Gunnery Commando PvE Guide

[deadandburied]

You pretty much got it. I average 177x dps (no adenals) in a 12 minute ops dummy test and i'm not quite best in slot yet as well. Short 4 armorings, 2 mods, 1 enhancement and 1 relic. Still using a Matrix cube, lol. I should be doing >1800dps on average on a 12 minute ops dummy test with all buffs and an exo stim. But without using adrenals, etc. With ~1900dps quite doable if i spam abilities and toss in more Hammershots and use adrenals. So i'm under performing a bit. Now that's with the 5/31/5 build. With the 6/31/4 build add another 60dps? Although the dps is greater it requires more hammershot spammage. And i'm not a fan of needing to use Hammershot a lot. It just doesn't work with my macros. So overall my raid dps is better with the 5/31/5 build on average mainly because of that.

 

With the gear and the way the stats are we hit the following.

Accuracy=+10.27%

Crit Multi=76.28%

If you increase surge you'd be lowering accuracy which is a dps loss.

 

As regards to crit%. Yes it's very dependent on your current gear. This is mainly affected by your power. Which changes your Tech damage bonus. You want your Tech Bonus damage close to +1100 fully buffed and using an Exo stim. If you exceed this then you swap in more crit mods, etc. This will then determine what your crit% is after the fact. So it'll be somewhere between 36-39.5% approx.

[MandalorianCpt]

http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/character/63c04389-25e9-4bea-8f39-bfd44877ecc9

 

is my build i might have 1 more 61 then 63 but the percentage values are pretty much on the money, (did it from memory) so please let me know ive also done some research into this fact as well, picking the mods with High aim (72aim 13 power) wont give you as nice of a return as (56aim 44 power) ones will, if this unbalances ur critc consider swapping out a crystal..

 

Incomin

 

Also please note i believe my accuracy is more 109.98 and my tech bonus damage is 1088.5

Edited January 1, 2013 by MandalorianCpt
incorrect values

[MandalorianCpt]

Also in Note to you comment i run a 5min parse for my guild testing if i were to go to a 12min parse would i see a improvement from my 1710-1750 range for average dps?

[deadandburied]

You're doing fine for dps. But like me i think we could both improve a little bit. Your build and gear is just about perfect as well. There is one A mod that needs to be swapped out. As for a 5 min vs 12 min fight. I use a 10-12 minute fight to get a better average vs 5-6 min. A 10-12 minute fight requires better ammo regen. So dps may be a bit lower on a 10-12 min fight. However exiting combat takes a few seconds. So the longer the fight the less dps loss. The shortest fight would provide the highest dps if the crit gods favor you. Try the 10-12 min tests and see how you do. And of course lag can really handicap us and some other class specs vs some other class specs which aren't handicapped by it as much. Using a ships dummy eliminates most of this though. So to answer the last question. The shorter fight. But it will usually take more than one test to get lucky. We don't use short tests like that btw. Edited January 1, 2013 by deadandburied

[MandalorianCpt]

I've thought over your 10-12min parse and it doesnt make any sense in a practical aspect, no boss fight is 10-12 mins, so it doesnt make sense to have to conserve your ammo/regenerate for that long, a 10-12 min parse just sounds like your trying to extend ur chance of a critc heavy period and weight it agaisnt a low dps point, i mean it might work for you but for my mind it just doesnt make sense to do a parse longer then a boss fight, since the average time of acutally dps periods is a average of 5-6 mins

 

but thanks for the suggestion

[deadandburied]

a 10-12 min parse just sounds like your trying to extend ur chance of a critc heavy period and weight it agaisnt a low dps point

No it's the opposite. The lower the time the higher the variance in dps. The longer the time the less variance and a better average. The one time i got 1998dps was from a 5 min test. I've never gotten near those results using a 10-12 min test for example. So as i previously said. A short test and the crit gods favoring you would provide the highest dps. So we don't use short tests as they aren't indicative of their true average. We're trying to reduce luck from the equation within an acceptable amount.

Edited January 3, 2013 by deadandburied

[jesseleeca]

No it's the opposite. The lower the time the higher the variance in dps. The longer the time the less variance and a better average. The one time i got 1998dps was from a 5 min test. I've never gotten near those results using a 10-12 min test for example. So as i previously said. A short test and the crit gods favoring you would provide the highest dps. So we don't use short tests as they aren't indicative of their true average. We're trying to reduce luck from the equation within an acceptable amount.

 

Another way to do this would be to do many, many more 5-6 min tests to try to reduce the effect randomness has on the results. According to some statistical thing or another, ~30 tests should give you a roughly normal distribution of results which should show your average dps. Too lazy to spend ~3 hours in front of a dummy but anyone who wants to try it should get some pretty reliable results. (At least that's the case if I remember my stats course correctly.)

