Please remove field respec from warzones.

[TonyDragonflame]

I approve, field respec must be removed from warzones, cuz there are some hackers who use macros for 1-click field respec during wz; its ridiculous. Bioware must disabled field respec on warzones.

[Odyseus]

Respec's should be disabled inside of WZ's. If Ranked only favors a few classes then the devs need to address that problem first and foremost.

[islander]

I approve, field respec must be removed from warzones, cuz there are some hackers who use macros for 1-click field respec during wz; its ridiculous. Bioware must disabled field respec on warzones.

 

Sad truth is, this does seem to be the only way to prevent cheaters. At this point, I'm not against removing field respeccers because of this.

 

Phillip_BW can talk all he wants about their 'software defenses and tools' but truth is, the cheaters are still there, they aren't getting caught, and if they are, they sure aren't getting punished severely enough because the stuff still goes on.

Edited July 8, 2013 by islander

[Raansu]

Yes, this is basically what I meant when I said to remove it, I'm fine with having it available at the start of the warzone, but that is it. Someone had said Voidstar was the only occasion in which field respec makes a difference. This is simply not true. In Civil War and Novare Coast this can also make quite a bit of difference. If, in a Civil War ranked match, you get your natural node before the enemy gets theirs, you can simply have your entire team respec to tanks/heals and stall for the rest of the game and win. If in Novare Coast you manage to cap the South Bunker, you can simply respec all tanks/heals and wait out the next 100%(if you've dwindled down the team's numbers at South.)

 

Do you really think a team can afford to respec in the middle of a CW and Novare? Come on man get real. Stalemates are already pretty common in ranked matches. Trying to respec in the middle of it is a terrible idea and could potentially cost you the node. Voidstar has a pause in gameplay for round 2 which gives people time to respec. It's a completely different situation.

 

Perhaps it's also a problem that tank and heal specs are much too strong in PvP, who knows.

 

This is an issue, but it is an issue for a different subject.

[NamikazeNaruto]

Do you really think a team can afford to respec in the middle of a CW and Novare? Come on man get real. Stalemates are already pretty common in ranked matches. Trying to respec in the middle of it is a terrible idea and could potentially cost you the node. Voidstar has a pause in gameplay for round 2 which gives people time to respec. It's a completely different situation.

 

Actually they can, thanks to the macros that a few people have already mentioned.

[islander]

Actually they can, thanks to the macros that a few people have already mentioned.

 

ding ding ding. If I had one button macro that switched me from MM to Engineer (or back) it would just take me a few seconds to manually modify my skill bars after that.

Edited July 8, 2013 by islander

[ManiacDavis]

Field respec allows more classes to enter the ranked scene. Without field respec, commando and sage are useless. A pure dps slinger and sentinel is more viable then commando/sage. A scoundrel healer is more viable then a commando/sage healer. If you remove field respec, you enlarge the disparity between classes because commando and sage utility comes from the ability to respec.

 

I know many will argue that sage heals are awesome or commando dps but the reality is a sentinel/slinger/scoundrel can do it better and bring aoe stuns as well.

 

Field respec is the only saving grace commando/sage have since scoundrel dps sucks and slinger/sentinel cannot heal.

[funkiestj]

I disagree with OP's argument that field respec should be eliminated because it increases the gear grind.

 

It might be good to remove in WZ respec. It might not. Whether or not a WZ is stale-matey is not a good critera either -- there are other ways to improve WZ...

 

The best reason to keep or remove in WZ respec is if it results in more novel play and team composition in top level rated matches.

 

The argument that in WZ respec increases the scope for skillful play is also a good argument.

 

There are many knobs that can be turned to change the game. From a practical standpoint it may be too much to ask BW to turn more than one knob a year and get things right...

 

If we continue to keep in WZ respec, I would like having the clicking the skill tree and gear swapping as quickly as possible not be part of the competition. I.e. give us multi-spec that allows us to change skill tree, quickbar and gear with a single click. If you adhere to the no-macros rule, this is the

of in WZ respec as competition. Edited July 8, 2013 by funkiestj

[foxmob]

there are a lot guilds -- my own included -- that build their teams purely on ACs. this is idiocy in the first place. assuming identical skill, slinger > mando (dps). HOWEVER, if mando A is a better player than slinger B, guess what? mando A should be the ranged option you take -- especially if you're filling a 2nd ranged spot. however, most ppl seem to think the AC gap is so wide that any idiot on a slinger is going to be better than a gunnery mando. he is not. that's the player base's fault. not the game's.

