1.2.0c Ninja Arsenal Nerf?

[Jeighkub]

So it's patch day. Not only do we not get a hotfix so that Heatseeker will work off our own heat signatures but there is also no dev post in this thread that has 100 replies and closing in on 8000 views.

 

Oh BioWare, the funny thing is that I am actually not surprised at all.

 

Such a reputation you have built for yourself over this launch of this game.

Edited April 24, 2012 by Jeighkub

[witchdoctaah]

What ^^ said!

[MrSIlverSurfing]

I'm tired of talking about things and the development team not listening. I'm just going to save my money. I will now have an extra $30 a month to bump up my cable TV service..

[Wrestle]

One account expired today, this account here has a few days left. Just saved 2.46 gig on my computer, game just uninstalled. Have fun paying $15 a month to get continually stomped in PVP.

[Somled]

I only do pvp... i have a mix of war hero and battlemaster gear and around 1200 expertise... im valor rank 84 so i have played my merc for some time now and i would say that i know what im doing...

 

I do competetive damage in wz but that is mainly because im using my ae abilitys smart i can pull 500k+ damage in void star...

 

When it comes to 1v1 situations or single target dps whatsoever i feel like all my burst gone up in smoke.. with 5 heatsigs up i rarly crit above 3k and even tho there was a bugfix in 1,2c my hsm have never been so week (10% buff anyone? ) i cant get out of my head that something is wrong and if theres nothing wrong we rly need balancing

 

Hands down im sure i do rly crappy dps compared to any class at equal gearlevel!

 

I rly love pvp and with 8mans coming up i pray u help me fix this ( and many with me) or im gonna be left wo a team !

[Wrestle]

I only do pvp... i have a mix of war hero and battlemaster gear and around 1200 expertise... im valor rank 84 so i have played my merc for some time now and i would say that i know what im doing...

 

I do competetive damage in wz but that is mainly because im using my ae abilitys smart i can pull 500k+ damage in void star...

 

When it comes to 1v1 situations or single target dps whatsoever i feel like all my burst gone up in smoke.. with 5 heatsigs up i rarly crit above 3k and even tho there was a bugfix in 1,2c my hsm have never been so week (10% buff anyone? ) i cant get out of my head that something is wrong and if theres nothing wrong we rly need balancing

 

Hands down im sure i do rly crappy dps compared to any class at equal gearlevel!

 

I rly love pvp and with 8mans coming up i pray u help me fix this ( and many with me) or im gonna be left wo a team !

 

I'm in the exact same situation. I have 4 pieces of war hero and the crit crafted war hero schematic gear atm. My expertiese is 1289 or so. My single target DPS is non existent. I never have been able to pull 500k, but I can pull 350k if everyone is grouped up tight for my AEs. It is a rarity, because its not my play style. In all honesty I have been at the bottom of the DPS charts since the change in 1.2c. That is even with my gear/expertise being superior to others. Doing the AEs to try and pull descent numbers isn't what I consider fun, so I'm going to take about 1 month off from SWTOR and see what GW2 is like.

Edited April 24, 2012 by Wrestle

[Hutt]

Dear dev team,

I received a ticket back after 1.2c initially came out saying everything is working correctly, however, after a week I appear to not be alone, merc & commando thread as a prime example of grievance. Do you still have the position that there is not a problem and everything is working correctly?

[solidkjames]

There is not a dev that works at Bioware that can honestly say that the 500 dps loss I am seeing since the 1.2.0c patch is working as intended. Your "fix" didn't not just affect other's heat signatures but it affected all of our abilities benefiting from the armor debuff. Put someone on this asap and please fix this issue. Mercs are the worst pve dps class in the game right now and no where near balanced. .

 

 

Easy fix for Bioware to hot fix asap

Make all Tracer missles share the debuff stacks with all other BH's, after 3 TM's the mob is refreshed by whoever's TM hits the target. That way there is only one 5 stack of debuff on the target, no matter how many BH's are attacking the target. Revert the changes you just did that broke all attacks benefiting from any armor debuff and problem solved. Our dps will be back within the 1300 - 1600 range that all other classes are pulling on fight. Thanks for your immediate attention to this.

[Aristarco]

Dear friens, as a merc i can say to forget the arsenal build, now pyro with a good build works nice, not as arsenal before but almost you can play it, in warzone, you're an easy target for most of the class, but bioware say that is working as intended, so instead of using a blaster pistol i may suggest to use a water pistol hoping to short circuit the force users

[JustTray]

I was warned for this post, it has been closed twice now.

