Stop balancing classes abilities, and balance how many are allowed in wz's

[AnEvilBus]

I did not specify as to which classes needed to be gutted and repurposed, just that it is necessary for 2 of them. Don't put words in my mouth.

 

 

 

"Most of these changes are not needed whatsoever(except for agents/scoundrels)" your OP you clearly didn;t suggest gutting them but you did specify a class.

iI also didn't understand the second part so don't shoot me

 

you did mention agents/ scoundrels ( there double hidden strike needed to be fixed i'll give you that but, bioware has pushed operatives a lot, and not for balancing but for financial reasons, i don;t have the quote on me, come by the forums.

Edited April 4, 2012 by AnEvilBus

[bellok]

If ops/scoundrels were buffed then even with full BM gear on as a sage I would be 1 or 2 hit then dead. Your class whatever that may be is probably wearing heavier armor with more hp than my sage with light armor and a bubble that mitigates 2.5k damage. Secondly ops/scoundrels were made to regulate sorcs/sages, obviously not the class you are playing.

[KryptikX]

You are arguing against something you know is true. Otherwise you simply don't fight in wz's and spend more time posting on the forums.

 

Well, I suppose I could be playing the devil's advocate... but I'm not.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=391796

 

They apparently don't agree with you either. After all, if it isn't about class balance but rather simply class numbers, then an 8 man team of ANY class should be OP. If that were the case, you wouldn't see them making jokes about certain 8 man/1 class compositions.

 

btw... if this is a troll, well done indeed.

[bellok]

"Most of these changes are not needed whatsoever(except for agents/scoundrels)" your OP you clearly didn;t suggest gutting them but you did specify a class.

 

you did mention agents/ scoundrels ( there double hidden strike needed to be fixed i'll give you that but, bioware has pushed operatives a lot, and not for balancing but for financial reasons, i don;t have the quote on me, come by the forums.

 

Actually yes agents/scoundrels need a regutting and need to be focused dps wise or something and should have never been able to become as a healing class. Same with Mercs/troopers. This is personal bias of course. The nerf I think needs to happen to agents/scoundrels is unrelated to the gutting comment actually. Just to clear up a couple of things.

[bellok]

Well, I suppose I could be playing the devil's advocate... but I'm not.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=391796

 

They apparently don't agree with you either. After all, if it isn't about class balance but rather simply class numbers, then an 8 man team of ANY class should be OP. If that were the case, you wouldn't see them making jokes about certain 8 man/1 class compositions.

 

btw... if this is a troll, well done indeed.

 

8 healers is over powered for healing. However not dps wise. NEXT!

[AnEvilBus]

If ops/scoundrels were buffed then even with full BM gear on as a sage I would be 1 or 2 hit then dead. Your class whatever that may be is probably wearing heavier armor with more hp than my sage with light armor and a bubble that mitigates 2.5k damage. Secondly ops/scoundrels were made to regulate sorcs/sages, obviously not the class you are playing.

 

I play as an operatives and sorc, jug, sent, and assasin, sorc do have useful abilities/ talents to shut down operatives be it early burst, or to survive / kill them especially if your hybrid build, and huttball bridges can make life easier.

I'm not asking to buff operatives, since other classes are being nerfed, it kinda lessens the issue

[bellok]

I play as an operatives and sorc, jug, sent, and assasin, sorc do have useful abilities/ talents to shut down operatives be it early burst, or to survive / kill them especially if your hybrid build, and huttball bridges can make life easier.

I'm not asking to buff operatives, since other classes are being nerfed, it kinda lessens the issue

 

Very true. I mainly play full spec'd seer so I'm hosed many times. Running with premades helps a lot. Although I disagree with the nerfs on everyone else.

Edited April 4, 2012 by bellok

[Chaos_Distortion]

If ops/scoundrels were buffed then even with full BM gear on as a sage I would be 1 or 2 hit then dead. Your class whatever that may be is probably wearing heavier armor with more hp than my sage with light armor and a bubble that mitigates 2.5k damage. Secondly ops/scoundrels were made to regulate sorcs/sages, obviously not the class you are playing.

So you're admitting to playing a Sage and want operatives/scoundrels to be completely gutted into oblivion because they're your counter class? Rofl, oh god this is the most hilarious thread I have ever seen in my history of MMOs. You are probably the most blatantly obvious worse sage player in the game or a really, really bad troll that is trying way too hard.

[Bnol]

The problem is they created 3 seperate healing classes, and the game was designed with that in mind. It may be a bad idea now that the game is out. The problem with having 3 classes for healing is the constant competeing with each other on who is the "better healer" in which all are about the same. Just different. They all have their advantages and disadvantages. Mixed with rage about healing being over powered(partially due to too many sages/sorcs in wz's), and now they are getting nerfed come 1.2.