 

crying that your mando is now worthless because he can't respec and will lose his spot to a slinger is an indication that your guild/team/whatever doesn't have a frackin clue. yes. snipers are better. no. they aren't hands down, universally the choice to make. there's room for a dps mando in rated with or without field respec. if your leader is too thickheaded to figure this out then that's a him problem not a game problem.

[NamikazeNaruto]

I disagree with OP's argument that field respec should be eliminated because it increases the gear grind.

 

It might be good to remove in WZ respec. It might not. Whether or not a WZ is stale-matey is not a good critera either -- there are other ways to improve WZ...

 

The best reason to keep or remove in WZ respec is if it results in more novel play and team composition in top level rated matches.

 

The argument that in WZ respec increases the scope for skillful play is also a good argument.

 

There are many knobs that can be turned to change the game. From a practical standpoint it may be too much to ask BW to turn more than one knob a year and get things right...

 

If we continue to keep in WZ respec, I would like having the clicking the skill tree and gear swapping as quickly as possible not be part of the competition. I.e. give us multi-spec that allows us to change skill tree, quickbar and gear with a single click. If you adhere to the no-macros rule, this is the

of in WZ respec as competition.

 

Even if you disregarded the fact of the additional gear grind it creates, the fact still stands that this greatly reduces the risk the winning team faces of ever losing in WZ. Whatever team gets their natural node first on Civil War can kick back and relax when they all respec tanks/heals. They can just send one tank/healer to node guard on their node, and 6 in middle for example, and since they are all tank/heals, they won't have to worry about losing a node for the rest of the game. Same applies to Novare once the South bunker is capped. Voidstar is obvious, and the power advantage of having an entire team be respeccable from DPS to Tank/Heals is apparent.

 

 

Normally it wouldn't be viable to do this in Civil War or Novare Coast, but since macros exist, it's pretty simple to do. This field respec basically means whoever caps the node/bunker first in Civil War or Novare Coast wins, and the other team has no chance to recover. No amount of tricky strategies or dps will get them the node against a semi-competent team that changes to all tanks/heals.

 

 

How is that in any way fun or competitive?

Edited July 8, 2013 by NamikazeNaruto

[ManiacDavis]

there are a lot guilds -- my own included -- that build their teams purely on ACs. this is idiocy in the first place. assuming identical skill, slinger > mando (dps). HOWEVER, if mando A is a better player than slinger B, guess what? mando A should be the ranged option you take -- especially if you're filling a 2nd ranged spot. however, most ppl seem to think the AC gap is so wide that any idiot on a slinger is going to be better than a gunnery mando. he is not. that's the player base's fault. not the game's.

 

crying that your mando is now worthless because he can't respec and will lose his spot to a slinger is an indication that your guild/team/whatever doesn't have a frackin clue. yes. snipers are better. no. they aren't hands down, universally the choice to make. there's room for a dps mando in rated with or without field respec. if your leader is too thickheaded to figure this out then that's a him problem not a game problem.

 

Would you play with only half of your gear? Would you play with only half of your abilities? By bringing an equally skilled dps commando over a dps gunslinger, that is what you are doing without field respec. Entrench, trauma, aoe DMG reduction, aoe node cap prevention, aoe flash bang cc, an execute; now please tell me why you would ever bring a commando dps who cannot offer heals when a slinger brings all of this utility assuming both players are equally skilled?

[foxmob]

Would you play with only half of your gear? Would you play with only half of your abilities? By bringing an equally skilled dps commando over a dps gunslinger, that is what you are doing without field respec. Entrench, trauma, aoe DMG reduction, aoe node cap prevention, aoe flash bang cc, an execute; now please tell me why you would ever bring a commando dps who cannot offer heals when a slinger brings all of this utility assuming both players are equally skilled?