[deadandburied]

Yup that works.

 

So as i often do i went back to 6/31/4 spec as opposed to the 5/31/5 spec. My First responder uptime was 54% on our TFB 16 man HM The Writhing Horror kill. This put me at 7% 54% of the time and 2% 46% of the time. For an average of 4.7% reduced cast time. As opposed to 4%. So really no noticeable difference in dps except ammo regen is easier with the 5/31/5 spec as it's a steady 4%. This is why i prefer 5/31/5. I did manage to get myself a bit higher on the torparse dps list for that fight though. So i'll stay with 6/31/4 for another week or so and see if i can do the same on other bosses as well. Not getting my hopes up.

 

My attacks per minute are well below average for Commandos. So getting First Responder to proc is terrible for me. I just do slow and steady dps. Didn't use 1 Hammershot during that fight for example. Now i'm not saying everyone will get the same results. Cause my way is not actually the right way. Spamming abilities and tossing in Hammershots is the right way. So First Responder uptime should be better for people doing it the right way. I'm just to lazy for that and my lazy way works for me.

[ArchangelLBC]

For what it's worth I've found First Responder uptime is much better with decent use of Hammer Shot and overall DPS is higher.

[jesseleeca]

Added advice on holostatues and finished strats for 1st and 2nd boss of TFB.

[deadandburied]

As it's an exploit i'd suggest removing the statues from your post. We don't use them or any cheats or any sort of exploits in any of our raids btw. We do all boss fights as SWTOR intended. Edited January 5, 2013 by deadandburied

[jesseleeca]

Finished all boss strats except for TFB, some of them are sloppy (which I'll elaborate on later).

Feel free to correct/comment.

[ArchangelLBC]

Dread Council aka Heirad , Ciphas,and Kel’sara

 

This fight is spread between three phases, each corresponding to the boss you are focus firing on.

 

Heirad: He has a random aggro table so just unload on him. There are two mechanics that need to be dealt with. First, he casts "Surge Lightning" (Or something like that) and Ciphas jumps over to shield him. Focus fire on Ciphas to burn down the bubble, interrupt, and get back to work on Heirad. I usually just throw three GRs on Ciphas and switch back, by the time the next GR is off, the shield is usually down. Second, he casts "Lightning Field" a big AOE ability that radiates out from each player. Get away from everyone else once he starts channeling, pop your defensive, and run back to the center for AOE heals after. I sometimes start casting Medical Probe, in time to finish just after it goes down, just for sh*ts and giggles and a bit of healing. Rinse repeat until he's dead.

 

Ciphas: Two mechanics: green circles and Doom. You will see two balls floating around you, when you see this get away from other people, drop your circle and get out of it. Occasionally he Dooms someone, if it's you run through three circles to get rid of it or you get one shot.

 

Kel'sara: Try to stand at max range and away from other people for this phase of the fight to give you more time to run when she marks you for death and to decrease the number of people hit by the AOE she does. Otherwise just burn her and whenever she calls adds, kill the ones with castbars first and it should be an easy fight.

 

Also remember that Ciphas occasionally leaps to someone early in his DPS cycle and begins force choking someone. He needs to be interrupted immediately as Leap+a few ticks of Force Choke will kill anyone. I basically interrupt as soon as I see him jump.

 

For Kelsara maximizing DPS output is crucial as its easy to fall behind because of all the running around and add killing, and then wipe due to hard enrage (she sprints around and basically one shots your raid 1 by 1. You can kill her during this phase but its damn difficult).

 

Operator IX aka Tron

 

This is a deceptively simple boss, in terms of mechanics, it helps to do it a few times. Before starting, divide your raid into 4 groups of 2, each of which will choose a color.

 

First half: When it gets to your color phase, get in the middle (you shouldn't be channeling) kill the adds and one of the floating ball of your color. Otherwise just kill datacores and adds.

 

Second half: DPS boss, get in your colored circle when it is casting black obtuse, and if you need to shield someone who gets targeted with your color, both run to the middle.

 

I'm confused as to why you don't have your DPS channel. We have our healers or tanks be the ones in the middle so that they can keep doing their job. We also deliberately fail the purple phase by taking time at the beginning to AoE the big adds, focus down the add you get for failing, and then finish the rest of phase 1. We've had a few times where this wasn't necessary though.

 

I guess its a matter of preference. Having a DPS in the middle means you can kill the adds quicker, but it means the tank or healer on the transition has to kill their sphere pretty quick (except for the first one obviously) so as to not slow down transitions. Also seems like melee DPS like sents are screwed for trying to get their sphere if they stand in the middle.

