Consolidated list of topics that BioWare should respond to.

[Sir-Coffee]

And from what I have seen the ability mis fire bug has received several responses in the past...a fix a short time ago etc. so by definition has not been ignored. Responding to / fixing in a time frame that suits the community is an entirely different conversation.

 

I disagree completely with the assertion that you personally missing a single cap constitutes a critical or game breaking bug in any way, though as always everyone will have a different take on it

 

Driz

 

1). The bug is back and BioWare has not responded. So yes, they are ignoring it.

2). Say that on the PvP forums

 

It's okay to voice your opinion, but you're wrong on so many levels.

[Sir-Coffee]

His point was that PvP players think they are the center of the universe, but they represent a small percentage of players. If there were no PvP the vast majority of players would neither care nor notice. PvP players are off on their own little worlds anyway (literally). What really angers PvP players is that no one pays attention to them--including the vast majority of players.

 

I'm not so sure about that.

[Trollokdamus]

Add this two threads to your list please:

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=650022 (feedback on the new Dark Ward animation)

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=651333 (Discharge animation bug)

Edited July 14, 2013 by Trollokdamus

[branmakmuffin]

I agree that they will be flamed for whatever they do, but remaining silent is not a good decision and they will look worse ignoring a thread.

"Answer my thread" does not work the CS reps on the forums of any game I've ever played.

 

I'm not so sure about that.

Which part?

 

I'm not saying PvPers should be ignored just because they PvP. The problem is that in every game I've played (DDO, LotRO, EQ2, TSW a bit, Neverwinter and TOR), on the forums, PvPers as a group have the attitude that they as a group are the most important segment of the gaming population. All the games I listed are PvE games. PvP is an add-on (to a greater or lesser degree) to help get a few more players in the game, or simply as a marketing tool because people expect an MMO to have PvP like just about every hotel has a swimming pool whether people are likely to use it or not. And note, my comment was about people who consider themselves primarily PvPers, not about people who ever PvP at all.

Edited July 14, 2013 by branmakmuffin

[Andryah]

Whereas I just assume they are still investigating/deciding how to fix/otherwise not ready to talk about it....glass half full vs glass half empty i guess

 

The only sort of thing that MUST receive instant and accurate communication is of course game breaking or other critical issues that prevent people logging in...none of the issues you linked appear to be game breaking however...

 

Driz

 

/Agree

[Andryah]

Sure, you might be pleased, but as ImperialSun/Driz wrote, parts of this community are extremely volatile for no reason.

Like I said, check this topic where Eric said "we placed it on known issues list" and got flamed for it

 

Exactly.

[Sir-Coffee]

Add this two threads to your list please:

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=650022 (feedback on the new Dark Ward animation)

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=651333 (Discharge animation bug)

 

Agreed, I will add those to the OP. Both threads have been ignored for a month(Or more).

[Sir-Coffee]

Exactly.

 

Well, this reminds me of that one time in 12th grade where 4 people in my class called the substitute teacher fat and the entire class suffered for that.

 

Just because people act like they're in 12th grade doesn't mean the rest of us should suffer.

 

It's also part of EricMusco's job title to communicate to the community(community manager).

 

We understand that EricMusco will get flamed no matter what he does. Ignoring the problems(Or appearing to be ignoring the problems) is not the answer.

[Andryah]

His point was that PvP players think they are the center of the universe, but they represent a small percentage of players. If there were no PvP the vast majority of players would neither care nor notice. PvP players are off on their own little worlds anyway (literally). What really angers PvP players is that no one pays attention to them--including the vast majority of players.

 

Pretty much true for the players that are hardcore (or solely) PvP.

 

Thing is... if this game was designed as a PvP game.. they would have some ground to stand on. But it's not. PvP is badly implemented and badly deployed in this PvE game. Always has been. And an infinite number of gold responses to special interest threads is not going to change this in any way either.

 

This is in fact true for most PvE MMOs to be honest (not all but most). Yet avid PvPers keep insisting on jamming a square peg into a round hole, and attacking anyone that has the logic and sense to point out that the hole is round.

 

I'm not so sure about that.

 

Since you are prosecuting a Pro-PvP centric bias.. of course you disagree. You will never agree. You will argue in a manner that is divisive to the wider community of players (which are majority PvE, NOT PvP) because PvPers are vocal, often acidic about it, and like to PvP about their PvP experience.

 

This game has, since beta, marginalized PvP play. It will never formally abandon it as the game wants to appeal to a broad base of players at a broadly casual level (not hardcore at anything)... but people with high expectations of PvP are going to be perpetually disappointed by this game and are going to be rash and angry about it.. and vocal and demanding.. and divisive and pejorative to anyone who disagrees with them. The fact is PvE and PvP rarely coexist well in MMOs from a mechanics, balance, and content standpoint. There are a few exceptions in the genre.. but SWTOR is not one of them. Suck it up.. or find something better suited to your needs (this advice applies to everything about MMOs, not just PvP).

Edited July 14, 2013 by Andryah

[Sir-Coffee]

Pretty much true for the players that are hardcore (or solely) PvP.

