So I heard the PT got nerfed while the Merc got buffed…

[Dio_Ymdar]

But did the Merc get buffed enough to be better than the PT? Or now they are more or less on par?

I'm interested to hear about any environment, ops pve, pvp, class missions.

[steave]

On the dummy, merc is better now, but it's because they have the armor debuff and don't have a execute ability like the PT does - and that's really noticeable in raids. I'm usually about tied with the other dps before 30% on my PT, but below it I catch up and surpass them in most cases.

[Macroeconomics]

But did the Merc get buffed enough to be better than the PT?

 

It depends on what you are comparing and for what purpose. Comparisons between Merc Bodyguard and PT Shield are obviously difficult to make. But as far as dps subclasses go....

 

Merc Arsenal got buffed.

PT AP got buffed, but not by as much

PT Pyro and Merc Pyro each got nerfed significantly.

 

Since Merc Arsenal was already tops amongst the four for pve, it remains at the top. Many users of the remaining three subclasses will have difficulty finding employment in the PvE area unless they can leverage existing social relationships.

 

For PvP, I'd rank order them (best to worst): Merc Arsenal & PT Pyro (tied), PT AP, Merc Pyro. Others will dispute the relationship with Merc Arsenal and PT Pyro. But IMO, Merc Arsenal still lacks the Huttball utility that PT Pyro has. It is a worse solo defender. But it does have better damage burst. Regardless all four subclasses lag behind the top ranged (Sniper) and melee (Assassin) subclasses respectively.

[Natholomew]

On the dummy, merc is better now, but it's because they have the armor debuff and don't have a execute ability like the PT does - and that's really noticeable in raids. I'm usually about tied with the other dps before 30% on my PT, but below it I catch up and surpass them in most cases.

 

Execute ability?

[Dio_Ymdar]

Thanks!

[Syas]

Execute ability?

 

An ability that is only usable when an enemy is < 30% health. In standard PVE/PVP content it isn't a huge deal, but in Ops where you may be fighting bosses for minutes while they are below 30%, it is a huge gap in output.

[ellenbec]

PT does not have a execute ability or a talent that buffs damage in a execute phase.

[DrDoofy]

PT does not have a execute ability or a talent that buffs damage in a execute phase.

Burnout

Edited April 19, 2013 by DrDoofy

[ellenbec]

Which is a pyro talent, and is inaccessible to AP. So my point still stands for the most part.

[Macroeconomics]

In standard PVE/PVP content it isn't a huge deal, but in Ops where you may be fighting bosses for minutes while they are below 30%, it is a huge gap in output.

 

I would argue that it has a big impact in PvP. For Assassins and Snipers for instance their terminal (target <30%) abilities are key factors n their success.

[Sunsou]

Which is a pyro talent, and is inaccessible to AP. So my point still stands for the most part.

 

No it doesn't. A PT has an execute ability. Simple as. You stated the complete opposite.

Edited April 20, 2013 by Sunsou

[Syas]

I would argue that it has a big impact in PvP. For Assassins and Snipers for instance their terminal (target <30%) abilities are key factors n their success.

 

That's fair, and I agree that there is a solid benefit there, I just think that when it comes to taking folks down in PVP vs. a Ops Boss, you may get your Execute off once or twice (at least in my experience), so the variance in damage compared to other high damage abilities is substantial, but not as substantial as it is on a long term fight where and Ops boss is < 30% for minutes.

 

I did not mean to say it is useless in PVP, just that I think the gap in damage output is more noticeable in Ops.

[steave]

Which is a pyro talent, and is inaccessible to AP. So my point still stands for the most part.

 

Rather than arguing semantics of exactly what was said, focus on the point...PTs are perfectly viable in operations, and from what I've seen so far still among the best, but you still need to be pyro for that. AP is gonna be fine in most cases too, but they won't top the dps charts, same as always.

Edited April 23, 2013 by steave

[Keypek]

Describing Burnout as an execute is kind of laughable. Certainly a nice spec ability for pyros though in pve.

[ScytheEleven]

Increase the kinetic damage on TD back to it's pre 2.0 levels, but keep the additional burn damage as-is.

 

PVP burst: restored.

PVE DPS: now a full TD will ALWAYS parse higher than a non-TD build, rather than in just the sub-30% health burn phases.

 

Win-win.

Edited April 23, 2013 by ScytheEleven

[Xargyn]

No it doesn't. A PT has an execute ability. Simple as. You stated the complete opposite.

 

Burnout is not an "Execute Ability" by any means. It's a talent that buffs periodic damage on opponents lower than 30% health.

 

An execute ability is an ability that does a large amount of direct damage against an opponent with low health. And it's not from a talent point.

[DrDoofy]

PT does not have a talent that buffs damage in a execute phase.

It's a talent that buffs periodic damage on opponents lower than 30% health.

 

Burnout is a valid answer to the original point, it's a 30% "execute phase" buff to ~20-25% of your output as a PT pyro (burning tech). It's also passive and free, requiring no additional resource management or use of a GCD (takedown, etc.).