 

Since Bioware is ignoring the Merc threads I have to post this in here. It has been CONFIRMED by many players that the current Tracer Missle 4% armor stacking debuff is NOT currently being applied to BH/Trooper abilities. (at least not ones self)

 

There is the misconception that Merc/Commando DPS is "Working as Intended" as a post by George Zoeller indicates, and this is WRONG because he was specifically referring to the 25% damage gained by heat signatures for heatseeker/demo round NOT the 20% armor penetration provided by the heat signatures themselves.

 

This is a GAME-BREAKING BUG. The fact that it did not get fixed in the patch yesterday indicates that Bioware STILL is not aware of it, despite 5 days and hundreds of pages of posts about it. It is not in the known bug issues, and it has not been addressed by Devs anywhere. Here is a relevant post from the Merc threads.

 

There is not a dev that works at Bioware that can honestly say that the 500 dps loss I am seeing since the 1.2.0c patch is working as intended. Your "fix" didn't not just affect other's heat signatures but it affected all of our abilities benefiting from the armor debuff. Put someone on this asap and please fix this issue. Mercs are the worst pve dps class in the game right now and no where near balanced. .

 

Easy fix for Bioware to hot fix asap

Make all Tracer missles share the debuff stacks with all other BH's, after 3 TM's the mob is refreshed by whoever's TM hits the target. That way there is only one 5 stack of debuff on the target, no matter how many BH's are attacking the target. Revert the changes you just did that broke all attacks benefiting from any armor debuff and problem solved. Our dps will be back within the 1300 - 1600 range that all other classes are pulling on fight. Thanks for your immediate attention to this.

 

I know this fix isn't easy to code, but it is what must be done, or a hotfix applied to increase the dps of Mercs for PvE and PvP immediately to compensate 20% armor being ignored on all abilities.

 

This is so easy to test that it kills me that I have to do it for you, again....

 

Spam tracer missle on duel or targetting dummy 10 times in a row. Notice damage not increasing in ANY shot.

Realize that each proc of heat signatures should be lowering the armor by 4% each, which should stack with High velocity cylinder AND the heatseeker 5% damage buff per signature.

 

Since damage doesn't ever go up we know for certain that the armor debuff component of Tracer missle is currently not working.

 

Thank you for your timely hotfix to this gamebreaking issue. Please do not move my thread to the location where it will be ignored/passed off as the known NON-issue with heatseeker. I would like this issue addressed directly as it it game breaking, and affects PvP AND PvE in a significant way.

[Droyan]

My mercenary dps arsenal is my only toon in that playing game (I have no time to create and leveling another class). I enjoy a lot with this class before latest bug touch our class.

 

I just stop my account because i'm too much regret my playability now and mainly because you don't have any react concerning this MAJOR problem. any post of your part on this Is there someone of Bioware looking this fourm sometimes ?

 

I'm very dissapointed about that!

 

One more time, sorry for my bad english but i hope, you well understand me.

[Cegenaus]

the best part is how people on my server with op classes and in premades with pocket healers are now talking **** about me being bad, after TWO damage nerfs to an already weak class. i hope that nerf hammer swings back around soon and levels the playing field

[solidkjames]

Little update as I now I have 5 pieces of Campaign/Black hole gear and my Campaign mainhand everything else is pre 1.2 BiS. My aim fully buffed is at 2138 primary damage is 836-1079 crit 38 percent, power 426, surge 75.82 and accuracy 112% tech.

 

My top dps last night on a boss was 1358 compared to our Marauder who has 2 pieces of Black Hole/Campaign with everything else pre 1.2 BiS and pulled 1824 on his best boss attempt. I'm not sure but having that much better gear and as someone who has almost always been top dps in our raids, I am discouraged to know I'm giving up almost 500 dps to a melee class. Please re look at Merc DPS Bioware, we are way behind the other pure dps classes.

Edited April 25, 2012 by solidkjames

[Macroecon]

What is happening is exactly what I predicted would happen. BW uses its ingame statistics collection to drive class (im)balance changes. It saw that Arsenal Mercs would doing more damage than other subclasses so it nerfed them. That caused a lot of players to leave the subclass. Those that continued were the hard core adherents to the class - better skilled, better geared players. So despite the nerf, average Arsenal productivity went UP. So Bioware nerfed them again. They can spin it as a bug fix, but I guarantee you - if a bug fix that hurt dps for Mara/Sent was needed, they would have counterbalanced it with a buff elsewhere.

 

Now you might ask, why do Mara/Sent get buffs? Again it is because BW's ingame stat collection does not account for player skill or likely even toon gear. And the recent influx of players into those subclasses meant the Mara/Sent population was dominated by low performing toons with players still climbing the learning curve and poor gear. That's why Mara/Sent got buffed in 1.2 despite already having the top dps, being the best team buffer AND being the best team off healer.