 

I dunno, if that's how you do it, obviously it works, but then I can say the same about having the DPS channel. Really the only thing that I guess you truly don't wanna do is pair up two DPS on the same color. I'd be hardpressed to believe two DPS could take down the datacores in time. Course I say that and I guess if you have two DPS on blue, and then pair up a tank and healer for yellow you could have all 4 DPS on datacores and finish the yellow phase in 30 seconds, but one healer and one tank for both big adds seems like it's pushing it.

 

For Kephess its important to know that multiple people may have nanites and once someone starts channeling a tower, you better start channeling as well if you have so much as 1 stack.

[jesseleeca]

Also remember that Ciphas occasionally leaps to someone early in his DPS cycle and begins force choking someone. He needs to be interrupted immediately as Leap+a few ticks of Force Choke will kill anyone. I basically interrupt as soon as I see him jump.

 

For Kelsara maximizing DPS output is crucial as its easy to fall behind because of all the running around and add killing, and then wipe due to hard enrage (she sprints around and basically one shots your raid 1 by 1. You can kill her during this phase but its damn difficult).

 

thanks for reminding me about the choke, I'll add it in.

As for the DPS on Kelsara, we don't seem to have any problems and I don't recall ever hitting the enrage except when dps are down.

 

I'm confused as to why you don't have your DPS channel. We have our healers or tanks be the ones in the middle so that they can keep doing their job. We also deliberately fail the purple phase by taking time at the beginning to AoE the big adds, focus down the add you get for failing, and then finish the rest of phase 1. We've had a few times where this wasn't necessary though.

 

I guess its a matter of preference. Having a DPS in the middle means you can kill the adds quicker, but it means the tank or healer on the transition has to kill their sphere pretty quick (except for the first one obviously) so as to not slow down transitions. Also seems like melee DPS like sents are screwed for trying to get their sphere if they stand in the middle.

 

I dunno, if that's how you do it, obviously it works, but then I can say the same about having the DPS channel. Really the only thing that I guess you truly don't wanna do is pair up two DPS on the same color. I'd be hardpressed to believe two DPS could take down the datacores in time. Course I say that and I guess if you have two DPS on blue, and then pair up a tank and healer for yellow you could have all 4 DPS on datacores and finish the yellow phase in 30 seconds, but one healer and one tank for both big adds seems like it's pushing it.

 

I'm usually on the purple with a tank (?) channeling. I think what we do, in sequence, is 2 dps, heals+tank, dps+tank, dps+heals (I may be wrong), with the ranged always in the middle if possible. Having tanks in the middle instead of DPS makes it harder for them to taunt the add(s), I think.

There doesn't seem to be a problem with killing the orbs or the datacores that I've noticed, the tank and heals that aren't on duty usually help out. And most of the time we can burn down the Regulator before the other comes out so it isn't that much of a problem, and if their both up by the time phase switches, the other tank comes help.

[ArchangelLBC]

thanks for reminding me about the choke, I'll add it in.

As for the DPS on Kelsara, we don't seem to have any problems and I don't recall ever hitting the enrage except when dps are down.

 

We had problems at first, not sure why. Too much running around I think. Haven't had problems lately, but I think it can definitely be an issue. Push DPS and push DPS hard early (if you hit a second lightning field on Heired you're too slow) and push it big on kelsara when there are no adds. We usually save second inspiration for right after we kill the dread guard adds for max up time.

 

 

I'm usually on the purple with a tank (?) channeling. I think what we do, in sequence, is 2 dps, heals+tank, dps+tank, dps+heals (I may be wrong), with the ranged always in the middle if possible. Having tanks in the middle instead of DPS makes it harder for them to taunt the add(s), I think.

There doesn't seem to be a problem with killing the orbs or the datacores that I've noticed, the tank and heals that aren't on duty usually help out. And most of the time we can burn down the Regulator before the other comes out so it isn't that much of a problem, and if their both up by the time phase switches, the other tank comes help.

 

Nah there's no problem for the tank taunting. They only have to taunt the one that heads towards the channeler since the other add comes straight for the guy in the middle. No worries there.

 

We just mass AoE the regulators from the orange phase at the beginning of the purple phase, kill a datacore, deliberately fail purple if we have to (don't always have to, but that's our safety valve), and then kill last datacores. Having a DPS+Heals on the last phase to get the regulators down is not a bad idea tbh. We usually have both up on the phase change and tanks blow cooldowns then, healers expect then to be the big damage taken phase and DPS focus down the regulator that is at lowest health (one of the tanks is an ops lt. who marks the first regulator to come out).

 

This mostly came from ease of organization (pairing up each DPS with a healer or tank). Dunno that we'll change it now since the strat you use to win is often better than trying to learn a new way, but it's interesting to hear how others do it.

