Hitting 50 makes me want to quit

[Skorz]

Because TOR has engame PvE (atleasts trying to) whereas GW2 doesn't have to worry about that.

 

Plus it's an mmo. Progression is part of the game. It's one of the reason people stop playing as much when they get fully geared. Half my guild is doing alts most of the time now since "playing main outside of guild rated runs doesnt really make sense atm that we're decked".

 

And this is why disney themepark games like SWTOR will always fail in the end because of gear progression and the same crap they make without trying anything new. This is one of the reasons you need sandbox elements in your MMO too. Hybrid MMO is the future.

Edited August 10, 2012 by Skorz

[boobaffet]

pvp reward should provide stat customization and appearence customization not straight advantage over someone.

[aeterno]

And this is why disney themepark games like SWTOR will always fail in the end because of gear progression and the same crap they make without trying anything new. This is one of the reasons you need sandbox elements in your MMO too. Hybrid MMO is the future.

 

The very fact there are 2 different ways of engame as is now is the problem. These "themepark games" are already a hybrid. A pve pvp hybrid. Sandbox/themepark really have nothing to do with this.

 

The problem is in pve raiding endgame you want the process of acquiring BIS gear to be quite a bit longer than in PvP where you want a reasonably fast way that still retains the balance between a sense of progression and being competitive. And yes, people in mmos like reasonable progression. So do mmo pvp players. Millions of us. It's what RPGs are about, among other things. I don't want an RPG experince where I get BIS handed to me and that's that. I don't even use the OP preorder bonus items they ship their RPGs off with cos what's the bloody point of playing an RPG if you start off with the BIS shield and sword.

 

TOR didnt launch with expertise mind you. I'm not saying it wasn't convenient, being able to do top raids in my battlemaster stuff, but I kinda understood why they changed it when half the raid was BM decked cos even with loot bags being random it was still the fastest way to get top tier gear.

Edited August 10, 2012 by aeterno

[AstralProjection]

Errr dude, I have Healed Denova SM in full War Hero, and Even KP HM in Battlemaster......

 

Expertise should not be in the game...

 

Its common knowledge that Battle-master is better than Tionese or any Daily rewards. And it is not hard to get. So yes PVPers can get there gear and come do PVE stuff...

 

But that is not the case with PVE to PVP....Recruit gear is like being given Level 45 green gear and being told to Tank EV HM.....It aint gonna happen. Its also common knowledge that PVP relics are BIS for dps and healers in PVE, I got mine in 6 Warzones, to get the best PVE one i have to grind 200 daily comms...

 

Now tell me PVP does not interfere with PVE.

 

Only problem with that statement is that you admitted that Battlemaster gear is easy to get. Which it is, very, very easy.

 

I'm all for removing the gear gap - real PVPers don't need an advantage, but honestly, this crying about losing at level 50 has been going on since the game launched, and it's kind of sad how lazy everyone is.

 

Suck it up, PVP for a week, get your Battlemaster gear. It's shockingly easy, and once you have BM gear, Augment it, and you're basically the same thing as a War Hero minus a small amount of expertise and other stats. If you can't take losing sometimes, well, you mustn't have a lot of PVP experience, because that's what will happen.

 

I'm playing a Sage in recruit gear right now - yeah, it's painful, and I explode in three hits if someone looks at me. That just means I have to use my brain when I play, and maybe respec for a little while to something more useful until I get my BM gear.

 

Don't expect to play a DPS class and do anything in recruit gear...respec to healer or tank, protect a player who CAN kill people, and earn easy commendations until you're geared out in BM. It will happen quickly.

[Blackardin]

OP has come to a point in the game where he will have to start making his own way and own fun and now he hates it.

 

This is as good an example of the problem with gamers today. They are incapable of creating their own fun in a video game and require it to be spoon fed to them or they experience frustration and a sense of loss. The game feeds that need up until 50. At fifty one must begin to do for themselves, find a guild, join raids, do PvP.....and that is when we hear the majority of complaints in this game "nothing to do at 50".

 

There is plenty to do at 50. There is just no spoon feeding at that level.

[floriwie]

OP is completely right...

 

I am in a BM/Recruit with WH MH combination....

 

In a match, I encountered with a, so called, squishy Sith Assassin Deception with 19K HP (most probably augmented full WH), he killed me from full health (15.5K) in 4 GCD in the same time I guess I can cause him 3K damage or so with my nornal rotation....