 

Thing is... if this game was designed as a PvP game.. they would have some ground to stand on. But it's not. PvP is badly implemented and badly deployed in this PvE game. Always has been. And an infinite number of gold responses to special interest threads is not going to change this in any way either.

 

Agreed. You are 100% correct here(In the bolded response).

This is in fact true for most PvE MMOs to be honest (not all but most). Yet avid PvPers keep insisting on jamming a square peg into a round hole, and attacking anyone that has the logic and sense to point out that the hole is round.

Not sure about that last one(Although some do, so you're half right)

 

 

Since you are prosecuting a Pro-PvP centric bias.. of course you disagree. You will never agree. You will argue in a manner that is divisive to the wider community of players (which are majority PvE, NOT PvP) because PvPers are vocal, often acidic about it, and like to PvP about their PvP experience.

You don't know what I would do. Sometimes it is a L2P issue, and sometimes it isn't. An ability bug in warzones destroys the entire experience. It ruins aspects of PvE as well, so please don't try to sugar coat this bug.

This game has, since beta, marginalized PvP play. It will never formally abandon it as the game wants to appeal to a broad base of players at a broadly casual level (not hardcore at anything)... but people with high expectations of PvP are going to be perpetually disappointed by this game and are going to be rash and angry about it.. and vocal and demanding.. and divisive and pejorative to anyone who disagrees with them. The fact is PvE and PvP rarely coexist well in MMOs from a mechanics, balance, and content standpoint. There are a few exceptions in the genre.. but SWTOR is not one of them. Suck it up.. or find something better suited to your needs (this advice applies to everything about MMOs, not just PvP).

 

Agreed with this entire bolded paragraph.

[DeathDevilZero]

Bump..........

[Sir-Coffee]

Bump..........

 

Thank you for your participation in this thread.

 

Hopefully we can get responses to some of the issues during the week.

[Blackardin]

I support the OP in his contention.

 

 

 

 

That's just standard PvPer QQing. Nothing new to see here. Move along..

This individual lost credibility in his first five words....I think that's a sort of record? ;p

[Blackardin]

 

Thing is... if this game was designed as a PvP game.. they would have some ground to stand on. But it's not. PvP is badly implemented and badly deployed in this PvE game.

 

This game was billed, from the beginning as both, no? I've yet to see any official report, information stating that this is a pve game with PvP added as a secondary implementation. If that is so, can you point me in the direction of said statement? I'd be interested in seeing that as it would explode a belief about this game that I've held true, even as a solid PVE Raider, and seldom a PvPer.

[MrJurgens]

This individual lost credibility in his first five words....I think that's a sort of record? ;p

This individual you speak of never has had any credibility to begin with.

 

This game was billed, from the beginning as both, no? I've yet to see any official report, information stating that this is a pve game with PvP added as a secondary implementation. If that is so, can you point me in the direction of said statement? I'd be interested in seeing that as it would explode a belief about this game that I've held true, even as a solid PVE Raider, and seldom a PvPer.

I notice a lot of the elite defenders of EAware and SWTOR tend to lean on the PvE side, but this is their "argument to end all arguments" so they anything else a PvP'er says means nothing since, according to them, this is a PvE-centric game with PvP as a mini-game.

 

I, too, would like to see them give us this information.

[DeathDevilZero]

Thank you for your participation in this thread.

 

Hopefully we can get responses to some of the issues during the week.

 

Definitely a good thread too, I also wish that this get's sticked. I will bump this thread at least one a day to help out.

[Andryah]

This game was billed, from the beginning as both, no?

 

You are missing my point.

 

If you honestly think the PvP in this game is anything other then a bolt-on to a PvE game.. then we just have to agree to disagree.

 

It was clear even before launch that PvP was only in the game to draw some PvP audience. At the heart and soul of the game implementation.. it's a PvE game with PvP mini-gaming. There is no true open warfare design in this game, no faction level objectives or incentives, no reason to PvP beyond getting personal rewards, and never has been. It's almost all instanced and contained...which is a bolt-on PvP copout by MMO companies. It's never been good. In fact.. it was one of the largest points of rage in the early months of the game.

 

While I do PvP on occasion with the guild in SWTOR.. this is not my PvP MMO. In fact.. there really isn't a good PvP MMO on the market right now IMO.. other then EVE.. but I have departed from EVE. But if I want to focus on PvP for a week or two.. I'll head over to TSW. It's subpar too.. but at least it works and was part of the core of the game design.

Edited July 15, 2013 by Andryah

[Sir-Coffee]

Thank you for the support everybody.

 

If this thread were to be stickied(Which I doubt it would be), then I would try my best to consolidate various threads that are untouched for 2 weeks and see if we can get developer responses for them.

[MrJurgens]

You are missing my point.

 

If you honestly think the PvP in this game is anything other then a bolt-on to a PvE game.. then we just have to agree to disagree.

 

It was clear even before launch that PvP was only in the game to draw some PvP audience. At the heart and soul of the game implementation.. it's a PvE game with PvP mini-gaming. There is no true open warfare design in this game, no faction level objectives or incentives, no reason to PvP beyond getting personal rewards, and never has been. It's almost all instanced and contained...which is a bolt-on PvP copout by MMO companies. It's never been good. In fact.. it was one of the largest points of rage in the early months of the game.

