cdman Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Even if the lore supported color restrictions (which it doesn't), the restrictions it would support would be factionally based, NOT alignment based. The reason the Sith used red crystals was because they did not have access to the natural crystal formations the Jedi did, and had to use synthetic crystals, and red synthetic crystals are the easiest to make. The Jedi, on the other hand, used natural crystals, giving them access to an assortment of colors. Yes, an assortment, not just green and blue. Because, as my signature states, prior to the Battle of Ruusan, Jedi had access to many more natural crystal sites, which provided crystals in a variety of colors. After the Ruusan campaign, the Jedi lost access to many of those sites, and could obtain crystals pretty much exclusively from Illum, which only provided blue and green crystals. In case you're wondering, the Ruusan Campaign takes place in 1,000 BBY, roughly two thousand years AFTER the timeframe in which TOR is set. Anyone who's even passively watched the Star Wars movies knows that there is absolutely no reason whatsoever to make it impossible for a Dark-Side character to use green and blue lightsabers, or for a lightsider to use red. Case in point: Anakin Skywalker, RotS, using his blue lightsaber after he turns to the Dark Side and becomes Darth Vader. General Grievous, RotS, using blue and green lightsabers despite being a thoroughly evil bastard. Darth Vader, RotJ, activating Luke's green lightsaber. Obi-Wan, The Clone Wars, using Asajj Ventress' red lightsaber. Let me make this perfectly clear: THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO REASON TO RESTRICT COLORS BASED ON ALIGNMENT. For those of you who claims is break immersion, we've all seen Sith characters who chose to play Light-Side running around FORCED to use blue and green because of the alignment restrictions, and Jedi who took Dark-Side options forced to use red. That makes no sense. Removing the alignment restrictions allows Sith characters to use Sith red lightsabers no matter their alignment choices, and allows Jedi to use green and blue no matter their alignment choices. Finally, the last nail in the coffin for pro-restriction arguments, is blasters. 95% of blasters in Star Wars fire red bolts. The ONLY blaster we see not shooting red bolts are the DC-15 rifles and carbines used by the Clone Troopers, which fire blue, and the SoroSuub ELG-3A blaster pistols used by Padme and her handmaidens (the sleek sliver blaster pistols, not the big honking ones that fired the grappling lines.) When alignment restrictions were in place, Troopers, Smugglers, Agents, and Bounty Hunters HAD to go dark side if they wanted to shoot red blaster bolts. Now, they don't. I don't often say this, but if you support alignment restrictions on color crystals, you are factually, demonstrably, utterly WRONG. I +1 this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dynastynyy Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 crystal colors dont bother me as much as the fact that any non-force-sensitive character can craft lightsabers. Lore dictates thatonly force-sensitive/Jedi/Sith can craft their lightsabers, no one else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikModi Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Actually, considering Lucas and his family have pretty solid control over TCW, it's not a stretch at all. You hit the nail on the head. Oh, I agree completely. But mention Clone Wars around ten Star Wars fans, and you'll get eight projectile vomits, one "meh, whatever," one "I really like it!" For the record, I really like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Zone Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Oh, I agree completely. But mention Clone Wars around ten Star Wars fans, and you'll get eight projectile vomits, one "meh, whatever," one "I really like it!" For the record, I really like it. For the record, I'm a meh, whatever. The art style is garbage, imo. I'd expect it in Samurai Jack, but not in Star Wars. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talorya Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Color crystals are not restricted by factions/alignment, but by availability of source material. It is a preference, for a weapon. One can simply take a saber from a defeated opponent and use it at will, light sabers are not dna encrypted or force alignment restricted. Flip the switch and it'll light up just fine, because that's what it was designed to do. If one plays the consular on tython, they do go into how there were no sith/jedis, merely force users. Crystals were not representative of alignment, merely a personal preference of appearance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Zone Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Color crystals are not restricted by factions/alignment, but by availability of source material. It is a preference, for a weapon. One can simply take a saber from a defeated opponent and use it at will, light sabers are not dna encrypted or force alignment restricted. Flip the switch and it'll light up just fine, because that's what it was designed to do. If one plays the consular on tython, they do go into how there were no sith/jedis, merely force users. Crystals were not representative of alignment, merely a personal preference of appearance. If I could have taken a lightsaber from a downed opponent, my SW would have had a purple blade on Dromund Kaas when I whacked ol' Grathan! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XLJedi Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 (edited) Whether the lore-lawyers (loryers?) can justify it or not... I personally just really like that image of all those red sabers lighting up on the dropship in the opening imp movie. If there was a blue one in that bunch it woulda really ruined that scene... So I can understand how the use of non-red sabers for sith can "ruin the scene" for others while playing. It seems fair to grant purple to the sith for their otherwise lacking choices of color (and just try not to think about Mace Winduu). I try to adhere to blue and cyan for my guardian. I go with the Yoda-green for consulars and I try to pretend that yellow, Mace Winduu and most every other silly color just doesn't exist. Oh, and the black blades are just stupid... Edited April 13, 2012 by XLJedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Likewater Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 (edited) The whole color thing is a recent thing started by Lucas for the prequals. Jedi have weilded red bladed lightsabers and were decent human beings, and Darksiders have weilded blue, yellow and all colors of the rainbow. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sariss http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Boc_Aseca http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Yun three characters from the same game. Edited April 13, 2012 by Likewater Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyrel Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 As mentioned before, plenty of lore examples of dark siders using blues and greens. Hell, even starting on a Dark Jedi path in the game nets you a green crystal for your Jedi Knight. As a player I wanted to do a Dark Jedi like Exar Kun ( before becoming a full fledged Sith Lord), I was thoroughly irked when I had to wave a red saber around because I wanted to explore the dark side alignment and how it affected my storyline. Not to mention lighting up a red sabre on Coruscant just made me feel like going in a hawaii shirt to a formal dinner. Now my Dark Jedi can have his blue sabre. From what I've seen the amount of colours hasn't changed on the Sith Empire side really. Seen some of the light side Sith rock a red sabre now that they can. So, the over all sabre colour balance at least on the servers I play on hasn't changed drastically. Restricting crystal colours to alignment was a poor idea, and I for one am very happy that it is gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vasinar Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 From what I understand is the difference in color crystals had more to do with refining techniques then with light/dark alignment. Its not like the crystals are kryptonite! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrymzenSith Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Why is Bioware letting kids on Sith side use blues and greens for color crystals? Those are Jedi colors, through and through, Guardian and Consular, not Sith. Give Sith variations on reds, maybe a black red, a light red, an orange red, and all the neutral colors like white, grey, black, etc, but NOT green and blue, it's just wrong. Yellow was bad enough (Sentinel), it seems like Bioware is making a mockery of Star Wars lore, the new Legacy system is absurd, now everyone wants to use Sith purebloods for Jedi and Republic roles.... They're blurring the lines between the factions WAY too much imho. *puts on snobby glasses* well actualy..certian factions do not really have certain colors.. the Jedi have green and blue yes but do you know why? the jedi farm the crystals they have naturaly..they find them in crystal caves etc..the sith do not..they try to manufacture crystal wich is what gives them the obscure color..in reality any jedi or sith can use any color depending on how they got it, bioware saying certian crystals are restricted to lightside/darkside is more against the lore than letting sith use blue etc.. exar kun used blue..he was a sith so what if people want to have jedi sith purebloods..yeah it may not make any sence at all as they are called SITH pureblood but look at scourge...he is helping the jedi yet i don't see you moaning about that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LemmingLeader Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Ok... here we go. Sith Lord using blue saber: Exar Kun. 'Nuff said. Jedi Master using purple saber: Mace Mutha****in' Windu. 'Nuff said. Also, Obi-Wan used a red saber for a while in TCW. Just because something is TRADITIONAL, does not mean it's MANDATORY. It is established by the movies and Sith using the rainbow spectrum of Lightsaber colors goes completely against that. All this rainbow saber BS is due to how stupid the Star Wars EU has gotten over the years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XLJedi Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 (edited) Ok... here we go. Sith Lord using blue saber: Exar Kun. 'Nuff said. Jedi Master using purple saber: Mace Mutha****in' Windu. 