Rustybucket_ Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Just wondering, is anybody having as much of a problem with them as I am? Pre 1.2 they never really concerned me, post 1.2 the burst damage is just silly... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venrale Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 playing a vanguard absolutly nothing has changed in our Burst, in fact it has acctually gone down due to the changes with the Assault/Pyrotech line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krayshawn Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Just wondering, is anybody having as much of a problem with them as I am? Pre 1.2 they never really concerned me, post 1.2 the burst damage is just silly... As a vanguard being my main, the only thing i can think of is multi-key bind as a tank. Using Sticky timed with our NEW Energy blast (all that really changed is that it doesn't respect global cool down) and somthing else eg: Ion pulse or HiB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silkystylez Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 I play a scoundrel healer and I can say that powertechs are the one advance class I have the most problems with. They are hard to kite and their burst is strong. On my server there are a few powertechs that consistently top damage and kills. I am sure these guys probably queue together and coordinate targets but whatever they focus is usually dead in two or three seconds. I know a lot of people complain about marauders but I feel that in comparison they are fine. Just my two cents Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venrale Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 As a vanguard being my main, the only thing i can think of is multi-key bind as a tank. Using Sticky timed with our NEW Energy blast (all that really changed is that it doesn't respect global cool down) and somthing else eg: Ion pulse or HiB. If your specd all the way up to energy blast(Tree cap skill) in sheild than your burst is garbage. Tactics/Prototype and Assualt/Pyrotech both have very good burst Assault line has a higher burst % but Tactics has a more sustained burst. Odds are what your experiancing is more people are testing out the Tactics/Prototype line due to the "nerf" (imo they fixed a broken skill) to Assault line revolving around reseting your high hitting skill, in the Tactics line I can in a matter of seconds pop off 2.5k firepulse,3k stockstrike(free),2k Ion Pulse,3k HiB and then spam Ion Pulse for 1-2k untill that same rotation is back up all the while working in Guts and hammer shots to keep a DoT on you and my ammo up... I was able to do this just as effectivly pre 1.2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antipodes Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 (edited) I play a scoundrel healer and I can say that powertechs are the one advance class I have the most problems with. They are hard to kite and their burst is strong. On my server there are a few powertechs that consistently top damage and kills. I am sure these guys probably queue together and coordinate targets but whatever they focus is usually dead in two or three seconds. I know a lot of people complain about marauders but I feel that in comparison they are fine. Just my two cents From a healer perspective, pyro powertechs do the most scary damage. If one converges on a healer with any other dps class for even a few seconds, it usually leads to a surprisingly swift death. It's silly how little effort is needed for a powertech to do unhealable damage. However, they don't have nearly the defensive CDs that a marauder does, and they go down surprisingly fast. I know which group you are talking about, and the reason they do well is more to do with the lack of good Rep players left on our server. Not saying powertech isn't among the top-tier (marauder, powertech, and tank-assassins), but I still think marauders are better overall. Edited April 25, 2012 by Antipodes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowOfVey Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Powertechs hurt so so very much That is all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varicite Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Just wondering, is anybody having as much of a problem with them as I am? Pre 1.2 they never really concerned me, post 1.2 the burst damage is just silly... You should have seen what we could do pre-1.2 if you think the burst is crazy right now. : ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exphryl Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 You should have seen what we could do pre-1.2 if you think the burst is crazy right now. : ) ^ Pop all Trinkets, get the rare: TD > Flame Burst > rail Shot > Flame Burst> Rail shot > Rocket punch > Railshot. The tears were glorious. Glorious I tell you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boarg Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Not saying powertech isn't among the top-tier (marauder, powertech, and tank-assassins), but I still think marauders are better overall. I agree with you that Marauders are better overall on an individual basis. However, when you start trying to stack a strong class/spec, Powertechs stack better. In a group, only one needs to get a burn up to use Rail Shot. Being ranged helps them get coordinated on targets quicker and with more subtlety. Being ranged and with a grapple helps them control and dictate positioning a lot more than a herd of melee that are forced to chase people. Their burst sets up quicker. Two working together is stronger than the individual value of two summed. Stacking Marauders is pretty much just stacking a good class. Tank-Assassins are the other direction...stacking them tends to be quite ineffective because there's less slots left for classes that actually kill people. Pit a premade with 4 Pyro PT's against a premade with 4 Tank-Assassins... The PT's will melt their faces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghamsar Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Powertechs