Someone explain the LFG tool hate?

[Kemosobe]

Yep, you got me. It's a quality of life feature that I'm used to. However, you're also wrong. I know I can live without it, but I choose not to.

 

Read that far and stopped caring. If you simply choose not to live without it, then go back to an MMO that has it and stop complaining that this MMO needs to conform to be a replica of every other MMO on the market simply for your sake of living.

[Skidrowbro]

Unfortunatly for you... change is coming to Swtor... many of them that the devs said they would NOT put into the game...

xserver PVP queues (in game 1.3)

same server PVE queues (in game 1.3)

Combat logs logs (in game 1.2)

 

Its funny that your sig says what it does... its like you need DBM to tell you the train that is change is coming to Swtor and no matter how long you stand in front of it... its not going to stop.

These changes are factual, not some prediction... they were NEVER to be implemented into Swtor per the devs... and less than 4 months after launch... here they are.

Its not rocket science to see the company is run by numbers... the numbers want what they want... and BIG SUPRISE, you (the vocal minority) are being ignored because the numbers that drive the game want what they want.

 

You have fought a good fight, but there are just too many that want these things in their games now days... the proof is in what BW has already done that they swore for years they would never do...

It doesn't take a physic to see that this trend will continue...

 

Wow, something that I can agree with you on. I already know they will. Money talks. Bioware can say no all they want but EA will say yes. And I know where my money will not be going and this will probably be the last online game that I will pay to play. I can get everything out of single player games that WoW, Rift, DDO, LotR have to offer.

[Skidrowbro]

Find me an RP server more highly populated than the one I'm on and I'll move.

 

Hint: I'm on the highest populated RP server.

 

Sorry, I won't hold your hand.

 

And judging by your attitude here on these forums, it's pretty easy to figure out why you aren't getting groups.

 

Hint: Try being nice to other players and they might remove you from their ignore list

Edited May 3, 2012 by Skidrowbro

[Kemosobe]

Wow, something that I can agree with you on. I already know they will. Money talks. Bioware can say no all they want but EA will say yes. And I know where my money will not be going and this will probably be the last online game that I will pay to play. I can get everything out of single player games that WoW, Rift, DDO, LotR have to offer.

 

Yup, I was saying pre-early access that the first time Bioware adds simplicity to this game that I am leaving. If I wanted easy in an MMO, I would go back to WoW. Guess EA just wants SW:TOR to become another flawed replica that dies in a fire while shouting, "WE REGRET NOTHING!!"

Edited May 3, 2012 by Kemosobe

[DarthTHC]

Read that far and stopped caring. If you simply choose not to live without it, then go back to an MMO that has it and stop complaining that this MMO needs to conform to be a replica of every other MMO on the market simply for your sake of living.

 

That's exactly what I said I would do.

 

And if you had read further or do some thinking about it, you would also see that such a move, on a large scale, is very bad for this game.

 

If this game fails to implement features that the majority of the MMO audience expects, it will never be more than a niche player. It will be SWG all over again. Or I suppose they could innovate, but if the best they have is voiceovers, that's not going to cut it.

 

It does disappoint me. Except for the tedium of finding a group, I love this game. I'd love to keep paying to play. I just won't pay to wait.

[Jaxarale]

Yup, I was saying pre-early access that the first time Bioware adds simplicity to this game that I am leaving. If I wanted easy in an MMO, I would go back to WoW.

 

Bye bye...

 

Can I have your stuff?

[DarthTHC]

Sorry, I won't hold your hand.

 

And judging by your attitude here on these forums, it's pretty easy to figure out why you aren't getting groups.

 

Hint: Try being nice to other players and they might remove you from their ignore list

 

Please add me to your ignore list. It would be the first time for me ever to be on one!

 

You haven't a clue whether or not I'm getting groups. You haven't a clue how successful those groups might or might not be, if and when I'm getting them.

[Kemosobe]

That's exactly what I said I would do.

 

And if you had read further or do some thinking about it, you would also see that such a move, on a large scale, is very bad for this game.

 

If this game fails to implement features that the majority of the MMO audience expects, it will never be more than a niche player. It will be SWG all over again. Or I suppose they could innovate, but if the best they have is voiceovers, that's not going to cut it.

 

It does disappoint me. Except for the tedium of finding a group, I love this game. I'd love to keep paying to play. I just won't pay to wait.

