Daniel Erickson thinks X-Server LFG is last resort

[EcrirTwyLar]

And look what happened to the people playing World Of Warcraft when the LFG cross server was implemented. Instead of actual decent players, they became wordless, mindless idiots who cared for nothing but themselves. People who would need on loot they didnt actually need just to sell, or leave a group if a boss they fought didnt drop the loot they wanted, even when it was only the first boss. Why should they care about other people? It is not like they would ever see them again, and even if they did, they can just leave the group and LFG using the tool again.

 

Yes THAT is what you are promoting, the lack of moral fortitude, or willingness to be patient. So I vow here and now, the day cross server LFG is added, I am GONE!!!!!

 

I agree with this. I would rather not deal with players from other servers.

 

Why don't they give you two options. LFG (same server only) and LFG (Xserver). Why they have to settle for one or the other is beyond me. More options>less options

 

This could be an option. For those who don't mind dealing with players from other servers they can. But we aren't forced to.

[EcrirTwyLar]

True, but with the ignore feature and with the server boundaries you are able to filter them out.

 

When you have cross server LFG you never see the same person again. When limited to one server, the population is not that large and ninja warnings work in general chat just fine. He can ninja once or twice and then he will never be able to join any operation/flashpoint group with this level 50 character.

 

Also... If they end up going with x server LFG, at the end of a run when you are given the option to add someone as a friend, you could also have the option to /ignore them so that you won't be forced to group with them again. There could also maybe be an option to up rate or like them which could give them some sort of incentive to "play nice".

 

But, if something like this isn't implemented, I don't want to be forced to group with people from other servers.

Edited May 28, 2012 by EcrirTwyLar

[sumuji]

Well, you gotta do some research instead of pulling a quote and making up your own context. The last resort was because they wanted players to form their own groups and socialize. Clearly that was optomistic but something every game developer seems to hope for seeing as almost all MMORPG's launch without some automated tool to form groups other than PvP, and even then it's random and not complex like filling roles. So you're critizing the lead dev for being like every other lead dev in history.

[Flain]

The game is dying, the subs are dropping... people are getting fed up. Patch 1.3 offers nothing particularly exciting, and the LFG tool offered is next to useless. The X-LFG tool could have the ability to save friends from other servers and then group with them, this would cut down on so-called "douchebaggery". That way you could separate the wheat from the chafe and it would make the people of "low moral" to think twice. Opening up the community and making friends on other servers is a good thing and can only strengthen, not weaken, a community. The anti-xlfg tool brigade don't have the luxury of burying their head in the sand any-more, it's time for action.

[RKLimes]

If your community is worth it's salt, it will be unaffected by a cross server lfg.

I would love to see a cross server LFG.

If you feel that playing with people from another server would be disruptive to your community experience, don't do it.

[mikphobos]

lol i guess they havent notice yet, that they are Already on they last resort with the community,

lol, but once again BW is deaf, blind and silence

Edited May 28, 2012 by mikphobos

[Grethore]

And look what happened to the people playing World Of Warcraft when the LFG cross server was implemented. Instead of actual decent players, they became wordless, mindless idiots who cared for nothing but themselves. People who would need on loot they didnt actually need just to sell, or leave a group if a boss they fought didnt drop the loot they wanted, even when it was only the first boss. Why should they care about other people? It is not like they would ever see them again, and even if they did, they can just leave the group and LFG using the tool again.

 

Yes THAT is what you are promoting, the lack of moral fortitude, or willingness to be patient. So I vow here and now, the day cross server LFG is added, I am GONE!!!!!

 

You speak of this as if it's a cause and effect...that the LFG tool CAUSED people to act like jerks. Sorry to burst your bubble there princess, but those people were already like that before then. Furthermore, just look at the community in that game as a whole...it was horrible long before LFG came along.

 

AND, to state that "if you don't get your way you'll take your marbles and go home" is EXACTLY like what those "wordless, mindless idiots" were.

 

Lastly, if BW ensures there is a STIFF penalty for leaving an in progress group, say loss of 10% of your credits, it should be enough to disway people from jumping ship early. A lengthy lockout wouldn't hurt either.

 

And frankly, even you would have to admit that THIS community is far better than WoW's community. Atleast it is in MY experience. The entire community isn't large enough as a whole to be anonymous like you can be in WoW. You screw up here, everyone will know about t and you'll get blacklisted fast.