 

Most probably, he popped up Expertise Adrenaline, 2xVoltaic Thrash, Recklessness, Shock, Discharge then I was gone...

 

I mean if I can cause only 3K damage to this guy with my War Hero gun with my normal rotation, how can close the 15K difference with my talents, I am a sniper, I can't kite him, I am slow like turtle, I have only a ****** 3 Def CD against Melee attacks and %20 damage mitigation for 20s and 4s stun....

 

I mean is this game about the guy behind the keyboard or about gear? My rotation will deliver normally a guy in 10-49 bracket 8K-10K damage in 4 GCD....is it ok that guy can face roll me because he is PVPing 3 months longer then me....

 

Is it any fun for him?

Edited August 10, 2012 by floriwie

[Skorz]

There is plenty to do at 50. There is just no spoon feeding at that level.

 

Like what? This game has no sandbox elements like player housing, free space exploration and even exploring planets gets really dull since all the planets are so linear. You could say that Hoth is pretty open but it is not.. it is split to 4 parts. Only thing I can think of is roleplaying but not everyone enjoys that.

Edited August 10, 2012 by Skorz

[Blackardin]

Like what? This game has no sandbox elements like player housing, free space exploration and even exploring planets gets really dull since all the planets are so linear. You could say that Hoth is pretty open but it is not.. it is split to 4 parts. Only thing I can think of is roleplaying but not everyone enjoys that.

 

Have you completed all raids through nightmare mode? Do you have all datacrons. Have you maxed out your codex entries, gone back and taken in all that you passed while rushing to 50? Have you totally explored every square inch of every planet? Have you maxed your tradeskills, completed all space missions, done all dailies, earned enough to open all legacy, maxed out your pvp gear and completed all aspects of such. Are your companions maxed in gear and crafting and ready for the next expansion. How many alts do you have at 50? Are you in a guild? Has that guild done any guild events?

 

I'm going to guess that you will answer no to 80% of that, which is what I am talking about.

[Skuhld]

Ofc the OP is right. Bring on GW2!

[tgjohnson]

This is not a suggestion post, so don't place it there. It's a *** is going on with the future of this game post. I've been a fanboy of this game but just recently started aqcuiring 50s. And what I've found out is the game suddenly stops. I mostly PVP so I know I am missing a whole lot, but it's what I enjoy. The 10-49 bracket was an absolute blast and I had fun every single match. But at 50... BLAH. The second you enter your first 50 match, ROFLSTOMPED. Even with crappy Recruit gear on. So you start your painful grind for a few measley WZ commendations per match, but you encounter endless ranked war heroes and conquerors in gear a billion time better than your own.

 

I have literally sat behind a scoundrel who didn't run and just went to town dpsing him and I couldn't make his HP budge. And in the 10-49 bracket I was always top dps. There was no one else healing him either. He would just throw on a heal or two and be back at full health. It's just ridiculous when it comes to the massive gap between new 50's and geared 50's. I'm sorry, but PVPing should be fun but when you hit 50 it's just not. Not to mention all the jerks who talk crap to you and laugh/spit when you can't take them down but you keep trying.

 

It's just demeaning and demoralizing. I know people say HANG IN THERE but really why should a player suffer this much? It seems like so many other games do PVP better, so why am I even wasting my time? There is no other way to get WZ commendations either. At least give us some other means to grind out some WZ comms when the queues aren't popping late at night or we just get tired of dealing with jerks, organized teams, and players who can 2-shot you.

 

Tell me again, why can't we have PVP SPACE BATTLES? I was really hoping for something reminiscent of Battlefront II when I got this game, but instead I got StarFox space battles on rails. Once you finish the objectives you can literally walk away and not touch the controls and still win the mission. Come on Bioware, I've got two accounts with you, pre-ordered the game in July 2011, and been on your side every step of the way, but I am just worn out and not having fun anymore.

 

Tell me Bioware, why should I keep paying and playing? Give me something to really get excited for! Whatcha got?! By the way, yes I am QQing. If you don't have QQs over some aspect of this game, then you are probably spending all your time trolling the forums instead of playing it.

 

Boxers don't complain when they get beat by someone who has been training longer and harder and is in much better physical shape than they are. Do they just quit boxing, or do they put in the time necessary to be on a level playing field with their competition?

[HuggyTheBear]

What i would like to see is.....

