BioWare says no more open world PvP in the making ever !!

[Uruare]

Good. Maybe it'll figure out what its trying to be when it grows up by paring away things it simply cannot/will not be.

 

Open world PVP? Nothing fundamentally wrong with it. In this game? It could work (theoretically, at least at the conceptual level).

 

Should it be their focus?

 

Probably not. Most people seriously focused on PVP, PVP and nothing but PVP aren't playing this game, or any game like it. There are exceptions, absolutely, but they are exceptions.

 

Call of Duty is full of PVPers. The Battlefield games; full of PVPers. The problem is, as most pvpers I personally know like to grouse about those games, is that they're full of the ugly, nasty sorts of PVPers that convince the world that the internet is populated only by feral 12 year olds with emotional disorders.

 

They are, however, the sorts of games that a hardcore PVP mindset is really catered to by. That's what those games are and do; that's what they began life being and that's what they wanted to be when they grew up.

 

A game like SW:TOR? Weeeeeell...PVP is doable. Its not -good-. The engine guarantees that it will never and can never be good. The implementation guarantees that you can outgear skill far more often than you can outskill gear.

 

This game is a very poor candidate, utility-wise, for a bright PVP future. And that's not even taking potshots at whatever disasters on the back-end await if they were to try.

 

We remember Ilum. By 'we' I of course mean the Royal 'we', meaning me. I remember Ilum.

 

I wasn't there. I kinda figured it'd be a disaster, logically deriving from all the other disasters playing out local to my PvE experiences, and my PvP pals were quick to confirm on that.

 

So, good. I'm glad they're committing to a bit more of a narrowed focus. I hope that's what they're doing anyway.

 

It'd be grand and lovely if they could make open world pvp work and properly support it and never leave anyone of any playstyle out in the cold, but that's just not realistic.

 

If something has to go, I hope its PvP. Not because I hate PvP; I tend to suck at it because I rarely do it, but when I do it, I have fun. I'm that person that tries to be useful even when I have no clue what's going on, and there've been some good times.

 

But not nearly enough for me to think they should continue to be a house divided between so many facets that DESERVE committed attention.

 

PvP deserves better than what they can give it. Honestly, it does. And if they can't properly support it and show it the love it deserves, they should cut it loose and focus on what they're proven to be good at, which is telling a story, making a fun single player game with multi-player activities and drumming up more world events.

 

If they focus on something, they might prove yet to be consistently excellent at that something, you see.

 

PvP can't be that something though. Even if the will was there, and I don't see any reason to believe that it is, they selected an engine, and did with that engine, all kinds of things that ensure that PvP will always be, and can never be anything other, than the unloved orphan allowed to live under the stairs, but little else.

 

And its a sad state of affairs. No mistake. I'm not, I absolutely admit, a hardcore PvPer...on here.

 

Lurv me some UT3 though. Back in the day, UT2004 was what I played like a fiend, not them-parky MMO's, or Everquest, or much of anything else.

 

That experience deserves love. PvPers deserve love; PvPing deserves love.

 

it won't happen here. It can't. Not really.

 

Sorry for that, OP. If you're off to greener pastures, may you kick some *** wherever you wind up.

 

I'll hope its not mine, 'cause my controls are always PvE tweaked and I'll just die a lot.

[hages]

Lol it can barely handle 8v8 combat. It took a year of tweaking to get 16 player WZ to run DECENT.

 

All you do is whine whine and whine...

The game is more then pvp. If you so obsesed by pvp then this game is not for you. Theire are plenty of other games out theire.

As for the cost of the game. It is worth it. the pvpe contend is not bad at all.

I am having fun (from beta) and enjoying it. with our witout open world pvp.

[Stib_]

I wouldn't shed a tear over this. I wish they would never do anything like the Gree event agin!

 

Yesterday, there was a point, where the pylons were unaccessable in all 3 instances because of gankers.

 

If someone wants to pvp, do warzones, or flag themselves willingly (not forced automatic), or go to a pvp server! Why can some people not leave those pve players alone, that just want to do their quests in peace!

