Groups should not be allowed in Random Warzones

[IndridX]

How does it promote unfair matches when everybody has the same options to find people to play with. EVERYONE can group up. It is not limited to only a certain few. What you want is something to benefit you. Not the community.

I NEVER ONCE SAID I WANT SOMETHING THAT BENEFITS ME ONLY. Not one time did I say. What I want, IS the community to be benefit from this. That WAS my point to begin with. I am a 'relatively' new player, that has legitimate concerns and some serious issues with the state of pvp in this game and am entitled to my opinion about it. So far, I have had little constructive feedback from the community, people have been putting words in my mouth and make assumptions about my character. It is not unreasonable for me to come here and say that organized warzone groups create scenarios where the coordinated group has an unfair advantage. REGARDLESS, if they are on my team or the other team it is UNFAIR. It is absolutely unreasonable to expect EVERYONE to group up for the sake of pvp. Period.

[IndridX]

get out. I was referring to the part where you said "It's perfectly legitmate when it happens to me". I do not think that, nor have I said it. Quite the contrary actually.. Edited April 4, 2013 by IndridX

[Jadescythe]

Organized groups that queue against randomly assembled players creates scenarios where the coordinated group has an unfair advantage. In my opinion, it goes against the spirit and integrity of 'random' pvp. A normal warzone queue should be for players who jump in and play against other players in a similar situation. Random warzones should not be a place where organized groups can come in and stomp pugs for easy comms. I believe that this kind of queuing drives people away from pvp. Some people who play and see they are against premade groups simply quit right off the bat, while others like me suffer through it. I understand that people can only queue in groups of 4. Regardless, the place for organized groups to pvp should be rated warzones against other organized groups, not against pugs.

 

Basically everyone gets to play alone unless they want to do ranked?

 

Talk about slapping casual PvPers in the face. Not every group is grouped for coordination, has optimal composition, etc, etc. Also, who is going into regular warzones to stomp PUGs for comms? These people already have min/maxed gear from doing RATED warzones and may be taking a break, taking it easy, or may have no one queuing against them at the time. Since one person isn't happy, let's make everyone else sit out because that's fair .

 

You can give me the best 4 players on SWTOR and match them with the 4 worst and if your 8 can't beat those 4 good players then you have some other problems to worry about. Warzones are an 8 man system and having half a team can't win it unless you don't do anything to stop them.

[ArchangelLBC]

get out. I was referring to the part where you said "It's perfectly legitmate when it happens to me". I do not think that, nor have I said it. Quite the contrary actually..

 

Everything I said is perfectly legitimate and I said this problem would be fixed by taking groups out of warzones. That is my solution, as asinine as you may find it. Regardless of what you may believe, it is not QQ to call an unfair situation unfair.

 

 

Just to be clear, in case you're having trouble following, you said the other posts on this topic were just a bunch of QQ threads, but that this thread was totally legit.

 

You don't see how calling it QQ when others just complain, while offering zero actual solutions, about an ingame system that others use but which they won't isn't the exact same as what you've done?

 

Like I said, I'm pretty sure we're getting trolled.

Edited April 4, 2013 by ArchangelLBC

[IndridX]

Basically everyone gets to play alone unless they want to do ranked?

Well.....yea. I understand it may slap some people in the face. But, the fact that groups can get together and queue against randomly assembled players isn't fair to me. They get their fun and comms at the expense of other players fun and comms. That is fundamentally wrong to me. I think there are other areas of pvp that should be worked on though to be sure. Obviously group oriented material that doesn't involve normal warzones.

[sirullrich]

I NEVER ONCE SAID I WANT SOMETHING THAT BENEFITS ME ONLY. Not one time did I say. What I want, IS the community to be benefit from this. That WAS my point to begin with. I am a 'relatively' new player, that has legitimate concerns and some serious issues with the state of pvp in this game and am entitled to my opinion about it. So far, I have had little constructive feedback from the community, people have been putting words in my mouth and make assumptions about my character. It is not unreasonable for me to come here and say that organized warzone groups create scenarios where the coordinated group has an unfair advantage. REGARDLESS, if they are on my team or the other team it is UNFAIR. It is absolutely unreasonable to expect EVERYONE to group up for the sake of pvp. Period.