'Nuff said. Also, Obi-Wan used a red saber for a while in TCW. Just because something is TRADITIONAL, does not mean it's MANDATORY. Not sure if it's fair to count Obi-Wan (while without his saber) picking up one of Ventress' sabers for one fight scene as "used a red saber for a while". He killed Grievous with a blaster too... so I guess he also used a blaster for a while. The purple saber should be rep use only too, but they had to throw the imps a bone on the colors... Edited April 13, 2012 by XLJedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belpheghor Posted April 14, 2012 Author Share Posted April 14, 2012 (edited) Whether the lore-lawyers (loryers?) can justify it or not... I personally just really like that image of all those red sabers lighting up on the dropship in the opening imp movie. If there was a blue one in that bunch it woulda really ruined that scene... So I can understand how the use of non-red sabers for sith can "ruin the scene" for others while playing. It seems fair to grant purple to the sith for their otherwise lacking choices of color (and just try not to think about Mace Winduu). I try to adhere to blue and cyan for my guardian. I go with the Yoda-green for consulars and I try to pretend that yellow, Mace Winduu and most every other silly color just doesn't exist. Oh, and the black blades are just stupid... I agree 100% If they made another Star Wars movie and the Sith all used a rainbow of colors I guarantee you the audience would freak out, you guys are forcing your justification on us because there is no written rules for saber crystal colors and some goofy Star Wars novel here or there may have had a contradiction to the norm. I grew up with Star Wars (37), saw the original trilogy in the theatres, had all the toys (btw, NEVER saw a toy figure Sith with a non red saber, or a Jedi with a red), and yes the prequels had some contradictions to the norm color wise, but that was basically Samuel Jackson demanding he have purple for his saber. Sith red, Guardian blue, Consular green, Sentinel yellow, not hard to figure out. Why not have WW2 toys of US soldiers have Nazi colors and symbols on them, or have the germans wears the US green lol, were does all this end? I don't care about a novel here or there with some crazy author who wanted to break all the rules, your justifications are weak, your arguments shallow. No true Star Wars fan would support this stuff. Bioware has blended the factions into a hodgepodge mess. Pretty soon there will be no point in having Imperial and Republic since the races and equipment and powers/abilities will all be blended together with the Legacy system. The Legacy system was a good idea for getting peeps to reroll new toons, but a BAD idea for the Star Wars lore, in a year everything will be so mixed up there will be little point to having 2 factions at all at this rate. Edited April 14, 2012 by Belpheghor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forgon Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 There is nothing 'canon' about the color of a laser. This. It is traditional, but not uncommon. At least one Jedi in the EU during the Clone War era had red sabers. Kuun had a blue saber even after becoming Sith up until his death as far as I am aware. It may be out of your Star Wars paradise but there needs to be some respect and mutual understanding between the community and this is an rp-ers luxury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Speedwolfdeath Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Oh, and the black blades are just stupid... I agree with this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belpheghor Posted April 14, 2012 Author Share Posted April 14, 2012 This. It is traditional, but not uncommon. At least one Jedi in the EU during the Clone War era had red sabers. Kuun had a blue saber even after becoming Sith up until his death as far as I am aware. It may be out of your Star Wars paradise but there needs to be some respect and mutual understanding between the community and this is an rp-ers luxury. Why would you want to rp blasphemy? I used to play the D20 Star Wars rp game, I LOVE to rp....but not at the expense of tradition and logic. Every time I see a Sith with a green or blue saber I die a little inside, it feels like treason to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranadiel_Marius Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 No true Star Wars fan would support this stuff. Wow it has been a while since I saw someone try and make a "no true Scotsman" argument. That's a rarity even on the Internet. I'm so glad you are here to tell all of us about how Star Wars is supposed to be since all of, especially those that have spent a lot of time learning the expanded universe are not true Star Wars fans. We are lucky to have you rescue us from our lack of true fanship with your intimite knowledge of the movie only canon. Clearly we must all cancel our subscriptions now for the true prophet has spoken and told us what we must do to be true fans! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPLaro Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Even if the lore supported color restrictions (which it doesn't), the restrictions it would support would be factionally based, NOT alignment based. The reason the Sith used red crystals was because they did not have access to the natural crystal formations the Jedi did, and had to use synthetic crystals, and red synthetic crystals are the easiest to make. The Jedi, on the other hand, used natural crystals, giving them access to an assortment of colors. Yes, an assortment, not just green and blue. Because, as my signature states, prior to the Battle of Ruusan, Jedi had access to many more natural crystal sites, which provided crystals in a variety of colors. After the Ruusan campaign, the Jedi lost access to many of those sites, and could obtain crystals pretty much exclusively from Illum, which only provided blue and green crystals. In case you're wondering, the Ruusan Campaign takes place in 1,000 BBY, roughly two thousand years AFTER the timeframe in which TOR is set. Anyone who's