Character Names, not a trivial problem.

[lollie]

We'd have the problem of people complaining about their unique last names instead. So, same problem, different cover. That wasn't my point to the other guy anyways, his statements were just full of complete ignorance in regards to everything regarding this game and MMOs in general.

 

No you'd have first name + surname being unique, which allows for many more possibilities, not just transferal of the unique name to surname like you're thinking.

[Primarch_PWnD]

While they didn't say it word for word, they did say they wanted to be the biggest MMO out there.

 

Secondly, they also said their original plan was to have only 1 server for each type: PvP, RP, etc but the technology wasn't ready for the launch.

 

So yeah, they did intend for everyone to be on the same server.

 

Third, 10 million sources of income are 10 million sources of income, it doesn't matter how they've made their characters, but they all need a name.

 

So your sig indicates that you have an RP side to you; are you trying to imply that there is only 1 person in the entire Star Wars universe named "Mike"? Was Luke Skywalker the very first "Luke" to ever exist?

 

If it were POSSIBLE to create a system whereby everyone was happy with their name, which has been shown in other MMOs to be entirely feasible, why wasn't that done?

 

This is what I'm talking about poor planning; asking the question, "can we make everyone happy with their identity?"

Edited November 24, 2012 by Primarch_PWnD

[Vandicus]

No you'd have first name + surname being unique, which allows for many more possibilities, not just transferal of the unique name to surname like you're thinking.

 

There are other issues tied to a system that allows players to have similar indicators. The mail system autofill would create a lot of player problems that would generate a mountain of CS work. The developers did mention they considered many of the options brought up to them(among them this particular suggestion and one regarding account based identification) and decided on unique first names per server, which has its own benefits and drawbacks. Ultimately, the decision made wasn't a terrible one or one that should be maligned as such. The drawbacks experienced thus far from it could be at worse described as a minor inconvenience, use ASCII or other workarounds if the name is so critical to a person's character.

[Vandicus]

While they didn't say it word for word, they did say they wanted to be the biggest MMO out there.

 

Secondly, they also said their original plan was to have only 1 server for each type: PvP, RP, etc but the technology wasn't ready for the launch.

 

So yeah, they did intend for everyone to be on the same server.

 

Third, 10 million sources of income are 10 million sources of income, it doesn't matter how they've made their characters, but they all need a name.

 

So your sig indicates that you have an RP side to you; are you trying to imply that there is only 1 person in the entire Star Wars universe named "Mike"? Was Luke Skywalker the very first "Luke" to ever exist?

 

If it were POSSIBLE to create a system whereby everyone was happy with their name, which has been shown in other MMOs to be entirely feasible, why wasn't that done given everything in my post 2-posts up?

 

Seriously, take a look at any of their projections made pre-launch. 2 million was their high upside estimate. The amount of servers at launch, even with the staggering, were set up to take somewhat more than 1 million people. To suggest they plan around that which they expect to be unlikely(an expectation that has thus far proven true) is silly. I don't think I'm going to be shot tommorow, I mean it could happen, but am I going to go around wearing a bullet proof vest?

 

Its not 10 million sources of income. Nor are all sources of income for WoW equal. A long-term subscription nets them only about 66% of what a month to month subscription does, sometimes even less. The dollars per unit of the supposed 10 million subscriptions is unknown. It is ultimately irrelevant to their earnings, which are readily available. They are part of a publicly traded company after all. The number 10 million though is simply used for PR purposes.

 

No, I'm not an RPer in MMOs. Not sure what your point is supposed to be there anyways. You trying to say that anyone should be able to have any name? That's a system that can be done but has its own drawbacks. The system they ended up going with hasn't been a huge problem.

[Primarch_PWnD]

The drawbacks experienced thus far from it could be at worse described as a minor inconvenience, use ASCII or other workarounds if the name is so critical to a person's character.

 

This system hasn't been a big problem FOR YOU. If the name issue isn't important to you, why are you on here staunchly defending a point of view that doesn't matter to you?

 

It's obviously very important to some of us. A name is an identity, it's the first thing people know about you when they meet you. IRL some of us take first-impressions very seriously (typically the more sucessful individual), and a name is very important. You don't see brokers on Wall Street naming their kids "Lemonjello", because they have a sense of presenting an appropriate impression.