 

Or, why can't they leave people like me alone, who not fight back, just try to get away if attacked!

 

Is it a challange to kill someone outnumbered? No.

Is it a honor, or glorious? No.

Do you get something for it, like an achievment, or quest reward? No.

So it's just about being an a**hole ganker.

 

To tell the truth, i was attacked yesterday once (other times, outnumbered), on one-on-one terms, fair. Fair, if you do not count, that i did not attacked back, to show i am not interested.

 

So, a smashmonkey defeated a not attacking healer. What a glorious pvp deed, you can brag about! A**hole...

 

Yes, i am angry. Sorry.

 

Here comes the part where the devoted pvp players tell me, that it was my fault to go there knowing the risks, and anyway, it's a pvp quest.

 

Well, that is true partially. But, the quest is not a pvp one. It's a pve quest, put in a pvp zone, what is BioWare's fault. So if a pve player wants to do it, we must go trough hell, and wait for the gankers to get bored and leave. And it's not my fault either, that some (NOT MOST) pvp players are childish a**holes, who did not get enough love from their mothers or something like that...

 

I hope some BioWare worker reads this, and other comments like this, and they realize, that they did a huge mistake with quests like that!

 

I support warzones, pvp servers, duells, and self flagging. I am not against pvp. I am against gankers, griefers, and putting pve quests in pvp areas! It's a huge mistake!

[Thaed]

Ah, don`t mind Lord-Karsk.

 

He is just one of these people who cant just simply unsub when they dont enjoy a game anymore but have to bang about how the next-overhyped-probably-also-flawed-and-lacking-content-at-lauch-MMO is going to be so much better.

 

I mean, WAR is comming, right? And remember how Rift kicked WOWs *** like people said before Rift actually was launched?

 

Oh, I'm also actually pretty excited for WildStar (read: very excited for WildStar). I just get annoyed when people spread misinformation/hate for the sake of hate.

 

This game has problems. There's no denying that. If people don't point out these problems, they'll never be addressed. When people rant about certain things without having anything to back them up, though, that really doesn't help anyone.

 

Personally, I'm happy to stay subbed to this game (I think I was subbed to Rift for 4-5months that I didn't play it more than once or twice a fortnight) and still enjoy it. There a certain decisions that Bioware makes, however, that simply leave me baffled (and sometimes angry).

[Thaed]

I wouldn't shed a tear over this. I wish they would never do anything like the Gree event agin!

 

Yesterday, there was a point, where the pylons were unaccessable in all 3 instances because of gankers.

 

If someone wants to pvp, do warzones, or flag themselves willingly (not forced automatic), or go to a pvp server! Why can some people not leave those pve players alone, that just want to do their quests in peace!

 

Or, why can't they leave people like me alone, who not fight back, just try to get away if attacked!

 

Is it a challange to kill someone outnumbered? No.

Is it a honor, or glorious? No.

Do you get something for it, like an achievment, or quest reward? No.

So it's just about being an a**hole ganker.

 

To tell the truth, i was attacked yesterday once (other times, outnumbered), on one-on-one terms, fair. Fair, if you do not count, that i did not attacked back, to show i am not interested.

 

So, a smashmonkey defeated a not attacking healer. What a glorious pvp deed, you can brag about! A**hole...

 

Yes, i am angry. Sorry.

 

Here comes the part where the devoted pvp players tell me, that it was my fault to go there knowing the risks, and anyway, it's a pvp quest.

 

Well, that is true partially. But, the quest is not a pvp one. It's a pve quest, put in a pvp zone, what is BioWare's fault. So if a pve player wants to do it, we must go trough hell, and wait for the gankers to get bored and leave. And it's not my fault either, that some (NOT MOST) pvp players are childish a**holes, who did not get enough love from their mothers or something like that...

 

I hope some BioWare worker reads this, and other comments like this, and they realize, that they did a huge mistake with quests like that!

 

I support warzones, pvp servers, duells, and self flagging. I am not against pvp. I am against gankers, griefers, and putting pve quests in pvp areas! It's a huge mistake!