 

YOU DON'T HAVE TO GROUP UP TO PVP THAT IS YOUR BIASED OPINION. Because you don't want to group up you feel it is unfair, but in reality everyone has the option to group up or not. If everybody has that option and you choose not to use it that is not BW fault it is your issue. Deal with it like everyone else. I just rerolled from one server to another server and had to pug 80% of the time. I still had nooooooooooooooo problems winning. Also I had no problems with people asking me to play with them. The funniest part of this thread as that usually when people post stuff about premades all the pugs chime in to defend the OP, but in your case not really happening.

[IndridX]

 

Just to be clear, in case you're having trouble following, you said the other posts on this topic were just a bunch of QQ threads, but that this thread was totally legit.

 

You don't see how calling it QQ when others just complain, while offering zero actual solutions, about an ingame system that others use but which they won't isn't the exact same as what you've done?

 

Like I said, I'm pretty sure we're getting trolled.

My solution is simple and is the obvious one. Remove groups from Warzone queues. Will it bring other issues? Certainly. And I think they should be addressed. I definitely think more content should be added for group pvp outside of the randomly assembled warzones for sure. My main concern though is as the title suggests. Warzones being only randomly assembled groups. If you want my opinion on other things, ask. I have no problem with answering.

[ArchangelLBC]

Well.....yea. I understand it may slap some people in the face. But, the fact that groups can get together and queue against randomly assembled players isn't fair to me. They get their fun and comms at the expense of other players fun and comms. That is fundamentally wrong to me. I think there are other areas of pvp that should be worked on though to be sure. Obviously group oriented material that doesn't involve normal warzones.

 

Wouldn't it make more sense to create more PVP content that's about 1v1? The warzones are teambased games.

 

Also, again, you're fine with sacrificing other people's idea of fun (not letting them play with their friends in normal warzones) so you can get something you think will make your life better.

 

So now, not only is it ok if someone QQs as long as that someone is you, now it's ok if someone's fun is ruined to benefit another person, as long as the beneficiary is you.

 

Got it.

[TUXs]

YOU DON'T HAVE TO GROUP UP TO PVP THAT IS YOUR BIASED OPINION. Because you don't want to group up you feel it is unfair, but in reality everyone has the option to group up or not. If everybody has that option and you choose not to use it that is not BW fault it is your issue. Deal with it like everyone else. I just rerolled from one server to another server and had to pug 80% of the time. I still had nooooooooooooooo problems winning. Also I had no problems with people asking me to play with them. The funniest part of this thread as that usually when people post stuff about premades all the pugs chime in to defend the OP, but in your case not really happening.

 

In all fairness, I think <I AM LEGEND> should be prevented from grouping...it'd make being a Pub against you guys more tolerable

 

(In case there's any doubt, I was KIDDING!!!)

[sirullrich]

Wouldn't it make more sense to create more PVP content that's about 1v1? The warzones are teambased games.

 

Also, again, you're fine with sacrificing other people's idea of fun (not letting them play with their friends in normal warzones) so you can get something you think will make your life better.

 

So now, not only is it ok if someone QQs as long as that someone is you, now it's ok if someone's fun is ruined to benefit another person, as long as the beneficiary is you.

 

Got it.

 

Yup that is exactly what I told him too. He only wants to benefit himself.

[TUXs]

My solution is simple and is the obvious one. Remove groups from Warzone queues.

That's not a solution, that's simply stupid.

[IndridX]

YOU DON'T HAVE TO GROUP UP TO PVP THAT IS YOUR BIASED OPINION.

Well you are right about one thing. It is my opinion. And it may be biased, I am ok with that. I'm all about whats fair to the ENTIRE community. Not just people that want to group up.

 

There are avenues that groups can use to pursue pvp. Rated Warzones.

 

There ought to be avenues for the more casual gamers who like to queue solo. WITHOUT fear of being put into unfair matchups promoted by an unfair matchmaking system. Regardless if the group is on your side or not.

 

It is you that insists on being unreasonable to a certain group of people. Not me.

Edited April 4, 2013 by IndridX

[IndridX]

That's not a solution, that's simply stupid.

Well I respect your opinion.

[IndridX]

Yup that is exactly what I told him too. He only wants to benefit himself.

Actually I think that poster is going in the right direction. I love that idea.