 

Funny how you bring up SWG seeing as everyone loved it before they nerfed the crap out of it to appeal to the WoW crowd. Just like this game, everyone still playing it loves it and will leave once they start catering to the wow crowd. Simply because an MMO does not have 300 million players does not at all mean it is a bad game. If that were true, then WoW was a crap game up until Wrath. And every other MMO ever released was complete garbage because they were only catering to the crowd they wanted instead of every single man, woman, and child on the planet.

[Skirata_Kal]

Read that far and stopped caring. If you simply choose not to live without it, then go back to an MMO that has it and stop complaining that this MMO needs to conform to be a replica of every other MMO on the market simply for your sake of living.

 

You sure love mischaracterizing everyone you disagree with lol. No one is asking for ToR to become a copy of WoW or any other game. If it did become an exact copy then your advice to go to those games would be good (in fact I'd have done so without even posting a thing on this forum). Some MMO's have done some good things though and this thread is about a tool that did a great deal of good when added to to another MMO. Requesting that tool in this game is not the same as asking for this game to become a clone of another MMO (of course you know that, you're just trolling, but it's still fun lol). If you have the opinion that the tool didn't do good in other MMO's then you are certainly entitled to your opinion at which point we should just simply agree to disagree at this point (and yes, I know that's not happening lol).

[Skidrowbro]

You haven't a clue whether or not I'm getting groups.

 

Except you've been arguing the fact that you aren't getting groups

[DarthTHC]

Funny how you bring up SWG seeing as everyone loved it before they nerfed the crap out of it to appeal to the WoW crowd. Just like this game, everyone still playing it loves it and will leave once they start catering to the wow crowd. Simply because an MMO does not have 300 million players does not at all mean it is a bad game. If that were true, then WoW was a crap game up until Wrath. And every other MMO ever released was complete garbage because they were only catering to the crowd they wanted instead of every single man, woman, and child on the planet.

 

I just don't see how a tool that eliminates tedium... in a game... can possibly damage the game.

 

"Hey, they changed this red light by my house to be 60 seconds long instead of 120 seconds. But I hate that, so I'm going to sit there through an extra 60 seconds of green light to keep it REAL." *brofist*

 

Perhaps I lack logic or imagination?

[DarthTHC]

Except you've been arguing the fact that you aren't getting groups

 

No. I'm arguing the fact that I'm spending more time waiting to get into groups than doing group content.

 

I have posted several examples in this thread of times I've been in groups.

[Skidrowbro]

You sure love mischaracterizing everyone you disagree with lol. No one is asking for ToR to become a copy of WoW or any other game. If it did become an exact copy then your advice to go to those games would be good (in fact I'd have done so without even posting a thing on this forum). Some MMO's have done some good things though and this thread is about a tool that did a great deal of good when added to to another MMO. Requesting that tool in this game is not the same as asking for this game to become a clone of another MMO (of course you know that, you're just trolling, but it's still fun lol). If you have the opinion that the tool didn't do good in other MMO's then you are certainly entitled to your opinion at which point we should just simply agree to disagree at this point (and yes, I know that's not happening lol).

 

You say it did wonderrs. I disagree. The dungeons and raids that I enjoyed doing became boring AOE fests because the new wave on none mmorpg players couldn't handle group concepts. All the challenge was ripped out of WoW just so they could have what? 10 millions subs. 10 millions screaming 14 year old girls love Justin Bieber. You gonna go out and buy all his albums?

Edited May 3, 2012 by Skidrowbro

[Kemosobe]

I just don't see how a tool that eliminates tedium... in a game... can possibly damage the game.

 

"Hey, they changed this red light by my house to be 60 seconds long instead of 120 seconds. But I hate that, so I'm going to sit there through an extra 60 seconds of green light to keep it REAL." *brofist*

 

Perhaps I lack logic or imagination?

 

You lack logic in understanding that there already is a LFG tool in the game and refuse to accept that, if people were to actually start using it, the game would not be "tedious" as you claim it to be. You do not need to be paired up with every single other person in the game in order to find groups, and all this does is destroy communities.

 

A much more accurate example is that you want to have a neighborhood party, but not a lot of people in your neighborhood can do it at the time you want, so you call in people from outside your neighborhood simply so you can have your party when you want to have it. Where is the neighborhood community in a get together that doesn't involve the neighborhood? If you do not like your neighbors and want them to be more active, are you going to run around screaming that they need to change or move to a better neighborhood?