 

While this may be a game, it's a Role-Playing game. This is a very imprtant distinction which matters when talking about things like names.

Edited November 24, 2012 by Primarch_PWnD

[Vandicus]

If the name issue isn't important to you, why are you on here staunchly defending a point of view that doesn't matter to you?

 

It's obviously very important to some of us. A name is an identity, it's the first thing people know about you when they meet you. IRL some of us take first-impressions very seriously (typically the more sucessful individual), and a name is very important. You don't see brokers on Wall Street naming their kids "Lemonjello", because they have a sense of presenting an appropriate impression.

 

While this may be a game, it's a Role-Playing game. This is a very imprtant distinction which matters when talking about things like names.

 

I'm defending the point of view that is most utilitarian. Its currently very easy to identify players in this game by their character names. Account ID based is an extremely inconvenient one to work with, and unique surname+first name combos is at the least moderately inconvenient for players(and quite a bit for CS).

 

You can use a work around with the current system. For all intents and purposes, you can pretty much keep your name. Changing to another system at this point is an absurd suggestion. Looking back and saying that they could've used another system, when none of the other systems can be said to be clearly superior is a wasteful form of ego stroking.

[lollie]

There are other issues tied to a system that allows players to have similar indicators. The mail system autofill would create a lot of player problems that would generate a mountain of CS work. The developers did mention they considered many of the options brought up to them(among them this particular suggestion and one regarding account based identification) and decided on unique first names per server, which has its own benefits and drawbacks. Ultimately, the decision made wasn't a terrible one or one that should be maligned as such. The drawbacks experienced thus far from it could be at worse described as a minor inconvenience, use ASCII or other workarounds if the name is so critical to a person's character.

 

If you'd actually read through this thread, you'd already know that people who enjoy names tend to regard use of ASCII and other workarounds as a fail name.

 

Also - other games use first name plus surname as unique name just fine (even the f2p GW2 manages this) so a big budget game like SWTOR was pre-launch had no excuse for not researching and working around the issue.

 

Especially given the pre-launch players cautioned them about this very thing.

Edited November 24, 2012 by lollie

[Vandicus]

If you'd actually read through this thread, you'd already know that people who enjoy names tend to regard use of ASCII and other workarounds as a fail name.

 

Also - other games use first name plus surname as unique name just fine (even the f2p GW2 manages this) so a big budget game like SWTOR was pre-launch had no excuse for not researching and working around the issue.

 

Especially given the pre-launch players cautioned them about this very thing.

 

That's because you selectively ignore the drawbacks. The pre-launch players have suggested everything under the sun. Attempting to use them as some wise guide of what should be done is patently ridiculous. The pre-launch playerbase no doubt also suggested the very system that is currently implemented.

[lollie]

snip

 

Other games manage it, so do players.

[Vandicus]

Other games manage it, so do players.

 

Seems this game and its players are managing it just fine. Honestly all those other systems should change to be just like ours. It is the 2nd most subbed MMO currently after all.

[MariaD]

Did they really expect 5 million people to be able to come up with 5 million unique names, and then a unique name for each of their alts?

 

It's literally impossible with a 26 letter alphabet to come up with 5 million unique, pronouncable, tolerable-sounding names (don't forget, they've also blocked out the names of many of the NPCs they've got in the game too).

 

This math is off. Because of servers. And because of the number of combinations out of 26 letters.

[MariaD]

Thus, my character Shein would be Shein@vego_mohenjo while someone else's would be Shein@someothername. Both characters would have the name Shein, but as far as the game server is concerned, they would be unique by virtue of their account suffix.

 

How would that fit with the current grouping mechanic if both of them go, say, to the same WZ? Two problems here.

 

First, it would not fit into the character limit on the current name plates in raid windows. So a big UI change would be needed.

 

Second problem is telling who's who at a glance. When people read, they usually read the first few letters only and go by that. For example, if I am running behind a couple of people in a WZ, I need to decide, very quickly, which of them to target for guarding or healing or interceding. I target from the raid window, especially if there are like 10 people in that one square meter in front of me. I need to look at the name in the field and then to quickly find it in the raid window. If I have to read too many characters for that to happen, people will die.

 

I have already planned a way to "cope," but I'm waiting to see if my efforts to get access to my names have a result. As far as I can tell, the characters sitting on my names have, with one exception, never been played. If the accounts of those players are inactive, perhaps they will reinstate my names for me. Doesn't hurt to ask.

