LotR army VS SW army

[Slowpokeking]

Well you've been throwing together forces piecemeal this entire time.

 

He started with put Galadriel and Morgoth to work together.

[Maaruin]

The novel clearly said 1 clone is close to 1 B1 droid.

The CIS also got heavy weapons, and there were only very few Jedi survived.

 

He was able to defeat hundreds or even 1 thousand, if it's 50-1(no source), then it's 100000+ troops and surely could add reinforcements later, plus Fett was causing trouble. I don't have a problem with that.

 

What, one clone is close to 1 B1 droid? What's the point in using clones then? Droids are far cheaper and far faster to produce.

 

Source is the wookiepedia article you have your numbers from. You may count how many droids fit into the Arena and how many Jedi are left in the end. Clown Wars Windu would solo them all, movie windu doesn't. I think you don't even see him defeat him one B2 droid. B2 are actually not that easy to kill for Jedi as the B1, except in Clone Wars.

 

 

It's different set of "magic". We don't need "probably", we need proof. Even if Yoda just sit here to focus on a force skill, it will give others chance to launch direct force attack against him.

 

Yeah, Star Wars can do telekinesis, LotR can use the elements. The rest is basically the same.

 

And how do you think should I proof how magic and the force are related to each other?

[Aurbere]

Wait a sec, when did Ancalagon work with Galadriel now? If you want to bring these together, then Rakata and could change a planet's environment permanently. Then Superstar Destroyer will fire Ancalagon to pieces with 1 hit.

 

You never laid the ground rules for the battle. Is it all of Middle-Earth's armies against all of SW armies or ME's good against SW's evil?

[Aurbere]

Not even the humans armies were destroyed by the nazgul. Their leader didn't even let a hobbit and a girl cower in fear and run off. Why would they make it on the elite soldiers under battle mediation?

 

The Nazgul were meant to spread fear and chaos. Eowyn was defending Theoden, Meriadoc was defending Eowyn. their willpower was great enough to resist the Witch-Kings terror. Normal grunts do not have the willpower to resist him. Especially if Sauron had the ring. Gandalf said that the powers of the nazgul would increase dramatically if Sauron regained his ring.

[Maaruin]

Not even the humans armies were destroyed by the nazgul. Their leader didn't even let a hobbit and a girl cower in fear and run off. Why would they make it on the elite soldiers under battle mediation?

 

You remember how everyone except gandalf fled from the Witch-king? And that Eowyn and Merry nearly died afterwards simple because they touched him? Eowyn was only able to stand against him because he threatened Theoden and Merry only because he threatened Eowyn. Unusual circumstances can give you extraordinary courage.

 

Edit: This is to write Fanfic, isn't it? Which side do you plan to be the protagonists, which the antagonists?

Edited June 16, 2012 by Maaruin

[Aurbere]

You remember how everyone except gandalf fled from the Witch-king? And that Eowyn and Merry nearly died afterwards simple because the touched him? Eowyn was only able to stand against him because he threatened Theoden and Merry only because he threatened Eowyn. Unusual circumstances can give you extraordinary courage.

 

This^. Mass armies flee from the Witch-King because they feel that together they have enough courage, but they don't. And Gandalf standing alone was his best moment IMO.

[Slowpokeking]

What, one clone is close to 1 B1 droid? What's the point in using clones then? Droids are far cheaper and far faster to produce.

 

Source is the wookiepedia article you have your numbers from. You may count how many droids fit into the Arena and how many Jedi are left in the end. Clown Wars Windu would solo them all, movie windu doesn't. I think you don't even see him defeat him one B2 droid. B2 are actually not that easy to kill for Jedi as the B1, except in Clone Wars.

 

EP II novel said about it.

 

That number got a source.

 

Inside the Worlds of Star Wars: Attack of the Clones. The setting is 50-1 and we know there are around 200 Jedi, so it's at least 10000+ droids joined the battle. at least 2000-3000 of them left in the end. And he's very exhausted, so it didn't retcon at all. He also didn't get beaten, so it make sense.

 

 

 

Yeah, Star Wars can do telekinesis, LotR can use the elements. The rest is basically the same.

 

And how do you think should I proof how magic and the force are related to each other?

 

 

So let's follow this rule, Galadriel, like Yoda and Sidious, may not be that easily to get choked, but if she stopped to cast a spell, Force Choke will work on her and mostly interrupt it.