 

Err. You know that not all of the pylons are in the PvP area, right? And as far as I'm aware, you're not automatically flagged in Ilum on a PvE server...

[Stib_]

Err. You know that not all of the pylons are in the PvP area, right? And as far as I'm aware, you're not automatically flagged in Ilum on a PvE server...

 

Ok, can you show me where to do the charge pylon "pvp" quest out of the pvp zone? As far as i know, there is only one place to do it, in the middle of the pvp area. I may be mistaken, i am not all knowing! If there is a safe way to do that quest, i admint, that it was only my fault, that i got ganked yesterday!

 

I know that you are not aoutomaticly flagged, but there are 2 "pvp" quests that are in the pvp area, where you get automaticly flagged after 10 seconds.

[ckoneful]

Ok, can you show me where to do the charge pylon "pvp" quest out of the pvp zone? As far as i know, there is only one place to do it, in the middle of the pvp area. I may be mistaken, i am not all knowing! If there is a safe way to do that quest, i admint, that it was only my fault, that i got ganked yesterday!

 

I know that you are not aoutomaticly flagged, but there are 2 "pvp" quests that are in the pvp area, where you get automaticly flagged after 10 seconds.

 

Wait, so you're complaining about PvP when doing a question specifically tagged [PvP]?

[Elear]

Ok, can you show me where to do the charge pylon "pvp" quest out of the pvp zone?

So you're crying because pvp quest that rewards warzone comms actually involves pvp. Good job.

 

 

Good. Maybe it'll figure out what its trying to be when it grows up by paring away things it simply cannot/will not be.

(snip)

 

Can't possibly disagree with this post. Game has engine that has issues with fights involving many players at once, so will try to adoind making them. Game does not have aspirations to become new esport, and is not pumping all it's resources into PvP. Fine enough.

Some people might leave, and some other people will come for features developed instead. Just another day in MMO life.

[Stib_]

Wait, so you're complaining about PvP when doing a question specifically tagged [PvP]?

 

As i said before, those are not pvp quests. Those are pve quests in a pvp area.

 

A kill npc, gather stuff from them, scan object, then kill npc is NOT a pvp quest.

A gather-deliver resource is NOT a pvp quest either.

 

If it would be a kill x players, or kill x players from enemy faction, or capture and holt area/object quest, it would be a pvp one, and i would not do it.

 

So it's a design failure from BioWare (as i said before), to put pve quests into pvp areas. It can be tagged pvp, it's still a pve quest, by design.

[Stoofa]

As i said before, those are not pvp quests. Those are pve quests in a pvp area.

 

A kill npc, gather stuff from them, scan object, then kill npc is NOT a pvp quest.

A gather-deliver resource is NOT a pvp quest either.

 

If it would be a kill x players, or kill x players from enemy faction, or capture and holt area/object quest, it would be a pvp one, and i would not do it.

 

So it's a design failure from BioWare (as i said before), to put pve quests into pvp areas. It can be tagged pvp, it's still a pve quest, by design.

 

The quest is listed under [PVP] tags in your quest log.

The reward is warzone commendations.

So what exactly makes you think these are not PvP quests?

[Stib_]

So you're crying because pvp quest that rewards warzone comms actually involves pvp. Good job.

 

I do the quest for the trophy, and the money, not for the comms. And it is still a pve quest by design, posing as a pvp quest. I can finish it without attacking anybody. If that does not proves it to you, then i do not know what could. If i would be out for true PVP (not for ganking), it would be boring as hell for me! Because it's a pve quest...

[Stib_]

The quest is listed under [PVP] tags in your quest log.

The reward is warzone commendations.

So what exactly makes you think these are not PvP quests?

 

As i said before, those are not pvp quests. Those are pve quests in a pvp area.

 

A kill npc, gather stuff from them, scan object, then kill npc is NOT a pvp quest.

A gather-deliver resource is NOT a pvp quest either.

 

If it would be a kill x players, or kill x players from enemy faction, or capture and holt area/object quest, it would be a pvp one, and i would not do it.

 

So it's a design failure from BioWare (as i said before), to put pve quests into pvp areas. It can be tagged pvp, it's still a pve quest, by design.