I think I heard of some people getting names in such circumstances. Hope it works out for you!

Edited November 24, 2012 by MariaD
typo

[Vego_Mohenjo]

How would that fit with the current grouping mechanic if both of them go, say, to the same WZ? Two problems here.

 

First, it would not fit into the character limit on the current name plates in raid windows. So a big UI change would be needed.

 

Second problem is telling who's who at a glance. When people read, they usually read the first few letters only and go by that. For example, if I am running behind a couple of people in a WZ, I need to decide, very quickly, which of them to target for guarding or healing or interceding. I target from the raid window, especially if there are like 10 people in that one square meter in front of me. I need to look at the name in the field and then to quickly find it in the raid window. If I have to read too many characters for that to happen, people will die.

 

 

I think I heard of some people getting names in such circumstances. Hope it works out for you!

 

In games that use this system, the account suffix would only be visible if you want it to be. The raid window would show only the character name. Of course, if there were several people with the same name in that window, it might be a little confusing, but I don't think people really pay much attention to the names there, just the stats (eg. If I'm healing, I don't look at the names, just the health bars).

 

Beyond that, I don't think anything else would be necessary. I don't think it would change anything.

[Surakis]

In all honesty, I don't think that's unfair. However, there's two things about that. First, my account wasn't inactive because I quit. I suspended it temporarily for external reasons. If they had contacted me to let me know what was going to happen, I could have reactivated, even temporarily to deal with the situation. The other thing is what I mentioned a moment ago, that my names have been awarded to seemingly inactive accounts.

 

Your game was inactive... it really doesn't matter why. Why should BW have reached out to you and found out why you were special instead of giving the name up to someone who was currently paying?

 

You do feel entitled to actually think that they should have reached out to you as if you had some "ownership" on a character name that's not even unique....

[Surakis]

It's not self serving. Even if this weren't an issue now (and it is), it will only get worse. Names are a limited resource. As names get taken (and often abandoned by free to play players who are here just to try the game out), there will be fewer options for further new players.

 

As for what's considered insignificat, that's not up to us. Personally, considering the game's track record, I don't think any number insignificant. One player lost over this is too many. If making the changes I and others have suggested avoids the loss of customers, then it's not a waste of resources. Quite the opposite, in fact.

 

It is self serving. You're here only offering "solutions" because you want your own personal issue fixed.... for god's sake, at least be honest about it!

[Vego_Mohenjo]

Your game was inactive... it really doesn't matter why. Why should BW have reached out to you and found out why you were special instead of giving the name up to someone who was currently paying?

 

You do feel entitled to actually think that they should have reached out to you as if you had some "ownership" on a character name that's not even unique....

 

You're right, it doesn't matter why my account was inactive, but it would still have been a courteous thing to do to send out a mass email to all former subscribers, giving them a chance to resubscribe before something like this was implemented. It wouldn't have taken much to do. It might not have helped, either. In fact, it may have exacerbated the problem.

[Vego_Mohenjo]

It is self serving. You're here only offering "solutions" because you want your own personal issue fixed.... for god's sake, at least be honest about it!

 

If it was only my personal issue it would be self serving, but it isn't just about me. There have been many threads started by others and many people in this very thread who have echoed my concern. And again, in time this is going to affect everyone. Eventually, it will become so difficult to find a name that no one will be able to join the game. It's already begun.

 

Certainly, I want my own issue fixed, but suggesting it's only my problem is incredibly short sighted.

[MajikMyst]

I was in the beta.. My account has never been suspended for any reason.. I have had all 6 of my names since their creation during early release..

 

I have kept all 6 of my names, through all the transfers.. I have not lost a single 1..

 

That being said, my wife who has also been playing since early release, has lost 2 of her names..

 

I fail to see why people QQ about the names they use in video games.. I credit much to not losing my names to simply creativity..

 

One of the names my wife lost was one of the names that was randomnly generated by the game.. She just happened to like it..

 

Having said all this.. I would like to point out a few simple facts..

 

When you started playing this game is irrelevent..

Whether or not you were in the beta is irrelevent..

If you account was inactive at time of transfer to another server, then that is your fault and nobody else's..