 

I never said she would be caught directly like those officials will, but if she started to cast a spell, it will give chance to the Sith to Force Choke her and stop it. Fair enough?

[Slowpokeking]

The Nazgul were meant to spread fear and chaos. Eowyn was defending Theoden, Meriadoc was defending Eowyn. their willpower was great enough to resist the Witch-Kings terror. Normal grunts do not have the willpower to resist him. Especially if Sauron had the ring. Gandalf said that the powers of the nazgul would increase dramatically if Sauron regained his ring.

 

So it could be easily conquered with battle meditation.

 

Also even with the Nazgul's works, the humans still didn't totally lose their position otherwise the orcs will kill them all.

[Slowpokeking]

 

Edit: This is to write Fanfic, isn't it? Which side do you plan to be the protagonists, which the antagonists?

 

I said it will mostly focus on Dooku, Galadriel and possibly Saruman. No clear protagonists or antagonists since I want make it all grey.

[Aurbere]

So it could be easily conquered with battle meditation.

 

Also even with the Nazgul's works, the humans still didn't totally lose their position otherwise the orcs will kill them all.

 

Can it? Even Gandalf's ring couldn't fully empower the Men of Minas Tirith to stand fast against the nazgul and orc hordes. Many of them were still very afraid, the only reason some of them fought was because they had hope Theoden would arrive. Which he did.

 

Battle of Osgiliath. The moment the Nazgul enter, the men run in fear and the orcs gain considerable ground. Faramir retreats to Minas Tirith. So yeah, the orcs did kinda overwhelm them.

[Maaruin]

EP II novel said about it.

 

That number got a source.

 

Inside the Worlds of Star Wars: Attack of the Clones. The setting is 50-1 and we know there are around 200 Jedi, so it's at least 10000+ droids joined the battle. at least 2000-3000 of them left in the end. And he's very exhausted, so it didn't retcon at all. He also didn't get beaten, so it make sense.

 

I have to pick up the novel some time because I still don't believe it. B2 could make sense, but not B1. If it is in the novel, it is canon, but then the republic was just stupid not to build droids.

 

That would mean Mace probably destroyed 200-300, mostly B1 but some B2. In middle earth he could kill around 600 Orks, I think.

 

 

 

 

So let's follow this rule, Galadriel, like Yoda and Sidious, may not be that easily to get choked, but if she stopped to cast a spell, Force Choke will work on her and mostly interrupt it.

 

I never said she would be caught directly like those officials will, but if she started to cast a spell, it will give chance to the Sith to Force Choke her and stop it. Fair enough?

 

Well, if you write the story, you decide the rules. I think it would probably like in SWTOR, some abilities are interruptable, others aren't.

 

I still think you should definitly need an army and Sidious or Yoda to counter her and Lothlorien.

Edited June 16, 2012 by Maaruin

[Maaruin]

I said it will mostly focus on Dooku, Galadriel and possibly Saruman. No clear protagonists or antagonists since I want make it all grey.

 

Then you should make them somehow equally strong. From their importance for the universe I would settle Dooku below Galadriel. If he would team up with Saruman and they combine their knowledge about both worlds, they could be a match for her.

[Aurbere]

You know who no one has mentioned in this war? The dwarves! Who doesn't like the dwarves? They could contribute a lot of war machinery and lend their craftsmen to the aid of the ME armies.

[Slowpokeking]

Then you should make them somehow equally strong. From their importance for the universe I would settle Dooku below Galadriel. If he would team up with Saruman and they combine their knowledge about both worlds, they could be a match for her.

 

No, I set her below Dooku, both individual power and army. And Dooku was trying to team up with her, luring her to the Darkness since she had the desire to save her people. Sidious was interested in take over middle earth, study the magic to see is there anything helpful to his Sith Power. Both Dooku and Saruman wanted to steal part of each other's power. Saruman even wanted to steal the identity so he could command the droid army.

 

Villain VS Villain is more fun than good VS evil.

Edited June 16, 2012 by Slowpokeking

[Slowpokeking]

Can it? Even Gandalf's ring couldn't fully empower the Men of Minas Tirith to stand fast against the nazgul and orc hordes. Many of them were still very afraid, the only reason some of them fought was because they had hope Theoden would arrive. Which he did.

