PvP: State of the Union

[QuiJonPed]

Open World PVP worked fine in WAR, I had a blast in the tier tier 2/3/4 areas.

 

If they've pulled WAR devs over, I am at a loss as to why they cannot implement ONE single open world "RVR" area where you siege keeps, sorry bases, using walkers etc.

 

You know, capture strategic points... pour resources into a global pot to spawn a walker; escort said walker to enemy base and blow it the **** up. As a reward, you receive WZ Comms etc.

 

Players can also acquire field combat weapons (orbital strikes, mortars, anti personal turrets etc.) from their base once they spawn (they'd spawn automatically once you've reached a certain resource level). These can be carried as a deployment beacon, and placed in the RVR zone.

 

Think: Battle for Hoth.

Edited May 18, 2012 by QuiJonPed

[DarthOvertone]

The problem is that the so-called pro hardcore pvp crowd bellyached and whined the loudest about the best effort at open world pvp yet--the Rakghoul plague.

 

I saw nothing but pleasant surprise and praise from the PvP community for the OPvP that occurred indirectly during the Rakghoul Plague. Keep in mind that the Rakghoul event wasn't intended by the Devs to spark OPvP. The Devs seemed to be as surprised as anyone that fun OPvP happened. lol

 

More events like Rakghoul are not only encouraged, but needed. I don't think there is a PvPer in SWTOR that would dispute that. Good times: http://bit.ly/Lk5LUN

Edited May 18, 2012 by DarthOvertone

[Krenzik]

I saw nothing but pleasant surprise and praise from the PvP community for the OPvP that occurred indirectly during the Rakghoul Plague. Keep in mind that the Rakghoul event wasn't intended by the Devs to spark OPvP. The Devs seemed to be as surprised as anyone that fun OPvP happened. lol

 

More events like Rakghoul are not only encouraged, but needed. I don't think there is a PvPer in SWTOR that would dispute that. Good times: http://bit.ly/Lk5LUN

 

I'm not saying there wasn't a lot of positive feedback. There certainly was which means there will be more events like this in the future. Tha'ts a big plus. The demographic I'm referring to are those who have also been vocal about the following:

 

>Outrage that rewards were reverted back to what they were in pvp pre-1.2

>Feeling entitled to treat others like garbage and leave warzones anytime they wish with no deserter penalty because they don't feel the rest of their team isn't up to their "leet" standards.

>Wanting the ability to kick any player for any reason

>That resolve isn't a flawed and broken system

 

These are the people who were initially catered to with 1.2 pvp, and they were the ones who most often vented angrily about the rakghoul event imposing on their warzone experience, and disregarded the true, wide open free range pvp the event provided.

[V-Serp]

I'm not saying there wasn't a lot of positive feedback. There certainly was which means there will be more events like this in the future. Tha'ts a big plus. The demographic I'm referring to are those who have also been vocal about the following:

 

>Outrage that rewards were reverted back to what they were in pvp pre-1.2

>Feeling entitled to treat others like garbage and leave warzones anytime they wish with no deserter penalty because they don't feel the rest of their team isn't up to their "leet" standards.

>Wanting the ability to kick any player for any reason

>That resolve isn't a flawed and broken system

 

These are the people who were initially catered to with 1.2 pvp, and they were the ones who most often vented angrily about the rakghoul event imposing on their warzone experience, and disregarded the true, wide open free range pvp the event provided.

 

What is the point of your post. Do you want someone to pat you on the head and say "there there, you're better than those other people?" Why pay $15 a month to make strawman arguments and rage at people?

[Tkara]

I think SWG did it right in the beginning. i had a blast.

 

Yup, me too!

 

Defending the 3 cities and/or hitting Restuss was a lot of fun.

 

And hey, it was all about fighting the other faction, not the same faction. lol

[mikedee]

Do something like lineage 2 with castle sieges but do planet sieges. Each planet is available to be attacked once or twice a week for a 3 hour period. Who ever captures it defends it against the other faction/guilds that attack it. The guilds of the server actually could hold them so there were bragging rights. Have some planet fights at the same time so people had to decide what they wanted. Of course have the planets create money or crafting bonuses to the faction/guild that holds it. This was the best world PvP i have experienced in any game.

