Hey guys just a flashback of last years pax

[hargrave]

Will be interesting to see whats "said" this year eh? Still waiting on last years announcement to come to light = ) enjoy

 

This is why i dont get excited until i can play whats been said. 1.2 ui customization is true ill give them that

 

 

Edited April 6, 2012 by hargrave

[livnthedream]

we got everything listed in that video. please point out a single lie that bioware has stated.

[hargrave]

100vs100 ilum bieng awesome guerilla style warfare. We didnt get any of that at all ilum has been effectivaly shutdown and was nothing more then a valor farmers paradise.

 

Why dont you show me something in that video thats true?

 

 

we got everything listed in that video. please point out a single lie that bioware has stated.

Edited April 6, 2012 by hargrave

[livnthedream]

100vs100 ilum bieng awesome guerilla style warfare. We didnt get any of that at all ilum has been effectivaly shutdown and was nothing more then a valor farmers paradise.

 

Why dont you show me something in that video thats true?

 

while i personally never saw 100v100 but i have seen 20+ on each side on my server. i also have no had the same lag/lowfps issue that is so whined about on these forums. the community decided it was crap (as they do in virtually every game) for one reason or another. since its "failed" bioware is going to retool the zone and try again. how is any of that a lie based on what was shown either in the video, or on live?

 

world pvp in general is dead, pretty much across all games. it sounds good, and is even fun when you outnumber/gank people, but as soon as the tables turn its "horribly broken". with as much as realm vs realm is being looked forward to from gw2 this very same complain is even being registered from them.

[iResist]

There is no good world pvp in any game because like the above poster said... it ends up being one side just outnumbering the other side.....

 

 

Thankfully, we have Warzones which are incredibly fun in SWTOR.

[JackalTurner]

I have to agree. World PVP isnt all that fun in any game. I didnt expect it would be here either.

 

Warzones are great though. Not perfect, but then again nothing ever is.

[Shingara]

There is no good world pvp in any game because like the above poster said... it ends up being one side just outnumbering the other side.....

 

 

Thankfully, we have Warzones which are incredibly fun in SWTOR.

 

Yup agree, also unless you slap a pve objective in there then a vast majority of the playerbase arnt gonna go near an open world pvp area on a pve server.

Edited April 6, 2012 by Shingara

[hargrave]

uh b/c there was never a 100vs100 it could barely handle the 20vs20 like you even stated. There was a newer interview where he says he would like to attempt 40vs40 lol. And in a more recent darth hater interview hes now saying he wants to try rvr just lolz.

 

Like said show me where thier isnt a lie. Btw thats what was anounced before launch. Ilum was never tested in beta on a large scale and is why it went in the toilet so fast. Yet hes selling it like hot cakes....

 

 

while i personally never saw 100v100 but i have seen 20+ on each side on my server. i also have no had the same lag/lowfps issue that is so whined about on these forums. the community decided it was crap (as they do in virtually every game) for one reason or another. since its "failed" bioware is going to retool the zone and try again. how is any of that a lie based on what was shown either in the video, or on live?

 

world pvp in general is dead, pretty much across all games. it sounds good, and is even fun when you outnumber/gank people, but as soon as the tables turn its "horribly broken". with as much as realm vs realm is being looked forward to from gw2 this very same complain is even being registered from them.

[hargrave]

You can have fun open world pvp the problem is thier isnt bases on other planets. Its just ilum thats why it was 1 sided i can say a lot of games that have somewhat decent open world pvp.

 

The main problem with this games faction imbalance is due to lack of alien races for the rep side. If we had rodians, wookies and more it would balance the game out more. Thier trying to solve faction imbalance with same faction pvp.

 

Warzones are crap 50% of the time its same faction. I would rather have open world pvp even if outnumbered then same faction instanced pvp.

[livnthedream]

You can have fun open world pvp the problem is thier isnt bases on other planets. Its just ilum thats why it was 1 sided i can say a lot of games that have somewhat decent open world pvp.

 

name them? please. the only "decent" open world pvp i have ever seen has been in eve. that style of pvp doesnt translate to these kinds of games in that fashion.

 

The main problem with this games faction imbalance is due to lack of alien races for the rep side. If we had rodians, wookies and more it would balance the game out more. Thier trying to solve faction imbalance with same faction pvp.

 

or it could be that the majority like to be evil? i know vader and the emperor are much more iconic to me than luke/obi-wan/yoda in terms of the story i want to play. i, like many, play both sides based on the story i want to play.

 

Warzones are crap 50% of the time its same faction. I would rather have open world pvp even if outnumbered then same faction instanced pvp.

 

ok, the majority dont.

 

op, really man, have you considered that maybe this isnt the game for you? they have stated that mistakes were made (nowhere near the same as lieing, or false advertising for that matter) and what plan they have in place to attempt to fix it. what else do you really expect?