 

Battle of Osgiliath. The moment the Nazgul enter, the men run in fear and the orcs gain considerable ground. Faramir retreats to Minas Tirith. So yeah, the orcs did kinda overwhelm them.

 

So they still would stay and fight, plus the mediation bonus.

[Aurbere]

So they still would stay and fight, plus the mediation bonus.

 

Not necessarily. If Sauron is a part of this battle, the Nazgul would be even more powerful. And wouldn't you run if Sauron or even a nazgul stood before you? Even if I felt courageous, I would run and not look back. Because I have a higher sense of self preservation.

[Oronoco]

I might have missed it but has anyone considered Darth Sion and Darth Nihilus? They are crazy powerful!

 

Also I think it might be impossible for the Light and Dark side to team up with the whole balance of the force thing being such an issue.

MAYBE IM IN MY OWN WORLD OF CANON but,

Wasnt the rule of two designed to weaken the mass number of jedi, while strengthening the only two sith, simply via force balance? Consequently why annakin fit the prophecy for balancing the force (2 sith alive vs 2 jedi alive ... also imo this is explains why Luke is so godmode, yoda dies and makes him the only lightside balance against vader and palpatine not to mention darth krayt chilling on tatooine)

[Maaruin]

No, I set her below Dooku, both individual power and army. And Dooku was trying to team up with her, luring her to the Darkness since she had the desire to save her people. Sidious was interested in take over middle earth, study the magic to see is there anything helpful to his Sith Power. Both Dooku and Saruman wanted to steal part of each other's power. Saruman even wanted to steal the identity so he could command the droid army.

 

Villain VS Villain is more fun than good VS evil.

 

Some thoughts about this. They are only my opnion of course:

 

1. No way Dooku is more powerful than Galadriel. More powerful in army, maybe. He could beat her with Makashi in a sword fight, okay. But never ever in Force/magic. Galadriel could just open the earth below him. Or let the rain drops be so hard they slice through his body. Or send a flood after him. (Is that what you need your overpowered Force Choke for?)

 

2. He tries to lure her, hmm? So he probably doesn't know that she rejected the ring. If he would know it and still try to lure her, it would be pathetic. There is just no chance for him to succeed.

 

Remember, Dooku is good at lightsaber fights and politics. He isn't that much into the deepest secrets of the Force (Yoda shows him in Episode II) and he also isn't that good in corrupting others.

 

 

I might have missed it but has anyone considered Darth Sion and Darth Nihilus? They are crazy powerful!

 

Darth Sion not so much. He is basically like a Nazgul, but without the ability to create that much fear. Darth Nihilus on the other hand is dangerous. He would probably try to feed on all the Elves, since they are a magic/Force-sensitive species. idk, maybe Gandalf the White could stand against him.

Or Tom Bombadil just sings him to death.

 

For light and dark: Right, it probably would be: Sauron vs Empire vs Good from both

Edited June 16, 2012 by Maaruin

[Aurbere]

Some thoughts about this. They are only my opnion of course:

 

1. No way Dooku is more powerful than Galadriel. More powerful in army, maybe. He could beat her with Makashi in a sword fight, okay. But never ever in Force/magic. Galadriel could just open the earth below him. Or let the rain drops be so hard they slice through his body. Or send a flood after him. (Is that what you need your overpowered Force Choke for?)

 

2. He tries to lure her, hmm? So he probably doesn't know that she rejected the ring. If he would know it and still try to lure her, it would be pathetic. There is just no chance for him to succeed.

 

Remember, Dooku is good at lightsaber fights and politics. He isn't that much into the deepest secrets of the Force (Yoda shows him in Episode II) and he also isn't that good in corrupting others.

 

1.Agreed

 

2.Agreed

 

3. Dooku can politically convert enemies, but Galadriel can resist even Saruman's persuasive powers. Dooku has not even the slightest chance of converting Galadriel.

[Slowpokeking]

Some thoughts about this. They are only my opnion of course:

 

1. No way Dooku is more powerful than Galadriel. More powerful in army, maybe. He could beat her with Makashi in a sword fight, okay. But never ever in Force/magic. Galadriel could just open the earth below him. Or let the rain drops be so hard they slice through his body. Or send a flood after him. (Is that what you need your overpowered Force Choke for?)

 

2. He tries to lure her, hmm? So he probably doesn't know that she rejected the ring. If he would know it and still try to lure her, it would be pathetic. There is just no chance for him to succeed.