[Omega-one]

I saw nothing but pleasant surprise and praise from the PvP community for the OPvP that occurred indirectly during the Rakghoul Plague. Keep in mind that the Rakghoul event wasn't intended by the Devs to spark OPvP. The Devs seemed to be as surprised as anyone that fun OPvP happened. lol

 

More events like Rakghoul are not only encouraged, but needed. I don't think there is a PvPer in SWTOR that would dispute that. Good times: http://bit.ly/Lk5LUN

 

damn i missed this one (RL stuff) that looks just awesome

[Mawduce]

or world pvp could be... you know... the ENTIRE WORLD! not just a playground somewhere

[Bbizzle]

I hate referencing Wow but they have it right.. Server merges and cross server pvp is the answer.. Take 30 light servers and turn it into 15 medium servers. Make out a few battlegroups and POOF problem solved.. Except for the need to double the WZ map list.. This is a good game with alot of potential.. If only someone at BW would use their brains, or drop the pride enough to listen to their players, This game can still be saved......

 

No, if its 30 light servers, make it 8-10 heavy/full. making medium servers is just asking for 5ish of them to have to experiece another dying server again.

[Omega-one]

did some more WZs today..just couldnt do more than 3..so...blah...

[Dodgefella]

Yup, me too!

 

Defending the 3 cities and/or hitting Restuss was a lot of fun.

 

And hey, it was all about fighting the other faction, not the same faction. lol

yep SWG had it right...and just wanted to add the rank buffs were a good idea also...I loved dropping generals airstrikes just at the right time

[Renita]

I simply do not understand what people are talking about. For starters, at launch the only pvp wow had was pvp servers open world pvp. And when they introduced battlegrounds initially the only one they had was capture the flag and the queues were awful, although the game was quite fun. Now, a decade later, of course they have a lot of pvp content and cross server queues that generally take little to no time.

 

At launch swtor had 3 interesting warzones with huttball being a unique twist on capture the flag. And now, less than a year after launch we have a 4th warzone. This proves bioware can come up with new content in a short period of time.

 

And for open world pvp, it's what your server makes of it, Ilum didn't work because players didn't make it work. It was a great concept but unfortunately what happened was(at least on my server), people just wanted to huddle in the middle and collect missiles on the ground, killing the one or two opponents who dared come when mid was being controlled by the opposing faction. Every now and then, you would get 2 full ops of opposing factions battling it out, and it was amazing, but ultimately the losing team would end up leaving and it would be a long wait before another battle would occur. This is the players' fault, not Bioware's.

 

As for open world on a pvp server, same thing, if pvp is not happening on your server, its not bioware's fault. If you want to do more than just go to low level areas, then get an op together and go to the opposing faction's daily quest hubs and raid them.

 

As for the low pop servers, I know it sucks, but it may be in your best interest to reroll on a high pop server. On the ebonhawk (rp, est) we have a good pvp community, and generally short queues, but I am sure there are even better servers if you shop around to find the best pvp server.

[GodKilla]

I simply do not understand what people are talking about. For starters, at launch the only pvp wow had was pvp servers open world pvp. And when they introduced battlegrounds initially the only one they had was capture the flag and the queues were awful, although the game was quite fun. Now, a decade later, of course they have a lot of pvp content and cross server queues that generally take little to no time.

 

At launch swtor had 3 interesting warzones with huttball being a unique twist on capture the flag. And now, less than a year after launch we have a 4th warzone. This proves bioware can come up with new content in a short period of time.

 

And for open world pvp, it's what your server makes of it, Ilum didn't work because players didn't make it work. It was a great concept but unfortunately what happened was(at least on my server), people just wanted to huddle in the middle and collect missiles on the ground, killing the one or two opponents who dared come when mid was being controlled by the opposing faction. Every now and then, you would get 2 full ops of opposing factions battling it out, and it was amazing, but ultimately the losing team would end up leaving and it would be a long wait before another battle would occur. This is the players' fault, not Bioware's.

 

As for open world on a pvp server, same thing, if pvp is not happening on your server, its not bioware's fault. If you want to do more than just go to low level areas, then get an op together and go to the opposing faction's daily quest hubs and raid them.

 

As for the low pop servers, I know it sucks, but it may be in your best interest to reroll on a high pop server. On the ebonhawk (rp, est) we have a good pvp community, and generally short queues, but I am sure there are even better servers if you shop around to find the best pvp server.

 

Actually the first battleground for WOW was not WG (CTF) it was Alterac Valley.

 

WoW Vanilla, and Vanilla ranked BGs were the funnest I had in WoW, other then that its crap once they put in arena

 

Some will say DAOC or WAR for best Open World PVP, but those are still nothing compared to the scale of Shadowbane. R.I.P

Edited May 19, 2012 by GodKilla

[Krenzik]

What is the point of your post. Do you want someone to pat you on the head and say "there there, you're better than those other people?" Why pay $15 a month to make strawman arguments and rage at people?

 

Must have hit a nerve. My point is that what we refer to as the "hardcore" crowd really doesn't want open world pvp or any experiences that make even the pve'ers want to give pvp a shot through open-world. Obviously most of the customer base isn't like that, hence the grumbling from the self-proclaimed elites.