[TUXs]

There ought to be avenues for the more casual gamers who like to queue solo.

 

It you that insists on being unreasonable to a certain group of people. Not me.

/invite <- that's your "avenue". I solo queue regularly. I win some, lose some.

[sirullrich]

In all fairness, I think <I AM LEGEND> should be prevented from grouping...it'd make being a Pub against you guys more tolerable

 

(In case there's any doubt, I was KIDDING!!!)

 

HAHA I could tell. I haven't been playing on POT5 as much because I live in Hawaii and don't get on early enough anymore.

[sirullrich]

Well you right about one thing. It is my opinion. And it may be biased, I am ok with that. I'm all about whats fair to the ENTIRE community. Not just people that want to group up.

 

There are avenues that groups can use to pursue pvp. Rated Warzones.

 

There ought to be avenues for the more casual gamers who like to queue solo. WITHOUT fear of being put into unfair matchups promoted by an unfair matchmaking system. Regardless if the group is on your side or not.

 

It is you that insists on being unreasonable to a certain group of people. Not me.

 

It is random there is nothing fair about random. Get over yourself. You are only talking about solo players not the community. I play rateds, but why do I need to play rateds all the time? Once again this only benefits you and no one else. So if I play with my RL friend who just started and is in recruit gear. I'm forced to find 6 more people and play rateds or my friend who is new has to play by himself? Is that fair to him?

[ArchangelLBC]

Well you are right about one thing. It is my opinion. And it may be biased, I am ok with that. I'm all about whats fair to the ENTIRE community. Not just people that want to group up.

 

There are avenues that groups can use to pursue pvp. Rated Warzones.

 

There ought to be avenues for the more casual gamers who like to queue solo. WITHOUT fear of being put into unfair matchups promoted by an unfair matchmaking system. Regardless if the group is on your side or not.

 

It is you that insists on being unreasonable to a certain group of people. Not me.

 

Spoken like someone who has no clue about how ranked warzones work. Have less than 8? Can't even queue. Don't have the right 8? Enjoy getting stomped into the ground by the only other team queuing that night.

 

The proper solution is proper matchmaking, but no, lets just screw over everyone who thought an MMO was the proper venue to play PVP while grouped with their friends.

[Jadescythe]

Well.....yea. I understand it may slap some people in the face. But, the fact that groups can get together and queue against randomly assembled players isn't fair to me. They get their fun and comms at the expense of other players fun and comms. That is fundamentally wrong to me. I think there are other areas of pvp that should be worked on though to be sure. Obviously group oriented material that doesn't involve normal warzones.

 

I'd hate to break it to you, but the people you are trying to protect are the ones that will be hurt the most. Those who are queuing for fun with friends don't particularly like running into the server's best premades either and now you are basically forcing them into that exact scenario. This game is about playing with other people and you are basically taking away that opportunity.

 

The current setup of allowing up to 4 players is enough to get plenty of your friends together without providing an overwhelming advantage in terms of stacking your team. You can still end up queued with 4 healers for your others and be screwed. Those who want to use the system to their advantage will have better teams more often and may be considered to be "PUG Stomping", but 95% of people are just doing warzones to do warzones with their friends, guildies, or random new people.

 

If you truly want more even warzones, then do the right thing. Advocate intelligent matchmaking so that you are queued with and against players of equal skill. If always queuing with groups truly does inflate your ability, then those who do it all the time will have higher ratings and be placed accordingly in matches.

[sirullrich]

I'd hate to break it to you, but the people you are trying to protect are the ones that will be hurt the most. Those who are queuing for fun with friends don't particularly like running into the server's best premades either and now you are basically forcing them into that exact scenario. This game is about playing with other people and you are basically taking away that opportunity.

 

The current setup of allowing up to 4 players is enough to get plenty of your friends together without providing an overwhelming advantage in terms of stacking your team. You can still end up queued with 4 healers for your others and be screwed. Those who want to use the system to their advantage will have better teams more often and may be considered to be "PUG Stomping", but 95% of people are just doing warzones to do warzones with their friends, guildies, or random new people.

 

If you truly want more even warzones, then do the right thing. Advocate intelligent matchmaking so that you are queued with and against players of equal skill. If always queuing with groups truly does inflate your ability, then those who do it all the time will have higher ratings and be placed accordingly in matches.

