ETA on Advanced Class change?

[TridusSWTOR]

Maybe you feel the same, but I am fine with people simply saying "I don't like the idea of AC change" and leave it at that. That's an opinion of personal preference and I can't argue with that. But apparently they feel the need to turn their opinions into objective fact.

 

You opened my eyes about this. I have to agree and you make a solid point.

 

Thanks for bringing this up to me, seriously.

 

I can see the reason why I'm so confused about how they respond- It's okay if they disagree with it, but when they have that "enforce" attitude, it makes me facepalm.

[TridusSWTOR]

It's really neat watching you try to emphasize how much of an adult you are.

 

*Updated: Any more?

 

That's all you can provide to this?

 

Thanks for debunked yourself.

[TridusSWTOR]

Alright You win If you are happy with having nothing but argument going on then so be it. I am not one to change one's mind on that. I already put my thoughts in why Advanced Class Change shouldn't be an option. Let the arguing commence.

 

Just remember, in the end, it's all pointless

 

Don't say it's pointless. Maybe to you it is.

 

These are forums though. The entire purpose is for discussion/debate. Yes it's rare to find but sometimes once in a blue moon....it's there!

 

Aren't you even remotely interested in how both sides came to their conclusions?

[BlackSpin]

what?

 

That's all you can provide to this?

 

Thanks for debunked yourself.

[branmakmuffin]

I can see the reason why I'm so confused about how they respond- It's okay if they disagree with it, but when they have that "enforce" attitude, it makes me facepalm.

Me, too.

 

I would probably never pay CC to change my characters' ACs. But you and I and others take the position that if some people wanted to take advantage of such an option, they should be allowed to do so. If people opposed to AC change were somehow going to be forced to do AC changes, they'd have an argument stronger than "I just don't like it."

[branmakmuffin]

what?

"What?" yourself. You seem to think that collecting various quotes of mine in which I refer to adulthood and maturity makes some kind of point.

 

Or have I just spawned a fan club?

 

Or a stalker?

[NrDLeipe]

A 1 time change should be fine for a high price of cc or something.

everybody can make a mistake with there choice, but after that 1 time no more possibilty.

 

its just to block the fotm, no good if theres a new fotm half the population switch to it that will take the fun out of the game imo.

And if they want more then they can always reroll a new char and put a little bit of effort in it

[BlackSpin]

"I disagree" and "I oppose" are not cogent arguments, they are opinions. I'm not forcing or persuading you with my opinion because I didn't present an argument. I'm already tired and bored of this, read a dictionary.

 

Cogent: appealing forcibly to the mind or reason : convincing.

 

 

"I don't think this feature should be added to the game because I don't like it" is a perfectly cogent argument. Not powerfully cogent, but cogent. Perhaps you don't know what "cogent" means.

Edited July 27, 2013 by BlackSpin

[MajikMyst]

Maybe you feel the same, but I am fine with people simply saying "I don't like the idea of AC change" and leave it at that. That's an opinion of personal preference and I can't argue with that. But apparently they feel the need to turn their opinions into objective fact.

 

The same can be said for people that want AC swapping.. Just felt the need to point that you..

 

Except for one small fact.. The people that don't want AC swapping are arguing for things to stay the way they currently are.. We are not imposing our play style on others..

 

Those that do want AC swapping are demanding that the game be changed, and they are imposing their play style on others.. That is not opinion...

 

That last part was pointed out for the benefit of someone else.. Not you Bran..

Edited July 27, 2013 by MajikMyst

[MajikMyst]

A 1 time change should be fine for a high price of cc or something.

everybody can make a mistake with there choice, but after that 1 time no more possibilty.

 

its just to block the fotm, no good if theres a new fotm half the population switch to it that will take the fun out of the game imo.

And if they want more then they can always reroll a new char and put a little bit of effort in it

 

And you fulfill the prophesy of the slippery slope argument with your very post..

 

As soon as they allow it once there well be calls to lift that restriction.. Just like there are calls to lift the restriction of not being able to do it at all..

 

Everyone needs to learn live with the definition of permanent.. The game makes it quite clear.. If you don't like your class, then roll another character.. That is how you do it in other MMO's.. This one is no different..

Edited July 27, 2013 by MajikMyst

[NrDLeipe]

And you fulfill the prophesy of the slippery slope argument with your very post..

 

As soon as they allow it once there well be calls to lift that restriction.. Just like there are calls to lift the restriction of not being able to do it at all..

 

Everyone needs to learn live with the definition of permanent.. The game makes it quite clear.. If you don't like your class, then roll another character.. That is how you do it in other MMO's.. This one is no different..

 

your assuming its a slipery slope but you cant predict the future, and your point of you get most of your key skills at lvl 10 is just bs, its more like lvl 30

 

i dont want 2 change my class but im not dissapointed, if they give a 1 time option for a high amount of cc to those who made the wrong choice im fine with that

Edited July 27, 2013 by NrDLeipe

[branmakmuffin]

"I disagree" and "I oppose" are not cogent arguments, they are opinions. I'm already tired and bored of this.

Obviously not tired and bored enough to not make that reply. But apparently too tired and bored to look up the word "cogent."

[MajikMyst]

your assuming its a slipery slope but you cant predict the future, and your point of you get most of your key skills at lvl 10 is just bs, its more like lvl 30

 

i dont want 2 change my class but im not dissapointed, if they give a 1 time option for a high amount of cc to those who made the wrong choice im fine with that

 

Actually no.. I am not assuming anything.. People are already asking for a restriction to be lifted.. That is just the start.. It doesn't take a brain surgeon to know that if Bioware allows it once and then calls it permanent, people will be back here asking to allow it twice or more.. I mean as it is now, they don't know what permanent means.. What makes you think they will know what it means after it is allowed once??

 

It isn't an assumption it is called common sense..

[branmakmuffin]

A 1 time change should be fine for a high price of cc or something.

everybody can make a mistake with there choice, but after that 1 time no more possibilty.

 

its just to block the fotm, no good if theres a new fotm half the population switch to it that will take the fun out of the game imo.

And if they want more then they can always reroll a new char and put a little bit of effort in it

You say that like it means something. If, for example, Powertech became a FOTM, that wouldn't allow Marauder players to switch to Powertech. So unless "half the population" (Imperial) were playing Mercenaries, your hyperbole is just that.

 

And in any event, who cares? Again, it's none of your business what someone does with his or her CC or how often he or she does it. Even though you say you are OK with AC change in a limited way, that's what this is all about for you, dictating to others how to play their game;.

Edited July 27, 2013 by branmakmuffin

[MajikMyst]

Obviously not tired and bored enough to not make that reply. But apparently too tired and bored to look up the word "cogent."

 

Cogent:

1: having power to compel or constrain <cogent forces>

 

2: a : appealing forcibly to the mind or reason : convincing <cogent evidence>

 

b : pertinent, relevant <a cogent analysis>

— co·gent·ly adverb

 

 

See cogent defined for English-language learners »

 

See cogent defined for kids »

 

Examples of COGENT

 

<the results of the DNA fingerprinting were the most cogent evidence for acquittal>

… Honeyboy Edwards provides a cogent analysis of the shift within the blues over the years … —David Hajdu, Mother Jones, September/October 2003

 

There... I looked it up and he is right.. Being opposed to or matter of opinion are not cogent arguments.. They are not based on evidence or fact..

[LordArtemis]

There are passionate reasons pro and con. I don't see any reasons as irrational particularly, at least lately....most of the silly reasons posted early on have dropped away.

 

No, AC change will likely NOT destroy the game, though it may have some negative impact on it....and it is likely there will be more than a few folks that will be unhappy if it is implemented.

 

No, a lack of AC change will likely NOT destroy the game. If it had any negative impact that time has likely passed and most folks have accepted the permanent choice I would expect. But it is likely there will be some folks that will be unhappy if it is not eventually added in some way to the game.

 

I have expressed my personal opinions I have against AC change and will not repeat them here. I will only say that I think that if it is to come to the game I would think it would be best to limit it's use in some way, at least for now.

 

That way we could see what kind of impact, if any, it might have on the game.

[MajikMyst]

You say that like it means something. If, for example, Powertech became a FOTM, that wouldn't allow Marauder players to switch to Powertech. So unless "half the population" (Imperial) were playing Mercenaries, your hyperbole is just that.

 

And in any event, who cares? Again, it's none of your business what someone does with his or her CC or how often he or she does it. Even though you say you are OK with AC change in a limited way, that's what this is all about for you, dictating to others how to play their game;.

 

Your big issue is that you don't like rules.. Well.. Life is full of rules.. So are video games.. You are the one dictating to others.. You are the one that wants to change the rules.. I fail to see why you have so much trouble observing the obvious..

Edited July 27, 2013 by MajikMyst

[Soluss]

I bolded the part, to where that addresses the person who is a first timer in an MMO.

 

Oh wait, you forgot about those guys right? Yea, it's easy since you don't honestly care about other people's situations.

I was brand new to MMOs at one point too. You know what I did? I looked at the classes and decided that I wanted to roll a wizard because I like range DPS. Rolling a warrior would not have gotten me range dps. For my second toon, I experimented with a few different classes for a few levels and decided if I liked it or not. It is no different then doing so here.

I hate to break it to you but umm Sin DPS and Sent DPS. Yea they are different. It seems you don't actually play this game or you are new to MMO's yourself. Either way, do some research before you make yourself look bad...well too late for that I guess.

 

I hate to break it to you but that's a poor comparison. You are arguing for AC change. AC change will not effect the difference between Sin DPS and Sent DPS whatsoever. What you need to compare, according to your argument, is Sin tank/melee dps to Sorc heal/range dps. Sent dual wield dps vers tank or single sabre dps. That would be the comparison you are looking for. Again, if you don't know if you want to be a range or melee or heal or tank....then do what everyone else does and experiment for 10 levels.

