ETA on Advanced Class change?

[TridusSWTOR]

Does changing class give you a character of a class which you did not level, even if you no longer have the class you leveled?

 

It doesn't add a new character. A new character means a brand new character that actually takes up a slot on the character select screen.

 

That's the difference.

[Soxbadger]

1950 posts about people freaking out over what someone else's AC is. I mean really. It's none of your business. Who cares who has what AC? Who cares if they change it? It's none of your business.

 

I agree, you still earned the exp. If you are a lvl 30 bounty hunter you earned the same amount of exp whether you decided on Merc or Ptech, so I just dont see the complaints.

 

I made a mistake with 1 character, Id like to be able to fix it. If I cant, oh well, but it would be a nice perk for subscribers (you get 1/2 chances to change your AC prior to 50). I think that gives people a chance to toy with what they want before making a final decision.

 

And I cant see how sub 50 characters switching AC is going to impact anyone, let alone hardcore guilds.

[branmakmuffin]

I agree, you still earned the exp. If you are a lvl 30 bounty hunter you earned the same amount of exp whether you decided on Merc or Ptech, so I just dont see the complaints.

 

I made a mistake with 1 character, Id like to be able to fix it. If I cant, oh well, but it would be a nice perk for subscribers (you get 1/2 chances to change your AC prior to 50). I think that gives people a chance to toy with what they want before making a final decision.

 

And I cant see how sub 50 characters switching AC is going to impact anyone, let alone hardcore guilds.

This is my attitude. If it ever becomes available, I might do it (depending on CC cost). Otherwise, I'm not gonna lose any sleep over it either way.

[Sinatore]

This thread is basically "I was too herpaderp and picked the wrong advanced class and now I'm too lazy to level another toon, please hand me something else"

 

Double XP weekends Derps. Go get to work.

 

the time you spend whining in here about being handed another class you could be leveling one.

 

GG

Edited June 25, 2013 by Sinatore

[PeterTLJr]

This thread is basically "I was too herpaderp and picked the wrong class and now I'm too lazy to level another toon, please hand me something else"

 

Double XP weekends Derps. Go get to work.

 

the time you spend whining in here about being handed another class you could be leveling one.

 

GG

 

picked the wrong advance class*

not sure if you noticed, but were not asking to switch classes, just AC's.

[Sinatore]

picked the wrong advance class*

not sure if you noticed, but were not asking to switch classes, just AC's.

 

Fix'd ty. and don't be surprised if the next thread on these forums IS about Class change in general

[PeterTLJr]

Fix'd ty. and don't be surprised if the next thread on these forums IS about Class change in general

 

Perhaps, dont think many people would be much for that.

[astrobearx]

Fix'd ty. and don't be surprised if the next thread on these forums IS about Class change in general

ah the slippery slope fallacy

 

is that all you have?

[LordArtemis]

Current list, pros and cons as reported by participants.

 

 

Option 1

Level 10 to 15 - Allow AC Change - max 2 changes allowed - reduction to level 10 with change - 24 hour cooldown - once you reach level 16 AC is permanent - everything except XP and quests are unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 2

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - max 1 change allowed - reduction to level 10 with change - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything except XP and quests are unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 3

 

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - max 2 changes allowed - no reduction in level - one month cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 4

 

Level 10 to 30 - Allow AC Change - max 1 change allowed - no reduction in level - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 5

Level 10 to 46 - Allow AC Change - no maximum changes, can change at will up to 46 - no reduction in level - no cooldown - once you reach level 47 AC is permanent - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 6

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - no maximum changes, can change at will - no reduction in level - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 7

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - no maximum changes, can change at will - no reduction in level - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - Must level one character to max level in an AC to unlock legacy ability to switch AC for that class - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 8

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - maximum 8 changes per account, can change at will - no reduction in level - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 9

 

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - no maximum number of changes - must change at AC trainers on fleet - 1 Week cooldown - Option for AC change unlocked as Character Perk for 600 cartel Coins (or 1.5 million credits) - Each subsequent AC change costs 40 cartel coins (or 100,000 credits).

 

Option 10

 

No AC change allowed.

 

 

 

And this is the pro and con list as it stands right now. It is certainly open for more additions or corrections.

 

 

PROS

 

1. breathing life into characters that may have been abandoned and thus extending someone's stay in game, their enjoyment in game.

2. allowing people who only have fun playing through a story once - experiment with their character without having to suffer through the story they already know and aren't having fun replaying.

3. allowing people to keep using unique, no longer acquirable items, that include pets, speeders, crystals, armor shells, as well as legacy perk unlocks on a character they have grown attached to, while enjoying the game play style that works better for them, within the same archetype, rather than having to reroll from scratch and lose all the investment they made into a character.

4. making extra money for bioware by making ac switch purchasable with cartel coins.

 

 

CONS

 

1) I would expect that many folks are not going to react well to this change if implemented.

2) They flirted with the idea before launch, even talked about it publicly, but in the end decided not to allow it. At the time folks were pretty dead set against it. I don't think it's likely the current environment has changed much since then.

3) Some classes could end up underrepresented due to bad design. Right now some folks stick with an AC they choose because they would have to reroll and do not wish to do so I would guess.

4) If restrictions are not in place this could end up being abused or exploited.

5) This will likely further demean AC choice.

6) Could cause FOTM issues.

7) If late game AC change is allowed it could end up causing folks that have an AC but do not know how to properly play it running Raids and Operations, making an existing problem worse.

 

 

I have decided to support option 1, option 7 but would prefer option 10. I like the idea of option 7...you have to level an AC to max level to get a legacy unlock you can use to switch to that AC inside the class for another character account wide.

 

I still prefer no AC change, but I'm open to support 1 and 7.

[LordArtemis]

I would also add what I would like to see happen with respect to AC.

 

1) Bioware would come out and publicly state, in no uncertain terms, that AC IS YOUR CLASS.

 

2) Make AC choice mandatory at level 10, move all abilities under the AC heading in the abilities pane and remove the base class header, move all trainable abilities from that point forward under the AC header on the trainer.

 

3) Remove all references in the game to your base class that can be removed once you choose your AC.

 

4) Add a small quest line at max level that is AC specific, where they refer to your AC directly.

 

IMO this would make the choice more meaningful.

[Ratajack]

I would also add what I would like to see happen with respect to AC.

 

1) Bioware would come out and publicly state, in no uncertain terms, that AC IS YOUR CLASS.

 

2) Make AC choice mandatory at level 10, move all abilities under the AC heading in the abilities pane and remove the base class header, move all trainable abilities from that point forward under the AC header on the trainer.

 

3) Remove all references in the game to your base class that can be removed once you choose your AC.

 

4) Add a small quest line at max level that is AC specific, where they refer to your AC directly.

 

 

IMO this would make the choice more meaningful.

 

We've asked for this, or at least some sort of statement from the devs regarding whether or not AC's are different classes, multiple times in this thread, and almost 200 pages into this thread and NOT one peep from the devs. What does that say to you?

[LordArtemis]

We've asked for this, or at least some sort of statement from the devs regarding whether or not AC's are different classes, multiple times in this thread, and almost 200 pages into this thread and NOT one peep from the devs. What does that say to you?

 

It says nothing to me, much like the hundreds of other threads that the devs have never commented in. When and if they have something to say in the matter they will post their thoughts.

[profhermit]

It is amusing how many people hate on something they won't utilize, and don't want others to have the option.

 

I want to see this feature added, strictly as a one time offering. I leveled two up alts, a scoundrel & vanguard, and dislike both classes. At max level I experimented with different skill trees and still do not like anything about either class.

 

I keep them because the crafting skills are maxed out on both. I have a considerable amount of time / creds / mats invested in REing for purple schems. Anyone who crafts can relate to this.

 

I grind dailies with my Gunslinger then mail credits to alts. The alts spend creds on companion missions to get mats.

 

Having a one time option to switch classes would enable me to run daily's with classes I enjoy, to get creds and gather mats to lower cost of crafting.

 

Hate on this option all ya want. I will use it, TWICE.

[LordArtemis]

It is amusing how many people hate on something they won't utilize, and don't want others to have the option.