Edited May 3, 2012 by Kemosobe

[Jaxarale]

I just don't see how a tool that eliminates tedium... in a game... can possibly damage the game.

 

It cant...

It never has...

It never will...

 

They are now just arguing for the sake of arguing...

 

You lack logic in understanding that there already is a LFG tool in the game and refuse to accept that, if people were to actually start using it, the game would not be "tedious" as you claim it to be.

 

You seem to lack the logic that there is already an automated LFG coming in 1.3... you keep on and keep on running this same exact thing through the wash... IT DOESNT MATTER.. the current LFG is being scrapped!!! Get it? Got it? Good!

 

You do not need to be paired up with every single other person in the game in order to find groups, and all this does is destroy communities.

 

Again... no proof whatsoever of this claim anywhere at all... ever.

 

You say it did wonderrs. I disagree.

 

The company that put out the game and is making billions a year thinks it did wonders too... your disagreement means nothing in the big picture.

Edited May 3, 2012 by Jaxarale

[Skidrowbro]

It cant......

 

Happened in WoW

 

It never has......

 

WoW went from a decently challenging game to a Hello Kitty Playland

 

It never will.........

 

See above

 

They are now just arguing for the sake of arguing...

 

That is a negative

Edited May 3, 2012 by Skidrowbro

[Bluerodian]

You lack logic in understanding that there already is a LFG tool in the game and refuse to accept that, if people were to actually start using it, the game would not be "tedious" as you claim it to be. You do not need to be paired up with every single other person in the game in order to find groups, and all this does is destroy communities.

 

And I'm calling in to question the very existence of this community to begin with. What community are you referring to? So far all I've seen are individuals going about their business with little to no interaction with anyone else. There is no common goal that unites the so-called community together in to a common driving force. Ninja-looting still happens. Bad behavior still happens. Neither is punished or gives the recipients of such bad behavior any recourse, such as it is with or without the LFG tool.

 

It's being spouted over and over that LFG destroys community and I'm calling BS on the very existence of community to protect from destruction.

 

There are guilds, of course, but guilds will continue to be guilds with or without the LFG tool so they are irrelevant to this discussion.

 

So let me ask you what exactly it is you're trying to protect here? Not you in the specific sense mind you, but you in the general anti-LFG sense.

Edited May 3, 2012 by Bluerodian

[Kemosobe]

You seem to lack the logic that there is already an automated LFG coming in 1.3... you keep on and keep on running this same exact thing through the wash... IT DOESNT MATTER.. the current LFG is being scrapped!!! Get it? Got it? Good!

 

Then why are you still here making yourself look like a fool?

[Skirata_Kal]

You say it did wonderrs. I disagree. The dungeons and raids that I enjoyed doing became boring AOE fests because the new wave on none mmorpg players couldn't handle group concepts. All the challenge was ripped out of WoW just so they could have what? 10 millions subs. 10 millions screaming 14 year old girls love Justin Bieber. You gonna go out and buy all his albums?

 

No, I could be the only person on the planet without a Justin Bieber album and still I wouldn't purchase them lol. Just as I'm no longer one of the 10 million who plays WoW and I have no intention of going back. Not sure what that has to do with this topic.

 

And how did you survive aoe-ing Putricide without having a skilled off tank in the Abomination suit? How did you manage the 'kissing' in the Blood Queen fight while simply aoe-ing. How did you heal Valithria while just using aoe's? How did you survive the Defile in the LK fight while aoe-ing him while Valkyrs were picking up your healers and dps and dropping them off the edge? How did aoe work during the bonestorm phase of Marrowgar? And please show me a video of aoe being used in Deathbringer...i'd love to see that, I'm sure it's entertaining. How did you survive Halion while aoeing him without half the raid entering the portal to damage both of his phases and how did you avoid that rotating beam while aoe-ing? How did you get Yogg down while just aoe-ing him without sending people into the portals and without having them refresh their stacks? How did you aoe Flame Leviathan without getting into the vehicles? How did aoe work with Thaddeus? Horsemen? And I'd really love to see a Youtube video of Instructor Rac being taken down via aoe with no shadow priests MCing (though I did see one of some hunters doing a kite fest).

 

Yep, such an aoe-fest it was

[Jaxarale]

Happened in WoW

 

It did?