It doesn't matter why your account was inactive.. You were not a paying customer..

Bioware should not be expected to notify you of anything when your account is inactive..

You keeping informed on what is going on is YOUR responsibility..

You don't need to be a subscriber to read the forums.. Only to post in them..

Yes.. This is a trivial issue..

 

I am aware that Bioware did take certain things into consideration when it came to dealing with duplicate names during the last transfer to the mega servers.. I am not aware of what system they use, but have read a lot of speculation.. Anything from how long a person has had the name to how many names they have lost previously.. I am not sure if any of that has been confirmed..

 

I am sorry you lost your names.. But like my wife, you are just going to have to make new ones.. It isn't a big deal.. This is just a video game.. If losing a character name in a video game is such an earth shattering event, then perhaps you shouldn't play video games.. I would also consider seeking therapy..

 

Just my view of this issue..

Edited November 24, 2012 by MajikMyst

[MariaD]

Of course, if there were several people with the same name in that window, it might be a little confusing, but I don't think people really pay much attention to the names there, just the stats (eg. If I'm healing, I don't look at the names, just the health bars).

 

Beyond that, I don't think anything else would be necessary. I don't think it would change anything.

 

When I PvP, I pay attention to names a lot. I mostly PvP on my Juggernaut, who needs to guard or intercede or do other things to/around people that depend on who surrounds them. So basically, I need to quickly look at nameplates in the field and THEN target in the list of names. I can't go by health bar alone. There may be an alternative way of doing what I do, but as I am playing now, I very strongly prefer to be able to tell who is who in about .3 seconds or less. I read everybody's names while waiting for the WZ to start, and try to link them to the positioning in the raid window. What you propose would mess up these actions.

 

I am less concerned about the mail system also mentioned, because there is no time factor. I am happy to mail stuff slower than now and to read more carefully. Even if I accidentally vendored my shield yesterday (no time pressure, just absent-mindedness). People with reading or typing issues may dislike the mail change too.

[Sotof]

It is self serving. You're here only offering "solutions" because you want your own personal issue fixed.... for god's sake, at least be honest about it!

Yeah, because it is so self-serving to do something for more than just yourself... Oh wait.

[Vinjar]

I hate it when Sephiroph (or however you spell it) is taken.

[legbamel]

If you'd actually read through this thread, you'd already know that people who enjoy names tend to regard use of ASCII and other workarounds as a fail name.

 

Also - other games use first name plus surname as unique name just fine (even the f2p GW2 manages this) so a big budget game like SWTOR was pre-launch had no excuse for not researching and working around the issue.

 

Especially given the pre-launch players cautioned them about this very thing.

I've read the whole thread up to this point and have yet to see anyone point out that this is what they've done, but in reverse. You have a given and a surname, and one of them must be unique. For SWTOR it's your given name and you can share your surname with half the rest of the server. But once you hit legacy your characters all have surnames, regardless of how your choose to display them on the screen.

 

The trick is that they planned for these surnames but they can't have identical given names because, until they hit legacy, new players haven't got one. In order to allow duplicate given names they'd have to extend the legacy system to character creation or create a third "middle" name that all of us would have to add to our existing characters.

 

This all seems like water under the bridge, to me. I have one toon that kept her original name. The rest gained shiny new apostrophes except one that got a better name entirely. I don't see more server mergers any time soon and I hardly think voluntary (presumably paid) transfers would convey naming priority. Yes, I'd be upset if I lost that one, unique name, partly because it's been my on-line identity since before MMOs were a thing, but I can refer to my characters in my head any way I like. She'd just have to go under cover and assume a new identity.

[Horseshoekrab]

You could have been born with a debilitating physical condition. You could have been born in North Korea. You could have been born in a country that has a mandatory death sentence for being a member of the wrong ethnic/religious/sexual orientation group.

 

Get over it. Its a NAME. In a COMPUTER GAME.

[Sotof]

You could have been born with a debilitating physical condition. You could have been born in North Korea. You could have been born in a country that has a mandatory death sentence for being a member of the wrong ethnic/religious/sexual orientation group.

 

Get over it. Its a NAME. In a COMPUTER GAME.

Invalid argument is invalid.

[shammancz]

the argument is actually prety valid .... IAM A NERD, HEAR ME ROAR!!!! ... do you people realize this is a internet videogame rite?