NINJAS! We know who you are!

[Dormain]

i read through this thread. most of it makes sense. i am just not getting the difference between need and greed.

 

let me know if i'm right or wrong.

 

greed = might get it

need= will get it unless someone else hit need, then its up to the game mechanics

 

sorta

 

greed= i would like the item for companion or its a sideways item upgrade (might get the item if noone needs it)

need= i would like that item for my main, its better than what i have (might get the item if noone else needs it)

 

if everyone greeds then we all roll against each other, if 2 roll greed n 2 roll need then the 2 who roll need roll against themselves

 

people who jawa roll need b4 greed usually dont know their class, and what items n stats are best for em, or they are ignorant of the loot system and how it works or they r just jawas

 

one way to hinder jawa looters is to roll last on an item, they usually wait until everyone has rolled greed then selects need and runs

Edited December 14, 2011 by Dormain

[ajwags]

ok, fantastic. thank you very much.

[Krakov]

Maybe they should just make instance loot all class specific, and only that class gets to roll on it...would solve some issues...less companions... Edited December 14, 2011 by Krakov

[_Twigge_]

Solution: Integrate restrictions for rolling NEED on items.

 

Let's say that you're a SI- sorcerer. You can't roll need on any weapons other than a single bladed saber (with appropriate stats). You also cannot roll need on anything other than light armor. Accessories follow the 'appropriate stats' guideline.

 

- A blaster pistol drops; SI-sorc can greed, but may not need .

- Heavy armor drops; SI-Sorc can greed but may not need .

- Ear piece with aim on it drops; the SI-sorc can greed but may not need.

 

Basically, if YOU cannot use it or it's not conducive to your class's bread and butter stats, you cannot roll 'need', but you can greed. This eliminates Jawas from being jerks (unless they are the same class as you. Tough luck there) as well as 'need' rolling for companions that are not present.

 

Also agreed that there needs to be a master-looting option, as well as an 'oops' window of time for trading to eligible players (those that were in your group)

[Ayth]

/signed for Loot Jawa

[TORPlayer]

they should just grey out the need box if you cant use it

[Ignath]

I know it was just the beta but I had a stupid Sith Warrior roll need on my Bounty Hunter chest peice in BT...was so annoying and since I was playing the healer for that group....I stopped healing him

 

This happened to me as well, lol...same exact scenario!

[CPhalanx]

Solution: Integrate restrictions for rolling NEED on items.

 

Let's say that you're a SI- sorcerer. You can't roll need on any weapons other than a single bladed saber (with appropriate stats). You also cannot roll need on anything other than light armor. Accessories follow the 'appropriate stats' guideline.

 

- A blaster pistol drops; SI-sorc can greed, but may not need .

- Heavy armor drops; SI-Sorc can greed but may not need .

- Ear piece with aim on it drops; the SI-sorc can greed but may not need.

 

Basically, if YOU cannot use it or it's not conducive to your class's bread and butter stats, you cannot roll 'need', but you can greed. This eliminates Jawas from being jerks (unless they are the same class as you. Tough luck there) as well as 'need' rolling for companions that are not present.

 

Also agreed that there needs to be a master-looting option, as well as an 'oops' window of time for trading to eligible players (those that were in your group)

 

This is a great system which was implemented in wow to lessen the frequency of ninja-ing gear on their servers. I know people on the forums here will dislike the idea because it one of two reasons. One they are ninjas (in swtor's case: jawas) and want to make money by stealing crap from people who are going to use it. Or they may just be the avid anti wow player where they dismiss that any system or theme ever used in wow (whether or not it was implemented in other games) is automatically considered a bad idea to them.

 

In summary TOR needs this system, it will help deal with cross class ninjas but I don't see popular vote giving the system it's time.

[Bahll]

And how do you find people to recruit to your guild without grouping with some randoms? Ignoring the community is a great way for your guild to grow stagnant.

 

If you don't know anyone from another game or have friends RL that are playing than that is your issue. I for one am playing with some RL pals and if I do pug with a guy/gal who ninjas stuff I won't group with them ever again, its that simple.

 

People will ninja, them getting a group in the future is a totally different situation.

 

Also, ive been playing mmo's for 8 years-ish and I can only think of 3 time ive had ninja loot issues.

 

EDIT MS Need>Companion/ OS need> Greed, im setting up a macro on my kb and posting in every pug I get into, if someone doesnt like it, you will be replaced.

 

Also, asking to need an item normally works in your favor, and players won't dodge you like he plague.

Edited December 14, 2011 by Bahll

[Zebart]

LMAO no longer they are called ninja looters they are now called JAWAS

[Djabelek]

Loot Jawa's lol, well I can say this much don't matter what game your playing this happens.

NO STOP GIVING THE JAWA's bad rap they are scavengers if you really want to blame someone blame the Sand People they shoot then take your gear.

[jesperand]

im rp my BH so give me some credits and i will stop loot jawaing

[snooggums]

This is a great system which was implemented in wow to lessen the frequency of ninja-ing gear on their servers. I know people on the forums here will dislike the idea because it one of two reasons. One they are ninjas (in swtor's case: jawas) and want to make money by stealing crap from people who are going to use it. Or they may just be the avid anti wow player where they dismiss that any system or theme ever used in wow (whether or not it was implemented in other games) is automatically considered a bad idea to them.

 

In summary TOR needs this system, it will help deal with cross class ninjas but I don't see popular vote giving the system it's time.

 

Or they could simply disagree with your outdated treatment of all random groups as if they were weekly raiding guilds where loot distribution needs to follow some preset expectations of a vocal and greedy group who thinks that if a Need roll is actually rolled then someone is 'stealing'.

