Executive Producer Rich Vogel Bails on TOR

[Holden_Dissent]

Best thing is, all you have to do is buy the box, no subs. If you don't like it you return the game if you can. Make up some excuse. And you don't feel like you wasted extra money cause you didn't have to pay for that extra month before you could start playing.

 

I thought it was a P2Win game?

 

It's F2P with a cash shop right?

[Blackardin]

I've received a grand total of SEVEN infractions and a warning defending this game from the very beginning and you know what it's embarrassing. I've said so many times if Rift can do what it did in a short period of time SWTOR and Bioware can too, boy how wrong I was. So I'm letting my sub run out August, I wasn't even a hater I loved this game. But EA along with Bioware just don't know what they're doing

 

 

I feel your pain (or I should say, frustration). Been actively posting on game boards for almost 20 years, not a single warning. I have 12, plus the one's that I've deleted.

 

I love the game also, but I have to ask myself why I would patronize an establishment where the bouncers continually pour beer on my head....just because they've been given the power to do so?

 

As a business owner myself. I understand that there are people in this world that should never be put in charge of anything, and that all systems must be monitored in order to head off potential problems. Can't blame those doing the damage. You have to blame those that are allowing the damage to be done. As I've stated, small sign of a much greater management problem.

 

Anyway, I'm done trying to boost this game, and now questioning why I am investing my time in it. Like any one in a dysfunctional relationship, my eyes are starting to wander. LOL

[Leggomy]

I wonder is this where the borg (sorry I mean EA) assimilate Bioware. They did this with Origin Systems back in the day. EA put up the money to create Ultima Online. A lot of people do not know that EA owned OSI before UO was even in development. Without the money from the EA purchase it never would have been made. Not too long after they closed OSI's offices in Austin Tx and moved some people to Redwood CA and laid everyone else off. Edited July 18, 2012 by Leggomy

[ikemenn]

I thought it was a P2Win game?

 

It's F2P with a cash shop right?

 

there is no pay to win in gw2.

 

pvp gear and pve gear are separated from each other. and structured pvp can be entered by level 1 characters .. they get boosted to level 80 and can equip all level 80 gear, skills and upgrades for their class. EVERYONE has access to these weps, armor and upgrades. (good thing to try out new classes - like a preview of end game stats and gear) no advantages at all.

 

in gw2 you cant 'pay' to have a distinct advantage over other people who dont pay i.e. buy a Over the top weapon from the cash shop that can only be bought using the cash shop which decimates their opponents in pvp (as stated above everyone has access to the pvp gear and skills)

all end game gear basically have the same stats only difference would be your customization to the item (adding bleed effect, defence sigil, fire damage etc to items).

legendary items are for prestige only and cant be bought and does not have any over the top advantage or any adv at all. will only look so cool. the legendary warhammer lets you walk around like your covered in molten metal and leave molten metal tracks. like t1000 from terminator but would still have the same stats as the best level 80 weapon. or the rainbow unicorn bow. DEATH BY RAINBOW LOL

 

you use cash shop for items like, limited time party stats boost, increase critical pve drops, increase exp boost for a time, aesthetic items only, probably buy one of the 2000 color dyes available, server transfer, extra character slots you get the idea

 

so what if people pay for exp boost? some people say that is p2w.. how exactly? they play their own role playing character which has no direct impact to your character or in your gaming experience. in pvp everyone is boosted to level 80 and has access to all gear. if they get to level 80 first so what? when they enter low level areas, they are scaled to that area. they only keep their skills intact everything else is scaled down damage, armor and character level etc. so everything is still challenging and you can have somewhat of a challenge helping low level friends.

 

game has 8 dungeons IIRC. first dungeon is at level 30. each dungeon has 3 paths you can go through and each path has different bosses leading to the same final boss.

 

oh and get this, gw2 has monthly and even yearly contest and tournaments for structured pvp!! winners from each "world" then goes to the yearly tournament for a showdown for prizes IIRC. i dont see that from swtor..do you? it just makes me want to go pvp all day and polish my skills as ive got somewhat of a destination / goal at the end. not like in swtor. pvp all day then what? get war hero stuff? which i already got 2 full sets

Edited July 18, 2012 by ikemenn

[supremeaaron]

I'm sure we will learn more about the future of SWTOR during the EA earnings report for the First Quarter Fiscal Year 2013 on July 31st.