 

While I do PvP on occasion with the guild in SWTOR.. this is not my PvP MMO. In fact.. there really isn't a good PvP MMO on the market right now IMO.. other then EVE.. but I have departed from EVE. But if I want to focus on PvP for a week or two.. I'll head over to TSW. It's subpar too.. but at least it works and was part of the core of the game design.

/Yawn

 

Same thing you said before EAndryah, just in a different format.

 

 

No different from EAware, I see. Cry some more.

 

Edited July 15, 2013 by MrJurgens

[Krewel]

Just because this isn't a PvP-centric game, it doesn't mean Bioware can just throw that aspect of the game into the trash bin and start waving Andryah's flag of surrender with the title on it "this is not the PvP game you're looking for". I seriously don't see the point in this argument - if it's not a 100% pvp game, does that mean pvp deserves the treatment it is getting by default; does that mean pvp players should play other games? What kind of helpful solution is this?

 

Anyone who's seriously played pvp in SWTOR can see major downfalls of it and also major potential for it, it's absolutely counter-productive for the whole game to not focus on the latter aspect.

[MrJurgens]

Just because this isn't a PvP-centric game, it doesn't mean Bioware can just throw that aspect of the game into the trash bin and start waving Andryah's flag of surrender with the title on it "this is not the PvP game you're looking for". I seriously don't see the point in this argument - if it's not a 100% pvp game, does that mean pvp deserves the treatment it is getting by default; does that mean pvp players should play other games? What kind of helpful solution is this?

 

Anyone who's seriously played pvp in SWTOR can see major downfalls of it and also major potential for it, it's absolutely counter-productive for the whole game to not focus on the latter aspect.

OMG LOL. Totes sig worthy, brother.

 

 

[Sir-Coffee]

Just because this isn't a PvP-centric game, it doesn't mean Bioware can just throw that aspect of the game into the trash bin and start waving Andryah's flag of surrender with the title on it "this is not the PvP game you're looking for". I seriously don't see the point in this argument - if it's not a 100% pvp game, does that mean pvp deserves the treatment it is getting by default; does that mean pvp players should play other games? What kind of helpful solution is this?

That was the hole in Andryah's argument.

Anyone who's seriously played pvp in SWTOR can see major downfalls of it and also major potential for it, it's absolutely counter-productive for the whole game to not focus on the latter aspect.

 

Well said.

[branmakmuffin]

Just because this isn't a PvP-centric game, it doesn't mean Bioware can just throw that aspect of the game into the trash bin and start waving Andryah's flag of surrender with the title on it "this is not the PvP game you're looking for"

They can, should and will if they make the finding that supporting PvP is no longer financially worthwhile. Having PvP in the game just for the sake of having PvP on the game would be stupid. Maybe it's true, though, that "PvP" will always at least have to be a marketing check-box in MMOs.

 

As to whether PvPers are shabbily treated, PvPers always think they are shabbily treated, no matter how they are treated.

Edited July 15, 2013 by branmakmuffin

[Sir-Coffee]

Everyone may have different opinions on PvP, and even though I am pro PvP: This is not what my thread is about.

 

I have created this thread so EricMusco and the rest of the BioWare team can just look to see what threads require responses. I believe that communicating to the community is a very good thing, and I don't appreciate how they are ignoring the threads.

 

Sure, most people can be rude to them, but if EricMusco is truly afraid to talk to the community out of fear, then he shouldn't be the community manager(I believe he has done an ok job so far, but he can do MUCH better).

 

Whether you hate PvP, PvE, or anything else in this game shouldn't dismiss the fact that BioWare needs to openly communicate with us.

 

Now then, I am not saying that every single thread needs a response, however this consolidated list of topics/threads will be updated if either:

A). I notice an issue that BioWare hasn't responded to/has ignored for 2 weeks+

B). Someone posts an issue that BioWare hasn't responded to/has ignored for 2 weeks+

 

Eric, you don't always need to have an answer to everything before you respond. In fact, if you show that you're willing to stick by our side until you do have an answer; then that looks good on your part and that makes damage control easier(You tend to let topics get out of control before responding).

[branmakmuffin]

I have created this thread so EricMusco and the rest of the BioWare team can just look to see what threads require responses.

No threads require responses. "The devs" do not like being called out. The best result from BWEA on this thread is that it will be ignored.

 

Sure, most people can be rude to them, but if EricMusco is truly afraid to talk to the community out of fear, then he shouldn't be the community manager(I believe he has done an ok job so far, but he can do MUCH better).

Without even knowing him, I guarantee you he is not afraid to post.

 

Now then, I am not saying that every single thread needs a response, however this consolidated list of topics/threads will be updated if either:

A). I notice an issue that BioWare hasn't responded to/has ignored for 2 weeks+

B). Someone posts an issue that BioWare hasn't responded to/has ignored for 2 weeks+

Then save yourself future bother and update the list now.