 

So your perfect game would have one dps class, one tank class, and one healing class to eliminate any issue of the "best" of each?

[Khoraji]

Seriously stop "balancing the classes". In fact throw out all of the class balancing being tested on the test server. Most of these changes are not needed whatsoever(except for agents/scoundrels). What does need to be done however is there needs to be a limit on the number of classes allowed in warzones.

 

The same problems we are seeing with sorcs when this game first came out are becoming apparent again. Only the class has changed. Marauders, assasins, and their mirrors. The whines have already shifted from sorcs to assasins/sins, and marauders/knights.

 

Please for the love of god stop balancing the classes individually, and start balancing how many of each class can enter into a warzone. Instead of work being done on "balancing the classes" here are some better things to spend your time:

 

1. Get cross server warzones running asap.

2. Only allow two of each class into a warzone.

3. 4 man premades should ONLY consist of 1 of each different class.

4. 8 man premades should ONLY consist of 2 of each different class.

 

Longer queue times? Absolutely. They will significantly get shorter with cross server warzones. However with longer queue times you will have a "more balanced" warzone experience overall.

 

I do realize there will still be the possibility of 6 healers in a warzone still. However that is a fault on Bio Ware. In my opinion there should only be 1 class in game dedicated for all healing needs. All others is just fluff. 2 of the classes need to be redesigned into something else so that there aren't problems amonst the people feeling ripped off because they perceive their class as being inferior. Even though they aren't. They're just different.

 

TLDR; Stop balancing classes. Instead balance amount of the same classes in a warzone. Get cross server warzones up and running, then regulate the classes. Get rid of 2 healing classes, and redesign them for something else. Patch 1.2 "class balancing" is utter nonsense. Except for bug fixes.

 

stupid idea... /thread.

[Radicalz]

Playing against a team of a majority of one class would be advantageous to your team.

 

L2play issue.

[Fredcat]

I agree with the OP but his reasoning is completely backwards. The reason to balance healer/tank/dps in a warzone is so YOU don't get screwed being on an unbalance team. I've been in warzones where everyone was a tank. Totally sucks. You got no heals and low dps, the chances of you winning are slime.

 

The only way they could ever make this work though is with cross server queuing, you'd be waiting forever for a balanced group on a single server.

 

Edit - I'm talking solo queuing PUGs, rated 8 mans should be able to put together any group they want.

Edited April 4, 2012 by Fredcat

[Bocherel]

I love how the TS says only the agent/scoundrel deserve a nerf, roflmao, talk about bias

[DkSharktooth]

This can only be implemented once there is a stable amount of ques for warzones during cross-realm warzones.

[RyanEclipse]

I pronounce this guy the official king of double and triple posts

[cashogy]

you invalidated your entire argument in the first 2 sentences

 

if any of the 1.2 class changes need to be thrown out, its the ones to operative/scoundrel. they have been relentlessly dragged through the mud since launch. that class needed no balancing once consumables were balanced. yet the forums erupted in a sea of tears, and op/scouns have been continually treated like 2nd class players.

 

forum opinion should not control the direction of the game. so far it has, and bioware needs to start thinking for themselves rather than taking the anecdotal evidence of baddies as facts

[Varicite]

Seriously stop "balancing the classes". In fact throw out all of the class balancing being tested on the test server. Most of these changes are not needed whatsoever(except for agents/scoundrels). What does need to be done however is there needs to be a limit on the number of classes allowed in warzones.

 

The same problems we are seeing with sorcs when this game first came out are becoming apparent again. Only the class has changed. Marauders, assasins, and their mirrors. The whines have already shifted from sorcs to assasins/sins, and marauders/knights.

 

Please for the love of god stop balancing the classes individually, and start balancing how many of each class can enter into a warzone. Instead of work being done on "balancing the classes" here are some better things to spend your time:

 

1. Get cross server warzones running asap.

2. Only allow two of each class into a warzone.

3. 4 man premades should ONLY consist of 1 of each different class.

4. 8 man premades should ONLY consist of 2 of each different class.

 

Longer queue times? Absolutely. They will significantly get shorter with cross server warzones. However with longer queue times you will have a "more balanced" warzone experience overall.

 

I do realize there will still be the possibility of 6 healers in a warzone still. However that is a fault on Bio Ware. In my opinion there should only be 1 class in game dedicated for all healing needs. All others is just fluff. 2 of the classes need to be redesigned into something else so that there aren't problems amonst the people feeling ripped off because they perceive their class as being inferior. Even though they aren't. They're just different.

 

TLDR; Stop balancing classes. Instead balance amount of the same classes in a warzone. Get cross server warzones up and running, then regulate the classes. Get rid of 2 healing classes, and redesign them for something else. Patch 1.2 "class balancing" is utter nonsense. Except for bug fixes.

