Coldin Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Seriously Bioware. Change your matchmaking system so pre-made groups do not get matched up against PUGs except in the most rare of circumstances. This isn't fun for anyone except perhaps the people running the premades. And please, no comments about how people should just form their own premades. That's no a solution, that's just compounding the issue of a badly designed matchmaking system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cashogy Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 there is no matchmaking system Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RazielHex Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 there is no matchmaking system There is, but when there's not a huge pool of people queuing, whaddya think is gonna happen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AltruisticRage Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 How do you define premade? Can I queue with one friend, two friends or three friends that I enjoy playing with? Do you know how rarely we run against teams that do not have at least 3 people from the same guild? I would say the majority of my warzones are against other premades because there are so many. Do you know what I do when I queue solo and go up against a premade? I try to win and don't run to the forums to cry about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chlomamf Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 (edited) Inb4 all the Premaders saying for us to make our own Premades so we can take on experienced Premades with members with 30K health each. Edited January 4, 2013 by Chlomamf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldin Posted January 4, 2013 Author Share Posted January 4, 2013 (edited) How do you define premade? Can I queue with one friend, two friends or three friends that I enjoy playing with? I say two+ people qualifies as a premade, though I don't mind a premade of two so much as a premade of four. Do you know how rarely we run against teams that do not have at least 3 people from the same guild? No idea. Is it as rarely as I run against a full PUG? I would say the majority of my warzones are against other premades because there are so many. Maybe on your server? I certainly go against a lot of premade teams, especially later in the day. Do you know what I do when I queue solo and go up against a premade? I try to win and don't run to the forums to cry about it. I try to win too. But that doesn't mean there's not a serious problem here in regards to matchmaking. It's frustrating and certainly not fun. Edited January 4, 2013 by Coldin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
criminalheretic Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 (edited) Seriously Bioware. Change your matchmaking system so pre-made groups do not get matched up against PUGs except in the most rare of circumstances. This isn't fun for anyone except perhaps the people running the premades. And please, no comments about how people should just form their own premades. That's no a solution, that's just compounding the issue of a badly designed matchmaking system. Actually forming your own premade IS in fact, the solution. Those of us that are in premades, were not born into this world as part of quadruplets with laptops in hand. Edited January 4, 2013 by criminalheretic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
criminalheretic Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Inb4 all the Premaders saying for us to make our own Premades so we can take on experienced Premades with members with 30K health each. In after all the people who complain about premades start lumping gear/skill along with being part of a premade, in a thinly veiled attempt to really say "I want to compete, but I don't want to compete against anyone that has a good chance of beating me. PS I also don't want to take any responsibility for helping myself win." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomeJagoff Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 there is no matchmaking system not true, the system most definitely prefers matching premades with each other against solo queue pugs. Every time I queue 2 or 4 people for a wz, almost always end up with with either another 4man or 2 other 2man premades and the opposing team in those cases are almost always full pugs. Also when i queue just 3 people, takes a super long time, then almost always end up with another 3man premade and a 2man premade. It's like the system specifically waits until there are enough odd number premades available before making the match. So if you're a 2man, it pops fast by finding another 3 2mans or a 2man and a 4man. If you're in a 3man, system has to find a 3man, then a 2man. I've sat in 3man queues for hours before waiting for a pop., then leave group, queue solo, instant pop. If the system wasn't trying to match just premades together, it wouldn't take an hour or more to grab 1 solo queuer to throw in with a 3man and a 4man premade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldin Posted January 4, 2013 Author Share Posted January 4, 2013 In after all the people who complain about premades start lumping gear/skill along with being part of a premade, in a thinly veiled attempt to really say "I want to compete, but I don't want to compete against anyone that has a good chance of beating me. PS I also don't want to take any responsibility for helping myself win." Gear and Skill is another separate problem. Fact of the matter is, fresh 50s coming in with just recruit gear should also no be matched against Elite War-Hero Geared Players except in edge cases. Perhaps if the matchmaking system took Valor into account, it would help prevent those kind of scenarios. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomeJagoff Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 How do you define premade? Can I queue with one friend, two friends or three friends that I enjoy playing with? Do you know how rarely we run against teams that do not have at least 3 people from the same guild? I would say the majority of my warzones are against other premades because there are so many. Do you know what I do when I queue solo and go up against a premade? I try to win and don't run to the forums to cry about it. lol does your guild ever solo queue? I don't think I've ever seen only 1 of you guys on my team pubside or against only 1 of you impside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
