Diplomaticus Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 Yo people, I respecced to this build a couple of days ago to try it out, and was pleasantly surprised to discover that Shock Charge counts as a bleed effect for Wounding Shots (hadn't expected this). One thing I'm not sure about is if I can use it to expand the number of internal bonus procs on WS to 3: The numbers are too close to eachother for me to be sure. Even after fraps'ing it and replaying it in slo-mo I'm still not sure. So I was wondering if this was known by you guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riiquiem Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 (edited) Shock Charge counts as a bleed effect for Wounding Shots No. /thread ? Edited July 14, 2012 by Riiquiem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diplomaticus Posted July 14, 2012 Author Share Posted July 14, 2012 No. /thread ? Oh no? You didn't even check it out, did you? Anyhow, I think I see three procs, but still not sure if it they're not part of the bleeds... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riiquiem Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 (edited) Oh no? You didn't even check it out, did you? Anyhow, I think I see three procs, but still not sure if it they're not part of the bleeds... Your video showed clearly and without any doubt that shock charge triggers the internal dmg component of wounding shots. Tho I can assure you it's not always been like that. When I did all the testings and combat logs in the sticky it definitely did not work for WS. Tho I can't remember if that was pre 1.2 or after.. however it does work in 1.3 now. strange Edited July 14, 2012 by Riiquiem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diplomaticus Posted July 14, 2012 Author Share Posted July 14, 2012 (edited) Your video showed clearly and without any doubt that shock charge triggers the internal dmg component of wounding shots. Tho I can assure you it's not always been like that. When I did all the testings and combat logs in the sticky it definitely did not work for WS. Tho I can't remember if that was pre 1.2 or after.. however it does work in 1.3 now. strange Ah, no problem, sorry if I were rough on you just then (you could very much be right about previous patches). So you think that it goes all the way up to three procs? Edited July 14, 2012 by Diplomaticus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riiquiem Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 Ah, no problem, sorry if I were rough on you just then (you could very much be right about previous patches). So you think that it goes all the way up to three procs? Yep, seems so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diplomaticus Posted July 14, 2012 Author Share Posted July 14, 2012 Yep, seems so. Ok thanks! The strategy eats energy like crazy so it's niche at best, but still... stacking three dots and pulling off that Wounding Shots must be insanely painful. Not to mention the yellow numbers spray really has a wow-effect. Wonder how fast a fully geared gs could drain health with this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riiquiem Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 Problem is that those ticks are quiet weak. They are not buffed with hemo blast like they would be in full DF spec. So I think 3 unbuffed proccs won't be any stronger than 2 buffed, you know? and it is kinda slow... you have to build all 3 DOTs before you can start your real burst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diplomaticus Posted July 14, 2012 Author Share Posted July 14, 2012 (edited) Problem is that those ticks are quiet weak. They are not buffed with hemo blast like they would be in full DF spec. So I think 3 unbuffed proccs won't be any stronger than 2 buffed, you know? and it is kinda slow... you have to build all 3 DOTs before you can start your real burst. Those aren't the problems. Time (without counting energy) is exactly the same, switch out HB in favour of SC (or is HB off global? - not sure). Damagewise, this rotation is more dangerous: Wounding Shots: 100% + 100% + 100% > 130% + 130% Dotwise, same logic. Shock Charge is mitigated by Armour but has a significantly higher tooltip value, so I think it evens out or even tips the odds even more in favour of the Hybrid. Also, I guess it's more cooldown friendly: no HB needed, and SC resets when the victim dies, so if you don't have Shrap Bomb you can still have a twin proc Wounding Shots. BUT the main crux is the energy consumption. 20 or even 16 energy for another dot, you feel that. This is why I think full DF is still more practical. But imma have fun with this. Edited July 14, 2012 by Diplomaticus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracokyaku Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 (edited) Yo people, I respecced to this build a couple of days ago to try it out, and was pleasantly surprised to discover that Shock Charge counts as a bleed effect for Wounding Shots (hadn't expected this). I messed about with this build a few weeks ago on PTS, it's a load of fun and your first few targets will drop very quickly (the last 30% of your opponents health is a blur ) Those energy costs really mount up though. Still, it IS amusing to play. Edited July 14, 2012 by Dracokyaku Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tibbel Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 (edited) I've just tested this on a sniper and can confirm that Interrogation Probe does not add extra poison ticks to Cull. Wounding Shots also specifically says its extra ticks require "bleeds" (and Shock Charge is not a bleed). Combined, these strongly suggest that WS's triggering of extra ticks from SC is unintentional and is indeed a bug. In extension: Has anyone actually tested whether having all three of VS, SB, and SC on a target will actually trigger 3 extra ticks for each hit of WS? (The combat log should be able to distinguish all the ticks from each other, even if it's not clear on screen.) From the game files, it looks as though WS should cap out at two extra ticks per hit, even if there are somehow more than two "bleeds" (or what it thinks are bleeds) active. Edited July 14, 2012 by Tibbel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentMutation Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 I ran a hybrid spec for a few days. Originally I didn't think the shock charge counted as a bleed for Wounding Shots, but that video would indicate otherwise. Probably won't be able to tell without some combat log parsing.... The problems have already been enumerated- the big one is that the energy cost per rotation is simply too high. On a side note, if SC does indeed proc wounding shots, does it also proc fighting spirit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skolops Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 Hmmm, seems like the gain is not that much to justify the extra energy cost an the extra time needed to set it up. Yes, its true that it is the same number of GCDs as if we included hemorrhaging blast, but HB is free, whereas shock charge is not, and that means it is an absolute necessity to through some extra flurry of bolts in there to keep the energy from dropping low enough to make you useless after your first kill or two. So, some math. The standard DF wounding shots would give us 3y + (1.3)(3)(2)x, where y is the WS base damage and x is the damage per bleed. That works out to 3y + 7.8x The hybrid with shock charge would be 3y + (3)(3)x, or 3y + 9x The difference then is 1.2x, where x is again the per bleed bonus of WS. It's really not that much. At level 47, its 258 total damage difference. Now, that doesn't factor in the additional damage being done by the 3rd bleed over time, which actually is fairly significantly greater. That said, with the better energy management available in a standard DF build, the target should probably be down before this could run its full course anyways, and more importantly, it would seem to be overwhelmingly better for the second, and especially third target to use a standard DF build. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvershadez Posted July 16, 2012 Share Posted July 16, 2012 It's definitely a bug that came in with the most recent patch. It wasn't like that the last time i used a hybrid spec. And it definitely shouldn't work with each other as the tooltip clearly says wounding shots only affects bleeds. It's your decision wether you want to abuse it or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vimm Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 It's definitely a bug that came in with the most recent patch. It wasn't like that the last time i used a hybrid spec. And it definitely shouldn't work with each other as the tooltip clearly says wounding shots only affects bleeds. It's your decision wether you want to abuse it or not. You can't really avoid it if you play hybrid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skolops Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 Not sure why it must be assumed to be a bug. Sure, it may be, but it may not be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenFry Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 (edited) Hmm. So I guess the build would be 2/11/28 rather than 2/8/31? Does seem like you would run into energy problems over a sustained fight, and the loss of Nice Try can also be relevant. Would have to check whether Shock Charge crits proc Fighting Spirit or not. DEFINITELY need Bravado in this build. Anyway...if it's intended that Wounding Shots triggers off of Shock Charge, some tooltips need to be updated. Edited July 19, 2012 by CitizenFry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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