[MWidowmaker]

people need incentive to open world pvp.

if they attempt it and keep getting crushed by loudmouthed epeen trashtalking douchebags, then why on earth would they ever want to do it again?

[mikedee]

people need incentive to open world pvp.

if they attempt it and keep getting crushed by loudmouthed epeen trashtalking douchebags, then why on earth would they ever want to do it again?

 

If you can't take being defeated. How can you defeat others? It takes time to L2P. You just don't get to show up and kill people. L2P kill the "epeen trashtalking dbags".

 

You will like the feeling after you do it once. Starting the whole reward process right there. When you can farm them and if it isn't rewarding enough on its own. Don't world PvP. But then you should probally roll on a PvE server. So those same people don't gank you.

 

I sit and gank everyone at the Black Hole nowadays. No wz PvP q's before 5pm. So this is how I get my PvP in. Winning 1v3's and keeping multiple people trapped in their base is a ton of fun. For me at least. They will qq on me. Try to pull me into turrents. Killing people is the reward. Not getting gear.

[Krenzik]

people need incentive to open world pvp.

if they attempt it and keep getting crushed by loudmouthed epeen trashtalking douchebags, then why on earth would they ever want to do it again?

 

I'd be for a commendation drop or accumulation toward a daily/weekly taht results in comm rewards, but even so, you just described what warzones are. It's sad.

[Omega-one]

I just watched the 1.3 update from IGN..not a single mention to PvP at all other than you will be able to augment all gear int he game..great...no more content.

[KhalDrogoe]

This thread goes through each patch and how they've only had ONE patch that benefitted PvP (and it was very minimal at that)

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=434107

[DarthKhaos]

Mr OP, they HAD open world PVP. It was called Ilum. It was a disaster at launch and their subsequent patch later drove everyone away from there. They completely killed interested in Ilum when they REMOVED the daily and weekly quests for that area.

 

SWTOR HAD OPEN WORLD PVP. THEY KILLED IT!

 

I know new subscribers don't know what happened before, but if I see another noob talking about how great open world PVP would be, I will scream. I wish they would sticky the threads about Illum then maybe people would stop asking for a dead theme.

The sad fact is different people have different views what open world pvp is. To some is the ability to gank people much lower level than them. For others it's having superior numbers ensuring a "win". In the rare case it's about finding a challenge in players of their level with a chance of losing and coming out on top.

 

BioWare didn't kill Ilum. The players did. Yes there were oversights but it was the players who exploited and made it not fun for others. And don't tell me well BioWare should of made sure the exploits are not there. The inconsiderate cheaters are to blame as far as I'm concerned.

[NuSeC]

I hate referencing Wow but they have it right.. Server merges and cross server pvp is the answer.. Take 30 light servers and turn it into 15 medium servers. Make out a few battlegroups and POOF problem solved.. Except for the need to double the WZ map list.. This is a good game with alot of potential.. If only someone at BW would use their brains, or drop the pride enough to listen to their players, This game can still be saved......

 

If they put the server I am on with another server of equal player base... It would still be dead. 13 people on fleet @ 8 pm!

 

They would need to combine at minimum 10 servers into 1 if they are in the same shape as the one I am on now... and that would still not be a beastmode PVP server. However, it would be a lot better then it is now. I really want this game to last... Hell I love the game but the lack of any thought by the developers for helping people in the situation I am in at the time being is ridicules. I put a lot of time into my toons and for me not being able to play them is just sad. Alas... I am not the only one in this position, not even close.

[MWidowmaker]

If you can't take being defeated. How can you defeat others? It takes time to L2P. You just don't get to show up and kill people. L2P kill the "epeen trashtalking dbags".

 

You will like the feeling after you do it once. Starting the whole reward process right there. When you can farm them and if it isn't rewarding enough on its own. Don't world PvP. But then you should probally roll on a PvE server. So those same people don't gank you.

 

I sit and gank everyone at the Black Hole nowadays. No wz PvP q's before 5pm. So this is how I get my PvP in. Winning 1v3's and keeping multiple people trapped in their base is a ton of fun. For me at least. They will qq on me. Try to pull me into turrents. Killing people is the reward. Not getting gear.

 

losing isnt the issue, the loudmouthed epeen douchebags are

getting gear should be a part of getting better, you honestly think that having no chance of at least getting comms to fight that guy in full WH gear when you are barely sc****** by with normal pve gear is incentive? getting gear goes hand in hand with getting better, evening the odds by having you work to a respectable set of BM gear should be enough incentive

most people generally dont like associating with those kinds of aholes, and if they outnumber normal people, its a big turnoff, and then you have less people to pvp with, what you end up with is some small inbred derp community that really no one likes or wants to be a part of, fewer wz pops, then you lose out on people who might be persuaded to partake and enjoy the content.... sounds like a lose/lose situation to me

i lost plenty when i first started to pvp, but i only do enough to get my dailies/weeklies done, pvp really is nothing more than a timekiller for me

now i win more than i lose

ganking is for scumbags, farming lowbies to get your kicks... its why i will never roll on a pvp server

Edited May 22, 2012 by MWidowmaker

[NuSeC]

losing isnt the issue, the loudmouthed epeen douchebags are

getting gear should be a part of getting better, you honestly think that having no chance of at least getting comms to fight that guy in full WH gear when you are barely sc****** by with normal pve gear is incentive? getting gear goes hand in hand with getting better, evening the odds by having you work to a respectable set of BM gear should be enough incentive

most people generally dont like associating with those kinds of aholes, and if they outnumber normal people, its a big turnoff, and then you have less people to pvp with, what you end up with is some small inbred derp community that really no one likes or wants to be a part of, fewer wz pops, then you lose out on people who might be persuaded to partake and enjoy the content.... sounds like a lose/lose situation to me

i lost plenty when i first started to pvp, but i only do enough to get my dailies/weeklies done, pvp really is nothing more than a timekiller for me

now i win more than i lose

ganking is for scumbags, farming lowbies to get your kicks... its why i will never roll on a pvp server

 

Yeah, I sort of agree on the point about ganking lowbies... I was never much into that and I play on a PVP server. I remember being lvl 36 on an alt and being ganked by 3 50s a couple times while I was trying to complete a class mission and be done with the world as it was the last mission on the planet. After I turned 50 I had no desire to return the favor (plenty of chances) as it is kind of lame IMHO I would actually feel bad for it lol. I mean what is the point other than to grief someone... there is no skill involved in that situation.

 

I will say it was fun watching my guildies show up with 7 50s to ROFL stomp them after I let them know what was going on. In the end it is just part of being on a pvp server so you deal with it.

 

To each their own. :-)

[DarthLightSide]

Just take a page out of Shadowbane's or Darkfall's book and simply have a few places on each planet (similiar to Den on Tat) but instead of just random "open" pvp....implement something to be contested over with a 3-6 hour window. Shadowbane had mines with 6 hour or 12 hour I can't recall timers. Basically you could open the world map, mouse over said mine and see it was going to be open in 30minutes for contested claim/defend time. You get your guildies together....and go PK anyone who was there and try to claim it. Sometimes there were 3 guys there...or sometimes there would be a whole guild there with 50+ people to try to claim a mine. BTW...the mines/nodes while owned would deliver X amount of gold/credits or crafting material over time and it would be deposited into the guild bank.

 

So ya...BW likes their instancing so much...and this would be easy to implement while adding "open world" pvp...encourage guild organization for gvg pvp...and boost the interaction between all in the community. It would be glorious!

[VoidJustice]

Just take a page out of Shadowbane's or Darkfall's book and simply have a few places on each planet (similiar to Den on Tat) but instead of just random "open" pvp....implement something to be contested over with a 3-6 hour window. Shadowbane had mines with 6 hour or 12 hour I can't recall timers. Basically you could open the world map, mouse over said mine and see it was going to be open in 30minutes for contested claim/defend time. You get your guildies together....and go PK anyone who was there and try to claim it. Sometimes there were 3 guys there...or sometimes there would be a whole guild there with 50+ people to try to claim a mine. BTW...the mines/nodes while owned would deliver X amount of gold/credits or crafting material over time and it would be deposited into the guild bank.

 

So ya...BW likes their instancing so much...and this would be easy to implement while adding "open world" pvp...encourage guild organization for gvg pvp...and boost the interaction between all in the community. It would be glorious!

 

Even thou that would be great... in the end... it would be too little too late. That being said... your idea... PLUS random spawn roving World Bosses in Pvp area's... PLUS degrading gear... or hell lets just call it... LOOTABLE GEAR.. or even LOOTABLE DEGRADING gear... plus player cities... plus player attackable harvesters... plus plus plus.. and yea ... player run shops too... then I'd be excited... right now... meh...

 

Contested Resources + Crafting + Faction Warfare + Player destructable world objects (harvesters) + Roving World Bosses + GIANT NEW WARZONES (oldskool AV style) + NEW PLANETS that are ALL PVP AREA's + New level cap + New player stories + Pvp Open World End Game at level 60.

 

EVEN THEN... how would you get the subs that were flee'ing without marketing your litteral backside off...

 

This may be the end of SciFi MMO's all together and with all EA's might we can't even get a Mod or Dev to tell us if they plan on even 1 new Wz in the next year... /weep

Edited May 22, 2012 by VoidJustice