hurt so so very much That is all Playing as a GSling fights are very weird. You are winning about to destroy them and all of a sudden...you dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antipodes Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 I agree with you that Marauders are better overall on an individual basis. However, when you start trying to stack a strong class/spec, Powertechs stack better. I guess it is hard to say without arenas/rated WZs. Even after rated WZs are released, there aren't enough guilds that will be able to support that type of min/maxing anyways. I think you underestimate how fast Pyro spec'd Powertechs go down. Marauders also have great group utility and cc to go along with their survivability (which also makes them easier to heal in group settings). I agree that Assassins don't scale as well in group PvP. They'll be more useful for objectives rather than winning a head-on group vs group fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krayshawn Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 If your specd all the way up to energy blast(Tree cap skill) in sheild than your burst is garbage. Tactics/Prototype and Assualt/Pyrotech both have very good burst Assault line has a higher burst % but Tactics has a more sustained burst. Odds are what your experiancing is more people are testing out the Tactics/Prototype line due to the "nerf" (imo they fixed a broken skill) to Assault line revolving around reseting your high hitting skill, in the Tactics line I can in a matter of seconds pop off 2.5k firepulse,3k stockstrike(free),2k Ion Pulse,3k HiB and then spam Ion Pulse for 1-2k untill that same rotation is back up all the while working in Guts and hammer shots to keep a DoT on you and my ammo up... I was able to do this just as effectivly pre 1.2. I totally agree that my burst is rubbish. i was just saying a possibility if someone had a good bind down it would offer a once every 15 second burst that OP wasn't expecting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DcyfR Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 I play a scoundrel healer and I can say that powertechs are the one advance class I have the most problems with. They are hard to kite and their burst is strong. On my server there are a few powertechs that consistently top damage and kills. I am sure these guys probably queue together and coordinate targets but whatever they focus is usually dead in two or three seconds. I know a lot of people complain about marauders but I feel that in comparison they are fine. Just my two cents As a powertech scoundrel healer is the hardest class to kill. Just LoS and use your instant dot cleanse. Our damage is all based on that fire dot on you. The dot adds 30% damage to railshot, it adds a snare and railshot will only hit you if you have a dot or stunned. Sure if you are standing in the middle of nowhere and don't have your escape or vanish you may die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astarica Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Powertech basically benefits the most from the 'XYZ is overpowered' syndrone. They're a high DPS low survivality class that's reasonably balanced in the grand scheme of things, but with 1.2 you get: Assassins - Got to kill them because Tankasins are overpowered (this includes Assassins who are not tanks). Marauders - Got to kill them because they're overpowered. Juggs - Got to kill them beacuse I heard they're overpowered. Ops - Got to kill them because Op healer is overpowered (even if they're not a healer). Sniper - Got to kill them because they could be overpowered. 5 out of 8 classes are generally thought of as a higher threat than the Powertecfh (which isn't necessarily true), and one of the remaining classes, Sorc, is generally viewed as an easy kill (because they are). Therefore, the class has an extremely good chance of avoiding attention and dish out their considerable DPS while people are busy to kill the 5 other overpowered class they heard on the Internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fdzzaigl Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 (edited) Assault / Pyro actually got "nerfed", but as expertise increases damage more than it reduces it, that didn't matter. All burst has gone through the roof, and as Pyro / Assault has the best single target burst, stacking Pyro's can be the road to success. Just today I faced a team with 5 Pyro's on it and 3 healers, and even though I play a vanguard myself, I have to say that was a ridiculous combination to face. Everything literally died in seconds. The solution isn't to nerf it even further though (and yes I'm biased), but to reduce the messed up TTK in general to pre-patch levels. Luckily for you imps, there are almost no vanguards around on my server, and our skill tree is bugged anyhow to give less ticks to plasme cell dot etc. Edited April 25, 2012 by Fdzzaigl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antipodes Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Therefore, the class has an extremely good chance of avoiding attention and dish out their considerable DPS while people are busy to kill the 5 other overpowered class they heard on the Internet. Not at all. Choosing a tank assassin or marauder over most other targets is a poor choice because they have a great amount of survivability. Focusing "overpowered classes" first is a really bad strategy. Instead, you should look at how easy the class is to kill or how much damage/healing you can prevent by attacking them (i.e. sorcs and mercs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varicite Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 (edited) Luckily for you imps, there are almost no vanguards around on my server, and our skill tree is bugged anyhow to give less ticks to plasme cell dot etc. While the dot bug does suck, how often does your dot actually last full duration on a target before you refresh it? Because mine doesn't last the whole time usually. That's probably why this bug wasn't even found until we had parses