 

When LFG was released in December 2009 subs went up to the highest point ever for WoW in the following 10 months to 12.5 million...

 

I'm not a math major but it sure looks like the facts say it did the exact opposite of what you claim...

 

Then why are you still here making yourself look like a fool?

 

LOL... now that is priceless!! The guy ranting and raving about using the LFG tool as is.... meanwhile its been scrapped by the gaming company already and your calling me a fool...

 

Hey pot? Meet kettle...

 

It really gets no better than this!

 

Think we have exhausted any real content in this thread... it was pretty good for 60 pages or so... until people had to start tossing around personal insults and name calling.

 

Thanks for the fun debate guys and gals!

Edited May 3, 2012 by Jaxarale

[Skidrowbro]

So let me ask you what exactly it is you're trying to protect here? Not you in the specific sense mind you, but you in the general anti-LFG sense.

 

The actual genre. To some MMORPG's are a hobby. And some of us are tired of seeing games that we liked get run into the ground. A single server LFG is not what the debate is. It's the cross server and what it brings to these games. Some of us like a challenge. And with cross server as been proven from WoW and Rift cause collapses in groups because randoms just can't seem to get their crap together and learn mechanics of fights

[Bluerodian]

The actual genre. To some MMORPG's are a hobby. And some of us are tired of seeing games that we liked get run into the ground. A single server LFG is not what the debate is. It's the cross server and what it brings to these games. Some of us like a challenge. And with cross server as been proven from WoW and Rift cause collapses in groups because randoms just can't seem to get their crap together and learn mechanics of fights

 

I understand where you're coming from as far as challenge goes. However long ago I accepted, as you should probably accept as well, that I'm a dinosaur and a relic of a bygone era. We either have to adapt to the changing landscape of MMOs or rail against them in utter futility. This is the new reality of the system.

[Muskaan]

The actual genre. To some MMORPG's are a hobby. And some of us are tired of seeing games that we liked get run into the ground. A single server LFG is not what the debate is. It's the cross server and what it brings to these games. Some of us like a challenge. And with cross server as been proven from WoW and Rift cause collapses in groups because randoms just can't seem to get their crap together and learn mechanics of fights

 

The challenge should be in the dungeon itself and not in finding the group. we are trying to come up with a solution which reduces player idle time while they wait to form a group. The way to do it is by increasing the player pool to draw players from for the group. Few servers have a large enough player pool to sustain grouped gameplay with minimum idle time. Most servers don't. The purpose of a cross server LFG is to increase the player pool to help people find groups faster.

 

Why is this so hard to understand? It's simple maths,

[Skirata_Kal]

The actual genre. To some MMORPG's are a hobby. And some of us are tired of seeing games that we liked get run into the ground. A single server LFG is not what the debate is. It's the cross server and what it brings to these games. Some of us like a challenge. And with cross server as been proven from WoW and Rift cause collapses in groups because randoms just can't seem to get their crap together and learn mechanics of fights

 

I too can empathize with that. I certainly don't want anything nerfed (speaking for myself here) in this game, I'm actually quite satisfied with the difficulty of the content that I've seen so far (as I said, I've managed to get some groups and ops). I don't think any of the normal modes anyway are insurmountable so they should be able to leave them as is. And I'll agree that some fo the WoW nerfs did go too far and even that some were unnecessary.

[Muskaan]

The actual genre. To some MMORPG's are a hobby. And some of us are tired of seeing games that we liked get run into the ground. A single server LFG is not what the debate is. It's the cross server and what it brings to these games. Some of us like a challenge. And with cross server as been proven from WoW and Rift cause collapses in groups because randoms just can't seem to get their crap together and learn mechanics of fights

 

You blame LFG and now Cross server LFR to have made WoW easier. It has definitely made WoW more accessible. Getting yourself started on raiding is not as daunting as it was back in Vanilla.

 

But, there's a whole niche bracket -- the heroic raids which are more challenging now than they ever was. So, WoW hasnt been completely neutered like you claim. Blizzard just created a new tier of more casual raiding beneath the hardcore layer.

 

The team work, coordination stuff that you are talking about are still extremely important for heroic fights. Most top guilds in WOW rate Heroic Ragnaros in Firelands as the toughest encounter created in the history of WoW. So, no-- WoW has not been dumbed down to the level of hellokittyonline?