[Typeslice]

If they would have just re skinned SWG with newer graphics and re-released it, it would be 99999999x better then what we have now.

 

And would have 30k subs.

[Eillack]

*Yawn*

 

Old news is old.

 

We were made aware of himm stepping down for at least a week....the search function is not strong with this one.

 

And...I shouldn't even bother compating the doom and gloom...I actually play the game, so I know I have nothing ot worry.

[islander]

It seems strange there is no official word on this.

 

Almost like he left and didn't tell anyone and the community team are running round going I just read on the forums Rich left?????

 

Ultimately this spells the problem in this game, a lack of communication and slow updates and additional content. When are we going to see PvP returned to the open world more content and a reason to log in.

 

Oh, they knew. They were just keeping it on the down low. Just like when Georg left. This also happened, supposedly a few weeks ago and not 'this week' but Bioware was able to supress the internet for a little while.

Edited July 18, 2012 by islander

[Anzel]

He did the same thing with SWG

[islander]

He did the same thing with SWG

 

Yeah, and after that SWG went in the crapper.

 

Doesn't say much for the future of this game :/

[Dein_Cathair]

probably not a good thing

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/174300/SWTORs_executive_producer_leaves_BioWare_amid_layoff_reports.php

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/07/17/swtor-executive-producer-leaves-bioware-new-layoffs-rumored/

 

Thanks for everything chief! Hope this turns out to be more good news then bad.

 

I predicted something like this just before 1.3 in a stickied post about 1.3.

[Wayshuba]

Neither did SWTOR.

 

No, it cost $200M...

 

http://www.gamespot.com/news/star-wars-the-old-republic-cost-200-million-to-develop-6348959

 

Was published in the Los Angeles Times.

 

Also, I don't think the game is going to die - EA will adjust for revenue vs. expense. However, when you consider all the lay offs and people leaving vs. the pace of content delivery (which has been rather pathetic vs. most other companies) it makes one wonder how much content delivery will slow down even further.

Edited July 18, 2012 by Wayshuba

[Subatia]

I've received a grand total of SEVEN infractions and a warning defending this game from the very beginning and you know what it's embarrassing. I've said so many times if Rift can do what it did in a short period of time SWTOR and Bioware can too, boy how wrong I was. So I'm letting my sub run out August, I wasn't even a hater I loved this game. But EA along with Bioware just don't know what they're doing

 

I've gotten several infractions from defending this game. What I've learned; Pointing out problems with others logic: Intimidation. Making fun of 133T SP34K? Harassment. Going and posting OP's response from another of his threads where he argues the exact opposite? Spam.

 

My reward? Insults and degradation from CS when I ask for help after I accidentally dropped a quest.

 

My sub is up on Sunday.

 

Might be back when this goes F2P. At least then I'll be getting the CS that would be equal to the amount I'd be paying for.

[Monoth]

Look it sucks when people lose jobs. It's not to say they are bad people, but maybe they were just not in the right spot. I'm sure Rich is extremely talented and I wish him the best in the future ...

 

BUT

 

How is it not a good thing when someone who has failed the community over and over again has left the game? This is the man who is personally responsible for "future content" meaning

 

He's the one who said 1.3 and 1.4 would be much faster then 1.2, and wasn't able to deliver

He's the one who said we would have ranked in 1.2, but only delivered 1/4 of what he promised in 1.3

He's the one who said we would have same sex relationships with the first content update back when that was a big topic, then never talked about them again even when they didn't show up in the first content release

He's the one who felt the main focus of the devs should be a new companion rather then new zones

He's the one that promised nightmare Denova and failed to deliver

He's the one that planned 10 bosses in Denova but could only deliver 4

 

and the list goes on and on and on

 

Hell, every minute someone with that track record continued to work for the company was a very bad sign. It's great that he's gone and might be replaced with someone who understands the community better and can deliver results.

 

This is a great day for SW:TOR. Now just get rid of the head PVP designer and we are golden.

