a note on non-consensual PvP in Illum

[ClavisN]

So, if there was a level 55 operations boss at the pylon that you couldn't kill as a level 50 Sage, that would be acceptable but since it's PvP that's not ok?

 

No, because the event is advertized as suitable for players level 50.

[kweassa]

*Sigh* that illustrates perfectly the mindset.

 

Queuing works. It is efficient, everybody gets his quest items/goals.

Cooperation wins over confrontation. What is so hard to understand about that?

 

PvP, otoh, or at least open world pvp, doesnt work. A level 50 sage in beginners gear has no chance in hell to ever win a mactch. Ever.

 

Actually, just about anybody sub-55 in expertise-less gear stands no chance against a well expertise-equipped level 55.

 

That is not sports. That is simply ganking. I was killed 4 times by the same guy today. He decloaked, 2-3 hits, dead. He isn't even scratched. He followed me around the map - attacked me in various places.

 

In other places I'd call that stalking, harassment, bullying. But, hey, you guys find that normal....

 

It is normal, and that's PvP.

 

You don't get to "choose" or give your "consensus" about PvP any more than a soldier is given a choice on whether they want the enemy to shoot upon him or not. If you weren't ready to accept that fact, then you shouldn't have entered the zone in the first place.

 

Hazardous zones are an "enter at your own risk" matter.

If you can't survive on your own, make a team and operate the quests together.

[Raansu]

Cooperation wins over confrontation. What is so hard to understand about that?

 

Why don't you take your own advice and ask yourself the same thing. What is so hard to understand that a pvp area is a pvp area. Stop crying and expecting to go into a pvp area and not end up in a fight.

 

See a psychologist.

 

I can not hide from someone I can not see, and both quests force me into the open at some point. "Caution" is hard to come by for a non-stealth class.

 

They are necessary because the event is so short. You need to get friend status to get any kind of reward at all - which means 15k reputation. On day one you cant do the ship mission., meaning you earn 1440. On days 2-6, you can do ship missions, meaning you can get 2070. That means after 6 days you have slightly below 12000 reputation. "Friend" needs 15000. You would need at least one Xeno plus something else (either a WB or the load screen rallye ) to actually hit the 15k.

 

But WBs and Xeno make you dependent on the quality of PUGs - many people tried to get into functioning Xeno groups today, without much success. The PvP area missions, otoh, add a nice 900 rep per day, which puts you comfortably over the line.

 

So your claim that these missions are "not necessary" should be taken with a grain of salt.

 

There is this thing called a guild, you should try it sometime. The very first time the gree event went live I hit the weekly cap within two days all without ever doing the pvp missions. Granted I did it with two toons, but with that said, if you actually TRY to do the pve crap you can reach the weekly cap quite easily without ever doing the pvp missions. You do not have to do them, stop crying about it and stick to your pve missions. Doing the dailies every single day, killing the WB and Xeno will get you to the weekly cap LONG before you will ever need to do the pvp missions.

[Astarica]

Don't know about other servers, but on my server I just switch to the instance with 10 guys in it and then it's easy to do the PvP quest. While I'm more than capable of killing the people that try to gank me (since a lot of them bizarrely aren't wearing PvP gear), it's obviously easier to do these quests without anyone getting in the way.

[Jherad]

There is absolutely zero 'non-consensual' PvP on a PvE server.

 

None.

 

You CHOOSE to PvP the moment you pick up a PvP quest (yes, they are titled that) and enter a PvP zone. You can scream and holler all you like that you were forced to do it, but, no. You weren't. You CHOSE to do it.

 

I am waaay behind on gree reputation. Probably because I CHOOSE not to do any of the PVE quests to grind it out. I do on occasion do the PvP ones as I roam around the zone and kill people however. I might get enough rep to get something interesting in another 2 or 3 events. That's fine.

 

Choice. It's a bummer, ain't it.