1. pvp gear(with reduced stats, expertise stays the same)

2. Pve Gear(bonus of 5-30% dmg to npc's along with dmg reduction and healing bonuses)

 

 

If their gunna make pve and pvp 2 different worlds then the gear they would wear in it should go null if lets say, pvp armor in pve fp/ops should be weaken. Or something of that nature.

[Achyllis]

Have you completed all raids through nightmare mode? Do you have all datacrons. Have you maxed out your codex entries, gone back and taken in all that you passed while rushing to 50? Have you totally explored every square inch of every planet? Have you maxed your tradeskills, completed all space missions, done all dailies, earned enough to open all legacy, maxed out your pvp gear and completed all aspects of such. Are your companions maxed in gear and crafting and ready for the next expansion. How many alts do you have at 50? Are you in a guild? Has that guild done any guild events?

 

I'm going to guess that you will answer no to 80% of that, which is what I am talking about.

 

So to be clear then join a raiding guild, quit your job and dedicate yourself fully to repeating content once you have explored the factionally accessible locations on each planet. Oh yes, and roll alts. And pay a sub to do this.

 

So much for casuals and welcome to f2p.

 

So much for the next generation in immersive story driven content.

 

To be fair - this raid/gear focused "end game" is driving the whole genre into the ground. This game was made for where the market was 5 years ago. Oops.

[Skorz]

Have you completed all raids through nightmare mode? Do you have all datacrons. Have you maxed out your codex entries, gone back and taken in all that you passed while rushing to 50? Have you totally explored every square inch of every planet? Have you maxed your tradeskills, completed all space missions, done all dailies, earned enough to open all legacy, maxed out your pvp gear and completed all aspects of such. Are your companions maxed in gear and crafting and ready for the next expansion. How many alts do you have at 50? Are you in a guild? Has that guild done any guild events?

 

I'm going to guess that you will answer no to 80% of that, which is what I am talking about.

 

I didn't mention anything about raids and datacrons on purpose because those are things I don't enjoy doing and space missions? pleeeeease.. I would do love to do space missions but not with the current kid edition space system that gets boring after 2 min of playing. Almost everything you listed for me is grind oriented repetitive themepark stuff.

Edited August 10, 2012 by Skorz

[Bomyne]

Unfortunately, We may never get a Jump to lightspeed style expansion. I'd love one but The game has gone free to play.

[Skorz]

To be fair - this raid/gear focused "end game" is driving the whole genre into the ground. This game was made for where the market was 5 years ago. Oops.

 

^ This.

[Bomyne]

To be fair - this raid/gear focused "end game" is driving the whole genre into the ground. This game was made for where the market was 5 years ago. Oops.

 

I agree.

[Nyoro]

Except for the fact that most of what you said is wrong, your right.

 

Its about numbers. BW has said they do in fact have things in place that try and place premades against premades when possible, but guess what? Most of the time that's not possible. Most of the time there are not 2 premades from opposite factions queuing up at roughly the same time. So it makes the premade wait a few and lo and behold they get put in against a non-premade.

 

Best way to beat premades? Make one yourself.

 

The numbers are completely irrelevant. Premades should always face premades and pugs should face pugs, it's not rocket science. You can't seriously expect the casual players to be forced to create coordinated premades just so they can have a little fun in warzones. You wouldn't put a Premier league football team up against a local pub team and I see no reason why this should be any different in an MMO.

 

If BioWare had implemented cross server battlegrounds and premade queuing then they wouldn't have this mess to deal with.

 

Whats the alternative? Make them wait until another premade comes along (IF another premade comes along) so that people get sick of waiting in a grp and just go back to solo, thus making premades virtually non-existant?

 

Better to alienate a small group of players(the premade crew) as opposed to almost every fresh level 50 that faces them. Casual players are the lifeblood of MMO's and if you piss them off then you're going to make no money.(as BioWare is starting to discover.)

[Skorz]

Boxers don't complain when they get beat by someone who has been training longer and harder and is in much better physical shape than they are. Do they just quit boxing, or do they put in the time necessary to be on a level playing field with their competition?

 

So what you really are suggesting is that player skill -> gear, am I rite? The longer you train, the better you get at boxing. Yeah seems logical and I can agree with you that PvP stats are pointless.. that is if you really meant that and I doubt it

[Valkirus]

You are exactly right, Sir! I also work a lot and have a family to take care of. Sometimes I just can't get on until really late and by then the queues just aren't popping. I really wish there was an alternate way to grind out WZ comms. Why would people care anyways because a skilled player in all War Hero who PVP'd for it all will still always beat an unskilled player in all War Hero gear who grinded it out on PVE content.