 

It's one of the reasons why the CGC nerf was BS for raid output, as your main DoT now does less with burnout active than it used to without.

 

Arguing over it not being an execute "ability" is irrelevant in PvE as it serves the same purpose; increased dps below 30% that doesn't show up on the dummy.

 

Defining an "execute" in PvP is another matter.

Edited April 26, 2013 by DrDoofy

[nadiel]

burnout is a talent, not an ability. the OP said powertechs get it which should mean ALL specs, not just 28 points pyrotechs

[Macroeconomics]

Increase the kinetic damage on TD back to it's pre 2.0 levels, but keep the additional burn damage as-is.

 

Never going to happen. BW hates to reverse itself. Just look at DFA. Other classes now have AoE attacks that do more damage, have a larger radius, lower CD and cost less resources than DFA. But DFA will never be restored to its former self. To do so would be BW admitting they made a mistake and let it sit for over a year. Not gonna happen. Similarly they are not going to reverse the nerf to TD.

 

PT is going to get further nerfed in 2.1 anyway, so talking about buffs to that class is pointless.

[ivonbeton]

Never going to happen. BW hates to reverse itself. Just look at DFA. Other classes now have AoE attacks that do more damage, have a larger radius, lower CD and cost less resources than DFA. But DFA will never be restored to its former self. To do so would be BW admitting they made a mistake and let it sit for over a year. Not gonna happen. Similarly they are not going to reverse the nerf to TD.

 

PT is going to get further nerfed in 2.1 anyway, so talking about buffs to that class is pointless.

 

Not sure why they would do that. Not so many people playing PT as it is. I'm in a 400man guild with lots of 55's and I'm the only level 55 PT in it.

[Gyronamics]

For PvP, I'd rank order them (best to worst): Merc Arsenal & PT Pyro (tied), PT AP, Merc Pyro. Others will dispute the relationship with Merc Arsenal and PT Pyro. But IMO, Merc Arsenal still lacks the Huttball utility that PT Pyro has. It is a worse solo defender. But it does have better damage burst. Regardless all four subclasses lag behind the top ranged (Sniper) and melee (Assassin) subclasses respectively.

 

PT Pyro is being called good in Huttball

 

Arsenal Merc has a longer HO, sponges more damage with talents, can clear walkways with AOE KB, has a root on Rocket punch, a 70% 3s snare on Unload (for max resolve targets), can self cleanse tech effects and heal a bit.

 

PT AP has the same extended HO, is hugely resistant to damage when stunned or AOE'd, sponges more damage with talents, moves faster in combat.

 

PT Pyro has 15% less dot dmg and an extra snare break.

 

Both PT have AOE stun which IMO < AOE KB in Huttball plus taunts and pull.

 

Arsenal or AP > Pyro for Huttball.

Edited May 21, 2013 by Gyronamics

[Luckeyduckey]

PT Pyro is being called good in Huttball

 

Arsenal Merc has a longer HO, sponges more damage with talents, can clear walkways with AOE KB, has a root on Rocket punch, a 70% 3s snare on Unload (for max resolve targets), can self cleanse tech effects and heal a bit.

 

PT AP has the same extended HO, is hugely resistant to damage when stunned or AOE'd, sponges more damage with talents, moves faster in combat.

 

PT Pyro has 15% less dot dmg and an extra snare break.

 

Both PT have AOE stun which IMO < AOE KB in Huttball plus taunts and pull.

 

Arsenal or AP > Pyro for Huttball.

Pull is definitely the highlight. The knockback is weak, and people can stay out of range, or hit another object. The pull not only gets them out of there, but to a position of your choice. Fire pit or not. AP also has a 70% AoE snare, which > Unload's. Root on RP is nice though. I agree, AP does beat Pyro, but I would take an AP over an Arsenal, even with the net.

Edited May 22, 2013 by Luckeyduckey

[PerinnAybara]

Never going to happen. BW hates to reverse itself. Just look at DFA. Other classes now have AoE attacks that do more damage, have a larger radius, lower CD and cost less resources than DFA. But DFA will never be restored to its former self. To do so would be BW admitting they made a mistake and let it sit for over a year. Not gonna happen. Similarly they are not going to reverse the nerf to TD.

 

PT is going to get further nerfed in 2.1 anyway, so talking about buffs to that class is pointless.

 

QF absolute T

[Marb]

I can see pyro still being top dog in high movement encounters, but all the evidence I'm seeing from logs is pointing at full AP as being more damage, at least vs the full pyro. The ap /pyro hybrid has the highest top end output under ideal circumstances, but again, high levels of movement are going to let the full pyro shine a little more.

[Hizoka]

I can see pyro still being top dog in high movement encounters, but all the evidence I'm seeing from logs is pointing at full AP as being more damage, at least vs the full pyro. The ap /pyro hybrid has the highest top end output under ideal circumstances, but again, high levels of movement are going to let the full pyro shine a little more.

 

if you look at HM 16m S&V for powertech on torparse the top US player on every full fight is a full AP powertech...

 

everyone says pyro is better then why is it the top powertech in the US on torparse is AP?

Edited May 30, 2013 by Hizoka