[Princz]

1. Its not a PvP quest. Its a PvE quest possibly involving some PvP activity.

2. It's necessary to get any kind of overall Gree event reward, given the short time frame of the event.

3. In any case, I did not subscribe to ganking.

4. As long as you have no quest induced reason to attack me, you shouldn't. (thats the difference to a wz)

5. in my experience, the well bolstered war zones are not even remotely as unfair as Illum PvP

 

But thanks for the answer(s) - from the uniformly negative reactions here I take it the PvP community condones this kind of crap and applauds nonconsensual PvP, ganging up and ganking, and I will take my issues elsewhere.

 

Those of you who are still capable of reflection I suggest you ask yourselves how this your ethos is any way related to sportsmanlike behavior and ideals.

 

Well pvpers are lurking these areas ...it was his mistake alone that was flaged for pvp....

If it is not your taste unflag... dont blame the player that killed him because that player was there to kill people.

Ilum is pvp planet for the pvp players .... i am personaly sad that Gree is an only an event... we need more of these events in other planets more constantly.

 

Please dont look for sympathy when ganked in a pvp forum ... it is like going in a "meat only" restaurant and ask for a green salad .... the waitor will give a really weird look @ you

Edited May 28, 2013 by Princz

[Crixa]

The notion of these quests as being "PvE quests" simply because they involve elements beyond engaging in combat with other players is completely out of place in this game. Every single warzone is won by completing objectives outside of this simple concept. Even in Ancient Hypergates, pylons must be captured and controlled for kills to count towards a score and the design still provides a nonlethal way to score points during those healfests when nobody actually seems to die.

 

Expecting to venture into a PvP zone and complete these objectives while circumventing a system designed to pit you in combat against other players is just as ridiculous as expecting to enter a warzone and do the same. There is no flag huttball league in this game yet, but with the rate PvE content is created compared to that of PvP content, I wouldn't be all that surprised if it winds up being announced as the next warzone map introduced to the game.

[Crujido]

Illum = a PvP planet.

 

/end thread

 

You go to a PvP contested planet you will find PvP.

You signed up by going over there.

Risk vs Reward.

Have fun!

[TheGrimaceOR]

LoL non-consensual PvP..i think all PvP is non consensual....

 

I doubt anyone sends a jawagram stating "you are cordially invited to partake in getting killed at your earliest convenience"

 

as anyone else has said..if you go to a pvp zone..wear pvp gear...even if doing pve content and quest..the planet is still a PvP planet.

 

On a side note this has been a blast...i just do the quests yet i have full pvp gear just don't feel the need to trounce on bads to make me feel better. Me and my friend were doing the heroic 4 and sure enough people would try and jump on us when we would get the boss droid..we would stop kill them then go back to the droid... two guys tried 3 times in a row to kill us..it didn't work any time on the third time i told them ' maybe you should just let us finish our quest...or if you like we will happily kill you for a 4th time'

[HexDecimalUK]

funniest part is this joker consented to PVP when he picked a pvp server

[Sziroten]

Hello,

 

I'm a PvE player. I play on a PvE server. And while I occasionally join a PvP match, I'm not that thrilled by it.

 

But during the last week, on Illum, I've been forced into PvP activity against my will every single day. And I resent that tremendously.

 

Now, when I subscribe to the two missions in the "PvP Area" I understand that Bioware built in a PvP element - the resource contention. People are supposed to compete at and - if necessary - battle for a limited resource. And to the extent that this is the case I accept that PvP is part of the quest. (My strategy for dealing with this is basically avoinding contentios times and instances. And I am not alone in this - on some days I have seen many groups from both factions politely and fairly queueing behind each other and everybody getting their quest goals with maximum efficiency. Cooperation wins out over confrontation every single time)

 

But this is where it ends. What we often see instead is

• PvP players in full expertise gear practically hunting and killing defenseless PvE players in the Illum zone.
  