[hargrave]

I expect to not be lied to thats what i expect. I guess thats asking to much you want to defend lies and liars have at it. I didnt ask him to get on a live stage and say 100vs100 and worse. I didnt ask james ohlen to say we have the best pvp team either.

 

Did it ever occur to you that your bieng lied to? That they continue to lie to you. That your defending bieng lied to and trying to justify thier lies with if you dont like lies leave lol.

 

Lotro online has meh open world pvp but it does work some what and its whats pvppve pvp is on the open world pvp poll.

 

eve is decent open world pvp to.

 

warzones are not liked more then open world pvp. Its just thats all thier is b/c they didnt put pvp objectives on other worlds. Those warzones are nothing but exploit tests and hackfests and they dont even ban the people doing that crap lol

 

 

name them? please. the only "decent" open world pvp i have ever seen has been in eve. that style of pvp doesnt translate to these kinds of games in that fashion.

 

 

 

or it could be that the majority like to be evil? i know vader and the emperor are much more iconic to me than luke/obi-wan/yoda in terms of the story i want to play. i, like many, play both sides based on the story i want to play.

 

 

 

ok, the majority dont.

 

op, really man, have you considered that maybe this isnt the game for you? they have stated that mistakes were made (nowhere near the same as lieing, or false advertising for that matter) and what plan they have in place to attempt to fix it. what else do you really expect?

Edited April 6, 2012 by hargrave

[Lokai]

PvP in and of itself suffers from terrible design choices, choices were made during development and choices we now pay for in grand shceme of things. However that said, is NOTHING anyone can do to fix faction balance with out LOCKING one faction till its balanced! then just get alot of people whining about being locked out of playing with there friends. Nothing devs can do about this ONLY we the players can actively choose to switch factions... but fact is a majority LIKE the empire and prefer it and have no intention of switching over. Is only compounded by terrible race choices, and aweful looking gear the republic has.

 

But design itself for pvp is real problem... they went the " carebear "route for pvp, designing it so factions don't cross at all, or very little. Are no real nuetral grounds or cities where both sides quest. Voss kind of borders that BUT then you still wont see many of other faction there either. Also the fact that, are safe zones in each planet you are BARRED from entering at all, again just kills world pvp! Then have illum which is most POORLY designed garbage i've ever seen... what should have been is AV open world AV, where was npcs battling along with the players, and less people had one one side more elites that side would spawn. Quests you completed fortified your base, spawned more special mobs, ect ect ect were tons of ways to do it and franky what we got was outright horrible and still is...

 

The biggest design flaw that bioware made was SAME FACTION warzones! was to try and combat faction imbalance, but really all it does is make one faction SICK and tired of doing huttball! now mind you i love spin they put on capture the flag and that warzone is fairly interesting BUT at end of the day, you can only do huttball so many times before you want to dig your eyes out with a spoon. Warzones shoouldn't have been a focus of pvp... but simply an option for those that enjoy it. Giving commendations for world pvp, making base style comflicts similar to AV on each of the contested worlds AND finally should have been RvR!? where taking a base denies a faction access to that base! but we got none of that... and reason is pretty simple... bioware has to little pvp experience and didnt give WAR team free reign to do what they liked instead they said " MAKE IT LIKE WOW" and so war team was constrained from day 1! trust me i loved WAR if TOR's pvp was more like that i'd be a happy camper! but its not...

 

As to being lied to...#1 rule in mmo's is you NEVER talk about a feature unless its been tested inside and out, the players love it, and you NEVER boast features that you cant deliver... because just piss people off when they dont get it!

 

all in all yea i'm disappointed in TOR's pvp and TOR in general needs alot of work...i hope the first xpac fixes alot of over arching problems but... i think that BW thought story alone would win the fans over...and while story is cool its not enough... DCUO proved that much.

[hargrave]

exactly!

 

PvP in and of itself suffers from terrible design choices, choices were made during development and choices we now pay for in grand shceme of things. However that said, is NOTHING anyone can do to fix faction balance with out LOCKING one faction till its balanced! then just get alot of people whining about being locked out of playing with there friends. Nothing devs can do about this ONLY we the players can actively choose to switch factions... but fact is a majority LIKE the empire and prefer it and have no intention of switching over. Is only compounded by terrible race choices, and aweful looking gear the republic has.

 

But design itself for pvp is real problem... they went the " carebear "route for pvp, designing it so factions don't cross at all, or very little. Are no real nuetral grounds or cities where both sides quest. Voss kind of borders that BUT then you still wont see many of other faction there either. Also the fact that, are safe zones in each planet you are BARRED from entering at all, again just kills world pvp! Then have illum which is most POORLY designed garbage i've ever seen... what should have been is AV open world AV, where was npcs battling along with the players, and less people had one one side more elites that side would spawn. Quests you completed fortified your base, spawned more special mobs, ect ect ect were tons of ways to do it and franky what we got was outright horrible and still is...