[Leira_Kheren]

the best guide i know around is this for BH: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1117292-1-5-Updated-Arsenal-Bounty-Hunter-Are-YOU-Doing-It-Right

 

The % alacrity you need depended on your personal lag / internet delay. With 60ms your need the 4% alacrity to come to a 1.5 gcd. If you have a higher average delay ypour should use the 7% alacrity spec. The reason behind is your personal decision making. The smoothest rotation does flow with the normal 1.5 second gcd. Because every cooldown can be broken down into it.

 

e.g.: If your ride the 7% alac, have around 30ms custom lag, then every Tracer cast needs 1.395 cast + 0.03 = ~1.4. You gain specificly 0.1 seconds time. With 15s between each rail shot you use about 6 Tracer. This way you will still have half a second cooldown on your next rail.

 

This way you may wait anyway or will use someething like rapid shots, because waiting means zero dps.

 

 

TL:DR: Adjust your specific specc to the average lag you have ingame to get to a 1.5 s gcd. Your overall rotation will feels smoother with less situaitions of waiting fraction of second for specific abilities.

 

 

If you want to go further and deeper I suggest my simulation BH: Still beta, but only because I lack testers

http://mmo-mechanics.com/swtor/forums/thread-1176-post-24930.html#pid24930

[ladwar]

I'm confused as to why you don't have your DPS channel. We have our healers or tanks be the ones in the middle so that they can keep doing their job. We also deliberately fail the purple phase by taking time at the beginning to AoE the big adds, focus down the add you get for failing, and then finish the rest of phase 1. We've had a few times where this wasn't necessary though.

 

i think im focusing to much on one part but for this part that my group has found to work out the best is to have the dps grouped together and get the first two colors. we have the dps spilt north and south one for each color. the next two color groups are tank/healer tank/healer with the tanks channeling. we get the orbs before channeling on all but the yellow tank(he picks up the boss and aoe his orb down). we don't fail any color.

[jesseleeca]

the best guide i know around is this for BH: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1117292-1-5-Updated-Arsenal-Bounty-Hunter-Are-YOU-Doing-It-Right

 

The % alacrity you need depended on your personal lag / internet delay. With 60ms your need the 4% alacrity to come to a 1.5 gcd. If you have a higher average delay ypour should use the 7% alacrity spec. The reason behind is your personal decision making. The smoothest rotation does flow with the normal 1.5 second gcd. Because every cooldown can be broken down into it.

 

e.g.: If your ride the 7% alac, have around 30ms custom lag, then every Tracer cast needs 1.395 cast + 0.03 = ~1.4. You gain specificly 0.1 seconds time. With 15s between each rail shot you use about 6 Tracer. This way you will still have half a second cooldown on your next rail.

 

This way you may wait anyway or will use someething like rapid shots, because waiting means zero dps.

 

 

TL:DR: Adjust your specific specc to the average lag you have ingame to get to a 1.5 s gcd. Your overall rotation will feels smoother with less situaitions of waiting fraction of second for specific abilities.

 

 

If you want to go further and deeper I suggest my simulation BH: Still beta, but only because I lack testers

http://mmo-mechanics.com/swtor/forums/thread-1176-post-24930.html#pid24930

 

Being a bit nitty-picky here, but in the guy's guide he said he uses, the BH equivalent of Reserve Powercell for DR.....no, you save it for FA since it's much more ammo regen efficient that way.

Edited February 12, 2013 by jesseleeca

[oaceen]

Being a bit nitty-picky here, but in the guy's guide he said he uses, the BH equivalent of Reserve Powercell for DR.....no, you save it for FA since it's much more ammo regen efficient that way.

 

actually, it doesn't matter at all which attack you use it on since they both cost 2 ammo

Edited February 12, 2013 by oaceen

[jesseleeca]

actually, it doesn't matter at all which attack you use it on since they both cost 2 ammo

 

There is a small difference, FA takes 3 secs, DR in instant (+GCD) which means FA gives you more time to regen.

[jesseleeca]

Added TFB to finish up raid guide, organized thread, and added dps section. Edited February 15, 2013 by jesseleeca

[jesseleeca]

Going to test out the changes for 2.0 once I can get my commando transferred to PTS, it's bugging and failing my transfer attempts now. Once I try it out I'll start updating.

[jesseleeca]

Started adding some impressions to the 2.0. Overall feeling +.

[ArchangelLBC]

It's gonna be an adjustment for sure, but not an insurmountable one. Plus now GR applies a full armor debuff for 45 seconds and gives full damage boost to DR with one cast. Not OMG amazing, but still, better than I expected.

[jesseleeca]

Updated with new info from official patch notes.

Will be adding more once the patch hits tomorrow.

Buff to DR. Long time since we've seen a buff to anything in gunnery.