• PvP players ganging up 3-1 or 4-1 on lone players to kill them in the Illum zone
  
• PvP player teams blocking the the quest resources/choke points for hours to get kills while having no need of them
  
• PvP players doing all that to even to their own faction mates (from a RP point ov view there is nothing more revolting and contemptible than a team of Jedi ganking other Jedi. These decrepit existences should be kicked from the order and forcibly transferred to the Empire).
  
• PvP players laying PvP traps in the non-PvP area - by running flagged into AoE fire in certain fights
  
• PvP players searching for easy kills in the PvE area because many PvE players are force-flagged here for a number of reasons
  

 

All that is not the PvE experience I signed up for when joining a PvE server.

As I have neither fully geared level 55 toons (not even to mention expertise-laden PvP toons) I am simply chanceless against these types. Yesterday my lvl 50 agent was killed in the PvP area by a shadow who did over 9000 (!!) damage with a single spell. I only have 16000 hitpoints. That means he can kill me with two hits - to this guy am am nothing more than a normal mob NPC. I did not attack the guy. I just went along minding my own business. He decloaked and killed.

 

The day before I was standing around near a pylon in the non-PVP area at the Gree ship, observing a group of fellow faction players doing the Heroic mission. One of the PvP types comes along, sees that one of the players in the group is flagged and attacks her without any communication. They were busy battling the guardian robot, and before they could react their mate was dead. She put up a decent fight, but couldn't make a dent with the guy.

 

So when the ganker was done and moved some away, I politely started to revive the dead player, so that she wouldn't have to walk back from the med bot. I immediately heard the damned drum and was flagged myself (for ****inmg what??). And before the drum even had played out, the ganker already jumped me and killed me within seconds.

 

Again - this is not what I signed up for.

 

I am quite aware that the majority of PvP players are decent people who dislikes that as much as I do. So my question here - what could and/or should be done by Bioware or the community to put an end to this crap?

 

Sometimes I wonder what else Bioware has to do to make people understand that everything they do may have consequences.

 

People joining warzones in PvE gear (prior bolster) because they choose to use the money option when they clicked onto the PvP terminal on the fleet and people which ACCEPT a PVP quest and ENTERING a PVP area CRYING ABOUT PVP is the top of the hill of stupidity which people can come up with. You are not even required to do it at all, nobody is forcing you and if some people chose to avoid the pvp element by queueing like in the supermarket..... good for them but you don't have any right if anyone comes along and does pvp.

 

There is 0 reason to be pvp flagged in the pve area. The only reason is your own stupidity. Heck I'm even forced not to use my abilities because someone flagged "helps" me kill whatever random boss faster.... . The only time I enganged in pvp was when 3 pvp reps tried to kill 2 of my pvp flagged guildmembers so we trashed them. Other than that... I even "respect" that this is a "pve" zone.

 

Consider this a "putting your nose into your own **** to make you understand why I'm not pleased with you" post.

 

Posts like this actually make me want to go there and kill some moronic people thinking that because the quest does not involve to pvp, it is not a pvp quest and they have the right to just pick the pve element on it.

Edited May 28, 2013 by Sziroten

[Stragul]

You dont need the PvP quest to get weekley cap... just use multi toons and do the PvE.

 

Only time I have done any PvP, was a "mistake" some Rep jerk was ninja something while I was killing some mobs... He steped into my orbital strike thingy and died...

[Princz]

NO .... means NO

 

Protest people ...protest

[Alkazarr]

Premades are ruining Ilum dailies!

 

QFT... lol

 

In other news, OP's post gave me cancer.

Edited May 28, 2013 by Alkazarr

[Ajuntalee]

So you were forced you to travel to ilum, then they forced you to take the JcJ quests, then they forced you to enter the tiny PvP FightZone, they forced you to ignore the warning about receiving the PvP enabled tag.

 

Then you inevitably got rofltomped like anyone else who entered this area this weekend has, then I guess you were forced again into this sequence of inevitable events over and over until you flet your lack of brains and outright stupidity was worth a page of public display here on the PvP forums.

