SWTOR Vs WoW: Blizzard gets it

[Zortezurtek]

oh, and what are your lotto number picks for this week? Prophets must be tested before being believed you know, even on a gaming forum.

 

4-8-15-16-23-42

[Jaksith]

Warcraft has had nearly ten years of development and is still crap. I have tried playing it 3 times over the years and could not stand it for more than a couple weeks. that said, let the horse rest in piece. Quit bringing up the TOR/wow comparisons. They are getting old and annoying.

 

Speaking of annoying - bold/red font.....annoying

 

Can't compare initial launches, so much as changed and learned since the days of WoW launch - comparatively, BW should have been more on top of performance issues and anticipated server load problems.

 

I don't think either company is focusing as much on the other as people like to believe. MMO subscriptions are down across the board, not just people switching games. Their focus should be on finding ways to hook new markets AND keep old markets interested. WoW went to pandas to try and hook a new market, but that's only a part of their next expansion, they are also doing a lot to try to keep the old market. Time will tell how successful they'll be, right now the core player feedback isn't great, although too focused on pandas and not enough focus on other new things. Hopefully the next xpac of SWTOR will manage that balance as well.

[Telarethiel]

Here's a free million Bioware: Integrate social networking in the form of Facebook/Twitter/G+ apps that post achievements, raid/boss clears, PvP wins/losses, etc. Free advertising, and it would let players compare with their friends for that almighty, engorged, e-peen. Even the mighty WoW can't claim that yet, so you'd be breaking ground.

 

In fact... hire me. I'll do it for you.

[Rivethed]

I agree with the OP. Research my posts and you will see.

 

I dont understand the reasoning behind the ," WoW has had a 6+ year head start! Other MMOs cant compare with that!".

 

ITS CALLED LEARNING FROM YOUR RIVALS.

 

It makes no difference if you love or hate Blizzard Entertainment Inc, they have set an industry standard for what players expect in an MMO. Period.

 

Learn from them. The devs at blizzard sure learned; they outright stole ideas from games like DAoC such as icons over NPC's head to indicate quests etc, "green" items dropping off common mobs- all this was in DAoC BEFORE Blizzard started their servers.

 

LEARN

[Bladedakoda]

I agree with the OP. Research my posts and you will see.

 

I dont understand the reasoning behind the ," WoW has had a 6+ year head start! Other MMOs cant compare with that!".

 

ITS CALLED LEARNING FROM YOUR RIVALS.

 

It makes no difference if you love or hate Blizzard Entertainment Inc, they have set an industry standard for what players expect in an MMO. Period.

 

Learn from them. The devs at blizzard sure learned; they outright stole ideas from games like DAoC such as icons over NPC's head to indicate quests etc, "green" items dropping off common mobs- all this was in DAoC BEFORE Blizzard started their servers.

 

LEARN

 

While i agree with what you have said even Blizz have seemed to have lost their way. They are hemorrhaging subs to the point that people on their forums are screaming for a server merge. LFR only solves easy mode, it does not help people that want to do normal or hard mode. Activision sacked 600 Blizzard staff, pandoria was the hope of getting in a new market of people, and it looks like even that is not going to help them.

[Kinrain]

I just went to youtube to have a look at the gameplay videos of Mist of Panderia to see if I was making unwarranted assumptions about the expansion.

 

I suggest you do the same.

 

Then come back here and honestly tell me, with a straight face, that you think Blizzard 'gets it'.

 

Can't be done.

[Suttree]

in before closing.

 

WOW equals medieval fantasy cr**. No thanks.

 

You forgot the word "cartoony".

[Terrix]

Cross Server PvP is going to follow this mechanic.

 

So far, they have not said anything specific about cross server LFG for PvE that I am aware of. It's server LFG only for PvE for now. All they said was that they would revisit the question in the future.

 

Touchè, Andryah.

 

However, the mmo industry's failed companies speak for themselves. Where is SWG today? What about WAR, or perhaps APB? Remember tabula rasa? That game did so much for the next generation of developers, and sparked our imaginations to boot. TR fell apart in a little under 3 years(the number of years it did or did not survive for is irrelevant to the discussion at hand), if memory serves. We deserve innovation, at this point, and I believe the only way we will get innovation is by letting games like swtor fail. The "Next Halo" Or "WoW" will create a new dynasty, and shape things for the next generation of gamers.

 

Simply put, allow swtor to fail, and we will be rewarded in the future by games made by people who really care about innovation and creativity. Titan is around the corner, from Blizz. Maybe they've learned something over the past ten years that will contribute to the next gen gaming scene. I digress.

 

Let the developers know, unanimously, that we do not put up with crap. And the next time they put pen to paper, they will remember that we do not forgive, and we never forget.

