brings something to the table to achieve the objective. Force melee do pretty well at the moment. Concealment could use a little work.....
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Melee definitely has a roll to play. Maybe people want more versatility in their classes but it seems like most brings something to the table to achieve the objective. Force melee do pretty well at the moment. Concealment could use a little work.....

 

Only "concept" that I fail to understand is how ranged DPS have low armor and health in every game (to compensate for them having CC and range) except in SWTOR, where as melee you get kited like crazy yet when you play well and stay on their back their health does not budge. SWTOR is also the one game where sins / shadows don't get good armor penetration exactly to deal with those classes.

Edited by Vaerah
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