criminalheretic Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Gear and Skill is another separate problem. Fact of the matter is, fresh 50s coming in with just recruit gear should also no be matched against Elite War-Hero Geared Players except in edge cases. Perhaps if the matchmaking system took Valor into account, it would help prevent those kind of scenarios. If the choices are: A. Someone in recruit gear has to tough it out for a few matches until they can grind the rest of WH (Anyone serious about PvP has their comms maxed when they hit 50) B. Completely redo the queue structure. I choose A. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belpheghor Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Do you know what I do when I queue solo and go up against a premade? I try to win and don't run to the forums to cry about it. ^ +1 sir.....WELL SAID! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldin Posted January 4, 2013 Author Share Posted January 4, 2013 not true, the system most definitely prefers matching premades with each other against solo queue pugs. Every time I queue 2 or 4 people for a wz, almost always end up with with either another 4man or 2 other 2man premades and the opposing team in those cases are almost always full pugs. Also when i queue just 3 people, takes a super long time, then almost always end up with another 3man premade and a 2man premade. It's like the system specifically waits until there are enough odd number premades available before making the match. So if you're a 2man, it pops fast by finding another 3 2mans or a 2man and a 4man. If you're in a 3man, system has to find a 3man, then a 2man. I've sat in 3man queues for hours before waiting for a pop., then leave group, queue solo, instant pop. If the system wasn't trying to match just premades together, it wouldn't take an hour or more to grab 1 solo queuer to throw in with a 3man and a 4man premade. Actually, I would be surprised to learn if it really does do this. I'm fairly certain that the system simply processes people in batches, with only a passing regard to group composition. Also, I personally have not seen an hour long queue since the server mergers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomeJagoff Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Gear and Skill is another separate problem. Fact of the matter is, fresh 50s coming in with just recruit gear should also no be matched against Elite War-Hero Geared Players except in edge cases. Perhaps if the matchmaking system took Valor into account, it would help prevent those kind of scenarios. not only that, but the biggest problem with solo queue is that you're Far more likely to end up in a losing match that somebody just ragequit out of. I may have gotten into a losing match with a 2man premade once, but never ever happened with a 3man or a 4man. So just by virtue of joining solo queue, there's a 50/50 chance you're going to come into a match that's already losing, or rarely sometimes, a match that's already winning. If you're in a premade, even 2man, there's like a 99.99% chance you're going to get a fresh match. For the people who are qqing about premades, just ask in general chat if people want to queue for wzs. I usually queue solo, sometimes with guild, but I've regularly been invited to premades from either other guilds or random groups of people. I mean, there's really nothing stopping you from making your own premade, just invite people. hell, even if you're a terrible pvper, just invite another equally terrible pvper and then you guys will both be less likely to end up in an in progress losing match and thus less likely to lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldin Posted January 4, 2013 Author Share Posted January 4, 2013 If the choices are: A. Someone in recruit gear has to tough it out for a few matches until they can grind the rest of WH (Anyone serious about PvP has their comms maxed when they hit 50) B. Completely redo the queue structure. I choose A. Which one has a better chance of keeping people playing and subscribing once they reach level 50? I choose B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomeJagoff Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Actually, I would be surprised to learn if it really does do this. I'm fairly certain that the system simply processes people in batches, with only a passing regard to group composition. Also, I personally have not seen an hour long queue since the server mergers. To be honest, I don't think group composition plays any role at all, recently I've been in matches with and against like 6 sorcs/sages and I've had matches with like 7 assassins before too. As for long queues, might be a bug, had times when we started with 4, had 1-2 leave, replaced them, queued, waited for like 20mins, we all logged, reformed, queued, instant pop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AltruisticRage Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 lol does your guild ever solo queue? I don't think I've ever seen only 1 of you guys on my team pubside or against only 1 of you impside. I don't know. Typically, there are at least 2 of us. We can usually run 4 man groups pretty easy. I solo queue. It just depends on who is on when I am trying to get my daily done. At night during peak hours you will see mostly 3-4 man groups of us, though. Frankly, I would prefer some legitimate options to matchmaking. However, if any of those substantially increase queue times, I am against it. Even though the OP doesn't think so, me doing 100k healing and 3 capping in a Civil War is as fun for him as it is for me. I would much prefer closer matches but teams get destroyed even without premades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
