Ban all premades outside of ranked 50

[Jadescythe]

i also had a guy who was about to die in voidstar run to where i was hiding in stealth watching for ninjacappers last night, the marauder he was facing of course force leapt/smashed, breaking my stealth, stunning me, and making me his next target. i ran round the corner a bit and missed the ninja stealther i knew would be coming and he capped the door.

 

now granted if i was in a group the guy probably wouldn't have come near me because he'd have realised my game, but it was going to take way too long for me to explain to him why i was there. voice comms would have made it pretty simple and quick to tell him not to come near me as i was hiding for a reason.

 

Premade or not, who runs at someone on their team that is stealthed? This is where most of the "communication advantages" arguments burn out. I shouldn't have to tell someone not to do what is outlined in this post. Voice chat offers significant advantages in rateds because you have an entire team in there, thus typing is completely unnecessary. It's also necessary to do things like quickly focusing targets that may not be typically targeted (aka not healers).

 

If I tell my team that I'm going to go ninja cap a node in vent, but don't tell the other 4 people and they follow me instead of pressuring another node, my plan will fail regardless of our awesome premade communication. If I call out incoming in vent, but the people available to come to help at the node aren't in my premade (say they are currently defending a node themselves) then I won't get any help.

 

TL;DR people should make common sense plays without being told and you still have to communicate everything to all 8 players.

[sirullrich]

wrong. you weren't there. we would have 2 turrets and the group would go run off and attack the 3rd. in the process we would lose 1 of the turrets we currently posesed. nobody cares about numbers. what did they help the team do to win? obviously they had a healer that did absolutely nothing to help anyone else outside their group. i lose more matches with them than i won. they need to l2p and the other people from the wz's agreed with me.

 

 

edit - so you are saying we should be forced to group to play? g.t.f.o. i didn't have to group to level why should i be forced to group for pvp? the only people who pvp need the "extra" help because they can't cut it without a healer on ther bvtt 100% of the time. aka oh please save me im getting beat down oh please save me.

 

Then u should've guarded. Period

[tiguelinus]

There simply is no valid argument for putting a premade group up against a bunch who solo queued. Anyone making an argument to the contrary is simply trying to maintain anunfair advantage.

 

The game is being ruined for many more players than those are who would be harmed because they won't get their daily ego stroke when the can't cheat their way to the top anymore.

 

Yes, ALL premises are cheats. They may not be hacks but the very concept of a premades, and it's often unfair advantage, is cheating every player to go up against.

 

Certainly not all premades meant victory, but the many groups out there that are class and level balancing their groups have ruined it for everyone.

 

On top of this many of them have become quitters when they can't get thei two groups of four into one single match.

 

I agree with you 100%

[sirullrich]

I agree with you 100%

 

LOL agree all you want but it is never 8 pugs vs. 2 premades.

[cycao]

LOL agree all you want but it is never 8 pugs vs. 2 premades.

 

Clearly this is the case if you pug you have a 100% chance of facing full teams made up of premades with non on your side ever.

[sirullrich]

Clearly this is the case if you pug you have a 100% chance of facing full teams made up of premades with non on your side ever.

 

YUP that must be it!!! No wonder every pug seems to lose all the time. HAHAAHAH

[ebado]

There's no crusade, the point is that people playing with certain advantages that come with setting up your own group should ideally be facing other groups who have those same advantages. Currently as a solo queuer there's no way to prevent yourself being in a group with no healers facing a group with 4 sorcerers/sages who can all communicate much more easily than your team. What is so difficult to understand?

 

It's not hard to understand. Again, nobody denies that coordination is an advantage. I'm just not sure why you brought up and insulted us over a scenario you created that didn't even illustrate your point. I'm done responding to you in any case. Cheers.

[buffgfc]

It's not hard to understand. Again, nobody denies that coordination is an advantage. I'm just not sure why you brought up and insulted us over a scenario you created that didn't even illustrate your point. I'm done responding to you in any case. Cheers.

