Irishbrewed Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 (edited) Sup bounty hunters! So in 1.2 you see the combat team at BIOWARE is making quality of life changes to certain talent trees (I.E. marauder, moving talents to lower tier to be accessible to more builds). Well there are not a ton of FUN/utility talents in the Arsenal/Pyro tree. But undoubtedly there is one really cool talent, and that is AFTERBURNNERS. I play pyrotech and it just would be rather cool if AFTERBURNNERS was bumped down one teir in the Arsenal Tree and would then be more accessible to the Pyro Bounty Hunter as well. It's a really fun talent and I don't know of any one reason why it should be limited to just one build, or require such a sacrifice in the pyro tree to get. It's apparent Bioware does pay attention to the community, they gave that TM a new animation for quality of life based on our feedback. Now maybe they can just entertain the idea of AFTERBURNNERS for the Firebug as well.... So if my fellow pyros want to use that rocketpunch more and just give us aliitle more kite utility with the awesome AFTERBURNNERS talent then give the thread a /SIGNED. Edited March 31, 2012 by Irishbrewed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diddley Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 /signed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Assaultrooper Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 Afterburners is the talent for the upgraded knockback right? if so... No.. Arsenal is supposed to be the Knockback spec, Pyro the kiting spec that is what you are signing up when you choose to be a pyrotech kite not knockback. This would significantly reduce the flavour each spec has, AND create balance issues... Why? Well why cant sorcs get a root every 15 secs AND a root on overload too?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baarabas Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 Afterburners is the talent for the upgraded knockback right? if so... No.. Arsenal is supposed to be the Knockback spec, Pyro the kiting spec that is what you are signing up when you choose to be a pyrotech kite not knockback. This would significantly reduce the flavour each spec has, AND create balance issues... Why? Well why cant sorcs get a root every 15 secs AND a root on overload too?? If that your mentality, then why does Sorc/Sage, a class who gets 90% of their DPS from ranged (30m), get so many CCs instant cast not channeled, get a force run (which is supposed to be a gap closer for melee), and get melee'esque defences with the bubble? Pyro hardly uses Rocket Punch, so that will not be an issue. So our main benifit will be in Jet Boost. It will require great sacrifice since the 1.2 nerf will REQUIRE muzzel fluting. It costs 2 points and will give 2m, thats it, 2m's. You are really saying 2m's will tip the balance? After all the nerfs we are getting in 1.2, we need some love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Assaultrooper Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 If that your mentality, then why does Sorc/Sage, a class who gets 90% of their DPS from ranged (30m), get so many CCs instant cast not channeled, get a force run (which is supposed to be a gap closer for melee), and get melee'esque defences with the bubble? Pyro hardly uses Rocket Punch, so that will not be an issue. So our main benifit will be in Jet Boost. It will require great sacrifice since the 1.2 nerf will REQUIRE muzzel fluting. It costs 2 points and will give 2m, thats it, 2m's. You are really saying 2m's will tip the balance? After all the nerfs we are getting in 1.2, we need some love. It is designed that way! Sorcs get don't get heavy armor, or a defensive cooldown, nor do they get to do full dps while moving! If you believe that the trade-out isn't fair by all means reroll it is not the class design.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irishbrewed Posted March 31, 2012 Author Share Posted March 31, 2012 (edited) Afterburners is the talent for the upgraded knockback right? if so... No.. Arsenal is supposed to be the Knockback spec, Pyro the kiting spec that is what you are signing up when you choose to be a pyrotech kite not knockback. This would significantly reduce the flavour each spec has, AND create balance issues... Why? Well why cant sorcs get a root every 15 secs AND a root on overload too?? Yes we knockback and kite those pesky warriors and so on. Knockback is also very good situational, a talented rocket punch can get someone off a catwalk and keep our jet boost off cd. It's an overall utility talent that would be really FUN to have. We can still knockback just as much as Aresenal as pyro as is. So it's not like the class is the anti knockback spec. Like I said its one of the few talents in the trees that is good fun utility and it would be rather cool if it was available to the pyro who wanted to sink 2pts in it. It would still not be the OPTIMAL talent for us considering it does not boost our damage but I for one would take the sacrifice to have the added utility for overall enjoyment sake. I don't see a balance issue at all. And the flavor of our class is we are FIREBUGS and a longer knockback doesn't identify an arsenal merc. Edited March 31, 2012 by Irishbrewed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Areaz Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 If that your mentality, then why does Sorc/Sage, a class who gets 90% of their DPS from ranged (30m), get so many CCs instant cast not channeled, get a force run (which is supposed to be a gap closer for melee), and get melee'esque defences with the bubble? Pyro hardly uses Rocket Punch, so that will not be an issue. So our main benifit will be in Jet Boost. It will require great sacrifice since the 1.2 nerf will REQUIRE muzzel fluting. It costs 2 points and will give 2m, thats it, 2m's. You are really saying 2m's will tip the balance? After all the nerfs we are getting in 1.2, we need some love. offtopic, but why would u not use rocket punch ? TD, rail shot, rocket punch, unload, proc'd RS. loooool all the things are dead. rocket punch can crit for 2.5k, it's worth it imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Assaultrooper Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 Yes we knockback and kite those pesky warriors and so on. Knockback is also very good situational, a talented rocket punch can get someone off a catwalk and keep our jet boost off cd. It's an overall utility talent that would be really FUN to have. We can still knockback just as much as Aresenal as pyro as is. So it's not like the class is the anti knockback spec. Like I said its one of the few talents in the trees that is good fun utility and it would be rather cool if it was available to the pyro who wanted to sink 2pts in it. It would still not be the OPTIMAL talent for us considering it does not boost our damage but I for one would take the sacrifice to have the added utility for overall enjoyment sake. I don't see a balance issue at all. And the flavor of our class is we are FIREBUGS and a longer knockback doesn't identify an arsenal merc. ok lol turning troll off.. I see were you're coming from but from the other side of stuff there is a huge difference, the arsenal knockback blasts you WAY farther, in say huttball unless you have something behind you it is guaranteed to knock someone off some thing or into something. and that is the beauty of arsenal PvP the fact that you are trading mobility and a snare for this ability, IMO it is unfair for arsenal specs mercs, who did the trading while the pyro who is already pretty decent gets a buff with no downside. Notice** that the "buffs" to marauders came at the expense of annihilation (which in all honesty, we can agree it was OP..) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irishbrewed Posted March 31, 2012 Author Share Posted March 31, 2012 ok lol turning troll off.. I see were you're coming from but from the other side of stuff there is a huge difference, the arsenal knockback blasts you WAY farther, in say huttball unless you have something behind you it is guaranteed to knock someone off some thing or into something. and that is the beauty of arsenal PvP the fact that you are trading mobility and a snare for this ability, IMO it is unfair for arsenal specs mercs, who did the trading while the pyro who is already pretty decent gets a buff with no downside. Notice** that the "buffs" to marauders came at the expense of annihilation (which in all honesty, we can agree it was OP..) Im not sure that the AFTERBURNNERS is the beauty of Arsenal? I think Aresenal has just been the benefactor of an awesome talent. Aresenal still poors out crazy DMg and requires less heat management and rapid fire then a pyro. Not to mention their armor debuffs. I do not agree that AFTERBURNNERS defines the arsenal merc. But to better address your stance. Let's take a look at INFRARED SENSORS. So you can say that the devs gave Pyro IS and arsenal AB. Well unfortunately IS is very much more situational and less beneficial then AB. It's a good talent and I take it, but it is not a good comp to AB. So I would argue they could bump IS down a teir too, for the Arsenal Merc if they want to sacrifice better talents for added utility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Assaultrooper Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 Im not sure that the AFTERBURNNERS is the beauty of Arsenal? I think Aresenal has just been the benefactor of an awesome talent. Aresenal still poors out crazy DMg and requires less heat management and rapid fire then a pyro. Not to mention their armor debuffs. I do not agree that AFTERBURNNERS defines the arsenal merc. But to better address your stance. Let's take a look at INFRARED SENSORS. So you can say that the devs gave Pyro IS and arsenal AB. Well unfortunately IS is very much more situational and less beneficial then AB. It's a good talent and I take it, but it is not a good comp to AB. So I would argue they could bump IS down a teir too, for the Arsenal Merc if they want to sacrifice better talents for added utility. no no no well it defines arsenal because otherwise, utility wise arsenal is way behind. Imagine arsenal without the upgraded knockback, it would be a glass canon that has to cast all of it's abilities and without any pro to it but a debuff on the target. (The dps output is another thing as I think bioware thinks that it should be on par, and I believe it is pretty much) Why I say it "defines" arsenal more so than tracer missle or anything else? Because it is the talent around which most of the fight is thought out. As an arsenal an entire fight can be decided upon when you use your knockback, and trying to pull-out as most casts as possible. That is not really true for pyro-specs, the priority is in moving around kiting the enemy, the knockback is supposed to be used in conjunction with the stun to create distance. Well to not repeat too much i'll leave u G luck on the idea if I am wrong (I haven't played too much my merc, but I have ample experience fighting them) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irishbrewed Posted March 31, 2012 Author Share Posted March 31, 2012 I think most bounty hunters spec one way or another for either TRACER HSM and turret play or IM TD and mobility play. Those define the specs. Just as useful is AB is to Arsenal it would be equally as useful for a pyro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baarabas Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 offtopic, but why would u not use rocket punch ? TD, rail shot, rocket punch, unload, proc'd RS. loooool all the things are dead. rocket punch can crit for 2.5k, it's worth it imo I never said we don't use it. I said we don't use it that often. Really, I would rather spend the heat on something out talent tree has enhanced. Also, though it is almost unavoidable, I try to stay out of melee range. Therefore the term "hardly" was used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McGarnagle Posted April 1, 2012 Share Posted April 1, 2012 (edited) It is designed that way! Sorcs get don't get heavy armor, or a defensive cooldown, nor do they get to do full dps while moving! If you believe that the trade-out isn't fair by all means reroll it is not the class design.. No defensive cooldown? What about a bubble they can put on themselves every 20 seconds (17 in pvp with healing gear). BH's get a 25% reduction shield that is on a 2 minute cooldown. and yes, I have a sorc and BH. The force speed along with slows and roots along with a spammable attack this is a slow is way better than having heavy armor. Plus they get extricate for huttball (and of course the speed which is not totally defensive). Sorcs have way more utility that more than makes up for light armor. Oh, and let's not forget a ranged interrupt vs. no interrupt. Edited April 1, 2012 by McGarnagle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baarabas Posted April 1, 2012 Share Posted April 1, 2012 No defensive cooldown? What about a bubble they can put on themselves every 20 seconds (17 in pvp with healing gear). BH's get a 25% reduction shield that is on a 2 minute cooldown. and yes, I have a sorc and BH. The force speed along with slows and roots along with a spammable attack this is a slow is way better than having heavy armor. Plus they get extricate for huttball (and of course the speed which is not totally defensive). Sorcs have way more utility that more than makes up for light armor. Oh, and let's not forget a ranged interrupt vs. no interrupt. Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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