criminalheretic Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Which one has a better chance of keeping people playing and subscribing once they reach level 50? I choose B. Waiting 20-60 minutes for their "solo queue only - < 60 Valor - < 1000 Expertise" match, then losing 50% of the time anyway, while 16 people run around keyboard turning and clicking, and then blaming each other in gen chat, is not going to keep people playing and subscribing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustinxDuff Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 One of the few things Rift got right was premade queues. If there was a premade queuing on the other side it would prioritize matching them with another premade before adding the PuGs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldin Posted January 4, 2013 Author Share Posted January 4, 2013 To be honest, I don't think group composition plays any role at all, recently I've been in matches with and against like 6 sorcs/sages and I've had matches with like 7 assassins before too. Sorry. Should have clarified that I simply meant number of people in the premade group. It clearly does not care at all for classes in the group. Waiting 20-60 minutes for their "solo queue only - < 60 Valor - < 1000 Expertise" match, then losing 50% of the time anyway, while 16 people run around keyboard turning and clicking, and then blaming each other in gen chat, is not going to keep people playing and subscribing. If it's taking 20-60 minutes, then it would still be a made match-making system. Either that, or the server is a ghost town. And matching via Expertise would be flawed, since it's easily changed by the player. Valor is better simply because it corresponds directly to warzones played, so at the very least, players with high valor ratings will likely have some experience and some gear. Losing 50% of the time would be much more preferable to losing 90% of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomeJagoff Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 I don't know. Typically, there are at least 2 of us. We can usually run 4 man groups pretty easy. I solo queue. It just depends on who is on when I am trying to get my daily done. At night during peak hours you will see mostly 3-4 man groups of us, though. Frankly, I would prefer some legitimate options to matchmaking. However, if any of those substantially increase queue times, I am against it. Even though the OP doesn't think so, me doing 100k healing and 3 capping in a Civil War is as fun for him as it is for me. I would much prefer closer matches but teams get destroyed even without premades. ah, k, guess I'm on at off hours. Yeah, I'm also against anything that increases queue times. And yeah, immediate 3 cap matches aren't particularly fun for either side, but think it comes down to the system pitting premades against pugs, like all premade against all pug more often than not. Usually there will be competent guilds + average guilds as premades vs all pugs, but every so often there are lolmatches. In the past month, been in an all pug, almost all unguilded, almost all 14k hp group on imp side vs a 4man of deadweight and a 4man of goof troop. Then same deal on pub side, but against a 4man of we haz cookies and a 4man of ascendancy. Those are the matches that make me laugh extra hard. Especially when there's that new undergeared player raging in ops chat about how everyone sucks but him and that if only we hadn't sucked so hard, we could have dominated the opposing team (lmao) and then at the end of the match, he ends up with like 15k damage. That's definitely one useful aspect to solo pvp queue though, farming terrible players/whiners for my ignore list so that I never get paired with them for flashpoints. But yeah, those 3cap matches are pretty sad. It's especially sad when you look at the scoreboard after those matches and you're the 1 solo queuer who managed to pull 9-10 medals, have more medals than 5 members of the opposing team, have 5-6 more medals than the next highest person on your team, and end up with 6 mvp votes. I always feel a little guilty in those matches, especially when other people in the match did try, but just got owned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z-ToXiN Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 (edited) Yet another one of these pathetic whining threads. Its an epidemic. As if one thread with over a thousand posts isn't enough. Face it, there aren't enough people queing on each server to make it feasible. If they implement cross-server PVP, I understand then you actually have a large selection of queing people to actually have matchmaking. But as is, forget about it and stop crying. Edited January 4, 2013 by Z-ToXiN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomeJagoff Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Sorry. Should have clarified that I simply meant number of people in the premade group. It clearly does not care at all for classes in the group. ahh, yeah, that's definitely true, I queued 4 sins in a premade the other day and 3 lolsmashers in another, hilariously overpowered. I usually try to play a different class if one of my guildies is same class/spec before grouping though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthRaika Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 The people that say the solution is to form your own premades show how horrible our school system is. sigh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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