 

We've already seen this happen before. Remember the double nerf to Concealment Operatives? Same thing. Nerf - low skill players leave. Average productivity rises. Nerf again.

[Calavero]

What is happening is exactly what I predicted would happen. BW uses its ingame statistics collection to drive class (im)balance changes. It saw that Arsenal Mercs would doing more damage than other subclasses so it nerfed them. That caused a lot of players to leave the subclass. Those that continued were the hard core adherents to the class - better skilled, better geared players. So despite the nerf, average Arsenal productivity went UP. So Bioware nerfed them again. They can spin it as a bug fix, but I guarantee you - if a bug fix that hurt dps for Mara/Sent was needed, they would have counterbalanced it with a buff elsewhere.

 

Now you might ask, why do Mara/Sent get buffs? Again it is because BW's ingame stat collection does not account for player skill or likely even toon gear. And the recent influx of players into those subclasses meant the Mara/Sent population was dominated by low performing toons with players still climbing the learning curve and poor gear. That's why Mara/Sent got buffed in 1.2 despite already having the top dps, being the best team buffer AND being the best team off healer.

 

We've already seen this happen before. Remember the double nerf to Concealment Operatives? Same thing. Nerf - low skill players leave. Average productivity rises. Nerf again.

This is the silliest thing I've ever read.

 

They don't want to drive people out of classes because "too many people are playing them". In a subscription based game, there is no such thing as too many people playing anything. Generally when you piss people off enough to stop playing their character, they don't start another character - they simply quit the game.

 

Conspiracy theories can be fun, but this one is just plain stupid.

[Akoti]

Has there been any news on this matter? Are they really considering it "case closed"?

[MagnisLupus]

You know, it's funny, I keep trying to look for a reason to come back, I really want to like this game, and I really want to forgive the devs for their /fail "balancing" act......and they just keep doing it, they just keep giving me more of a reason to stay away.

 

Glad i quit, the devs are showing far too much arrogance for my liking.... I think the only thing that could bring me back to this game now is if it went completely free to play, because at this point it's not worth paying $15 a month just to spend your time building your char only to have it completely destroyed by arrogant devs and forum whiners in the next patch.

 

Bioware really needs to take a step back and look at what they are doing, and deal with the people in their staff who are pushing these moronic changes through.

[theunwarshed]

Little update as I now I have 5 pieces of Campaign/Black hole gear and my Campaign mainhand everything else is pre 1.2 BiS. My aim fully buffed is at 2138 primary damage is 836-1079 crit 38 percent, power 426, surge 75.82 and accuracy 112% tech.

 

My top dps last night on a boss was 1358 compared to our Marauder who has 2 pieces of Black Hole/Campaign with everything else pre 1.2 BiS and pulled 1824 on his best boss attempt. I'm not sure but having that much better gear and as someone who has almost always been top dps in our raids, I am discouraged to know I'm giving up almost 500 dps to a melee class. Please re look at Merc DPS Bioware, we are way behind the other pure dps classes.

 

in all fairness, most mmo give melee a little more dps than ranged to offset the inherent advantages of ranged dps over melee dps (specifically up time). i believe that the gap is just a little too wide with some classes over others. my main problem is that BW broke something and won't even acknowledge it, much less fix it. my other issue is that they refuse to add utility to a class that desperately needs it and instead chose to reduce the effectiveness of the only thing (damage) that we brought to the table.

[AcePortgas]

I was warned for this post, it has been closed twice now.

 

Since Bioware is ignoring the Merc threads I have to post this in here. It has been CONFIRMED by many players that the current Tracer Missle 4% armor stacking debuff is NOT currently being applied to BH/Trooper abilities. (at least not ones self)

 

There is the misconception that Merc/Commando DPS is "Working as Intended" as a post by George Zoeller indicates, and this is WRONG because he was specifically referring to the 25% damage gained by heat signatures for heatseeker/demo round NOT the 20% armor penetration provided by the heat signatures themselves.

 

This is a GAME-BREAKING BUG. The fact that it did not get fixed in the patch yesterday indicates that Bioware STILL is not aware of it, despite 5 days and hundreds of pages of posts about it. It is not in the known bug issues, and it has not been addressed by Devs anywhere. Here is a relevant post from the Merc threads.

 

There is not a dev that works at Bioware that can honestly say that the 500 dps loss I am seeing since the 1.2.0c patch is working as intended. Your "fix" didn't not just affect other's heat signatures but it affected all of our abilities benefiting from the armor debuff. Put someone on this asap and please fix this issue. Mercs are the worst pve dps class in the game right now and no where near balanced. .