 

As much as swtor's story was inspiring, If I'd wanted a good story, I would have read a book. I wanted a good star wars gaming experience, and what i received was trash. Triple A title? Paid for by EA. Glowing reviews by sites and magazines alike? Paid for by none other than the 800 pound gorilla of the gaming world.

 

Resolve now to say no to refuse (garbage, I r smartz), and this travesty will never happen again. The community has spoken, and we all say there are thousands of things wrong with this game. When we ask BW when they're planning on fixing the plethora of mistakes, their only response is "In the 'near' future". That's not an answer. That's a sly dodge. I want real and tangible fixes. Not BS aesthetic junk that serves no purpose at all, as far as gameplay is concerned. When are you going to fix Illum?! When are you going to fix Crafting?! When are you going to add the things you mentioned before the game was even out? As I said in my previous post, adding crap to the game isn't fixing anything. You're only breaking the game further. Half of your operations don't even function properly. And you expect me to wait patiently while you "Fix" everything.

 

As far as our wow comparisons are concerned: Wow has had 8 years to fix their game. Years that BW could have been learning what constituted the "norm" in the very industry they were trying to break into.

 

LFG is a must have these days. Did wow have it at launch? No, but they put it in and innovated the idea of having the game find you a group. They had LFG for PVP. So why not PVE? Because they don't listen. Searching for groups in gen chat is an antiquated concept, as far as our genre is concerned. And we've all been saying that for months now. Possibly since we first heard this game was coming out.

 

I used to love the idea of a star wars mmo. Now? I wished they'd go back to square one with the entire project, and let us know in another few years how they're getting along.

 

I apologize profusely to those i have offended. I'm not usually one for fiery rhetoric, but someone had to say it. To those that would rebut: I am willing and open to all those who would disagree with me. Please give me one reason to come back to the game. One genuine good reason, and I'll rethink my entire line of thought about swtor. I don't want you to say their fixing crafting, or they scrapped illum. Those two things are so minute to my real problems with this game, that I'm not even concerned at the moment with anything BW has to say about them.

 

Just give me something tangible. I want to like this game. But BW, you're making it really hard to do so at the moment.

 

This game should never have gone public...

 

Again, I apologize for the wall of text. Thank you for reading this, and good luck in the future to everyone, including the bioware team. Your other games were great, but I can't begin to describe what happened with swtor. It kind of hurts just thinking about it...

[Terrix]

While i agree with what you have said even Blizz have seemed to have lost their way. They are hemorrhaging subs to the point that people on their forums are screaming for a server merge. LFR only solves easy mode, it does not help people that want to do normal or hard mode. Activision sacked 600 Blizzard staff, pandoria was the hope of getting in a new market of people, and it looks like even that is not going to help them.

 

The 600 sacked by blizz were mostly customer service positions that had been automated.. I think only 10% of that 600 number were people related to the design teams. Everyone's been hit by the market. Even Acti-blizz.

[Terrix]

I just went to youtube to have a look at the gameplay videos of Mist of Panderia to see if I was making unwarranted assumptions about the expansion.

 

I suggest you do the same.

 

Then come back here and honestly tell me, with a straight face, that you think Blizzard 'gets it'.

 

Can't be done.

 

Blizzard gets it. :|

 

lmao

[Shingara]

Touchè, Andryah.

 

However, the mmo industry's failed companies speak for themselves. Where is SWG today? What about WAR, or perhaps APB? Remember tabula rasa? That game did so much for the next generation of developers, and sparked our imaginations to boot. TR fell apart in a little under 3 years(the number of years it did or did not survive for is irrelevant to the discussion at hand), if memory serves. We deserve innovation, at this point, and I believe the only way we will get innovation is by letting games like swtor fail. The "Next Halo" Or "WoW" will create a new dynasty, and shape things for the next generation of gamers.

 

Simply put, allow swtor to fail, and we will be rewarded in the future by games made by people who really care about innovation and creativity. Titan is around the corner, from Blizz. Maybe they've learned something over the past ten years that will contribute to the next gen gaming scene. I digress.

 

 

Let the developers know, unanimously, that we do not put up with crap. And the next time they put pen to paper, they will remember that we do not forgive, and we never forget.

 

As much as swtor's story was inspiring, If I'd wanted a good story, I would have read a book. I wanted a good star wars gaming experience, and what i received was trash. Triple A title? Paid for by EA. Glowing reviews by sites and magazines alike? Paid for by none other than the 800 pound gorilla of the gaming world.