 

I think this is a terrible idea on so many levels.

 

you invalidated your entire argument in the first 2 sentences

 

if any of the 1.2 class changes need to be thrown out, its the ones to operative/scoundrel. they have been relentlessly dragged through the mud since launch. that class needed no balancing once consumables were balanced. yet the forums erupted in a sea of tears, and op/scouns have been continually treated like 2nd class players.

 

forum opinion should not control the direction of the game. so far it has, and bioware needs to start thinking for themselves rather than taking the anecdotal evidence of baddies as facts

 

Yeah, well, those teams of those guys shouldn't have made all of us unsub.

Edited April 4, 2012 by Varicite

[TheOpf]

Seriously stop "balancing the classes". In fact throw out all of the class balancing being tested on the test server. Most of these changes are not needed whatsoever(except for agents/scoundrels).

 

 

What! An agent needs the nerf? How can you say that? I don't know anyone who goes dangit that pesky Operative/scoundrel is just too powerful for me. Heck I rarely see them in any pvp matches. I mean seriously what semi-skilled player is afraid of an operative. I am more terrified of Sins and snipers than a scoundrel.

 

Granted, When you run into 3 of them it's annoying, but so is running into a team of sages, sentinels, assassins, well really anything except a team of mercs/troopers. I personally hate when I see 3 snipers waiting for me.

 

I play a sage.

 

Oh wait, should started with this than no one would have wasted time reading the rest.

Edited April 4, 2012 by TheOpf

[bellok]

What! An agent needs the nerf? How can you say that? I don't know anyone who goes dangit that pesky Operative/scoundrel is just too powerful for me. Heck I rarely see them in any pvp matches. I mean seriously what semi-skilled player is afraid of an operative. I am more terrified of Sins and snipers than a scoundrel.

 

Granted, When you run into 3 of them it's annoying, but so is running into a team of sages, sentinels, assassins, well really anything except a team of mercs/troopers. I personally hate when I see 3 snipers waiting for me.

 

 

 

Oh wait, should started with this than no one would have wasted time reading the rest.

 

For the love of god this thread isn't a call to nerf agents/scoundrels. That is just an opinion I had about them not related to this thread whatsoever. Oh and.....look at my sig merc.

[Bocherel]

For the love of god this thread isn't a call to nerf agents/scoundrels.

 

Thats exactly what it is by you putting all your bias into the first sentence of your own thread

[Kainiil]

Not bad making sure there is somewhat of a group composition requirement would be a good thing.

 

 

Nothing like going into battle with no healers when your oponent has some.

[DarthJustifier]

don't limit classes limit roles. 6 healers is stupid. Limit the amount of heals tank and dps spec to a balanced number for both teams.

[kweassa]

What about the people facing premades with 7-8 of the same class? Where is their freedom to have a fair fight?

 

The only thing that is "fair" in PvP is the number of players. If you don't like your odds, go make a premade of your own to counter the specific challenge you need to beat.

 

When you face a team that has a lot of DPS instead, and your team does not have enough damage, then are you going to start crying that they need to limit the number of pure DPS classes in a single party as well?

 

What if I don't like to face a lot of ranged, while I'm stuck with mostly incompetent newbie melees in my team? Should I go making requests to limit the number of ranged classes in a party?

 

 

 

Are they supposed to just go then and reroll to the class that is perceived as the new FOTM?

 

If you don't want to do that, there is a more simpler solution of becoming a superb player, and then gathering other superb players to counter the specific team combination you hate.

 

 

You want something done in PvP?

 

Make efforts, practice, learn, and organize. That's how things are handled in PvP, instead of screaming to mommy every time to 'make them stop doing it'.

 

You either get better at it, or **** and just give it up. That's PvP. PvP is competition, not a daycare center for the witless.

 

 

 

Your argument is actually psuedo intellectual. People will be more happy with warzones(I guarentee it) if we adhere to strict group balancing guidlines, as opposed to not.

 

Who are you to dictate what makes people more happy?

[TheOpf]

Oh and.....look at my sig merc.

 

Um, where do you get that I am a merc? Is it because I called you out for being a sage? haha, you are such a noob, it's funny. Your obvious bias was stated in the first sentence.

 

I am a Powertech. One of the few, the proud, and generally the quiet powertech community. We eat Mercs for lunch. Try exercising a little more brain power in your next reply.

[TheOpf]

Not bad making sure there is somewhat of a group composition requirement would be a good thing.

 

 

Nothing like going into battle with no healers when your oponent has some.

 

It would be impossibly complex to write the code that checked specs before setting them in the queue. Besides have you seen how few tanks there are in some servers. Some people pve as tanks, and pvp as dps. heck, i could queue as a tank and then rush to respec to dps just to get an earlier queue.

 

If you want composition go with a premade group.