 

Easy fix for Bioware to hot fix asap

Make all Tracer missles share the debuff stacks with all other BH's, after 3 TM's the mob is refreshed by whoever's TM hits the target. That way there is only one 5 stack of debuff on the target, no matter how many BH's are attacking the target. Revert the changes you just did that broke all attacks benefiting from any armor debuff and problem solved. Our dps will be back within the 1300 - 1600 range that all other classes are pulling on fight. Thanks for your immediate attention to this.

 

I know this fix isn't easy to code, but it is what must be done, or a hotfix applied to increase the dps of Mercs for PvE and PvP immediately to compensate 20% armor being ignored on all abilities.

 

This is so easy to test that it kills me that I have to do it for you, again....

 

Spam tracer missle on duel or targetting dummy 10 times in a row. Notice damage not increasing in ANY shot.

Realize that each proc of heat signatures should be lowering the armor by 4% each, which should stack with High velocity cylinder AND the heatseeker 5% damage buff per signature.

 

Since damage doesn't ever go up we know for certain that the armor debuff component of Tracer missle is currently not working.

 

Thank you for your timely hotfix to this gamebreaking issue. Please do not move my thread to the location where it will be ignored/passed off as the known NON-issue with heatseeker. I would like this issue addressed directly as it it game breaking, and affects PvP AND PvE in a significant way.

 

 

Very well said, I couldn't have said it in a better way. So if you are even looking at this thread Bioware, FIX up mercenary class ninja bug or you will see your subscription to go down as you've never seen before.

[albynomonk]

Very well said, I couldn't have said it in a better way. So if you are even looking at this thread Bioware, FIX up mercenary class ninja bug or you will see your subscription to go down as you've never seen before.

 

They're not looking at this thread... they don't care about Bounty Hunters! This is a Star Wars game, only Jedi matter!

[garrthos]

They're not looking at this thread... they don't care about Bounty Hunters! This is a Star Wars game, only Jedi matter!

 

They really don't. The mods here have answered my questions after I refused to go away quietly, reposting my issues, and their official reponse has been "We're not involved with game balancing." Their only function is to prevent spammers and links to adult websites/pics. This is not a place where the balance team visits or has a presence.

 

In a related story, still waiting on my DPS rotation to be revolutionized and led away from Tracer > HSM > Unload, like we were promised with the initial 1.2 nerfs. I don't expect it to happen, though, as coding all the family tree legacy unlocks appears to be eating up their free time. You know, the useless vanity crap that impacts precisely nothing of value? Sure am glad I got a baby Tauntaun pet today.

 

It really blows my mind that the "Dev Tracker" fields questions about braindead kids dying to womp rats in KP, but things like this are utterly ignored.

[codaking]

"If the best defense is a good offense, the Mercenary’s got the most intimidating defense in the galaxy. Heavily-modded blasters and deadly heatseeking missiles make the Mercenary a mobile heavy weapons platform. There’s no problem extra firepower can’t solve, and no one who knows what he’s doing gets between a Mercenary and his target."

 

Anyone seen anything like the above description in the game lately?

 

Maybe we can sue for false advertising....

[Wrestle]

"If the best defense is a good offense, the Mercenary’s got the most intimidating defense in the galaxy. Heavily-modded blasters and deadly heatseeking missiles make the Mercenary a mobile heavy weapons platform. There’s no problem extra firepower can’t solve, and no one who knows what he’s doing gets between a Mercenary and his target."

 

Anyone seen anything like the above description in the game lately?

 

Maybe we can sue for false advertising....

 

So true.

[Reno_Tarshil]

I actually do believe its working.. I'm only level 42 but when I fire a HSM at a mob with 0 HS it does 900-1000 dmg and 1200-1300 with 5 stacks of HS.

 

Edit: After some further testing on the Esh-ka I can confirm the above to be true. A definitive difference between No HS and 5 HS. Usually 300-400 dmg difference. Maybe its a bug for level 50's?

Edited April 26, 2012 by Reno_Tarshil

[Wrestle]

I actually do believe its working.. I'm only level 42 but when I fire a HSM at a mob with 0 HS it does 900-1000 dmg and 1200-1300 with 5 stacks of HS.

 

Edit: After some further testing on the Esh-ka I can confirm the above to be true. A definitive difference between No HS and 5 HS. Usually 300-400 dmg difference. Maybe its a bug for level 50's?

 

It is working from what I see as well. What isn't working is that we never got a 10% increas after 1.2. Atleast it doesn't look that way.