[Skidrowbro]

WoW had to impliment one because people were not willing to pay $25 to transfer off of dead servers. Also after X-LFD came into WoW all world pvp became extinct and zones empty due to the fact that you didn't have to leave your home city. I do not think Bioware will be willing to let $300million or whatever their cost was go to waste with empty zones but I believe the new LFD will be instant teleporting to dungeons so if that's the case they may as well go all the way and make it x-server because they are already breaking immersion by doing it that way Edited May 28, 2012 by Skidrowbro

[Gungan]

I can name and shame them so they are known as what they are... they do it often, they will find it very hard to group again. They drop their habits or buy a new server transfer.. either way they are no longer jerks for me

 

Cross-server will ensure they get away with it.. which truly sucks. And since I don`t trust Bioware to handle a Cross-Server solution professionally... I`d rather have only same server.

 

And who exactly is going to take the word of some random mouthbreather screaming about it over general chat? If I were listening to your claims, you would be on my ignore list before he was.

[Gungan]

It doesn't. It was no fun in WoW either.

 

Your opinion. I loved it in WoW. It makes it easier for people to embrace multiplayer online gameplay when it doesn't take an hour (WoW) to form a group, or 7 hours (SWTOR) for that matter.

[Gungan]

Where do you get off calling the man clueless? Perhaps it is you who has no clue.

You don't insult people you don't agree with. Especially when it's you that is wrong.

 

Super Servers are coming. You have absolutely no idea that cross server queues will be needed. There are reasons players don't want it. As someone who played World of Warcraft from Beta, till this games release, I can surely attest to the change in the way players treated other players with cross server easy queues. I can care less if you prefer rude players who kick others from the group for the most trivial reasons, or drop mid combat with no warning. I like it better when players have to consider their reputations

 

Super servers are complete friggin' vaporware with no ETA, and probably even no basis in fact.

[EcrirTwyLar]

You speak of this as if it's a cause and effect...that the LFG tool CAUSED people to act like jerks. Sorry to burst your bubble there princess, but those people were already like that before then. Furthermore, just look at the community in that game as a whole...it was horrible long before LFG came along.

 

AND, to state that "if you don't get your way you'll take your marbles and go home" is EXACTLY like what those "wordless, mindless idiots" were.

 

Lastly, if BW ensures there is a STIFF penalty for leaving an in progress group, say loss of 10% of your credits, it should be enough to disway people from jumping ship early. A lengthy lockout wouldn't hurt either.

 

And frankly, even you would have to admit that THIS community is far better than WoW's community. Atleast it is in MY experience. The entire community isn't large enough as a whole to be anonymous like you can be in WoW. You screw up here, everyone will know about t and you'll get blacklisted fast.

 

Seriously, is this how you want to discuss this?

 

I think everyone knows there are players with attitudes. Your reply is proof. The problem is that some of us want to use the LFG tool, but we (from experience) know that if someone knows you aren't from their server, they are more willing to be a jerk because they most likely won't see any backlash from it. Yeah, the tool itself doesn't create bad players. But it sure creates a nice environment for them to prosper.

 

If we have a x-server tool, it needs to have an option to disable the x-server function.

[Senatsu]

Cross-server LFG tools have been proven to diminish the community simply because people aren't forced to behave. If you behave like a douche in a X-server LFG group, then you can leave/you can get kicked and you never have to see them ever again, and if you don't see them again then you don't get any repercussions. Back in vanilla and TBC WoW guilds had black lists on their own forums and the official ones, listing players who continuously ninja loot, misbehave and otherwise ruin the experience for everyone else. After landing on that list, you would be unable to get a decent guild, people stopped trading with you and getting groups became much harder to get. That type of system forces those people to behave or else they will get black listed, X-server LFG tools allows their destructive behavior run rampant without any repercussions.

There is no way anyone can deny that, it's pure logic. People are stupid, and they will do stupid things, so we need something to keep them from doing those stupid things. Just like they do in Super-Nanny, you misbehave, you get sent to the naughty corner or we will remove a toy from your toy box and throw it out.

 

BioWare is forgetting one thing though: single-server LFG tools only work if there are actually people on those servers, and as we all know, almost every server in all the regions are having major issues because there are too many. Simply too many servers for the playerbase. It's apparent they have no idea how to fix this and their only solution are server transfers? I fear X-server LFG will be put into the game within a month after the launch of the single-server one, unless BioWare uses that old hamster to do something we all know has to be done.

[Gungan]

Seriously, is this how you want to discuss this?

 

I think everyone knows there are players with attitudes. Your reply is proof. The problem is that some of us want to use the LFG tool, but we (from experience) know that if someone knows you aren't from their server, they are more willing to be a jerk because they most likely won't see any backlash from it. Yeah, the tool itself doesn't create bad players. But it sure creates a nice environment for them to prosper.