 

Im pretty positive he said same sex relationships with companions would be in a future update NOT the first content release. And I do believe most of the comments you made he never gave time tables, your implying that he did in your argument. The only one I can think of where you are right was the ranked warzones but they did come forward and said they were having issues and that the system they had in place on the test server was not popular with the testers so they went back to the drawing board which is why there was a delay.

 

Anyways if your going to try and quote someone you better back it up with links ...

Edited July 18, 2012 by Monoth

[Shingara]

No, it cost $200M...

 

http://www.gamespot.com/news/star-wars-the-old-republic-cost-200-million-to-develop-6348959

 

Was published in the Los Angeles Times.

 

Also, I don't think the game is going to die - EA will adjust for revenue vs. expense. However, when you consider all the lay offs and people leaving vs. the pace of content delivery (which has been rather pathetic vs. most other companies) it makes one wonder how much content delivery will slow down even further.

 

$200 mil, not that much when you start totting stuff up, orchestras payed for, license fee, voice actors for english, french, dutch, spanish and whatever else its in, cutscene costs which when added up ammount to about the same length or more of a pixar film, 5 years in development etc etc and then the games production costs after. being artists, concept developers, writers, coders, background testers, managment staff etc etc etc.

 

Either way i wouldnt be shocked if they made that back in the launch week.

 

But who are you comparing development speed to exactly, only one i know faster is rift, wow most definatly isnt faster, they are the slowest in the buisness.

Edited July 18, 2012 by Shingara

[Monoth]

No, it cost $200M...

 

http://www.gamespot.com/news/star-wars-the-old-republic-cost-200-million-to-develop-6348959

 

Was published in the Los Angeles Times.

 

Also, I don't think the game is going to die - EA will adjust for revenue vs. expense. However, when you consider all the lay offs and people leaving vs. the pace of content delivery (which has been rather pathetic vs. most other companies) it makes one wonder how much content delivery will slow down even further.

 

Pretty sure Blizzard wasn't rolling out updates every week either, nor was Aion or Age of Conan,etc...etc.... I think the issue is the same issue other MMO's have people who want to live in a MMO and spend all there time playing it, always end up complaining about a lack of content. I really don't think you will find any MMO that can handle players who play 8-10 hrs a day, well I guess Asian MMO's with there extreame grind can, but thats all I can think of.

 

Yes I know Rift puts out content fast, but pretty much all there new content is just revised versions of existing content with different skins.... It's rare if Rift puts out anything truly different or original..

[Valkirus]

$200 mil, not that much when you start totting stuff up, orchestras payed for, license fee, voice actors for english, french, dutch, spanish and whatever else its in, cutscene costs which when added up ammount to about the same length or more of a pixar film, 5 years in development etc etc and then the games production costs after. being artists, concept developers, writers, coders, background testers, managment staff etc etc etc.

 

Either way i wouldnt be shocked if they made that back in the launch week.

 

I agree. I am sure they have made back thier initial production costs and then some. The issue now however is the costs to maintain the game. No company will continue to let a product line bleed money from the overall profits.

[Lukery]

I don't care who they kick out, as long as Daniel "ABSolutely" Erickson and James Ohlen stay. Even if Ohlen would be kicked, I'd still be playing. But if Abs leaves, I'm going with him. With that said, this news is only a good thing. If you can't deliver what you promise, you might as well leave. Now, lets get someone who can make the game better on the job!

[MbaxterBeau]

Look it sucks when people lose jobs. It's not to say they are bad people, but maybe they were just not in the right spot. I'm sure Rich is extremely talented and I wish him the best in the future ...

 

BUT

 

How is it not a good thing when someone who has failed the community over and over again has left the game? This is the man who is personally responsible for "future content" meaning

 

He's the one who said 1.3 and 1.4 would be much faster then 1.2, and wasn't able to deliver

He's the one who said we would have ranked in 1.2, but only delivered 1/4 of what he promised in 1.3

He's the one who said we would have same sex relationships with the first content update back when that was a big topic, then never talked about them again even when they didn't show up in the first content release

He's the one who felt the main focus of the devs should be a new companion rather then new zones

He's the one that promised nightmare Denova and failed to deliver

He's the one that planned 10 bosses in Denova but could only deliver 4

 

and the list goes on and on and on

 

Hell, every minute someone with that track record continued to work for the company was a very bad sign. It's great that he's gone and might be replaced with someone who understands the community better and can deliver results.