 

I do the quest for the trophy, and the money, not for the comms. And it is still a pve quest by design, posing as a pvp quest. I can finish it without attacking anybody. If that does not proves it to you, then i do not know what could. If i would be out for true PVP (not for ganking), it would be boring as hell for me! Because it's a pve quest...

 

I do not know how else i could expalin it, for people like you to understand. It's not the tag that matters, and not the reward. It's what you're doing. It's pve stuff.

[spectreclees]

You can't blame them when they have an engine that can barely handle 16 players on screen at once.

 

I'd love some serious Open World PvP or something like GW2 WvW in SWTOR. But without a proper engine in place that can handle tons of people on screen. You won't see them putting it on the drawing boards.

Edited May 22, 2013 by spectreclees

[Tatile]

Ok, can anyone explain to a PvE'er what World PvP actually entails and how Bioware isn't doing it?

 

I thought World PvP was -

Flag self for PvP

Go out into open world

Find people also flagged for PvP

Fight

 

Are you lacking rewards? Quests? Chairs?

[Stib_]

Ok, can anyone explain to a PvE'er what World PvP actually entails and how Bioware isn't doing it?

 

I thought World PvP was -

Flag self for PvP

Go out into open world

Find people also flagged for PvP

Fight

 

Are you lacking rewards? Quests? Chairs?

 

You are absolutly CORRECT!

 

Flag self for PvP

 

Self, not forced on you automaticly. That's the difference.

[Stoofa]

I do not know how else i could expalin it, for people like you to understand. It's not the tag that matters, and not the reward. It's what you're doing. It's pve stuff.

 

And I am running out of ways to try and explain a really simple concept:

 

The area where the quest takes place is a "free for all PvP area".

It doesn't matter if I'm gathering resources, "doing PvE stuff". The fact is these missions are INSIDE a PVP zone.

How easier does it need to be?

[Thaed]

I do the quest for the trophy, and the money, not for the comms. And it is still a pve quest by design, posing as a pvp quest. I can finish it without attacking anybody. If that does not proves it to you, then i do not know what could. If i would be out for true PVP (not for ganking), it would be boring as hell for me! Because it's a pve quest...

 

Are you talking about the Heroic 4 quest, or the quest that's tagged PvP? If the former, there are other pylons on the northern half of the map.

 

If the latter, well, it's a PvP quest. It's PvP by design; it's a competition to use your orb before someone else does. If you're having trouble, try grouping up or finding an instance where people are enforcing a line up. Alternatively, skip the quest altogether and run through the event on an alt to make up for missed rep. This is probably the easiest faction to gain rep with, you can hit the weekly cap with one character without doing the PvP quest. Besides, it's not going to go away forever.

[Stib_]

And I am running out of ways to try and explain a really simple concept:

 

The area where the quest takes place is a "free for all PvP area".

It doesn't matter if I'm gathering resources, "doing PvE stuff". The fact is these missions are INSIDE a PVP zone.

How easier does it need to be?

 

Yes. And that's why i am complaining. They put pve quests in pvp areas. Huge design failure in my eyes.

[Lord_Karsk]

Ok, can anyone explain to a PvE'er what World PvP actually entails and how Bioware isn't doing it?

 

I thought World PvP was -

Flag self for PvP

Go out into open world

Find people also flagged for PvP

Fight

 

Are you lacking rewards? Quests? Chairs?

 

Really simpel, reason why call of duty games have millions of people playing them everyday is because the player vs player part is so well made, and they game objectives with them like search and destroys and capture the flag etc.

Some of these mecanics are in some MMOs as well. But bioware as a company just dont have a clue on how to do these things. They tried pre launch with ilum and we got the biggest mass exodus from the game with ilum 1.1.

 

Even a simpel stat system that says how many times you have killed this player, been killed by this player

have rewards that take a long time to get lets say a uniq awesome mounts etc that only can be obtained by doing these things.Simpel castle objectives with holo flags that represent republic and empire, take a objective and raise the flag and gain prestige, some like that. These are all things BioWare is not smart enough to handle so they just give up

and make a few instanced WZ instead that gets old fast.

