Shingara Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 He has the downward trend to back him up in his assumption. 2.4 million box sales, then 1.7 million prior to 1.2, and finally 1.3 million last month. That's a trend over six months. That trend is down. Reasonable people can conclude that since there have been no major changes to the game (aside from the very recent mergers), the trend will continue. The fact that there is a million box sales difference to subscribed numbers shows that people who bought the game a million never even started playing the game at launch, and least forget origin that doesnt count to box sales. There was a drop from 1.7 mil to 1.3 mil that i have said is there and never once disputed. So where he has the downward trend to back his assumptions i have a million copys of the game not even activated yet to back up mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dezzi Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 The fact that there is a million box sales difference to subscribed numbers shows that people who bought the game a million never even started playing the game at launch, and least forget origin that doesnt count to box sales. There was a drop from 1.7 mil to 1.3 mil that i have said is there and never once disputed. So where he has the downward trend to back his assumptions i have a million copys of the game not even activated yet to back up mine. What? I'm using BioWare's numbers. What are you using? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafaman Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 So... people are going to come and go. It is the nature of the beast these days. There is renewed interests now, not sure why some are taking that personally, but it will diminish again and people will leave again. Maybe for a second time. But I sure you, as soon as there is a reason to come back, new content, features etc. many will come back again. I think the thing to remember is that while we have lovers (full disclosure, I love the game) and haters there are many who are not staunchly one or the other. Success, in my opinion, is going to be in the ebb and flow. I don't think that a business plan for a successful MMO can discount that these days. Forget consumer loyalty, just keep them coming back every few months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 (edited) What? I'm using BioWare's numbers. What are you using? sorry my bad, there is a difference of 700k box sales to subscribed players not counting origin sales. Edited June 17, 2012 by Shingara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 As an impartial observer to this 'debate', trust me you aren't coming off well from your posts. Probably not as i refuse to speculate on the death or every lasting life that swtor has via subsciption numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrunkShizzle Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 (edited) The only downside is that bioware now has about 3 weeks to put 1.3 out. Or else people will leave again. so you think people wont do that when 1.3 comes out? they'll resub,see the game is still trash like its been for 6 months.and then leave again Edited June 17, 2012 by CrunkShizzle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordSkyKnight Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 (edited) Shingara you can believe whatever you want, it won't change matters. The game appears to be continuing to loose subscriptions as time rolls on. I am still in contact with many players from my guild and trust me, they aren't coming back. Some have gone to Diablo 3, some to Tera, and friends from work flat out quit playing mmos because of this last one called swtor. They don't know about transfers, new patches, anything.....they don't give a crap, they aren't coming back. I'm sure some people will come back to see the new patch and the dungeon finder with the transfers but trust me bro, it's not going to be the number you want it to be. Bioware has fouled up this game with their total incompetence. That 1.3 million sub number they released was from the first quarter taken at the end of March and you can bet your butt they inflated it as much as they could. Edited June 17, 2012 by LordSkyKnight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrunkShizzle Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 (edited) i doubt dungeon finder will do a whole lot in bringing people back bioware will cave to the wow crowd who are so firmly against cross server.and im sure by then,the population on the servers wont be as good as it is now,so people will end up standing on the fleet jerking off for 5 hours in there queues and end up leaving but hey,at least they can say "we didnt piss the minority whiny baby wow crowd off" Edited June 17, 2012 by CrunkShizzle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyIommi Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 (edited) Really. If you think the sub number is equal to or greater than 1.3 million RIGHT NOW, you are being willfully ignorant. It is EXTREMELY apparent that the sub numbers have dropped since MARCH when that figure was calculated. You say you have seen guildies come back, well here, I'll give you my anecdotal evidence since thats all that you can provide. In late march (AFTER that figure was calculated) my server saw peak times with as many as 200 or more people on the fleet, it was a very active server AT THE TIME THAT THE 1.3 MILLION FIGURE WAS CALCULATED. Now, taking into account that the 1,3 million figure was calculated in March, and my server has gone from having 200 people on the fleet down to having less than 50 at peak times, I'm going to go ahead and ASSUME with my anecdotal evidence that you cannot disprove, that the sub count since the 1.3 million figure was calculated has dropped off by *AT LEAST* 75%. So there we go. You think that "47 people have returned since the transfers" and I think that 75% of players have left since March. I'm sure theres an even ground somewhere in between us that is more accurate, but since you insist on using absolutely terrible, unprovable math, so will I. Watch this. If you think sub numbers have dropped from march YOU ARE BEING WILFULLY IGNORANT. Edited June 17, 2012 by TonyIommi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 (edited) Shingara you can believe whatever you want, it won't change matters. The game appears to be continuing to loose subscriptions as time rolls on. I am still in contact with many players from my guild and trust me, they aren't coming back. Some have gone to Diablo 3, some to Tera, and friends from work flat out quit playing mmos because of this last one called swtor. They don't know about transfers, new patches, anything.....they don't give a crap, they aren't coming back. I'm sure some people will come back to see the new patch and the dungeon finder with the transfers but trust me bro, it's not going to be the number you want it to be. Bioware has fowled up this game with their total incompetence. That 1.3 million sub number they released was from the first quarter taken at the end of March and you can bet your butt they inflated it as much as they could. I dont perticularly care what the subscription numbers are, if they have enough to cover the game, content development and other costs which were stated as 500k need subscribers its all good. If there are a zillion other subscribers on other servers it makes not a jot of difference to me aslong as my server has enough people on it to make content playable as designed. As for the number i want it to be as you put, i do not care. it could be Googolplex and people would still complain. As for your friends not playing anymore then my condolences to you, but as your still here they cannot be as flawed as you stated, and like i said where you have seen one trend i have seen the other amongst friends. So when Bioware give out there next active subscription numbers i shall take those as gospel and carry on regardless playing swtor. Edited June 17, 2012 by Shingara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roalmo Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 Watch this. If you think sub numbers have dropped from march YOU ARE BEING WILFULLY IGNORANT. And you don't think they've dropped from March? Strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyIommi Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 And you don't think they've dropped from March? Strange. I have no evidence either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanisawake Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 Because 1.2 was suppose to be the release candidate and finally signaled the end of the paid beta. 1.3 on the other hand is just a bunch of polishing and nice features. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wutru Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 It's funny how the moderators keep baseless threads like this open. There is NO proof numbers have increased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GiMMLi Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 If people are resubbing I don't believe it's strictly for 1.3. As mentioned before, alot of players had to resub for thier "free transfer". That being said, I'm sure everyone who got a transfer is looking forward to 1.3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rumpleseq Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 I resubbed for group finder.. If the tool fails I will leave again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgelling Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 (edited) a update of NO content. This is an post with NO evidence at all subs are increasing? Edited June 17, 2012 by jgelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wutru Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 I resubbed for group finder.. If the tool fails I will leave again. The tool is actually quite nice. All it needs is queues for Heroics and World Bosses., and bug fixes too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrunkShizzle Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 I have no evidence either way. its hard to provide evidence when the company itself doesnt show its true sub numbers.and by true,i mean.people who are still logging in and playing the game,not the lvl 1-20 free trial kids and the people who bought 6 month subs and only played for a month id love to see how many true subscribers this game has.my guess? its a truckload lower then it was before Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrunkShizzle Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 (edited) I resubbed for group finder.. If the tool fails I will leave again. anyone with half a brain knows it will fail your talking about a game thats sole purpose was to drive the wow community away from wow,and look at much of a grand failure the lfg tool was in wow Edited June 17, 2012 by CrunkShizzle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 its hard to provide evidence when the company itself doesnt show its true sub numbers.and by true,i mean.people who are still logging in and playing the game,not the lvl 1-20 free trial kids and the people who bought 6 month subs and only played for a month id love to see how many true subscribers this game has.my guess? its a truckload lower then it was before When that day happens and wow do it also i shall walk on water for you whilst balancing plates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmcooke Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 You're the one making blase statements based off of nothing, no logical thought, and then reply with this. I would suggest don't go into politics if you can't back up fantastical statements with at least one shred of proof. Why not? Making fantastical statements without a shred of proof is sort of a strong point for politicians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanxxx Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 We all know the ambition of 1.2, and the mass of content it introduced. BUT there has been a mass of re-subscribers to this game, in anticipation to 1.3, a update of NO content. What do you think of this? Do you think of this? Is there a reason? Is 1.3 the savior of SWTOR over the ridiculously featured 1.2? No evidence to support a change in population (or subs) as a result of 1.3 on the PTS. We do know that the release of 1.2 to the live servers resulted in a population spike that lasted 12 days, my guess is that 1.3 will generate the same but have a longer lasting effect , maybe 30 days, some will resub for ranked warzones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valkirus Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 He has the downward trend to back up his assertion. 2.4 million box sales, then 1.7 million prior to 1.2, and finally 1.3 million last month. That's a trend over six months. That trend is down. Reasonable people can conclude that since there have been no major changes to the game (aside from the very recent mergers), the trend will continue. It's perfectly reasonable to conclude that today's numbers are smaller than 1.3 million--especially provided the post-free month milestone is here. Very well said. The handwriting is on the wall. The one problem with the OP's post is he refered to a "mass" amount of players returning. My definition of the term "mass" may be different than his I am sure. If he had said "several" then maybe it would not have caused so much debate. Noone knows for certain how many subs TOR has now. And players will not know until the next quarter reports is released and even better..when the third one is. But it would be less risky to assume it has dropped a lot than to assume it has'nt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyIommi Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 (edited) Very well said. The handwriting is on the wall. The one problem with the OP's post is he refered to a "mass" amount of players returning. My definition of the term "mass" may be different than his I am sure. If he had said "several" then maybe it would not have caused so much debate. Noone knows for certain how many subs TOR has now. And players will not know until the next quarter reports is released and even better..when the third one is. But it would be less risky to assume it has dropped a lot than to assume it has'nt. However you'll not that the trend is decelerating. The drops have become less and less significant everytime we get a reveal of the sub numbers. Extrapolating from this it can be shown that the trend will eventually stop. Again you have no evidence that it hasn't you based it on the downward trend which if you look at it it's becoming smaller and smaller. I really have no evidence that the trend is less this time around OTHER than extrapolating from the given data which is more or less what you people did in the first place. Give that eventually it will flatten out somewhere around 1 million which is enough to keep this game very profitable for EA. It is not less risky to assume one or the other. Simple analysis will lead you to conclude that the handwriting is indeed on the wall it's just not what you think it is. Especially when you consider the introduction of the f2p to lvl 15 model and the potential it can bring to the table to bring more people in with. The downward trend is only likely to get more and more marginal as it goes. Speculation is not evidence. If you want to treat it as such, I can as well. Edited June 17, 2012 by TonyIommi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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