 

The biggest design flaw that bioware made was SAME FACTION warzones! was to try and combat faction imbalance, but really all it does is make one faction SICK and tired of doing huttball! now mind you i love spin they put on capture the flag and that warzone is fairly interesting BUT at end of the day, you can only do huttball so many times before you want to dig your eyes out with a spoon. Warzones shoouldn't have been a focus of pvp... but simply an option for those that enjoy it. Giving commendations for world pvp, making base style comflicts similar to AV on each of the contested worlds AND finally should have been RvR!? where taking a base denies a faction access to that base! but we got none of that... and reason is pretty simple... bioware has to little pvp experience and didnt give WAR team free reign to do what they liked instead they said " MAKE IT LIKE WOW" and so war team was constrained from day 1! trust me i loved WAR if TOR's pvp was more like that i'd be a happy camper! but its not...

 

As to being lied to...#1 rule in mmo's is you NEVER talk about a feature unless its been tested inside and out, the players love it, and you NEVER boast features that you cant deliver... because just piss people off when they dont get it!

 

all in all yea i'm disappointed in TOR's pvp and TOR in general needs alot of work...i hope the first xpac fixes alot of over arching problems but... i think that BW thought story alone would win the fans over...and while story is cool its not enough... DCUO proved that much.

[TreizeLOTV]

trust me i loved WAR if TOR's pvp was more like that i'd be a happy camper! but its not...

 

PvP in WAR was not bad, I'd argue DAoC was significantly better. I was majorly disappointed with what WAR offered in the PvP field, but PvP in this game makes WAR's PvP look like a masterpiece.

 

If they at least attained that level of PvP, I'd be happy. Currently the 3 Warzones are a joke, and the class mechanics in PvP are just infurating. Even DAoC had diminishing returns on CC, I routinely find myself getting stunned or otherwise immobilized every other step, sometimes literally (i'm a healer). And the knockbacks that apparently every class has makes any attempt at coordination in Huttball a nightmare.

 

But honestly, if they just added variety and worthwhile zone PvP areas, I'd probably be ok with the CC abilities, they don't last forever, and some idiot is always shooting me and breaking me free.

[Kalfear]

RVR in DAoC was amazing and I roll my eyes at anyone that says its broke and just turned into zerging.

 

sometimes yes but the realm defence concepts were amazing and a group of 20 smart players could defend a level 10 keep from 50 attackers (before the stupid new frountiers and Relam Abilities were added to game).

 

DAoC at release was almost perfect, they just needed to fine tune the CC problem (mythic seems to love cc and they never learn it seems) and make sheilds actually bloke attacks rather then be a useless item in RVR combat. After that it was amazing and smart players could out do certain number disadvantages.

 

And seeing 100+ albions of all levels rallying to a relic keep to defend against 100+ mids is still one of my all time favorite MMORPG memories.

 

The problem today is people demand PVP have xp gain, special equipement, abilities and it losses what its suppose to be. 2 players (or a group), equal for the most part (if levels the same) facing off and may the best player win.

 

PVP is suppose to be a ego trip, not a alternative play style to level and outfit yourself in. PVP is suppose to enhance the main game, not be a substitution for it.

 

These modern developers need to grow a spine and say no to some of the memememe players because its their demands that have ruined the concept and experience of pvp.

 

Same goes for Raiding and the gear score crap where you have to have certain gear and certain stats and blah blah blah.

 

You create around the elitist minority and you loss out on satisfying the normal majority!

 

Thats what has happened to PVP and thats what has happened to Raiding.

 

And thats what has happened to PVE as well.

[Lord_Ravenhurst]

Everything correct in this video - what´s the point?

[NikonNikkor]

World pvp needs faction and server pride before things get real...

 

TM vs SS anyone? People would get on boards and brag about the latest running over of SS and so the alliance would get on and run over TM... there were some EPIC battles back then.

 

The original Alterac Valley anyone? that was 40 v 40 goodness... battles that lasted for days and actually took real strategy to win... like a real battle...

 

WoW did it better back then (it doesn't now)... perhaps the TOR people here just don't give a flying rats rear end about the other side and wouldn't care that one of their outposts was overrun...

 

World pvp is possible... you just can't limit it and you need to create powder keg zones like the TM vs SS area.

[Lord_Scythe]

Will be interesting to see whats "said" this year eh? Still waiting on last years announcement to come to light = ) enjoy

 

This is why i dont get excited until i can play whats been said. 1.2 ui customization is true ill give them that

 

 

 

Excellent post! My stocks in tin keep going up and up and up.

 

Seriously if you don't like the game why play? If you like the game why not go the the suggestion box and put in your ideas on how to make open world pvp better? Seriously OP add suggested fixes for the game not just they lied woe is me!

