CelticMarauder Posted August 2, 2012 Share Posted August 2, 2012 (edited) I'm speaking here of the quest line involving Thana Vesh and Darth Gravus. I'm adding a filler sentence here to prevent words from the spoiler box being shown when mousing over the thread title. At the end of the quest line, you have the option to kill Thana. The only problem I see is, killing her is a dark side choice. I know Bioware considers virtually every decision to kill someone in conversation as a dark sided action. But it just doesn't make any sense at all in this context. If you commit the "light side" choice of letting the sadistic mass-murderer leave, you are directly responsible for the countless people that will suffer and/or die at her hands. This isn't some abstract question over whether or not to commit a small evil to ensure a greater good. She is literally guaranteed to cause more suffering and death, and you and your character know this. In fact, I'd go so far as to suggest that the light side action here is far and away more dark sided than the dark side choice. Agree? Disagree? Please post with your response. Edited August 2, 2012 by CelticMarauder To prevent words from the spoiler box from appearing in the preview of the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raltar Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 This is the only dark side choice I take on my light side empire characters. Worth it, imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan_Loto Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 I agree completely. Then again, this is the case for a lot of the moral choices in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohmygah Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Light Side generally = preserving life. Dark side generally = taking away life. If you don't look at light as necessarily "good" (whether morally or otherwise) and dark side necessarily as "bad," it's a lot easier to make sense of the alignments attached to the decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuixupu Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 There have definitely been some instances where killing someone was light side... but the only one I can think of at the moment is Killing Watcher X in the Agent storyline was lightside, letting him live was dark side AS for Thana... I think it's more about your motivation for killing her, and the timing. In the context of the story it's not you being noble and saving the galaxy from her evil, it's more like, "yeah, you're annoying, thanks for your help but I'm going to enjoy killing you now". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bright_ephemera Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 The "LS is preserve life, DS is take it" is staggeringly short-sighted. I think, though I don't recall the details, that I once saw a DS/LS choice that was "kill the prisoner here, or walk out and let the other guy kill him. Knowing, 100% sure, that the other guy is going to kill him." "I didn't pull the trigger myself" is close to an ironclad moral defense as far as the Force is concerned. Which freaks me out, but then, LS/DS isn't quite Western morality as we know it. I think "take Thana Vesh prisoner" would've counted as LS, but you don't get that option; it's all "Use her and kill her because that's all she's good for" (DS) or "use her and let her free because you're not responsible for her crimes anyway" (LS). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuffystuffs Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 There have definitely been some instances where killing someone was light side... but the only one I can think of at the moment is Killing Watcher X in the Agent storyline was lightside, letting him live was dark side AS for Thana... I think it's more about your motivation for killing her, and the timing. In the context of the story it's not you being noble and saving the galaxy from her evil, it's more like, "yeah, you're annoying, thanks for your help but I'm going to enjoy killing you now". That's pretty much the problem...the game is assuming character motivation and dishing out LS/DS accordingly. I had the same issue with the Watcher X decision. My LS agent spared him as she felt sorry for him however the game is assuming she's doing it to get dirt on Imperial Intelligence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pubsam Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 I suppose that there could have been three options. LS - let her live. DS - kill her for fun/she annoys you/to destroy a fellow Sith, etc. neutral (perhaps) - kill her because she's too dangerous and crazy to let live. The last is not LS because honestly, there will never be a LS decision where you actively kill someone. On the whole though I don't think that neutral option makes a lot of sense for Empire side. You meet crazy Sith every day who are every bit as bloodthirsty as Thana, yet are probably not incompetent like her and have way more power. And you happily take side quests from them/interact with them civilly. As being part of Imperial society you are not supposed to see a Sith acting like a Sith as some moral outrage. My very LS agent took the opportunity to kill Thana since she always takes the opportunity to kill Sith when she can. But this is a DS side to her. She thinks she knows better what