 

I want to see this feature added, strictly as a one time offering. I leveled two up alts, a scoundrel & vanguard, and dislike both classes. At max level I experimented with different skill trees and still do not like anything about either class.

 

I keep them because the crafting skills are maxed out on both. I have a considerable amount of time / creds / mats invested in REing for purple schems. Anyone who crafts can relate to this.

 

I grind dailies with my Gunslinger then mail credits to alts. The alts spend creds on companion missions to get mats.

 

Having a one time option to switch classes would enable me to run daily's with classes I enjoy, to get creds and gather mats to lower cost of crafting.

 

Hate on this option all ya want. I will use it, TWICE.

 

This does seem to be the most common reason folks would want to switch. Do you think it is unreasonable to ask folks to unlock the alternate AC you wish to switch to through legacy?

 

In other words you would have to have a max level character in that AC before you could switch a current character to that AC.

[Vhaegrant]

This does seem to be the most common reason folks would want to switch. Do you think it is unreasonable to ask folks to unlock the alternate AC you wish to switch to through legacy?

 

In other words you would have to have a max level character in that AC before you could switch a current character to that AC.

 

I think the biggest reason folks would want to switch is to experience the other AC of a class without having to level another character all the way, with the option to revert back if they are still unsatisfied.

 

This feeds into the same vein of 'Hardcore, you have to earn everything with time spent at the keyboard' versus 'Casual, hey I only have so many hours in the day to play'.

 

So the only way that would allow you to switch a character you've played for 48 hours is if you pour 96 hours into the class you want to change over to. Which I still feel is kind of defeating the purpose of a proposed AC change.

 

Now I can understand wanting to limit the place a character can change AC (not in active WZs/ OPs), how often (once a week), and even place a price on it (cartel coins and/or credits). These steps all help to limit the amount of AC swapping that is likely to occur, but still allows gamers the chance to resurrect interest in a character they no longer enjoy playing without having to step back to square one.

Edited July 3, 2013 by Vhaegrant

[Ratajack]

I think the biggest reason folks would want to switch is to experience the other AC of a class without having to level another character all the way.

 

This feeds into the same vein of 'Hardcore, you have to earn everything with time spent at the keyboard' versus 'Casual, hey I only have so many hours in the day to play'.

 

So the only way that would allow you to switch a character you've played for 48 hours is if you pour 96 hours into the class you want to change over to. Which I still feel is kind of defeating the purpose of a proposed AC change.

 

Now I can understand wanting to limit the place a character can change AC (not in active WZs/ OPs), how often (once a week), and even place a price on it (cartel coins and/or credits). These steps all help to limit the amount of AC swapping that is likely to occur, but still allows gamers the chance to resurrect interest in a character they no longer enjoy playing without having to step back to square one.

 

So, you made a PERMANENT choice, one that you KNEW was PERMANENT and now want it not to be permanent because it no longer suits you?

[Vhaegrant]

So, you made a PERMANENT choice, one that you KNEW was PERMANENT and now want it not to be permanent because it no longer suits you?

 

I think you're finally getting it

 

But then I approach the game with more focus on story aspects than pure raw game mechanics. It makes less sense to me to have a species change than it does to be allowed to switch to the other Advanced Class.

[BounceDK]

Will swap commando for vanguard.

[LordArtemis]

Species and appearance was permanent and I knew it was permanent. It is no longer permanent.

 

Bioware decided to make species and appearance permanent because, according to their words (as has been posted more than once in this thread) ".....we felt that you should feel invested in your character, your choice should have meaning".

 

It is no longer permanent.

 

The argument that the prior dev staff made it a permanent choice is a moot point. If anything can be gleaned by the recent changes to the game, it is likely everything is on the table.

 

Not to mention a dev specifically stated this was likely..."We have had serious talks recently about offering an Advanced Class change option – I think that one will likely happen eventually.", also posted many times in the thread.

 

The writing is on the wall. Like it or not it may be coming soon.

Edited July 3, 2013 by LordArtemis

[MajikMyst]

Species and appearance was permanent and I knew it was permanent. It is no longer permanent.

 

Bioware decided to make species and appearance permanent because, according to their words (as has been posted more than once in this thread) ".....we felt that you should feel invested in your character, your choice should have meaning".