 

god and you did all that to receive 20 k ingaame money, bit of useless reputation, and WZ commendation which you wont use cause it gives useles stuff for someone who never does PvP.

 

You are way beyond redeeming bro, and not only as a player, ask yourself why any sane human being would ever impose such kind of things to themselves, you need a shrink dude you have serious issues in your head, your way of thinking needs a complete overhaul.

[AlrikFassbauer]

But this is where it ends. What we often see instead is

• PvP players in full expertise gear practically hunting and killing defenseless PvE players in the Illum zone.
  
• PvP players ganging up 3-1 or 4-1 on lone players to kill them in the Illum zone
  
• PvP player teams blocking the the quest resources/choke points for hours to get kills while having no need of them
  
• PvP players doing all that to even to their own faction mates (from a RP point ov view there is nothing more revolting and contemptible than a team of Jedi ganking other Jedi. These decrepit existences should be kicked from the order and forcibly transferred to the Empire).
  
• PvP players laying PvP traps in the non-PvP area - by running flagged into AoE fire in certain fights
  
• PvP players searching for easy kills in the PvE area because many PvE players are force-flagged here for a number of reasons
  

 

I agree to this part.

 

Before I went into PvP myself months ago - I mean the War-Zones here - I naively thought it was about a "challenge".

I naively thought that I would meet other characters which would give me a fair, challengbing fight.

That I experienced instead is what I learned here is called "roflstomping" and "smashing".

There simply is no challenge.

 

On Ilum, it's almost the same : There just is not a single challenge. But instead it's people trying to exploit many ways to roflstomp people who are so much more weaker than that.

 

What I didn't see, however, but what I'm suspicious that it is imho *very* likely to happen, is, that the same people who play mighty predators will run away from others having the exact same characters, experise, power in general etc. - I'm quite sure that this will happen.

 

Because - my personal experience taught me a single, most important thing :

 

PvP isn't about challenge.

It is about roflstomping & PK.

Edited May 28, 2013 by AlrikFassbauer

[Ajuntalee]

Before I went into PvP myself months ago - I mean the War-Zones here - I naively thought it was about a "challenge".

I naively thought that I would meet other characters which would give me a fair, challengbing fight.

That I experienced instead is what I learned here is called "roflstomping" and "smashing".

There simply is no challenge.

 

it is about challenge, only the challenge is as follow :

 

You hone your skill as an individual and as a group to match or outmatch that of the other dudes/gals.

 

and not

 

we carefully gauge how sucky you are atm and adapt our performance to give you the impression you are nearly a champion.

 

you are not boxing with your daddy here, and you don't get any bruises when you fail,

 

So there is no reason not to have a go at what you find best, you learn faster this way, and then we too can enjoy the challenge with a fresh team of contender we don't already know and these are you and your teammmates.

[Alkazarr]

I agree to this part.

 

Before I went into PvP myself months ago - I mean the War-Zones here - I naively thought it was about a "challenge".

I naively thought that I would meet other characters which would give me a fair, challengbing fight.

That I experienced instead is what I learned here is called "roflstomping" and "smashing".

There simply is no challenge.

 

On Ilum, it's almost the same : There just is not a single challenge. But instead it's people trying to exploit many ways to roflstomp people who are so much more weaker than that.

 

What I didn't see, however, but what I'm suspicious that it is imho *very* likely to happen, is, that the same people who play mighty predators will run away from others having the exact same characters, experise, power in general etc. - I'm quite sure that this will happen.

 

Because - my personal experience taught me a single, most important thing :

 

PvP isn't about challenge.

It is about roflstomping & PK.

 

^ plays on PVE server

[Calvin_Mago]

Like the OP, I'm on a PVE server. So imagine my surprise when in an Alderaan Civil War that I queued for in my PVE gear, while I was trying to cap the middle pylon, 5 players in their PVP gear jumped on me and killed me before I could get any objective points. And they were my OWN faction!