 

Afterall, PVP gear can be used to do PVE content, so why not allow PVE content to get PVP gear? Maybe then we'd have more people getting involved in PVP? I'm sorry but by forcing level 50's to get ROFLSTOMPED in recruit gear for weeks/months until they can get War Hero gear is just going to keep so many people away. Like I said, it's just not fun and therefore lots of people will just not do it at all.

 

Did they ever add the cross server LFG for PVP? I thought they did. I donot PVP in TOR and in fact have only played maybe for 2 hrs the last 2 months..so I would'nt know. I do wish MMO's would get away from this seperate stat for PVP crap. I understand the reasonings for it, but it usually means in any type of open world pvp, a pvp stat geared player is going to own you if all you have is pve gear.

[Nyoro]

Boxers don't complain when they get beat by someone who has been training longer and harder and is in much better physical shape than they are. Do they just quit boxing, or do they put in the time necessary to be on a level playing field with their competition?

 

That's a terrible analogy. Boxers are divided by weight classes Featherweight, Lightweight, middleweight and finally heavyweight. Depending on the weight of the boxer they are faced against opponents of the same weight.(the level playing field) The only variables after that are the boxers skill and physical conditioning.

 

If we're going to compare PvP to boxing then fresh 50's would be in the featherweight class and War Hero premades would be in the heavyweight class.

[Kaonis]

This is the exact reason I gave up on PVP when my characters hit 50. It's just plain not fun, I go in with recruit gear and get stomped by geared people. 10-49 was fun because it was based more on skill then gear, but the second you hit 50 the full war hero guys will just destroy you every time. Far too often I've seen 3 vs 1 where the 1 is in war hero and the 3 aren't and that one war hero just demolishes 3 guys while still being at enough health to roll a few others.

 

Expertise is the bane of the game. Now it wouldn't be so bad if say you got a little for getting war heros gear. But in the amount we get now the differences are just too drastic. Whenever I do randomly try a 50 match, if we see a team with war hero gear and we don't have it, the people on my team commit to just quitting and trying to farm medals since they already declared we lost, because we're tired of getting rolled.

[Technohic]

Eh. I probably will out-level Voss on my sniper because I learned after my first toon and am sitting at level 47 with 1500 ranked WZ comms and I don't plan on doing anything but PvP until I cap that then cap my regular comms, or I hit level 50. Whichever comes first. Won't get me everything I need, but it should get me something to soften the entry.

[belizar]

well it is WoW in space they got resi so SWTOR had to copy it why does WoW suc in pvp yes thats right resi (and the unblanced classes)

 

wow lvling is more fun pvping with 0 resi soon as u hit 70 its meh <can get full resi gear at 70 yes i kno max is 85

same way SWTOR was fun to lvl pvp other than the mess that is the game engine

[Ianosm]

So according to the OP and many others there should be no reward for me having sat through hours of war zones and put in the effort over someone who has just hit 50?

By the same token I should therefore expect to be handed a set of gear at 50 for PVE so I can go on HM ops right away? Oh whats that? No I can't? I have to grind dailies for gear, columi, rakata etc or else groups won't take me. Well how about that...

 

The reason people in war hero gear do well is because they put in the time to get it. You say it takes no effort to get it at the same time you complain about being stomped in war zones. Well guess what, those same war hero players got stomped but they didn't come on a forum to whine, they stuck at it and got the rewards.

 

Has anyone also considered that being undergeared and fighting higher geared players is a fantastic way of improving your skill in pvp? It literally forces you to scramble to stay alive. If everyone was handed gear with little to no effort to achieve it, the zones would be full of inexperienced pvpers and I guarantee you would be on here complaining about how the teams you are in are full of idiots.

 

In short, you are given a set of recruit gear, it's not that hard to get battlemaster and be competitive and then just put in the effort and get war hero and enjoy the fruits of your labour. There is nothing unfair about a system that rewards effort, we all live in it!

[belizar]

So according to the OP and many others there should be no reward for me having sat through hours of war zones and put in the effort over someone who has just hit 50?

By the same token I should therefore expect to be handed a set of gear at 50 for PVE so I can go on HM ops right away? Oh whats that? No I can't? I have to grind dailies for gear, columi, rakata etc or else groups won't take me. Well how about that...

 

QUOTE]

 

sorry but with the new lvl cap SOONtm your gear grinding for HOURS means nothing either lol welcome to MMO's