 

equally skilled, then the first spot would go to a slinger. 2nd ranged, equally skilled, mando dps (assuming heals are sage and scoundrel). electro net will be more valuable burning down the other team's healers. you're not losing a huge amount of dps. you don't need a second "area guard". mando is more mobile, which will also aid in attacking a point. as you mentioned, snipers are more about defending an area. there are trade offs. certain WZs benefit one or the other class. I would rather have a mando for hb. he's no liability in vs, but the sniper's going to be better. the team strat has to change too. in novarre, if you're trying to kill the other team, go with the mando. if you're trying to mezz cap, sniper's flash bang is great (but you will also have an op's and a couple awes and nades so it's not a big deal). in CW, where you MUST wipe the other team (more or less) to cap mid, then the mando will be better. a sniper is great when you have mid. he's easy to nullify (from an opponent healer's perspective) when trying to cap. it's just very easy to los him at mid. hypergate is a push. maybe the extra 5m ranged is a slight advantage to the sniper. you're not going to use either one to guard. net is going to allow your team to polish off a lot of sages/scoundrels.

 

the real issue...is treating your guildies like they're equally skilled when, in fact, they are not. one will be better than the other.

 

bottom line, there's more than one way to skin a cat. mando dps is perfectly viable. learn to use them. (as a team).

[ManiacDavis]

electro net will be more valuable burning down the other team's healers.

 

Electro net has a 1 minute and 30 second cooldown. What are you going to do the next 1 minute and 21 seconds. A sniper's dps is consistent for the duration and far outpaces the mando in dirty fighting.

 

mando is more mobile, which will also aid in attacking a point.

 

The mando relies upon castable abilities, grav round/full auto. That is 4.5 seconds of there rotation which needs to be stationary.

 

I would rather have a mando for hb.

 

This is utterly the most obvious clue that you do not have extensive ranked experience. Sniper is utterly the most important class in Huttball because of entrench. It allows them to grab the ball without being cc'd and lasts 30 seconds. The only counter is MM sniper which is non-existent these days in ranked but under-utilized. Thus, Sniper is best at getting the ball, and only way to counter it is another sniper.

 

The only other class that comes close to this is shadow with resilience which is only 3 seconds. A shadow's time is better spent in tank stance trying to firepull the enemy ball carrier.

 

in novarre, if you're trying to kill the other team, go with the mando.

 

You just said the sniper puts out more dps, so how will the mando kill the other team faster.

 

net is going to allow your team to polish off a lot of sages/scoundrels.

 

Like I said before, the cooldown on net does not give the commando an advantage over sniper.

 

bottom line, there's more than one way to skin a cat. mando dps is perfectly viable. learn to use them. (as a team).

 

Learn to use them... I am very confident to say that I am in the top 1% of all commandos. Prior to 2.0 I demonstrated that commando assault can rip through targets. After 2.0 when people abandoned commandos, they saw me rip people up and attempted to copy my play-style. For any other details visit my stream in my signature.

[mulzii]

its not just heals/tanks that can take advantage of this. I know a sin that specs deception when going to take a node solo, then once he takes it, changes to tank to keep it.

 

B/W can't prevent the macroers. but they can implement a cooldown on it, and perhaps a debuff that makes you do 50% damage and take 50% more damage for 2 minutes after a respec,

[Crujido]

Nah. Thanks though

 

5char

[TheCourier-]

Would you play with only half of your gear? Would you play with only half of your abilities? By bringing an equally skilled dps commando over a dps gunslinger, that is what you are doing without field respec. Entrench, trauma, aoe DMG reduction, aoe node cap prevention, aoe flash bang cc, an execute; now please tell me why you would ever bring a commando dps who cannot offer heals when a slinger brings all of this utility assuming both players are equally skilled?

 

The Watchmen uses a mercenary for ranked. Electro-net is extremely powerful, and heatseeker missiles can crit for over 11000 damage. Stacking snipers doesn't guarantee a win. Mercenary actually has more burst than sniper.

[Raansu]

Actually they can, thanks to the macros that a few people have already mentioned.

 

That is an entirely different subject. One that I have personally seen people on my server banned for, twice.