 

It is no longer permanent.

 

The argument that the prior dev staff made it a permanent choice is a moot point. If anything can be gleaned by the recent changes to the game, it is likely everything is on the table.

 

Not to mention a dev specifically stated this was likely..."We have had serious talks recently about offering an Advanced Class change option – I think that one will likely happen eventually.", also posted many times in the thread.

 

The writing is on the wall. Like it or not it may be coming soon.

 

First of all.. The idea of changing a characters appearance is not new and it is in many other games.. Ever heard of a Barber shop?? WOW has one.. Most MMO's do.. So your first argument is largely irrelevant as usual..

 

The second is a soft 'No' which they have been using for over a year now.. Eventually in this case means never... It is the closest thing they will come to actually saying no, without actually saying no.. Because they are not stupid.. If they actually said straight 'No'.. They know the morons will come unglued with threads and more stupid petitions in attempt to change their mind.. So the best thing is to keep people in limbo or in the dark as to what the truth is.. All gaming publishers use this tactic.. Oddly enough however.. Some of the folks in this forum don't seem to get it..

 

What is it they don't get?? Played the game latetly?? As you and everyone like you continue to do is ignore that which is right in front of you.. The game.. The game says it is a permanent choice.. Case closed..

 

So like it or not.. You will never see it.. And you call yourself neutral?? Another lie perhaps?? I have better things to do than sit here and attempt intelligent conversations with people who simply seem to lack intelligence.. I mean, how stupid do you have to be to try and compare something it is cosmetic and something that isn't cosmetic?? Well??? Changing your race is cosmetic and meaningless.. Changing your class is something totally different and it isn't meaningless.. Which is why no other MMO has done it.. SWTOR is doubtful to be the first.. It doesn't benefit Bioware at all.. Another issue that you love to ignore..

 

I am leaving tomorrow on another fishing trip.. Some of us have better things to do than to lie about people or accuse them of editing a post because you can't argue with right..

Edited July 3, 2013 by MajikMyst

[MajikMyst]

I think you're finally getting it

 

But then I approach the game with more focus on story aspects than pure raw game mechanics. It makes less sense to me to have a species change than it does to be allowed to switch to the other Advanced Class.

 

But see, that is actually incorrect.. Species or race has no bearing on this game.. The story is the same for a human Jedi and a Chiss Jedi.. Race doesn't effect story at all..

 

Having to level a new character to try a new class is a reality and a mechanic of many MMO's including this one.. Why should that rule be broken??

 

You are also not addressing a real fear.. Bioware allows it once to twice to appease their curiousity?? Does the rest of the community now have to wade through even more threads asking to remove the limit of doing it twice?? When is the community forced to live with their choice and when are they forced to live with the word permanent?? Like the game says..

 

Games should not be at the whim of the players.. Players should have to live within the rules and architecture of the game.. Games have rules for a reason.. I think this is one that we the players learn to respect..

 

Other than giving people a free 50 or 55 of another class without leveling.. This doesn't benefit anyone.. Especially Bioware..

Edited July 3, 2013 by MajikMyst

[MajikMyst]

ah the slippery slope fallacy

 

is that all you have?

 

Considering how this topic first started after Bioware caved on a way to change your spec in game during the beta..

 

The slippery slope fact is all we need..

 

Give an inch take a mile... I am sure you heard a few times in your life..

Edited July 3, 2013 by MajikMyst

[MajikMyst]

picked the wrong advance class*

not sure if you noticed, but were not asking to switch classes, just AC's.

 

In case you haven't heard.. Your AC is your class.. That has been said over a year now.. It comes from Bioware..

[Aries_cz]

Species and appearance was permanent and I knew it was permanent. It is no longer permanent.

 

Bioware decided to make species and appearance permanent because, according to their words (as has been posted more than once in this thread) ".....we felt that you should feel invested in your character, your choice should have meaning".

 

It is no longer permanent.

 

The argument that the prior dev staff made it a permanent choice is a moot point. If anything can be gleaned by the recent changes to the game, it is likely everything is on the table.