 

Constructive criticism might not get you lambasted. However a silly blanket statement is a guarantee unless that is what you were wanting!

 

I can link you tube videos too!

 

 

100 vs 40 here! Kind of an unfair fight though:

 

 

Those look like mass pvp battles to me!

Edited April 6, 2012 by Lord_Scythe

[Fenshire]

PvP is just a side thing to do when group PvE isn't an option. Nothing to get worked up about.

[Goretzu]

There is no good world pvp in any game because like the above poster said... it ends up being one side just outnumbering the other side.....

 

DAoC and WAR, both great RvR.

 

 

GW2 system does seem good too though, 3 sides (WARs biggest flaw) and winning servers go on to battle other winning servers. (and losing servers battle losing servers).

[Goretzu]

Where as RvR in SWTOR is non-existent, Ilum is terrible, utterly horribly designed for RvR..... and will be gone (maybe forever) with 1.2.

 

What's worse is SWTORs CC system, it just doesn't work well for PvP, there is too much CC and the diminishing returns/immunity system is overly complex and basically isn't fit for purpose.

 

A much simpler immunities system like WAR has would have worked much better in SWTOR.

 

In no MMORPG should you ever be able to be "stunned to death", this is a critical flaw in the PvP side of any MMORPG with it.

Edited April 6, 2012 by Goretzu

[darkuk]

Like other posters have said RVR in DAOC was amazing.

 

Like the post above who mentioned the albs v the mids for the relic, I especially loved playing in hib at times watching mids and albs fight over a keep to attacking when both of their numbers were low and eventually taking the keep ourselves and that could only be done by having three factions.

 

Every game always has a strong faction (higher numbers) but the difference to just having two to three the smaller ones can team up to overtake the stronger faction instead of just the two and the weaker one just goes away or either re-rolls.

 

I've yet to see a balanced pvp faction mmo game with only two factions succeed.

 

GW2 looks very promising with the three faction warfare.

[FourTwent]

In no MMORPG should you ever be able to be "stunned to death", this is a critical flaw in the PvP side of any MMORPG with it.

 

then in your perfect system you'd have 1 CC = a full resolve bar?

 

i like the system to an extent. allowing for stunlocks adds another layer of strategy into the game

 

im not saying it's perfect, but it's in no way broken. just needs to be tweaked. i suggest either drop the cooldown on our CC breaker from 2min to 1min. . .or let the CC breaker reset after death(leaning more towards lowering the CD since resetting after death could possibly be abused).

 

id say it would be pretty hard to kill someone within one stun, but very easily within 2 full duration stuns. . .especially if focused.

[amnie]

my I ask what exactly you want?

 

they .thought. that Ilum would be fun. they weren't .lying. at all. they just didn't realise their own faults, didn't believe what people in beta were concerned about. but lying? far stretch. what do you think why they were changing Ilum and ultimately 'taking it out' completely to 'revamp' it? they .want. Ilum to be that kind of 'epic battle'.

[Goretzu]

Like other posters have said RVR in DAOC was amazing.

 

Like the post above who mentioned the albs v the mids for the relic, I especially loved playing in hib at times watching mids and albs fight over a keep to attacking when both of their numbers were low and eventually taking the keep ourselves and that could only be done by having three factions.

 

Every game always has a strong faction (higher numbers) but the difference to just having two to three the smaller ones can team up to overtake the stronger faction instead of just the two and the weaker one just goes away or either re-rolls.

 

I've yet to see a balanced pvp faction mmo game with only two factions succeed.

 

GW2 looks very promising with the three faction warfare.

 

 

 

Warhammer Online 1.3.6 was as close as I've ever seen a 2 faction game get...... and it was quite close.

 

 

 

then in your perfect system you'd have 1 CC = a full resolve bar?

 

i like the system to an extent. allowing for stunlocks adds another layer of strategy into the game

 

im not saying it's perfect, but it's in no way broken. just needs to be tweaked. i suggest either drop the cooldown on our CC breaker from 2min to 1min. . .or let the CC breaker reset after death(leaning more towards lowering the CD since resetting after death could possibly be abused).

 

id say it would be pretty hard to kill someone within one stun, but very easily within 2 full duration stuns. . .especially if focused.

 

No, the resolve bar is overly complex and doesn't really work for the purpose it's designed for (by the time it's full you're usually already dead in many circumstances).

 

 

I'm not convinced any CC in PvP should stun, largely it should all break on damage (a CC system designed for PvE cannot really be balanced in PvP), however whether it's in there or not you need a decent, robust system to stop chain CCing.

 

Again Warhammer Online comes very close to perfection with this, certainly an awful lot close than SWTOR does.

 

They really need to rework the CC system for PvP (it can stay the same for PvE).