[foxmob]

Electro net has a 1 minute and 30 second cooldown. What are you going to do the next 1 minute and 21 seconds. A sniper's dps is consistent for the duration and far outpaces the mando in dirty fighting.

 

 

 

The mando relies upon castable abilities, grav round/full auto. That is 4.5 seconds of there rotation which needs to be stationary.

sigh. electro net is 1.5m BECAUSE it's so darn powerful. mando isn't going to keep pace with a sniper, especially not on one of those pvp dummies who apparently stand there for you. mandos are FAR more mobile than snipers. they're both turrets, but once the sniper pops entrench, he's stuck there or he loses entrench. see entrench: los. mando takes two steps and then continues his roto. believe me, I'm supremely jealous of snipers. I think entrench lasts waaaay too long for what it does. but it's also a heavy anchor.

 

 

 

This is utterly the most obvious clue that you do not have extensive ranked experience. Sniper is utterly the most important class in Huttball because of entrench. It allows them to grab the ball without being cc'd and lasts 30 seconds. The only counter is MM sniper which is non-existent these days in ranked but under-utilized. Thus, Sniper is best at getting the ball, and only way to counter it is another sniper.

you do realize that with the mando dps filling the 2nd range slot that there's a sniper in the 1st one, right? or did you conveniently forget that? I would rather have the mobility of a mando with hold the line running around than a second sniper.

 

The only other class that comes close to this is shadow with resilience which is only 3 seconds. A shadow's time is better spent in tank stance trying to firepull the enemy ball carrier.

as a fire puller, you should have no problem hanging around mid. in fact, you never need to go past the first platform (closest to center).

 

 

Learn to use them... I am very confident to say that I am in the top 1% of all commandos. Prior to 2.0 I demonstrated that commando assault can rip through targets. After 2.0 when people abandoned commandos, they saw me rip people up and attempted to copy my play-style. For any other details visit my stream in my signature.

perhaps you thought I was insulting you or your ability here? if I wanted to troll you, I'd have said L2P. you see, that's mean. it implies you don't know how to play your class. I was speaking of team tactics. they shift depending on team comp. just because you have two snipers doesn't mean you're better than an opponent with a merc and a sniper. the way a mando/sniper team plays, however, does need to change...just like any other comp changes. throwing 2 snipers out there is just cookie-cutter. it's not the only effective comp.

Edited July 9, 2013 by foxmob

[islander]

its not just heals/tanks that can take advantage of this. I know a sin that specs deception when going to take a node solo, then once he takes it, changes to tank to keep it.

 

B/W can't prevent the macroers. but they can implement a cooldown on it, and perhaps a debuff that makes you do 50% damage and take 50% more damage for 2 minutes after a respec,

 

This is the crux of the problem. They can't (or won't) stop cheaters. Period.

It's just like in real life when a couple of people at work abuse a benefit, and as a result the benefit gets taken away. A few jerks wreck it for everyone.

[funkiestj]

This is the crux of the problem. They can't (or won't) stop cheaters. Period.

It's just like in real life when a couple of people at work abuse a benefit, and as a result the benefit gets taken away. A few jerks wreck it for everyone.

 

It is so much simpler and less costly to devalue macro-respec programmatically (e.g. the previous poster gave some suggestiosn) than it is to police the issue. Policing is an ongoing operational cost that scales proportionally to the population size. Adding respec debuffs and/or a minimum interval between skill tree point reset and skill tree point commit is a non-recurring engineering cost -- pay it once and we are done.

[islander]

It is so much simpler and less costly to devalue macro-respec programmatically (e.g. the previous poster gave some suggestiosn) than it is to police the issue. Policing is an ongoing operational cost that scales proportionally to the population size. Adding respec debuffs and/or a minimum interval between skill tree point reset and skill tree point commit is a non-recurring engineering cost -- pay it once and we are done.

 

I am completely open to alternatives such as these.

[Raansu]

I'm seriously getting to the point now where I just leave voidstar every time. Why bother playing when you know exactly whats going to happen. Everyone will be tanks/healers on defense and on offense they will all go dps. It's so stupid and annoying. It doesn't help that the map itself is flawed as well.