 

All that is not the PvE experience I signed up for when joining a PvE server. As I have neither fully geared level toons I am simply chanceless against these types.

 

If we politely and fairly queued behind each other to cap the node, we would all get our quest goals, the eight medals, with maximum efficiency. Cooperation wins out over confrontation every single time. What is so hard to understand about that?

 

Also, a shadow popped out of stealth and attacked me in several places. This non-consensual PVP made me very uncomfortable.

 

Again - this is not what I signed up for. And in conclusion, WAHH WAAHH WAAAAHHH!

[ClavisN]

funniest part is this joker consented to PVP when he picked a pvp server

 

You want to learn to read. I play on a PvE server.

[cycao]

I agree to this part.

 

Before I went into PvP myself months ago - I mean the War-Zones here - I naively thought it was about a "challenge".

I naively thought that I would meet other characters which would give me a fair, challengbing fight.

That I experienced instead is what I learned here is called "roflstomping" and "smashing".

There simply is no challenge.

 

On Ilum, it's almost the same : There just is not a single challenge. But instead it's people trying to exploit many ways to roflstomp people who are so much more weaker than that.

 

What I didn't see, however, but what I'm suspicious that it is imho *very* likely to happen, is, that the same people who play mighty predators will run away from others having the exact same characters, experise, power in general etc. - I'm quite sure that this will happen.

 

Because - my personal experience taught me a single, most important thing :

 

PvP isn't about challenge.

It is about roflstomping & PK.

 

If people wanted to crush players then you would see 55's camping out lowbies on planets not steered towards end game content.

[HaLeX]

I'm with the original poster on this one. Frankly, I'm shocked, appalled and saddened at the reaction you have received from these cruel and inhumane pvpers. What ever happened to community? to helping people out? to respecting peoples desires and not be molested while minding ones own business? This is whats wrong with America today. They reward bullies and give them a forum to do the bullying.

 

I was self washing my car at 4 am the other day and some bum kept trying to talk to me. He obviously wanted money, I wanted to be left alone. He yelled at me my name is blah blah blah and this and that. I said listen pal, I'm only gonna say this once. You have the right to say what you want where you want. I, however, have the right to be left alone. With sprayer in hand, I told him in no uncertain terms, leave me alone ... and he left me alone. I was about to shove the sprayer up ... anyways a bit off topic.

 

The bottom line is EA needs to fix this ASAP, I put this issue up there with bolster and x-servers as something that needs to be addressed. I believe I speak for 90% of pvpers when I say I'm sorry that happened to you, maybe some people will do the right thing and let you do your quest in peace next time. I'd like to hear something from the devs on this ...

[ImpliedCarth]

I don't understand why its hard for people to understand its a PvP quest in a PvP area expect to get killed.

 

Pre 1.2 Ilum nobody complained about dying during those quests whats the diff now?

[Ajuntalee]

@Halex

 

Are you serious ?

 

So you were about to phisically injure a bum that lost at real world PVE itemization and force him into non consensual real life PvP with a BlackHole sprayer Type 4, only because he was taunting you while you were showing off your new real life Mount to show the rest of your street how well YOU did in real life PvE.

 

good fun bro.

[cycao]

The bottom line is EA needs to fix this ASAP, I put this issue up there with bolster and x-servers as something that needs to be addressed. I believe I speak for 90% of pvpers when I say I'm sorry that happened to you, maybe some people will do the right thing and let you do your quest in peace next time. I'd like to hear something from the devs on this ...

 

How, how is this FFA area broken? You get warned prior to going in and these quests are not mandatory and can be skipped. I believe I speak for 90% of the PvPers who actually get a certain amount of joy every so often when this event comes around because its the only type of "open world PvP" that we get since the original Ilum was revamped so long ago.

 

This area was implemented for the PvP community, if PvP is not your first intention then you have should know that people get killed in these areas (red=dead) and you assume the risk if you chose to do the two non-mandatory missions.