 

If we have a x-server tool, it needs to have an option to disable the x-server function.

 

I'll take a guy with attitude who excels at his class over a chatty Kathy who stands in the fire any day of the week because I like to execute tasks properly in order to achieve victory. I don't particularly have a problem with chatting in groups, but I'm not going to initiate.

[Senatsu]

I'll take a guy with attitude who excels at his class over a chatty Kathy who stands in the fire any day of the week because I like to execute tasks properly in order to achieve victory. I don't particularly have a problem with chatting in groups, but I'm not going to initiate.

 

So you think people are either jerks and pr0, or they are social and idiots? I don't want to live on this planet anymore...

 

How you even have the ignorance to write such a thing is beyond me. This is an MMO, if you don't like socializing with other players then you're in the wrong genre, cupcake.

Edited May 28, 2012 by Senatsu

[Kaywinnit]

I agree with Daniel.. the community on individual servers in WOW went to hell after cross server LFG was implemented.

 

Tons of people were jerks, just to be, and because there were no repercussions to their actions..since with the cross server LFG...they'd likely never group with the same people again.

 

I'd rather have slightly slower queue times on a same server LFG...than have to group with a bunch of random jerks who have no worries of repercussion for bad behavior.

[EcrirTwyLar]

What we need is a thread providing constructive ideas to be added to the LFG tool. Unfortunately, Bioware probably decided on their own what features they will add to the tool. Which may or may not be features that the community wants.

 

The biggest feature I would want is some sort of positive reward system. At the end of a run, we should be able to click a button if had a good experience with another group member. There could be some sort of reward for players who gain a lot of these votes.

 

There could also be an ignore feature, but there shouldn't be any kind of negative vote. Because this could be misused. If you don't want to group with someone, select that option and you won't be grouped with that person again. You should also have the option to select this if someone bails early in the middle of a run.

[Gungan]

Cross-server LFG tools have been proven to diminish the community simply because people aren't forced to behave. If you behave like a douche in a X-server LFG group, then you can leave/you can get kicked and you never have to see them ever again, and if you don't see them again then you don't get any repercussions. Back in vanilla and TBC WoW guilds had black lists on their own forums and the official ones, listing players who continuously ninja loot, misbehave and otherwise ruin the experience for everyone else. After landing on that list, you would be unable to get a decent guild, people stopped trading with you and getting groups became much harder to get. That type of system forces those people to behave or else they will get black listed, X-server LFG tools allows their destructive behavior run rampant without any repercussions.

There is no way anyone can deny that, it's pure logic. People are stupid, and they will do stupid things, so we need something to keep them from doing those stupid things. Just like they do in Super-Nanny, you misbehave, you get sent to the naughty corner or we will remove a toy from your toy box and throw it out.

 

BioWare is forgetting one thing though: single-server LFG tools only work if there are actually people on those servers, and as we all know, almost every server in all the regions are having major issues because there are too many. Simply too many servers for the playerbase. It's apparent they have no idea how to fix this and their only solution are server transfers? I fear X-server LFG will be put into the game within a month after the launch of the single-server one, unless BioWare uses that old hamster to do something we all know has to be done.

 

Proven? By whom? Where's your independent study with a control group? I know my guild never had a blacklist on our forums because most of us have thicker skins. How did those blacklists work out once the name change service was implemented I wonder?

[Senatsu]

What we need is a thread providing constructive ideas to be added to the LFG tool. Unfortunately, Bioware probably decided on their own what features they will add to the tool. Which may or may not be features that the community wants.

 

The biggest feature I would want is some sort of positive reward system. At the end of a run, we should be able to click a button if had a good experience with another group member. There could be some sort of reward for players who gain a lot of these votes.

 

There could also be an ignore feature, but there shouldn't be any kind of negative vote. Because this could be misused. If you don't want to group with someone, select that option and you won't be grouped with that person again. You should also have the option to select this if someone bails early in the middle of a run.

 

Very good ideas. Could also add a system that favors people you have high points with, though it could also be easily misused.

 

Proven? By whom? Where's your independent study with a control group? I know my guild never had a blacklist on our forums because most of us have thicker skins. How did those blacklists work out once the name change service was implemented I wonder?

 

This is like debating with religious people, equally ignorant. Certainly friends lists and ignore lists don't update the names if the player changes them, that's just absurd! Oh wait... they do.

Edited May 28, 2012 by Senatsu

[Gungan]

So you think people are either jerks and pr0, or they are social and idiots? I don't want to live on this planet anymore...