even passively watched the Star Wars movies knows that there is absolutely no reason whatsoever to make it impossible for a Dark-Side character to use green and blue lightsabers, or for a lightsider to use red. Case in point: Anakin Skywalker, RotS, using his blue lightsaber after he turns to the Dark Side and becomes Darth Vader. General Grievous, RotS, using blue and green lightsabers despite being a thoroughly evil bastard. Darth Vader, RotJ, activating Luke's green lightsaber. Obi-Wan, The Clone Wars, using Asajj Ventress' red lightsaber. Let me make this perfectly clear: THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO REASON TO RESTRICT COLORS BASED ON ALIGNMENT. For those of you who claims is break immersion, we've all seen Sith characters who chose to play Light-Side running around FORCED to use blue and green because of the alignment restrictions, and Jedi who took Dark-Side options forced to use red. That makes no sense. Removing the alignment restrictions allows Sith characters to use Sith red lightsabers no matter their alignment choices, and allows Jedi to use green and blue no matter their alignment choices. Finally, the last nail in the coffin for pro-restriction arguments, is blasters. 95% of blasters in Star Wars fire red bolts. The ONLY blaster we see not shooting red bolts are the DC-15 rifles and carbines used by the Clone Troopers, which fire blue, and the SoroSuub ELG-3A blaster pistols used by Padme and her handmaidens (the sleek sliver blaster pistols, not the big honking ones that fired the grappling lines.) When alignment restrictions were in place, Troopers, Smugglers, Agents, and Bounty Hunters HAD to go dark side if they wanted to shoot red blaster bolts. Now, they don't. I don't often say this, but if you support alignment restrictions on color crystals, you are factually, demonstrably, utterly WRONG. show them big mama Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guildrum Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Why would you want to rp blasphemy? I used to play the D20 Star Wars rp game, I LOVE to rp....but not at the expense of tradition and logic. Every time I see a Sith with a green or blue saber I die a little inside, it feels like treason to me. Okay. So is it more lore breaking that a light side sith is practically forced to... A. Use a yellow/orange/purple saber they may not like to use... B. Use a blue or Green or blue saber... In the middle of the Fleet? Where realistically, he would be attacked for using Jedi colors? Really people, Based on your views on crystal colors, I would say you think that all Sith must be Dark side and all Jedi must be light side... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeutschGamer Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Its one thing to see an iconic image on TV or a movie screen, especially for someone old like you who grew up with the original trilogy and believed everything in it was canon and everything after doesn't count. Its a whole different ball park when you actually put yourself in the shoes of a Jedi or Sith that you are allowed to customize and then find you are limited to what some movie said, while you are in a game that isn't even set in the same time period as the movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth-Rion Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Why would you want to rp blasphemy? I used to play the D20 Star Wars rp game, I LOVE to rp....but not at the expense of tradition and logic. Every time I see a Sith with a green or blue saber I die a little inside, it feels like treason to me. I RP a Sith with a White Lightsaber who tries to walk the balanced line between Light and Dark. How does that make you feel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koronii Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 My Sith Inquisitor is wielding a blue lightsaber he took from a jedi's corpse. U MAD? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belpheghor Posted April 14, 2012 Author Share Posted April 14, 2012 Okay. So is it more lore breaking that a light side sith is practically forced to... A. Use a yellow/orange/purple saber they may not like to use... B. Use a blue or Green or blue saber... In the middle of the Fleet? Where realistically, he would be attacked for using Jedi colors? Really people, Based on your views on crystal colors, I would say you think that all Sith must be Dark side and all Jedi must be light side... "light" side Sith is an oxymoron, Bioware shouldn't have introduced such a thing UNLESS they were going to allow for faction changes, THAT would make for an interesting storyline....a Sith who turns from the dark side and becomes a Jedi...or vice versa, a Jedi who falls to the dark side. What's the point of going "light" side as a Sith? If you wish to choose the light side path, pick a Jedi class and follow the light side of the force. Sith follow ideals and philosophies that contradict the path of the light. But if Bioware allowed us to change our alignment towards the ultimate goal of faction change, that would be interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belpheghor Posted April 14, 2012 Author Share Posted April 14, 2012 My Sith Inquisitor is wielding a blue lightsaber he took from a jedi's corpse. U MAD? Not at all, General Grievous would be an excellent example, but most do it just out of boredom or raw, misplaced vanity. I actually admire that in concept, but again, most do it I suspect just to be "cute". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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