LotR army VS SW army

[Erudain]

Another one that made me lol....are Mumakils LotR's AT-AT?

[Maaruin]

Not really, you can still do pretty much anything with the Force. No one has put a limit on force powers or what have you, its just writers don't seem to wanna bother creating new powers. Given that there are over 100+ force powers in Star Wars.

 

Yes, and no. For example Force lighning:

 

in ROTJ it could very well just be one of countless ways Sidious can use the Force to torture, today it is a standard (or high end) Sith ability.

 

You said there are 100+ force powers. That's exactly what I mean: there are specified force powers. A writer can invent new ones of course. In the OT you might think Yoda and the Emperor could use the force for whatever they want.

 

Most of the magic in LotR is not specified. For example what the One Ring can do. It can make you invisible. But it can do much more. You can see the other rings of power, it lengthens your life, somehow you can see things far away from you, somehow you learn to control if it makes you invisible. Somehow (it is not described how) you can use fire against your enemies. Well Sauron could.

 

The power of the ring greatly depends on the person who uses it. It will make everyone powerful. But only in your social context (a hobbit in his village, a king on the whole continent). So you can't really say: the ring gives you this specific set of powers.

 

(And it's the same with all LotR magic. You don't know what it can do in detail, you only have some hints. Which doesn't make it easy to compare to Force powers.)

 

Of course in games and in the LotR EU (which is non-canon if I'm informed correctly), there is a specific set of magic powers.

 

Another one that made me lol....are Mumakils LotR's AT-AT?

 

 

That's interesting actually. They have around the same size. I'm just thinking about using them against each other. Of course the AT-AT could shoot the Mumakil in a frontal attack, no contest. But if the Mumakil attacks attacks from the side and without warning, it might be able to knock over the AT-AT. And it is harder for an AT-AT to get up again.

[Wolfninjajedi]

Yes, and no. For example Force lighning:

 

in ROTJ it could very well just be one of countless ways Sidious can use the Force to torture, today it is a standard (or high end) Sith ability.

 

You said there are 100+ force powers. That's exactly what I mean: there are specified force powers. A writer can invent new ones of course. In the OT you might think Yoda and the Emperor could use the force for whatever they want.

 

Most of the magic in LotR is not specified. For example what the One Ring can do. It can make you invisible. But it can do much more. You can see the other rings of power, it lengthens your life, somehow you can see things far away from you, somehow you learn to control if it makes you invisible. Somehow (it is not described how) you can use fire against your enemies. Well Sauron could.

 

The power of the ring greatly depends on the person who uses it. It will make everyone powerful. But only in your social context (a hobbit in his village, a king on the whole continent). So you can't really say: the ring gives you this specific set of powers.

 

(And it's the same with all LotR magic. You don't know what it can do in detail, you only have some hints. Which doesn't make it easy to compare to Force powers.)

 

Of course in games and in the LotR EU (which is non-canon if I'm informed correctly), there is a specific set of magic powers.

 

 

 

 

That's interesting actually. They have around the same size. I'm just thinking about using them against each other. Of course the AT-AT could shoot the Mumakil in a frontal attack, no contest. But if the Mumakil attacks attacks from the side and without warning, it might be able to knock over the AT-AT. And it is harder for an AT-AT to get up again.

 

Fun fact: Palpatine originally was suppose to be the only one to use Force Lighting.

 

But anyway I see your point, yes specific but there are a variety of force powers and new ones that can be created was really the main point of my post.

Edited June 18, 2012 by Wolfninjajedi

[Aurbere]

Fun fact: Palpatine originally was suppose to be the only one to use Force Lighting.

 

 

What stinks is that now every Sith and their moms(If the Sith haven't killed them yet) seem to know Force Lightning. I think having Lightning being a Palps exclusive would have made him unique as a Sith.

[Slowpokeking]

well actually what made the Witch King "killable" was the enchanted westernesse sword/dagger Merry used to stab him, that's what got him open for Eowin's blow (and even with that it almost killed them both...)

So unless you can enchant a ligthsaber or create some form of force attack that has the same effect of a numenorean spell, I think a ligthsaber/force attack will "dispell" him at best, but he will be back.

 

Another question....what can stormtroopers do against the army of the dead?

 

And he let a hobbit be able to stab him?

 

No, the Maia/Valar also can crush him, powerful Force users can kick his ***, too.

 

In the novel the undead are very weak and didn't totally turn the tide, Sith spell got a lot to do with necromancy.

[Maaruin]

And he let a hobbit be able to stab him?

 

No, the Maia/Valar also can crush him, powerful Force users can kick his ***, too.

 

In the novel the undead are very weak and didn't totally turn the tide, Sith spell got a lot to do with necromancy.

 

And Palpatine let Vader throw him down a bottomless hole. Both were to focused on their target and didn't watch for their surroundings.

 

Gandalf was a Maia and he was afraid of the Witch-king. Yes, he was able to stand against him, but it wasn't easy for him.