 

I didn't insult anyone except in self defence your honour. In fact i don't think i insulted anyone at all. Glad you're done, i have little time for people who can't have an intelligent discussion without feeling insulted that someone says something they don't understand/disagree with. You're welcome :-)

[buffgfc]

Premade or not, who runs at someone on their team that is stealthed? This is where most of the "communication advantages" arguments burn out. I shouldn't have to tell someone not to do what is outlined in this post. Voice chat offers significant advantages in rateds because you have an entire team in there, thus typing is completely unnecessary. It's also necessary to do things like quickly focusing targets that may not be typically targeted (aka not healers).

 

If I tell my team that I'm going to go ninja cap a node in vent, but don't tell the other 4 people and they follow me instead of pressuring another node, my plan will fail regardless of our awesome premade communication. If I call out incoming in vent, but the people available to come to help at the node aren't in my premade (say they are currently defending a node themselves) then I won't get any help.

 

TL;DR people should make common sense plays without being told and you still have to communicate everything to all 8 players.

 

Can't disagree with any of that except that even in a 4/4 group i can still vice comm to warn of an attack which can then be relayed by someone else to the other members of the team (while waiting for entry for instance) while i hold off the attack. As my friend above called it, that is only one hypothetical scenario, but voice communications will always trump typed communications in a warzone. Of course you're right too that often good teams don't even need to communicate much.

 

Tl;dr i agree

[ebado]

I didn't insult anyone except in self defence your honour. In fact i don't think i insulted anyone at all. Glad you're done, i have little time for people who can't have an intelligent discussion without feeling insulted that someone says something they don't understand/disagree with. You're welcome :-)

 

Oh, now you got me to chime back in. Tricky.

 

We were having an intelligent discussion. There are discussions about Elo ratings in here, the validity of valor of a matchmaking mechanics (hint: it's not valid) and many other things. And then you brought up a hypothetical about calling incomings that is exactly the same for a competent player in voice chat or ops chat, and many of us were dumb enough to respond to it.

 

But hey, I'm delusional (not a personal attack by the way) because I don't think calling out incomings in ops chat negatively affects my gameplay more than calling it out in voice chat (hint, competent people in voice chat are typing it out, too). Or maybe I'm afraid to admit it that typing out a few keys is such arduous task that my gameplay is negatively affected because the internet is serious business. Poor me.

 

nope, i solo guard fine most of the time, but anyone who can't admit that being able to communicate fully AND still go about the rest of your business is an advantage over having to type using the same hands and keyboard you use to play is delusional. or just afraid to admit the truth

 

If you want to have an intelligent discussion, don't bring up hypotheticals that don't illustrate your point and then get defensive when they are struck down. You mentioned earlier you are probably a terrible communicator. Maybe the problem is closer to home than you think.

 

Cheers, and have a good day .

Edited April 5, 2013 by ebado

[ebado]

LOL agree all you want but it is never 8 pugs vs. 2 premades.

 

I'm always on a team with seven other recruit or worse geared pugs against two fully min-maxed EWH premades using voice chat (and realistically, channeling Bastila's battle meditation). I'm a victim.

[-IceHawk-]

Hey, me too! This happens almost every single time I Queue!

[L-RANDLE]

Getting pretty tired of these threads, but I have said it multiple times everytime they come up, if you somehow think that this is unfair in some way,

 

Explain what is stopping you from doing the same thing?

Is premading only limtited to certain players, and you are not one of them?

Are you anti-social?

Do you have real friends or drinking buddies?

 

Someone posted on here "why should they be forced to group to PvP?" This isn't golf or tennis.. TEAM OBJECTIVE-BASED PVP...

 

By Solo-Queing, you just drafted yourself to the Jacksonville Jaguars, then complain that the Partiots are too good to be in the same league.... LAWL...

 

And no, its not about keping an "unfair advantage", you have the same luxury. I PuG 90% of the WZ I am in. I prefer to play with guild members on occasion because I know they have a clue and I prefer to play with, you know(?), my guild....

 

No truly competitive person ever complains about getting stomped and ask for a system change where "they can be more competitive". They get better.. whether that means grouping, gearing, or examining their own "skillz". Not only that, they relish the underdog role and fight harder to try to compensate for horrible teammates.

 

I will also debunk another myth. There is no such thing as a "fun loss" or a "boring win" for a competitive person.

A win, is a win, is a win. A loss, is a loss, is a loss. Competitive people don't like losing, ever! So stop with that "enjoyable close loss" crap... Losing a close one should PISS YOU OFF EVEN MORE!! Even with that, I actually prefer the lopsided ones, because that means I can squeeze in more WZ's in a given sitting.