 

How you even have the ignorance to write such a thing is beyond me. This is an MMO, if you don't like socializing with other players then you're in the wrong genre, cupcake.

 

Apparently you don't understand the concept of extreme left and right wing examples. If your socializing during a flashpoint or OP is interfering with the group's progress, I expect you to focus more on the game so we can get the job done.

 

You're under the impression that because you cannot deal with someone with an abrasive attitude, that other people cannot, and their experience in the game would also be ruined. That is simply not true. For people who dote on the community so much, it sure sounds like you need better people skills.

Edited May 28, 2012 by Gungan

[MasterKayote]

Daniel Erickson, Lead Game Designer for Star Wars: The Old Republic, in an interview:

 

As it should be. Kudos to Daniel Erickson and all the devs who value the games communities.

 

Thank you for the way you implemented damage parsers, and thank you for upcoming LFG tool. Keep your principles. There may be tons of those spoiled WoW rejects throwing temper tantrums because youre not offering the instant gratification WoW does, but there are just as many who are behind you 100%.

[EcrirTwyLar]

I'll take a guy with attitude who excels at his class over a chatty Kathy who stands in the fire any day of the week because I like to execute tasks properly in order to achieve victory. I don't particularly have a problem with chatting in groups, but I'm not going to initiate.

 

This is a pointless statement. Some how you think that most skilled players are @ss hats? I know from experience that this is not true. There are both skilled and non-skilled jerks and nice people out there. Your statement really has no bearing other than to say "I don't mind grouping with a jerk as long as he has skills". Which is fine. If you want that option and you are willing to deal with those people. Good, they will have someone to group with after I put them on ignore.

 

I personally would rather group with a nice person even if they aren't as skilled. Maybe I can even help them learn to be a skilled player.

[Gungan]

This is a pointless statement. Some how you think that most skilled players are @ss hats? I know from experience that this is not true. There are both skilled and non-skilled jerks and nice people out there. Your statement really has no bearing other than to say "I don't mind grouping with a jerk as long as he has skills". Which is fine. If you want that option and you are willing to deal with those people. Good, they will have someone to group with after I put them on ignore.

 

I personally would rather group with a nice person even if they aren't as skilled. Maybe I can even help them learn to be a skilled player.

 

It's not. That was the general implication of my statement. I have no problem dealing with the full range of people's attitudes, because they don't come in only two flavors. Some people like yourself prefer to discriminate based on attitude. I prefer to discriminate based on your ability to play the game and/or follow instructions.

 

All the anti-LFG people are implying that my way is wrong, and your way is right, which is just complete nonsense because they're both right, or both wrong, depending on your world outlook.

 

This whole "community" argument just comes down to same server LFG supporters wanting to be able to discriminate and enforce it on their server, while cross server LFG supporters just want a larger pool of players to pick from to actually play the content.

Edited May 28, 2012 by Gungan

[Senatsu]

Apparently you don't understand the concept of extreme left and right wing examples. If your socializing during a flashpoint or OP are interfering with the group's progress, I expect you to focus more on the game so we can get the job done.

 

Certainly, people who does nothing but talk needs to use the keyboard for something else, and people need to enforce that. No problem here. The only issue are the people that join FP queues purely to piss people off. Doesn't matter if you have "tough skin" or not, the problem is there and if a tool is made that helps those people spread their idiocy then that feature can't be implemented.

[EcrirTwyLar]

Apparently you don't understand the concept of extreme left and right wing examples. If your socializing during a flashpoint or OP is interfering with the group's progress, I expect you to focus more on the game so we can get the job done.

 

You're under the impression that because you cannot deal with someone with an abrasive attitude, that other people cannot, and their experience in the game would also be ruined. That is simply not true. For people who dote on the community so much, it sure sounds like you need better people skills.

 

Actually you are pretty much proving our point. Whether someone is a bad player or they are a jerk, you should have the option to not group with them again.

 

I once entered a dungeon using the LFG tool in WoW. I was the healer. There was a solo tank and the other three players were all dps and were from the same guild (They queued together obviously). One of the dps people rolled on a tanking item and won it. The tank called BS and I agreed. The three dps people laughed at him and said "Too bad, we don't care." When he said he wasn't moving until he got the tanking item, they tried to vote him out of the group (Which means we would get the next tank in the queue). But they needed my vote to kick him. I refused. Eventually they started pulling and trying to get us all killed.

 

That is what you have to look forward to with a X-Server LFG tool. I had many other experiences like this. The most common thing is people staying in the group just long enough to see if that one item they want drops. If not, they bail on the group.