available. /shrug Edited April 25, 2012 by Varicite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fdzzaigl Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 (edited) While the dot bug does suck, how often does your dot actually last full duration on a target before you refresh it? Because mine doesn't last the whole time usually. That's probably why this bug wasn't even found until we had parses available. /shrug Idd, but it's just pissing me off that there are again differences in functionality between Empire and Republic that go unfixed for weeks. Assault is not even the main one, I play tactics way more often: our 70% slow from pulse cannon does not work, our 50% damage bonus is instead a 20% bonus and affects unrelated abilities (sticky grenade / mortar volley) and our movement speed buff from HEC often just plain doesn't work either. And what I said about there being few vanguards is a reality on my server: we couldn't even form a team of assault vanguards if we wanted to. Edited April 25, 2012 by Fdzzaigl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varicite Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Idd, but it's just pissing me off that there are again differences in functionality between Empire and Republic that go unfixed for weeks. Assault is not even the main one, I play tactics way more often: our 70% slow from pulse cannon does not work, our 50% damage bonus is instead a 20% bonus and affects unrelated abilities (sticky grenade / mortar volley) and our movement speed buff from HEC often just plain doesn't work either. And what I said about there being few vanguards is a reality on my server: we couldn't even form a team of assault vanguards if we wanted to. I fully agree that it's lame that the "mirrors" are still not mirrors, even after all this time. I feel bad when I beat up Vanguards, because let's face it, they literally are a weaker version of my class. I just didn't think that THIS particular bug was all that terrible. : ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovia Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Here is a mini-guide on how to counter Pyrotech powertechs/assault vanguards with a scoundrel and i am fairly certain these tricks will apply to every healer provided he has a way to remove tech debuffs. I main a vanguard and have a scoundrel alt (yes both 50 something like 35 days played between those two) so i use the terminology of those instead of the powertech/operative one. Triage a 4.5sec cd skill removes both assault plastique (15sec cd hits for anything between 2k-4k) and the two dots the vanguard uses to cast high impact bolt on your so if you time it right with the current high impact bolt inner cooldwon you can pretty much not die to one before he runs out of ammo. Especially if you remove incidiary round and he reapplies it there is no way he can come up with the ammo to defeat you. just look for the assault plastique debuff and remove it and from that point on spam triage on every cooldown till he stops bothering you. The same applies for commando and sage healers (with talented restoration) you can negate the burst of an assault vanguard/powertech pyro if you use the skill properly and run him out of ammo pretty fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovia Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 While the dot bug does suck, how often does your dot actually last full duration on a target before you refresh it? Because mine doesn't last the whole time usually. That's probably why this bug wasn't even found until we had parses available. /shrug The problem isnt the last tick, its the first tick that doesnt do damage effectively removing from the damage that would be done by your Ion pulse if the dot re-applied and ticked. (flame burst for PT) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varicite Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 (edited) The problem isnt the last tick, its the first tick that doesnt do damage effectively removing from the damage that would be done by your Ion pulse if the dot re-applied and ticked. (flame burst for PT) Y'know, when I heard about the bug, that's exactly what I said about it. It's even more problematic because the first tick is the one that comes coupled w/ High-Impact Bolt (Rail Shot) refreshes, so you're losing out on something like 600-1k damage PER HIB (not to mention each Ion Pulse). At least that's the way I understood it. Someone made sure to swear up and down that it was only the last tick that was missing, and as I play a PT, I couldn't exactly test it myself so I made the grave mistake of believing someone on an internet forum. :c Edited April 25, 2012 by Varicite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kehtal Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 So how come this isn't a nerf Pyrotech thread? WHOAWHOAWHOASTOP. No, no, hold on. I'm not calling for it. I die to them too, but, unlike 85% of the people in this forum I'm able to, you know, accept that. Scary, huh. Anyway, this thread is clear evidence that sent/maras are not the only class that tears up squishies with scary efficiency. And Powertechs can even do it from range. PvP Forum logic follows that there should be a mob around here with torches and pitchforks hungry for some Powertech nerfin. Jussayin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varicite Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 So how come this isn't a nerf Pyrotech thread? WHOAWHOAWHOASTOP. No, no, hold on. I'm not calling for it. I die to them too, but, unlike 85% of the people in this forum I'm able to, you know, accept that. Scary, huh. Anyway, this thread is clear evidence that sent/maras are not the only class that tears up squishies with scary efficiency. And Powertechs can even do it from range. PvP Forum logic follows that there should be a mob around here with torches and pitchforks hungry for some Powertech nerfin. Jussayin. But we die easy and we just got nerfed. :c Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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