[Epyoch]

Meh my guilds in previous mmo's had a master list of loot ninjas (confirmed by 2 people either in trade or within the guild)...usually the name becomes pretty infamous within our guild, we kept it updated pretty regularly.

 

It wasn't foolproof, but it saved the ignore list.

[Cytogenix]

almost as bad as the people who ditch halfway through a flashpoint. I've already started my list. Really hope they don't add paid name changes AT ALL.

[AuronBlake]

This is just stupid. Every player in group has the chance to take drops...so if you don't take it, don't cry like a child. Because maybe the other player can use it, give it to a companion or else, it's not your buisness. Please be adult...

[Greyfeld]

Or they could simply disagree with your outdated treatment of all random groups as if they were weekly raiding guilds where loot distribution needs to follow some preset expectations of a vocal and greedy group who thinks that if a Need roll is actually rolled then someone is 'stealing'.

 

Taking an item that another player can use on their PC, so you can gear out your companion, is rude and inconsiderate.

 

If you want something for your companion that badly, it shouldn't be that hard to speak up and ask if your group is fine with you rolling need on it. If you can't even give that much courtesy to whatever group you're running with, you shouldn't be surprised when people get upset with you, and/or kick you from the group.

 

This isn't difficult to figure out. If you're selfish and inconsiderate of other players, you're going to get a reputation. If you don't want that reputation, don't be selfish and inconsiderate.

[MarcoGouveia]

the age of the ninja is over, the age of the Jawa has begun.

[SojornCorr]

UTINNI !!! haha loot Jawa, filthy creatures.

[Viake]

Reading this thread it boils down to three main positions

 

1. Player who is in it just for themselves, out to get whatever they want without any consideration for anyone else. Will loot whatever they want regardless.

 

2. Player who wants to play a more cooperative style, willing to work for benefit of group overall and pass, need or greed in line with that.

 

3. Player who is inexperienced and hasn't put themselves into either group 1 or 2

 

Players will tend to gravitate to people who play like themselves. Players who go down the cooperative route will exclude players in group 1 after a while from grouping; players who go down the always need route will tend to end up in groups with similar tendencies. Both groups are unlikely to agree with the other's viewpoint

 

The community will sort itself out. Having the system decide for you by building in who needs what is probably a step too far and imposes playing styles on people. A master loot option does make sense, seen it work well in other games - or at least as well as the person who is the master looter.

[Grimmas]

I like "Loot Jawa"; very fitting!

 

Don't forget to assume good faith in some cases. My beta experience with TOR was actually the first time I had ever encountered the need/greed mechanic (not a big MMO player) and, because I attached a negative connotation to "greed", I kept selecting "need" until I stopped to think about it and asked one of my subsequent groups. (For some reason I thought "greed" was sort of like an auction and you'd bid on it if you really wanted it... don't ask me what I was thinking, I'm not sure, but I definitely had it backwards and I wasn't trying to "steal" from my group.)

 

Nobody had said anything about it to me, but I do wish I could have gone back to them and said, "Oops, sorry about that." Most people probably know better than I did, so you're probably right, but it may be worth pointing it out to them and see if they're behavior changes before you /lootjawa them into oblivion. Just a thought.

 

The same thing happened to me the first time I rolled Need in WoW, all those years ago. Fortunately, people pointed out the issue to me and we got on fine after that.

 

I'd also like to point out that just because someone does not equip an item he pressed Need on right away it does not follow that he does not need it. I tend to equip items I Need on only after the instance or in case of a wipe, because it's just too hectic looking for it among all the trash in my crowded inventory during an instance, especially while simultaneously DPSing AND healing, as was the case in TOR so far.

[Tashohnie]

As my girlfriend would say...

"I need for gold."

[Captain_Mark]

Yeah, this happened to me. A bastard Jedi stole a blaster my Smuggler needed. YOU HAVE A LIGHTSABER!!! GRRRAAAAAHHHHH!!!!!

[G-Seven]

I would really like to see a system where items that bind to your character when you pick them up can be traded to other members of that group within 1-2 hours or so. It's a system that could make some Jawas to give the item to the one that had the best use for it, and it encourages being patient with other players.

 

Yes, a flaw of this would be that two people could roll on something and then give it to the other to increase their chances, but I don't see the issue with that since you play with people from your server, and as such there will be consequences to that behavior. Combined with a need/greed based on what classes actually can use I think it will be neat, since then you can also trade items to other players who may like it for their companion or whatever.

 

Of all the features BW 'borrowed' from other MMOs, I cannot believe they left this one out for release.

 

Either the buttons are too small, people are not taking the time to learn what each symbol means, and/or simply are ignorant of which gear benefits which class.

[halfhourofpower]

Here's my issue and maybe you can help me. Everyone complains about Ninja looters and I understand the concept and why it would be a problem.

 

Here's the problem I have though. How are you supposed to be able to tell in the middle of a firefight at a glance, that the item is something you need or not? I'm serious. I know I'm probably going to get laughed at for this but I mean it. An item pops up and I'm supposed to make a split second decision about that item all while I'm monitoring my health bar, spamming attacks on an enemy and dodging return fire. I don't know how I can do that. But if I guess wrong, if I hit need instead of greed or need when I should have passed, than suddenly I'm a Ninja looter and it's ignore city.

 

How do you deal with that? Do you just wait until the firefight is over and then choose? What do you do?

 

Thanks.

 

 

Well, you'll figure out quickly what stats you need quickly enough and if you roll need on, say, willpower geared stats to sell them or for whatever other reason and there's a consular in your group who actually needs it then you're screwing them over pretty bad for your own personal reasons.