 

He can't agree with you on this because if he does then everything he has been writing is BS.

[criminalheretic]

Groups oftentimes create unfair advantages..... Threads will continue. Sorry.

 

Groups create advantages, not "unfair" advantages. There is nothing unfair about using an option that is available to everyone.

 

The fact that the success of grouping has been proven over and over and over again, yet people still refuse to group up, boggles the mind.

 

I've come to the conclusion (Assumption, not something I am presenting as fact) that the people who "don't want to, or cant" find a group, are just not very good, and therefore are not recruited for PvP guilds, or don't want to be held accountable for their performance as part of a group.

 

If everyone's definition for "fair" means creating an environment where people of below average skill level, can maintain a .500 record, we will NEVER achieve fairness in this game. All this talk about the "spirit" of the game is meant to hide what people are really saying "Bioware, please limit the amount of good players against whom I must compete in PvP".

 

If/when we ever have the population, or x-server queues to support it, I would wholeheartedly support the idea of an "Pee-Wee" queue. But until that day, stop trying over and over again to punish the people who are better than you, and who know at least 3 other people who are better than you, by suggesting that using all of the tools available is a plot to ruin your gaming experience.

[TUXs]

Groups create advantages, not "unfair" advantages. There is nothing unfair about using an option that is available to everyone.

Great point!!! Similar to how gear and buffs and BiS items create "advantages".

[sirullrich]

groups create advantages, not "unfair" advantages. There is nothing unfair about using an option that is available to everyone.

 

The fact that the success of grouping has been proven over and over and over again, yet people still refuse to group up, boggles the mind.

 

I've come to the conclusion (assumption, not something i am presenting as fact) that the people who "don't want to, or cant" find a group, are just not very good, and therefore are not recruited for pvp guilds, or don't want to be held accountable for their performance as part of a group.

 

If everyone's definition for "fair" means creating an environment where people of below average skill level, can maintain a .500 record, we will never achieve fairness in this game. All this talk about the "spirit" of the game is meant to hide what people are really saying "bioware, please limit the amount of good players against whom i must compete in pvp".

 

If/when we ever have the population, or x-server queues to support it, i would wholeheartedly support the idea of an "pee-wee" queue. But until that day, stop trying over and over again to punish the people who are better than you, and who know at least 3 other people who are better than you, by suggesting that using all of the tools available is a plot to ruin your gaming experience.

 

two thumbs up!!!!

[TonyDragonflame]

Groups create advantages, not "unfair" advantages. There is nothing unfair about using an option that is available to everyone.

 

The fact that the success of grouping has been proven over and over and over again, yet people still refuse to group up, boggles the mind.

 

I've come to the conclusion (Assumption, not something I am presenting as fact) that the people who "don't want to, or cant" find a group, are just not very good, and therefore are not recruited for PvP guilds, or don't want to be held accountable for their performance as part of a group.

 

If everyone's definition for "fair" means creating an environment where people of below average skill level, can maintain a .500 record, we will NEVER achieve fairness in this game. All this talk about the "spirit" of the game is meant to hide what people are really saying "Bioware, please limit the amount of good players against whom I must compete in PvP".

 

If/when we ever have the population, or x-server queues to support it, I would wholeheartedly support the idea of an "Pee-Wee" queue. But until that day, stop trying over and over again to punish the people who are better than you, and who know at least 3 other people who are better than you, by suggesting that using all of the tools available is a plot to ruin your gaming experience.

 

So go play ranked, its specially maked for "good" premades. Make friends, joing pvp guild, and go ranked.

 

Ranked specially were designed for this purposes - for really good players, who wanna be competitive in the game with equal chances - both 8-man premades, with TS.

 

Looks like only baddies and cowards go premades on regular wz and afraid play ranked for real competition

[sirullrich]

So go play ranked, its specially maked for "good" premades. Make friends, joing pvp guild, and go ranked.

 

Ranked specially were designed for this purposes - for really good players, who wanna be competitive in the game with equal chances - both 8-man premades, with TS.

 

Looks like only baddies and cowards go premades on regular wz and afraid play ranked for real competition

 

LOL! So if four fresh 50's group up they should play ranked too?