 

Not to mention a dev specifically stated this was likely..."We have had serious talks recently about offering an Advanced Class change option – I think that one will likely happen eventually.", also posted many times in the thread.

 

The writing is on the wall. Like it or not it may be coming soon.

 

Apples and oranges, race is purely cosmetic choice that changes nothing, except maybe how some people react to you. Changing class is changing most of your abilities, how you play (in major way, yes, there is a difference between healing and DPSing, but the basic playstyle, like range, used items (generator, focus, second weapon, etc), etc remain same), etc.

Advanced class should be, for all intents and purposes, your class, and it should not be possible to change. Race is not used anywhere in game statistics, and gives no bonuses, therefore, changing it changes nothing.

 

Now, I know you are claiming to be against changing, but you still insist on keeping this thread alive...

[Vhaegrant]

But see, that is actually incorrect.. Species or race has no bearing on this game.. The story is the same for a human Jedi and a Chiss Jedi.. Race doesn't effect story at all..

 

You seem to have misunderstood the concept of subjectivity. When I play a class story, species is perhaps one of the most fundamental choices I make, I wouldn't dream of using the customisation booth to alter species. On character creation I assumed this would be a permanent decision so I put a lot of thought into character appearance. However just because I have no use for the feature I'm not against others being able to change species.

 

Having to level a new character to try a new class is a reality and a mechanic of many MMO's including this one.. Why should that rule be broken??

 

Why shouldn't it? So many people decry SWTOR because it follows the path of WoW or some other MMO. WHat if SWTOR decided to be a little different. SWTOR placed story at the heart of their game, they put the full voice overs in, they had a large team of gifted writers craft stories that allow players to form an attachment to the character, companions and choices that are made. It makes far more sense for me that SWTOR would view an Advanced Class change as a higher grade of respecialisation, something that can be done but not anywhere, at anytime, for no cost.

 

You are also not addressing a real fear.. Bioware allows it once to twice to appease their curiousity?? Does the rest of the community now have to wade through even more threads asking to remove the limit of doing it twice?? When is the community forced to live with their choice and when are they forced to live with the word permanent?? Like the game says..

 

I wouldn't impose a restriction on the possible number of times it could be done. Fear removed. Again, as long as it is restricted to a certain place be it a terminal on the players ship, a vendor on fleet or the home planet (like respeccing), has a reasonable cool down period (I have previously used one week as an example), and an associated cost to deter a high frequency (again I'd have an initial high cost per character to unlock the function and then a further moderate cost per change)

 

Games should not be at the whim of the players.. Players should have to live within the rules and architecture of the game.. Games have rules for a reason.. I think this is one that we the players learn to respect..

 

Rules change. If the argument for the change is well reasoned.

 

Other than giving people a free 50 or 55 of another class without leveling.. This doesn't benefit anyone.. Especially Bioware

 

It is not a free anything. You are not gaining an additional character, you are gaining the ability to play the character in a slightly different way. Instead of being limited to just three options set by the three skill trees you have six options.

Where is your evidence that this wouldn't benefit anyone. There are as many posters turning up with a single post saying 'yes please' as there are saying 'No don't do it' but knowing how skewed forum populations can be with regards a vocal and entrenched minority this is meaningless. Only Bioware has the depth and breadth of metrics that would allow them to see the sort of playtimes and expenditure the average player spends on their character.

 

This option would offer little if anything to those gamers that space-bar plough through the quests, class based or otherwise, reducing time spent in story to a minimum in their race to endgame so they can start proper PvP or raiding. At the same time it takes nothing away from them.

 

It does however offer those players who invest more to their characters an extra string or two to their bow without having to go through exactly the same content. Or have a desire to see just how the other Advanced Class plays before they decide to sink a considerable chunk of the leisure time into levelling one. With eight unique class stories to play through already I see no reason to ask players to level up through the same story multiple times. It's something I intend to do, and have already started, but I realise I am in the fortunate position of having more game time than many.

 

Whether someone else switches their AC has zero impact on me, and I imagine zero impact on the game (with the proviso of the limitations I outlined) beyond allowing a certain portion of the player base a chance to refresh their interest in a character or switch over to a preferred playstyle.