 

This is a great day for SW:TOR. Now just get rid of the head PVP designer and we are golden.

 

This comment should be framed and placed on the wall in a Bioware office. Framed in an intricately carved gold leaf antique frame it's that awesome!

[Nakazia]

But who are you comparing development speed

 

Development of this game has been behind since launch. Basic features that should have already been in the game and fluff cash sinks (Legacy is really not all that) are about all we've been getting, not a whole lot more.

 

I don't know exactly what the vision is or will be in the future, but with the sheer amount of people dropping off of this project by choice or not doesn't bode well. You can say good riddance to X,Y, and Z because you think they weren't doing a good job and you believe a change will represent a good thing, but there's no guarantee that something better will actually happen at this point.

 

I've gotten the impression that a lot of people didn't really care about the game behind the scenes... that they were disconnected in a way from the players and they lacked the real vision (or desire) to make this game fun, to make a player feel as though they are achieving something useful for their time and it shows in the product we play today.

 

I don't know if they have the ability to step it up or if they'll even have the man power and foresight to get this game going in a better direction again.

 

I'd like to see this game succeed but with all the bad press and word of mouth from gamers, EAware isn't doing themselves any favors lately. I bought into the hype and I'm still here playing and enjoying the game for the most part, but I just don't think what has happened to this game was intended or could have even been anticipated in December.

 

Good luck Rich, and good luck to everyone else left picking up the pieces.

 

[Krisbone]

I've gotten several infractions from defending this game. What I've learned; Pointing out problems with others logic: Intimidation. Making fun of 133T SP34K? Harassment. Going and posting OP's response from another of his threads where he argues the exact opposite? Spam.

 

My reward? Insults and degradation from CS when I ask for help after I accidentally dropped a quest.

 

My sub is up on Sunday.

 

Might be back when this goes F2P. At least then I'll be getting the CS that would be equal to the amount I'd be paying for.

Have to agree, the customer service in this game is terrible and borders on ridiculous.

 

It's "Find a glitch? We don't care. Someone used foul language in General? Man the battleships!"

[irishfino]

Have to agree, the customer service in this game is terrible and borders on ridiculous.

 

It's "Find a glitch? We don't care. Someone used foul language in General? Man the battleships!"

 

McCarthy era forum control.

Edited July 18, 2012 by irishfino

[Holden_Dissent]

I've gotten several infractions from defending this game. What I've learned; Pointing out problems with others logic: Intimidation. Making fun of 133T SP34K? Harassment. Going and posting OP's response from another of his threads where he argues the exact opposite? Spam.

 

My reward? Insults and degradation from CS when I ask for help after I accidentally dropped a quest.

 

My sub is up on Sunday.

 

Might be back when this goes F2P. At least then I'll be getting the CS that would be equal to the amount I'd be paying for.

 

I thought this only happened to me. I've had an infraction in every month (several in some months) since the game released. Mostly I was giving tough love to the seething minority of haters. It's not like I told them I was coming to their house to beat them up or anything. This is a PUBLIC forum that EVERYONE can see. Wouldn't it make more sense for them to keep it tidy of all the blind baseless hate from people? Blizzard at least does that right. It almost seems like Bliz has an auto-delete on their forums if you put too many of certain keywords together in a paragraph.

[Tuscad]

McCarthy era forum control.

 

"You must be a forumist!" lol, that explains it all.

Edited July 18, 2012 by Tuscad

[Celebrus]

Also, I don't think the game is going to die - EA will adjust for revenue vs. expense. However, when you consider all the lay offs and people leaving vs. the pace of content delivery (which has been rather pathetic vs. most other companies) it makes one wonder how much content delivery will slow down even further.

 

The game isn't going to die anytime soon, but it will never have a chance at a booming population the likes of which it had the chance to grab at release.

 

And I also agree when it comes to the content delivery pace. When they said they were going to be pushing out content at an "unprecedented" pace, I figured that would mean it would be fast, but the pace they've set is so horribly slow that I can't see them really catching up and turning this game around at this point. There just aren't many second chances in the MMO world.

Edited July 18, 2012 by Celebrus