 

 

Here are a few words of wisdom, that applies 100% to your "problem".

 

"Don't be so soft. There is no stinking honor in any of this. It's a game, play to win.."- Prince Vegeta

 

If you are not playing to win and/or doing everything in your power to be in the best situation possible(premade), you will not be competitive in the game. Accept it or move on...

 

/jumpoffsoapbox

 

TL;DR- If you care enough about premades ruining your WZ, then read it...

Edited April 5, 2013 by L-RANDLE

[Monterone]

^^^

 

What he said, grow a pair people.

[buffgfc]

Getting pretty tired of these threads, but I have said it multiple times everytime they come up, if you somehow think that this is unfair in some way,

 

Explain what is stopping you from doing the same thing?

Is premading only limtited to certain players, and you are not one of them?

Are you anti-social?

Do you have real friends or drinking buddies?

 

Someone posted on here "why should they be forced to group to PvP?" This isn't golf or tennis.. TEAM OBJECTIVE-BASED PVP...

 

By Solo-Queing, you just drafted yourself to the Jacksonville Jaguars, then complain that the Partiots are too good to be in the same league.... LAWL...

 

And no, its not about keping an "unfair advantage", you have the same luxury. I PuG 90% of the WZ I am in. I prefer to play with guild members on occasion because I know they have a clue and I prefer to play with, you know(?), my guild....

 

No truly competitive person ever complains about getting stomped and ask for a system change where "they can be more competitive". They get better.. whether that means grouping, gearing, or examining their own "skillz". Not only that, they relish the underdog role and fight harder to try to compensate for horrible teammates.

 

I will also debunk another myth. There is no such thing as a "fun loss" or a "boring win" for a competitive person.

A win, is a win, is a win. A loss, is a loss, is a loss. Competitive people don't like losing, ever! So stop with that "enjoyable close loss" crap... Losing a close one should PISS YOU OFF EVEN MORE!! Even with that, I actually prefer the lopsided ones, because that means I can squeeze in more WZ's in a given sitting.

 

 

Here are a few words of wisdom, that applies 100% to your "problem".

 

"Don't be so soft. There is no stinking honor in any of this. It's a game, play to win.."- Prince Vegeta

 

If you are not playing to win and/or doing everything in your power to be in the best situation possible(premade), you will not be competitive in the game. Accept it or move on...

 

/jumpoffsoapbox

 

TL;DR- If you care enough about premades ruining your WZ, then read it...

 

So have your premade group more likely to enter awz against another premade group, and have pugs more likely to face other pugs. Why are people scared of that idea?

[L-RANDLE]

So have your premade group more likely to enter awz against another premade group, and have pugs more likely to face other pugs. Why are people scared of that idea?

 

And the Patriots should never play the Jets, cause they get killt everytime... You only can play the games on your schedule. There are cupcakes, there are anvils. It happens in any sport whether RL or E.

 

 

You want a cupcake division... Why?

 

I'll tell you why, because you are the one that is "scared"...

 

Scared to interact with others for better gameplay.

Scared to look in the mirror and blame yourself for getting stomped or losing.

Scared to push yourself when the odds are heavily stacked against you.

Scared to admit that you might actually suck at this game, in any form or fashion.

 

You ask for a competitive playing field, but refuse to allow the Alphas, and even the beta and gammas(which I would classify myself as) in the game? :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

 

Don't you want to be an Alpha?

 

Nope, cupcakes for everyone...:D:D:D:D

 

 

Here is one for you, why should I be forced to group to get decent competition?.

 

Its the same spin as your/others argument...

Edited April 5, 2013 by L-RANDLE

[criminalheretic]

My logic is clear: if i go solo on wz and meet ranked premade, I lose with my pug.

 

After this, I go to Alderaan and kill several imps lowbies, just for relax.

 

If I cannot play with equal chances on warzone (which I love to play) and others use their unfair advantage there, than I use MY unfair advantage of high level for ganking. Eye for eye.

 

Until the people that rolled you in the WZ, miss you and follow you to Alderaan.

[MOUSEKETEERS]

"Please punish people for making friends and playing with them in this MMORPG."