 

Remember, Dooku is good at lightsaber fights and politics. He isn't that much into the deepest secrets of the Force (Yoda shows him in Episode II) and he also isn't that good in corrupting others.

 

1. Dooku was a master of Force, too. He was close to Yoda during their battle of the Force in EP II. He also could also bend natural being to his will, great ability on healing and telekinesis. Most importantly he could mix these power, make his opponent hard to anticipate. Also he wasn't interested in a duel, but mostly use his army to threat and help her.

 

2. Yes she did, but it's about personal ambition, if her people was in great danger of SW's army of both sides(especially after knowing they would build a Death Star in the future), and possibly involvement of the Middle Earth evils, she would have to find a new power source to defend her pride and her people. So it begins.

[Maaruin]

1.Agreed

 

2.Agreed

 

3. Dooku can politically convert enemies, but Galadriel can resist even Saruman's persuasive powers. Dooku has not even the slightest chance of converting Galadriel.

 

But he could unite Rohan, Gondor and the Dwarfs against Galadriel. Not that they would do much damage to her, but they could provide supply and maybe even lure her out of Lothlorien.

[Slowpokeking]

Not necessarily. If Sauron is a part of this battle, the Nazgul would be even more powerful. And wouldn't you run if Sauron or even a nazgul stood before you? Even if I felt courageous, I would run and not look back. Because I have a higher sense of self preservation.

 

Under mediation, maybe not. I remember it could affect the enemy as well. Plant fear and even illusion is also Sith's feat as well, such as Aleema and Rain's Sith Sorcery.

[Slowpokeking]

3. Dooku can politically convert enemies, but Galadriel can resist even Saruman's persuasive powers. Dooku has not even the slightest chance of converting Galadriel.

 

He got an army, and let his master pay attention to Middle Earth and the elves, so there is a huge threat, he also got an droid army made of 1000billion droids I remember. So he could force Galadriel to ally with him, or suffer annihilation of her entire race.

 

Politics is not just talk talk and talk.

[Maaruin]

1. Dooku was a master of Force, too. He was close to Yoda during their battle of the Force in EP II. He also could also bend natural being to his will, great ability on healing and telekinesis. Most importantly he could mix these power, make his opponent hard to anticipate. Also he wasn't interested in a duel, but mostly use his army to threat and help her.

 

2. Yes she did, but it's about personal ambition, if her people was in great danger of SW's army of both sides(especially after knowing they would build a Death Star in the future), and possibly involvement of the Middle Earth evils, she would have to find a new power source to defend her pride and her people. So it begins.

 

1. Well, my impression was that Yoda pretty much defends himself single handedly. And I still think his abilities are no match for galadriels. She should be better at healing than him, can bind nature to her will. Telekinesis is an advantage, though.

 

Using his armies is the right strategy, especially if he has battle cruisers. As I said, politics and lightsaber fights is what he does best. So he might very well be able to outmaneuver a superior Galadriel politically.

 

2. Using the ring was about saving Middle Earth from Sauron. It was for her people. But the ring would have changed her into wanting more personal power. Just as the Dark Side does. It is very similar.

Edited June 16, 2012 by Maaruin

[Slowpokeking]

1. Well, my impression was that Yoda pretty much defends himself single handedly. And I still think his abilities are no match for galadriels. She should be better at healing than him, can bind nature to her will. Telekinesis is an advantage, though.

 

Using his armies is the right strategy, especially if he has battle cruisers.

 

2. Using the ring was about saving Middle Earth from Sauron. It was for her people. But the ring would have changed her into wanting more personal power. Just as the Dark Side does. It is very similar.

 

1. It's a disadvantage of the Jedi, they mostly use defensive skills, so even if they are stronger, sometimes it's still hard to beat a Sith directly by the power of the Force. Galadriel was a bit similar, her skills are not that offensive.

 

2. They still got a chance other than take the ring, her own ring did a good job against the orcs, too. They could also leave Middle Earth.

 

No it's not start to study the Dark Side from the beginning, it would be stupid.

 

It's like, Dooku asked her to work with him to fight other evils at first, then slowly let her see the power of the enemy and the loss of her people, the danger they are facing. Let her feel she's powerless along with showing her the power of the Force. Unlike the ring, she didn't know too much about the Force.

Edited June 16, 2012 by Slowpokeking