 

If players have a awesome reason to pvp out in the world then the players will come bigtime as proven 1000 times

in other games that understand PvP. So in short, the developers at bioware is lazy and ignorant.

Edited May 22, 2013 by Lord_Karsk

[Stib_]

Are you talking about the Heroic 4 quest, or the quest that's tagged PvP? If the former, there are other pylons on the northern half of the map.

 

If the latter, well, it's a PvP quest. It's PvP by design; it's a competition to use your orb before someone else does. If you're having trouble, try grouping up or finding an instance where people are enforcing a line up. Alternatively, skip the quest altogether and run through the event on an alt to make up for missed rep. This is probably the easiest faction to gain rep with, you can hit the weekly cap with one character without doing the PvP quest. Besides, it's not going to go away forever.

 

I disagree with you. It's not a competition, because you can wait for other players to finish, you have time for that. When i was there yesterday, there was no competition at all. The gankers simply did not let anyone near the charger.

 

Once when i was there, i was mezzed 2 times before i could do the charging myself. I got mezzed, and the other player charged. Ok, i was a bit angry, but not everyone can wait for their turn. I could. The orbs lasted long enough. See? No competition, pve.

[Thaed]

I disagree with you. It's not a competition, because you can wait for other players to finish, you have time for that. When i was there yesterday, there was no competition at all. The gankers simply did not let anyone near the charger.

 

Once when i was there, i was mezzed 2 times before i could do the charging myself. I got mezzed, and the other player charged. Ok, i was a bit angry, but not everyone can wait for their turn. I could. The orbs lasted long enough. See? No competition, pve.

 

Is a race not competition, then, as the runners can complete the race whenever they like?

 

It's PvP in a PvP zone. The zone is designed to encourage PvP; if you're unwilling to PvP/group up, it will take you longer to complete the quest than those who are willing to PvP/group up.

[Elear]

Once when i was there, i was mezzed 2 times before i could do the charging myself. I got mezzed, and the other player charged. Ok, i was a bit angry, but not everyone can wait for their turn. I could. The orbs lasted long enough. See? No competition, pve.

 

Any activity where killing other players is allowed and makes it easier is PvP. This includes seeker droids on pvp servers, gathering chests from outlaws den, or doing quests in pvp areas.

 

Quest design is just fine, because unlike any kill quests it doesn't encourage huge groups running around looking for lone players, and is also completable when there are no other players around.

 

But why are we wasting our breath on explaining it to you, you clearly are more stubborn than mule. What important is, that most players consider those quest pvp, expect pvp during them, and you can't change that.

[Screaming_Ziva]

I'm a bit confused. We have PvP servers, aren't those open world PvP? What else are people looking for? Open world PvP on PvE servers?

[Neglience]

I'm a bit confused. We have PvP servers, aren't those open world PvP? What else are people looking for? Open world PvP on PvE servers?

 

something worth fighting for, not brainless ganking.

[Stib_]

Any activity where killing other players is allowed and makes it easier is PvP. This includes seeker droids on pvp servers, gathering chests from outlaws den, or doing quests in pvp areas.

 

Quest design is just fine, because unlike any kill quests it doesn't encourage huge groups running around looking for lone players, and is also completable when there are no other players around.

 

But why are we wasting our breath on explaining it to you, you clearly are more stubborn than mule. What important is, that most players consider those quest pvp, expect pvp during them, and you can't change that.

 

I can't change them, but i can disaggree with them. And i hope there will be no more like them!

 

In a perfect world you would be right, and it would encourage pvp. But now, it's just a tool for gankers a griefers to be able to get their twisted satisfaction.

 

You see, i do not see groups of players fighting eachother, just gankers and annoyed pve players. On Ilum, and in the Outlaws Den too.

 

If you attack someone who does not want's to fight another player, that's not pvp. It's ganking, and griefing.

 

Well, you are right, i am stubborn, but you are too. We live in different worlds, see things differently. Pvp players should behave nicer on a PVE server imo. Not everyone, just the a**holes. The others are okay.