 

You telling people that they are new to MMOs or new to this game is getting old. You are very childish with your comments and it appears that you are the new one here. This MMO operates no different then any other MMO. You pick your class and play it. If you don't like it then you reroll. It is you that needs to do research. If you had done so then you wouldn't need to change your AC.

 

Then he finishes with comparing other MMO's into it. That's how you know they can't hold a discussion. Hey other MMO's have wizards and magic, why doesn't SWTOR have that? I mean all these MMO's got trolls and orcs too, damn we should put those in the game too!

 

Great logic there bud, great logic.

 

By great I mean horrible.

 

Because most MMOs are the same thing with a different skin. This is why we can compare them. Take away light sabers and insert sword. Take away lightning and insert fireball. Its all the same thing with a different theme. If you looked at the Juggernaught tank abilities, they are almost identical to WoW War abilities. Here is a picture of side by side ability comparison to prove it.... http://i.imgur.com/UmcMV.jpg. They are so identical that they might as well be the same game. Oh wait, it pretty much is because they are both the same genre. Are you new to MMOs. Get a clue. :rolleyes:

[Soluss]

Yea they said they will probably(very likely) add this feature in the future. So, I'll let you stamp your feet until you come to terms with that.

 

Stop trying to tell other players how to play. It's as simple as that. You don't pay their sub, last time I checked.

 

Im not the one stomping my feet here. Im playing within the mechanics of the game. Im voicing my opinion that I like it that way. Until you can come to terms that some people don't agree with you then you shouldn't post.

 

Last time I checked, you started a topic and I shared my opinion on it. If you don't like that people have differing opinions then stay off the forums. I will voice my opinion however I want to.

[branmakmuffin]

You telling people that they are new to MMOs or new to this game is getting old. You are very childish with your comments and it appears that you are the new one here. This MMO operates no different then any other MMO. You pick your class and play it. If you don't like it then you reroll. It is you that needs to do research. If you had done so then you wouldn't need to change your AC.

And you keep implying that because it works this way now, that means it can't ever be changed. Talk about a weak argument. I used this way back in the thread, but here it is again. This is how your argument goes:

 

We want to raise the speed limit on this street from 25 to 35.

You can't do that.

Why not?

Because the speed limit on this street has always been 25.

 

There may very well be good reasons to not change something, but "Because it's always been this way" is not one of them.

[Soluss]

Let's see, I'll take "Any and every player" for 500 alex. Once again, stop speaking for every player, it makes you look bad.

 

Not sure how else I can say this- You. Don't. Pay. For. Other. Players. Subs. Stop. Telling. Them. How. To. Play. The. Game.

 

I broke it down for you, I might have to break it down further to get the point across it seems. Hopefully it'll finally click in though....I doubt it.

 

We aren't. Bioware is and its their game to do so. They are telling you that the choice you make is permanent. I am telling you that the choice you make is permanent and I like it that way. If you don't like it, I don't care.

[Soluss]

No, it is not any of your business how others play the game.

 

Its completely my business. The mechanic in the game is one that I would like to see stay. I will voice that until the point it is changed. I have every right to do so and you have no right to tell me otherwise. So take your own advice and stay out of my business or argue with something better.

 

And you would never be forced to buy one. "Problem" solved.

 

Not in my opinion.

 

It's not a rule, it is, as has been stated already, a game mechanic, which can be changed should BWEA choose to do so.

 

Semantics is semantics. If you want to call it a mechanic then call it a mechanic. Of course it can be changed a PVP RULEset server can also be changed to PVP. That doesn't mean it will happen. If it does then it does.... that doesn't mean I wont give my opinion that I think it shouldn't.

[branmakmuffin]

We aren't. Bioware is and its their game to do so.

Which means it's their game to change, isn't it?

 

They are telling you that the choice you make is permanent. I am telling you that the choice you make is permanent and I like it that way. If you don't like it, I don't care.

And I don't care if you are opposed to AC change. i also don't care that much if it's ever allowed or not. But I am capable of appreciating that not everyone is the same as me when it comes to playing TOR.

[branmakmuffin]

Its completely my business. The mechanic in the game is one that I would like to see stay.

And no one will ever force you to change your characters' ACs. Yet you want to deny that option to others. That's childish.

 

I will voice that until the point it is changed. I have every right to do so and you have no right to tell me otherwise.

I certainly do have that right. Watch:

 

You may no longer post in this thread.

 

Making you do what I say? That's another matter.

 

So take your own advice and stay out of my business or argue with something better.

I am staying out of your business. I am not trying to tell you how to play the game. You are trying to tell others how to play the game.

[LanceCorporalDan]

Hopefully never. Didn't you read the character description of abilities, lore, playstyle, etc. in the character creation screen?