 

In the novel the fear the undead produced did the most damage to the Corsairs. They won the battle against them, which made it possible for troops from south Gondor to come to the Pelennor fields in time to turn the tide. (You know what fear can do from the Dread Masters.)

[Erudain]

hehe this is fun.....

 

Ok another one...can Earendil with his flying Vingilot and the power of the Silmaril take down a battleship?

[Mirdthestrill]

In the novel the fear the undead produced did the most damage to the Corsairs.

 

Stupid other roleplayers...just because I'm the corsairs doesn't mean I have to get defeated the same way every time...

[Maaruin]

hehe this is fun.....

 

Ok another one...can Earendil with his flying Vingilot and the power of the Silmaril take down a battleship?

 

We have far to little information, I think. The battle isn't described in detail and we don't know what he can actually do.

 

From my imagination, I doubt it. A ship has far more offensive weapons than a dragon, and I don't know if Vingilot could withstand turbolasers. But if this depiction is correct, I think he could. (For those who don't know: The ship you see in the picture defeated the large dragon.)

 

Still, taking out one battleship won't be enough and neither Vingilot nor the Silmaril can be mass produced.

[Erudain]

Wow cool pic....haven't seen LotR art in a while now....all the drawings I have are mostly from John Howe and Ted Nasmith

[KingKolKappi]

A single 1st generation slann mage priest could take on middle earth

[Slowpokeking]

And Palpatine let Vader throw him down a bottomless hole. Both were to focused on their target and didn't watch for their surroundings.

 

Gandalf was a Maia and he was afraid of the Witch-king. Yes, he was able to stand against him, but it wasn't easy for him.

 

In the novel the fear the undead produced did the most damage to the Corsairs. They won the battle against them, which made it possible for troops from south Gondor to come to the Pelennor fields in time to turn the tide. (You know what fear can do from the Dread Masters.)

 

Because he was using force lightning on Luke and battle mediation on his troops, also Vader was a powerful Sith Lord rather than a little hobbit. I'm sure a hobbit won't be able to throw Sidious.

 

Fear is Sith' great weapon.

[Maaruin]

Because he was using force lightning on Luke and battle mediation on his troops, also Vader was a powerful Sith Lord rather than a little hobbit. I'm sure a hobbit won't be able to throw Sidious.

 

Fear is Sith' great weapon.

 

The book is in front of me:

 

"He bent over her like a cloud, and his eyes glittered; he raised his mace to kill.

But suddenly he too stumbled forward with a cry of bitter pain, and his stroke went wide, driving into the ground. Merry's sword had stabbed him from behind, ..."

 

So he was busy killing Eowyn and didn't see it comming. Pretty much like Sidious. A hobbit might not have been able to throw Sidious, but could very well stab him from behind. In addition: Nazgul don't have the best senses. It is perfectly possible that the Witch-king didn't even notice Merry was there.

 

And only few Sith master fear as an effective weapon. Sidious' weapon for example was manipulation.

The Dread Masters of course could drive armies insane just like the Army of the Death can.

[LordQordisz]

he lost most of his power due to the forging of the One Ring.

 

That's not true. Even if he were not wearing the Ring he'd still have his full powers. When he wore the Ring his power in Middle-Earth was actually enhanced. Tolkien wrote in one of his letters, "While he wore it his power on earth was actually enhanced, But even if he did not wear it, that power existed and was in 'rapport' with himself: he was not 'diminished'. Unless some other seized it and became possessed of it. If that happened, the new possessor could (if sufficiently strong and heroic by nature) challenge Sauron, become master of all he had learned or done since the making of the One Ring, and so overthrow him and usurp his place."

[LordQordisz]

Sauron got his *** kicked by armies many times. He couldn't handle the army of Numenor at all, only corrupt them from inside.

 

Tolkien says of the Numenoriens who were decieved in trying to take over Valinor, "Faced by this rebellion, of appalling folly and blasphemy, and also real peril (since the Numenoreans directed by Sauron could have wrought ruin in Valinor itself) the Valar lay down their delegated power and appeal to God, and receive the power and permission to deal with the situation; the old world is broken and changed." Remember the Numenorians were so like the Elves at this point in the powers of body and mind. In the death of Isildur I believe the Numenoriens could take on numerous times their number when facing the Orcs.

Edited June 20, 2012 by LordQordisz

[LordQordisz]

His main skill was as a deceiver, but in battle he was all but invincible, he had only one weakness, one that only Isildur managed to luckily pull off.

 

But really, if we are going to go big guns, we should be going Morgoth vs Luke, Abeloth etc...

 

Morgoth shouldn't need to be explained, it's practically no contest for me.

 

Isildur had no luck. He took the Ring off of Sauron's hand after Gil-Galad and his father destroyed him. Sauron was powerful. Think of him as one of many in a pantheon of gods. The kings of elves and men who Sauron fell to were no pushovers. Read the Lay of Lethian where a battle between Sauron and Felagund is related and Sauron beat him. He was a powerful Elf. Felagund's uncle gave Melkor 6 permanent wounds before falling to Melkor in single combat.