is best for the Empire and sees the Sith standing in the way. Killing them is not LS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreksOrden Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 (edited) Another confusing LS/DS reversal is in the trooper story...In chapter 3 you have to free Sergent jaxo from a detention center where an imperial ambush puts everyone at risk. you have the option of trying to rescue jaxo or letting her get shot into space. Ls is to let her die and Ds is to try and save her. also if you have elara out she gives +149 affection. sadistic psychopath! Edited August 3, 2012 by DreksOrden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreksOrden Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 on the subject of thana well... my Bh tried to get with her and almost succeeded but when he saved a transport from certain doom she got turned off. She later sent me money saying she hoped it would "make me more professional" no matter what the Ls Ds options are, Thana is one crazy *****. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bright_ephemera Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Another confusing LS/DS reversal is in the trooper story...In chapter 3 you have to free Sergent jaxo from a detention center where an imperial ambush puts everyone at risk. you have the option of trying to rescue jaxo or letting her get shot into space. Ls is to let her die and Ds is to try and save her. Which gets even weirder if you consider the Knight endgame...where when one of your companions (Kira, Doc, or Rusk) is in trouble and outnumbered during your final offensive, you can choose to go let the Emperor continue his power-gathering exercises preparatory to killing everything in the galaxy while you rescue the companion (LS) or you can focus on your mission and take out the Emperor as fast as you can because, you know, he's working on killing everything in the galaxy (DS). The trooper's LS/DS writing is relatively forgiving of the lesser evil and sets up a lot more scenarios where you do have to destroy something or let something be destroyed for the greater good. The JK is all "Failing to stop in the street to rescue that puppy is evil. Even when every puppy who ever lived will die in agony if you don't just get to the other side of the street already." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohmygah Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Taking Thana prisoner on what authority? This isn't the Republic. As for Watcher X... You DO kill him, but the decision is more about stopping him from escaping than outright killing him. Watcher X springs an ambush on you, not the other way around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pubsam Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Another confusing LS/DS reversal is in the trooper story...In chapter 3 you have to free Sergent jaxo from a detention center where an imperial ambush puts everyone at risk. you have the option of trying to rescue jaxo or letting her get shot into space. Ls is to let her die and Ds is to try and save her. also if you have elara out she gives +149 affection. sadistic psychopath! How is that confusing at all? Perhaps you didn't notice that if you save her, you are condemning hundreds of others to die. But if you save those other hundreds, you have to abandon Jaxo. Elara is not a sadistic psychopath (or she probably would've stayed Imp)! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreksOrden Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 How is that confusing at all? Perhaps you didn't notice that if you save her, you are condemning hundreds of others to die. But if you save those other hundreds, you have to abandon Jaxo. Elara is not a sadistic psychopath (or she probably would've stayed Imp)! Oh i diddnt realize that happens if you try to save jaxo. I still think that +149 affection for killing somebody does not speak well for elara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
undeadsithdread Posted August 4, 2012 Share Posted August 4, 2012 I'm speaking here of the quest line involving Thana Vesh and Darth Gravus. I'm adding a filler sentence here to prevent words from the spoiler box being shown when mousing over the thread title. At the end of the quest line, you have the option to kill Thana. The only problem I see is, killing her is a dark side choice. I know Bioware considers virtually every decision to kill someone in conversation as a dark sided action. But it just doesn't make any sense at all in this context. If you commit the "light side" choice of letting the sadistic mass-murderer leave, you are directly responsible for the countless people that will suffer and/or die at her hands. This isn't some abstract question over whether or not to commit a small evil to ensure a greater good. She is literally guaranteed to cause more suffering and death, and you and your character know this. In fact, I'd go so far as to suggest that the light side action here is far and away more dark sided than the dark side choice. Agree? Disagree? Please post with your response. killing her is dark side because your character want do it out that she is annoying and she is no longer useful to you not because he/she cares about other people lives. doing an evil act to evil person is still evil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts