ferroz Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 (edited) What you claim for me is the same as you. Good thing that I stick to factual, objective arguments without ad hominem attacks or other fallacious logic, eh? Just copying pasting my post doesn't actually say anything meaningful; I'm not even convinced based on your usage here that you actually understand the stuff that you're parroting. I mean, if I was doing any of those things, it would be easy to give examples. I have specific examples every time you did those things. If you expect anyone to believe your claim that I'm doing that, you should also give some specific examples... Now, you're not giving any examples; you're just blindly quoting what I said, without adding anything that supports your claims. And as such, your premise is as false as you claim that mine.This conclusion doesn't follow from your premise. You have a false premise; it's objectively false. You claimed that cross server prevents people from chatting hanging with people that they meet, and that's just not the case. MY premise on the other hand: arguments that use fallacious logic are not valid support for your position. Therefore your argument is invalid. My premise is objectively true; it's basically tautological. My conclusion (which is the 2nd sentence of those 2) follows logically from my premise: your argument is based on a false premise, so it's fallacious, so your argument is invalid (edit: whoops typo). So there's nothing false about my premise; nor is there anything false about the conclusion I'm drawing based on that premise. Edited March 31, 2012 by ferroz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azzras Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 (edited) While rift did not launch with one it was already in full development during beta when the game did launch. Tera will be launching here in the states and EU with a cross server lfg tool. Yes Tera was launched in korea without it. But thats still not the same as the western Tera. To be fair wow was the first to do cross server lfg as we know it today and there really has not been many games launched from then to know to say none has ever launched with one. What i can say is that almost every game on the market has gone and added one since wow released theirs. I disagree. They had a full year without the feature in their game. We could say the same about SWTOR if it launched in other regions by this logic. And SWTOR will have one soon. Edited March 30, 2012 by Azzras Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 I disagree. They had a full year without the feature in their game. they who? Rift had it in far less than a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touchbass Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 A lot of people believe this, but it's just a myth. (in regards to server policing) There are many reasons not to like X-LFD and what not, server policing is not one of them. I don't care what you say, you can't blacklist someone in these kind of MMORPGs anymore. There have been multiple threads in general and in-game about people ninja'ing stuff for their companions and not once have I heard of someone been blacklisted for it. What I have seen is someone try and blacklist someone for stealing loot and the end result has been that person been told to **** off and 9/10 that person is the one that gets put on ignore, not the person who caused said infraction. We leave in a world where getting your 2nd 50 takes less then 2 weeks, where server and name changes are looming in the future and groups are so small people can hide very easily. The good old days of righteous policing are dead, as they should be. Half the time they were legitimate claims by people being ***** but the rest of them were personal vendetta's over a stupid argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azzras Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 they who? Rift had it in far less than a year. We were talking about Tera there, but even Rift launched without this tool. The reason I keep stressing that NO game in history has launched with an LFG tool for PvE is, in my own way, an attempt to calm some people about SWTOR not having one yet. NO OTHER MMO EVER LAUNCHED WITH ONE...EVER. An automated LFG tool is coming to SWTOR. How it will work and when I do not know, but it has been confirmed. I know this isn't exactly about xserver, but I hope it helps ease some people's minds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rojahar Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 I'm not a fan of cross-server anything. When WZs and FPs are server only, it often allows you to meet new friends, and recruit/befriend skilled PvPers/PvEers you happen to come across. It also builds a sense of community in that you get to know and recognize those who regularly join WZs and such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrOrionQuest Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 We're not getting a cross-server LFG tool any time in the near future. This was discussed at the Guild Summit, so this conversation is now defunct. Arguing for either side isn't going to get you anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 We were talking about Tera there, but even Rift launched without this tool.You mentioned both in the post I quoted. The reason I keep stressing that NO game in history has launched with an LFG tool for PvE is, The fact that you have to qualify it pve vs pvp kind of says something. if you go back far enough, there wasn't a game in history that launched with an lfg tool, pvp or pve. if you go back far enough, there wasn't a game in history that had a quest log. if you go back far enough, there wasn't a game in history that had instanced content. the industry changes... and the time where it was acceptable to people to leave out certain QoL features at launch is pretty much over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 We're not getting a cross-server LFG tool any time in the near future. This was discussed at the Guild Summit, so this conversation is now defunct. Arguing for either side isn't going to get you anywhere.sure it is. Trion said the same thing in rift, and they wound up adding it. I'm convinced that the speed at which they added it was at least in part driven by the storm of commentary on their forums about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 I'm not a fan of cross-server anything. When WZs and FPs are server only, it often allows you to meet new friends, and recruit/befriend skilled PvPers/PvEers you happen to come across. this is also true of cross server WZs and FPs.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kfab Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 the way I was describing was how it worked before cata was released... I'm pretty sure he's talking about the 4.1 incarnation of the troll dungeons. It sounds like it's a combination of things that allowed him to be kicked; maybe they've addressed it and maybe they haven't... but it's still no more abusive than TOR. Yup, that's exactly when it happened. They fixed it, fortunately. At the time, the only thing I could do was report them (they were all from the same guild which should have tipped me off in the first place) and hope that a GM would remove the bear mount from whomever won the roll. I highly doubt that happened though. At least it got fixed and I eventually got that bear mount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lpooljay Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 LFG tool has to be implemented. The amount of time I spent on imperial fleet searching for ppl for fp is quiet big and Im not havin fun then just standing there bored to death typin LFG every min. Im lvl 50 now and wanna di operation, so I need minimum 8 ppl im trying for like a week and cannot gather a full team. I think to mak it easy to find ppl some kind of system has to be implemented cause loads of ppl will just leave the game cause they will ge tboard with standing around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rojahar Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 this is also true of cross server WZs and FPs.... Not when people are just going to go back to their own servers. Most people don't even bother being respectful in cross-server content, because they're likely never going to see any of those people again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reevax Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 I'm not a fan of cross-server anything. When WZs and FPs are server only, it often allows you to meet new friends, and recruit/befriend skilled PvPers/PvEers you happen to come across. It also builds a sense of community in that you get to know and recognize those who regularly join WZs and such. I will post this again since people like you seem to ignore it. My 10 man raid guild met after the formation of the LFD in WoW. We are still friends today. We hang out, talk on vent, and drink beer. I have even met a few of them in real life. We hung out drank beer and had fun. = Community? The WoW LFD matches you with your server first, so I often ran with people who I knew from around Org. = make friends, get to know people? There is no community in this game, at all, nothing. I never even see anyone except when I am on the station. There are NO FPs going pre or at 50. You are making a totally invalid argument and sticking to it like it is some sort of fact. Your argument is no to X-server because otherwise you can't make friends? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferroz Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 Not when people are just going to go back to their own servers. Yes, it's still true even when people are going to go back to their own servers. Cross server does not prevent that. Most people don't even bother being respectful in cross-server content,The proportion of people that don't even bother being respectful in cross-server content is the same as proportion of people that don't even bother being respectful in single-server content Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rojahar Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 There is no community in this game, at all, nothing. I never even see anyone except when I am on the station. There are NO FPs going pre or at 50. Sounds like YOU are just not part of the server community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reevax Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 Not when people are just going to go back to their own servers. Most people don't even bother being respectful in cross-server content, because they're likely never going to see any of those people again. I always see people say stuff like this. People don't need X-server to act like jerks, you must realize that by now. 95% of my LFD runs in WoW are fine, no one is rude, no one act like an idiot, the run is fast, and smooth. You would sacrifice more access to game content because you are worried someone will be rude? The Internet may not be the place for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mayjin Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 Il tell you why some people are agents LFG tools..its most prob grumpy guild leaders and people that think they hold a little power over others..and with a LFG tool they lose all that "POWER" and cant threaten people with the finger on the kick from guild button:P beause people will have no need to suck up to them to get into FP/raids..and thats all it is.. What freaking community?? omg i spammed lf flash point please for 2hrs..got into a group now all of a sudden i'm a social buff magnet..get a life!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touchbass Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 (edited) I always see people say stuff like this. People don't need X-server to act like jerks, you must realize that by now. 95% of my LFD runs in WoW are fine, no one is rude, no one act like an idiot, the run is fast, and smooth. You would sacrifice more access to game content because you are worried someone will be rude? The Internet may not be the place for you. This is such a ballant lie, you are what's wrong with the community. Shame on you. DIAF. The truth is 99% of runs in LFD are fine, haha, gotcha Edited March 31, 2012 by Touchbass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mayjin Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 (edited) Il tell you why some people are agents LFG tools..its most prob grumpy guild leaders and people that think they hold a little power over others..and with a LFG tool they lose all that "POWER" and cant threaten people with the finger on the kick from guild button:P beause people will have no need to suck up to them to get into FP/raids..and thats all it is.. What freaking community?? omg i spammed lf flash point please for 2hrs..got into a group now all of a sudden i'm a social buff magnet..get a life!!!!! and btw get ready to say bye bye to a lot of people..if LFG isnt here sooner then late! see how fun it is to be all social on your own. what people dont get is that i might be willing to do the whole social thing but others dont..like my mates all left alrdy due to standing and waisting time trying to find a FP ;( me sad ;( Edited March 31, 2012 by mayjin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaosdefined Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 It's actually really quite sad that the main argument people have against Cross Server goes along the lines of... "I don't trust people from other servers!" It's actually one hell of a xenophobic view to have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reevax Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 Sounds like YOU are just not part of the server community. You can't really be a part of something that does not exist. My server is "Standard" population and there are almost no FPs going. Even the FP spam in general has all but stopped. There are never any Hardmode runs and the pre 50s are usually Hammer Sta or Athiss, after that nothing. I would be happy to risk a few rude people to be able to have access to all of the games content. Can you imagine such a thing, mind boggling I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touchbass Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 It's actually really quite sad that the main argument people have against Cross Server goes along the lines of... "I don't trust people from other servers!" It's actually one hell of a xenophobic view to have. Most of the people who don't like X-LFD are usually complete jerks who have no sympathy for other human beings in a blight. If we have to lose them from the game then I'd a double boon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitewolfe Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 We're not getting a cross-server LFG tool any time in the near future. This was discussed at the Guild Summit, so this conversation is now defunct. Arguing for either side isn't going to get you anywhere. Actually it can get us a long ways. Yes for now the anti cross server crowd has won but that doesnt mean we cant change Bw's mind. Remember BW took the same stance about cross server pvp and we have confirmation that pvp warzones will be going cross server now. So it is not pointless to keep telling BW how much the majority want a cross server pve tool also! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitewolfe Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 Most of the people who don't like X-LFD are usually complete jerks who have no sympathy for other human beings in a blight. If we have to lose them from the game then I'd a double boon. Agreed! I think it is also key to point out that it may be the very reason those people claim to have so many bad runs. Its clear they are the common element in all those bad runs they have had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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