[Fyurii]

The Ewoks were able to defeat the Empire because

 

...the Ewoks had unwittingly created armour-piercing stone head arrows.

[Inzuher]

Yeah sure, they should get HUGE advantage, just not sure how did the Ewoks got those troops, it could be "adapted" and make the story a bit more fun.

 

The ewok beating stormtroopers part of episode 6 was totally ridiculous since Palpatine said it was some of the empires elite troopers... I guess Lucas just wanted a silly suprice in the movie /shurg.

 

Personally I still wish the empire had won...

 

Furthemore, I can't help but notice that people keep pitting the sith, jedi, different empires and the republic against things from the Lord of the Rings world's strongest periodes. I mean to be fair lets try using Star Wars' strongest periode as well then.

 

For instance lets try pitting Morgoth and his army of Balrocks up against the Celestries who crafted star systems and worlds millenia before the empire and republic. Or no that's not fair... Lets try putting Morgoth and his army against the Rakata Infinite Empire then, which had far more advance techonolgy than the star wars we play and far more powerful force users... BOM Lord of the Rings is doomed, too bad...

Edited June 20, 2012 by Inzuher

[Maaruin]

The ewok beating stormtroopers part of episode 6 was totally ridiculous since Palpatine said it was some of the empires elite troopers... I guess Lucas just wanted a silly suprice in the movie /shurg.

 

Personally I still wish the empire had won...

 

Furthemore, I can't help but notice that people keep pitting the sith, jedi, different empires and the republic against things from the Lord of the Rings world's strongest periodes. I mean to be fair lets try using Star Wars' strongest periode as well then.

 

For instance lets try pitting Morgoth and his army of Balrocks up against the Celestries who crafted star systems and worlds millenia before the empire and republic. Or no that's not fair... Lets try putting Morgoth and his army against the Rakata Infinite Empire then, which had far more advance techonolgy than the star wars we play and far more powerful force users... BOM Lord of the Rings is doomed, too bad...

 

I noted several times that most of Middle Earth's armies would be roflstomped by regular SW armies. Only very few spots on middle earth have a chance. If you go from the end of the third age:

 

Lothlorien, Barad-Dur, maybe Isengard, maybe Rivendell, and with lots of luck some Dwarves in their mines and some Orcs in the mountains. They could repell the first, maybe the second attack and hope their planet isn't valuable enough so the Empire or Republic gives up then.

 

I don't know much about the Celestries, couldn't find them on Wookiepedia.

 

Morgoth's forces against the Rakata... probably the same as above: He might be able to repell an attack, but in the end the Rakata win, of course. Morgoth will end up in a mind trap.

 

Edit: Found the Celestials.

 

Edit2: The Celestials seem to be on the same level with the Valar (the Valar created sun, moon and some stars (planets, probably)), but there are much more Celestials than Valar.

Edited June 20, 2012 by Maaruin

[LordQordisz]

You don't give Galadriel the credit she deserves. She was the most powerful elf of her time. The only elf with comparable power was Elrond.

 

I think even you are short selling Galadriel here. Feanor was the most powerful Elf and Galadriel if not his equal was comparable to him. Therefore no Elf was stronger than her unless maybe Feanor. In her powers of mind\body she was a match for any of the Elves of the old days. Elrond was not in her league. She could even touch Sauron's mind.

Edited June 21, 2012 by LordQordisz

[NummSaul]

Lotr has Legolas so... end of discussion

And what about the army of ghosts Aragorn commanded

[Aurbere]

I think even you are short selling Galadriel here. Feanor was the most powerful Elf and Galadriel if not his equal was comparable to him. Therefore no Elf was stronger than her unless maybe Feanor. In her powers of mind\body she was a match for any of the Elves of the old days. Elrond was not in her league. She could even touch Sauron's mind.

 

Well I'm kinda biased towards Elrond because Hugo Weaving played him very well, but Galadriel is more powerful now that I think on it. I was just drawing a quick comparison because I didn't have much time at the time and it's hard to find someone to compare to Galadriel.

 

Edit: If I recall correctly, Elrond was one the most powerful elves of his time.

Edited June 21, 2012 by Aurbere

[Slowpokeking]

I think even you are short selling Galadriel here. Feanor was the most powerful Elf and Galadriel if not his equal was comparable to him. Therefore no Elf was stronger than her unless maybe Feanor. In her powers of mind\body she was a match for any of the Elves of the old days. Elrond was not in her league. She could even touch Sauron's mind.

 

Elves are still not close to Sith Lords.

[Maaruin]

Elves are still not close to Sith Lords.

 

If you want to write your fanfiction that way, sure.

 

But I think there is no evidence to support that statement. Not for regular Sith Lords like Count Dooku.

[LordQordisz]

Elves are still not close to Sith Lords.

 

Not all Sith Lords or Jedi are powerful. This can be seen in the books and comics. Sometimes you look at them and wonder how the hell they could be Jedi. It's hard to compare but I do think the SW's army would win.