 

That is all I see every time I see one of these "premades are ruining pvp!" thread.

[buffgfc]

And the Patriots should never play the Jets, cause they get killt everytime... You only can play the games on your schedule. There are cupcakes, there are anvils. It happens in any sport whether RL or E.

 

 

You want a cupcake division... Why?

 

I'll tell you why, because you are the one that is "scared"...

 

Scared to interact with others for better gameplay.

Scared to look in the mirror and blame yourself for getting stomped or losing.

Scared to push yourself when the odds are heavily stacked against you.

Scared to admit that you might actually suck at this game, in any form or fashion.

 

You ask for a competitive playing field, but refuse to allow the Alphas, and even the beta and gammas(which I would classify myself as) in the game? :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

 

Don't you want to be an Alpha?

 

Nope, cupcakes for everyone...:D:D:D:D

 

 

Here is one for you, why should I be forced to group to get decent competition?.

 

Its the same spin as your/others argument...

 

which part of that answers my question? i just see a lot of smiley faces and waffling.

[buffgfc]

"Please punish people for making friends and playing with them in this MMORPG."

 

That is all I see every time I see one of these "premades are ruining pvp!" thread.

 

why would it be a punishment to have a premade group more likely to face another premade group?

[TonyDragonflame]

Until the people that rolled you in the WZ, miss you and follow you to Alderaan.

 

It will be awesome, cuz 1 vs 1 I can kill anyone from these premaders.

 

Without voice speak for focus fire, and without pocket healers, they are just regular baddies

[criminalheretic]

why would it be a punishment to have a premade group more likely to face another premade group?

 

The "punishment" is making them go into their own queue, and thus have to wait longer for a match, just because they are good. The only model we have for this is ranked, and we know how that worked out.

[foxmob]

Getting pretty tired of these threads, but I have said it multiple times everytime they come up, if you somehow think that this is unfair in some way,

 

Explain what is stopping you from doing the same thing?

Is premading only limtited to certain players, and you are not one of them?

Are you anti-social?

Do you have real friends or drinking buddies?.

I stopped reading right here. you might have said something valuable later, but frankly, this is enough.

 

let's just say solo Q guy is of average skill. he's never going to be able to premade with 4m grps of elite, great, very good, and often not even good skill level. it's a "fact" I've observed over my course of mmos that the better the player, the more likely he is to grp with players whom he considers to be equally skilled.

 

now magnify this with the jackwaggons who run superQs and you've completely eliminated the chance for average player to land in a wz with better players. you're actually restricting the Q pool for everyone in order to ensure that you, yourself, get the best possible comp. perfectly "legal" as a 4m. obnoxious and cheating as a superQ. but either way...well...see both sides of the issue.

 

your argument assumes that solo Q guy has the right/ability to Q just like elite premade guy. and he does. in a way. but very much does not in another way.

 

if player A is better than player B, and they fight each other, you'd expect player A to defeat player B. c'est la vie. But it's incredibly demoralizing for player B to face player A x 4. and every time player A queues, he's surround for at least 3 more clones.

 

now don't get me wrong. I don't blame the better player for wanting to play with better players to increase the likelihood that he'll win. I've just been on the other side of the equation too, and it's the same reason the rated queue is dry - inferior opponents don't want to sit around getting spawn camped, farmed, and trolled. give them their more restricted sandbox. really...what's the harm? queues pop all the time. there are always grps and solos Qing. I really don't see what the big deal is.

 

:2cents:

[criminalheretic]

It will be awesome, cuz 1 vs 1 I can kill anyone from these premaders.

 

Without voice speak for focus fire, and without pocket healers, they are just regular baddies

 

When you insist that you are better than the people who roll you all the time, it really just looks like a pretty obvious defense mechanism. Jus' sayin.

[foxmob]

It will be awesome, cuz 1 vs 1 I can kill anyone from these premaders.

 

Without voice speak for focus fire, and without pocket healers, they are just regular baddies

this. however, I do not hold to be true. it's a fallacy that I see spread all over the forum by ppl who solo Q and complain about premades. sometimes you can 1v1. that has nothing to do with anything. but the premades that cause you frustration? no. I'm quite certain the fast majority of them would stomp the complainers 1v1.