 

Resolve now to say no to refuse (garbage, I r smartz), and this travesty will never happen again. The community has spoken, and we all say there are thousands of things wrong with this game. When we ask BW when they're planning on fixing the plethora of mistakes, their only response is "In the 'near' future". That's not an answer. That's a sly dodge. I want real and tangible fixes. Not BS aesthetic junk that serves no purpose at all, as far as gameplay is concerned. When are you going to fix Illum?! When are you going to fix Crafting?! When are you going to add the things you mentioned before the game was even out? As I said in my previous post, adding crap to the game isn't fixing anything. You're only breaking the game further. Half of your operations don't even function properly. And you expect me to wait patiently while you "Fix" everything.

 

As far as our wow comparisons are concerned: Wow has had 8 years to fix their game. Years that BW could have been learning what constituted the "norm" in the very industry they were trying to break into.

 

LFG is a must have these days. Did wow have it at launch? No, but they put it in and innovated the idea of having the game find you a group. They had LFG for PVP. So why not PVE? Because they don't listen. Searching for groups in gen chat is an antiquated concept, as far as our genre is concerned. And we've all been saying that for months now. Possibly since we first heard this game was coming out.

 

I used to love the idea of a star wars mmo. Now? I wished they'd go back to square one with the entire project, and let us know in another few years how they're getting along.

 

I apologize profusely to those i have offended. I'm not usually one for fiery rhetoric, but someone had to say it. To those that would rebut: I am willing and open to all those who would disagree with me. Please give me one reason to come back to the game. One genuine good reason, and I'll rethink my entire line of thought about swtor. I don't want you to say their fixing crafting, or they scrapped illum. Those two things are so minute to my real problems with this game, that I'm not even concerned at the moment with anything BW has to say about them.

 

Just give me something tangible. I want to like this game. But BW, you're making it really hard to do so at the moment.

 

This game should never have gone public...

 

Again, I apologize for the wall of text. Thank you for reading this, and good luck in the future to everyone, including the bioware team. Your other games were great, but I can't begin to describe what happened with swtor. It kind of hurts just thinking about it.

. .

 

The propaganda is strong in this one, not so much rubbish have i read in a long time, bravo. the community has spoken have they. under your theoligy it shouldnt be swtor allowed to fail but infact wow.

 

And if bliz have learned anything over the years then it is that shiney sparkly virtual items make alot of cash, that to recycle content is the cheapest way to develop a game. That micro transactions are king and that greed is good. If those are the atributes that the future of mmos under your eyes are, and the things that should come to pass then quite frankly you can keep your mmos and i shall keep to mine.

 

And so what you dont like it, your still here 3 months after release. there are plenty of people who like the game and you know what. i never once hear the game is bad from within game, the only place i hear it is from a vocal minority within the forums who scream doom and gloom from day 1 which has not come to pass.

 

They screamed that bioware wouldnt do what was needed, but ow look they are. so as i say if you dont like it simply do not play it, vote with your wallet and we shall vote with ours. As for convincing you back to the game pfft for someone with your ideals of the world i would rather not as without you the community can only be a better place.

Edited March 27, 2012 by Shingara

[Bladedakoda]

The 600 sacked by blizz were mostly customer service positions that had been automated.. I think only 10% of that 600 number were people related to the design teams. Everyone's been hit by the market. Even Acti-blizz.

 

True, but it was still 600 sacked to try save money. See thats exactly right every MMO has been hit, and the sad truth is, at least IMO, people are sick of the same old same old. I mean really doing dailys, raiding for top tier ( i raid so please lets not start on the whole raid thing). But for once i would like to see raid gear not be the main focus at end game. There just needs to be more to do at max level for every MMO, not just raiding or PVP. I am no MMO maker, so i have no idea how they would chage the pattern that every MMO to date has fallen into.

 

There just seems to be a real lack of any middle ground at end game. It is either raid, PVP or grind alts, just seems alot of people are over it after doing it for 9+ years, longer for some.

[Trollbacca]

Blizzard dude quote:

"WoW has had close to ten years of development, so you're not competing with brown-box WoW," explained Brack. "You're competing with WoW today, which has a Dungeon Finder, now it has a Raid Finder, and soon will have scenarios. It's got all these other features for helping matchmaker and group and have battlegrounds and all this stuff that didn't exist on day one, but now it's hard to imagine the game without it. Going back and trying to form a group by talking in various party chats to get the group together in Star Wars feels very retro and very painful these days."

 

 

 

Very painful.

 

While leveling I would venture to say it is damn near impossible to find a group for heroics, without investing at least an hours worth of wasted time.

Edited March 27, 2012 by Trollbacca

[Shingara]

Blizzard dude quote:

"WoW has had close to ten years of development, so you're not competing with brown-box WoW," explained Brack. "You're competing with WoW today, which has a Dungeon Finder, now it has a Raid Finder, and soon will have scenarios. It's got all these other features for helping matchmaker and group and have battlegrounds and all this stuff that didn't exist on day one, but now it's hard to imagine the game without it. Going back and trying to form a group by talking in various party chats to get the group together in Star Wars feels very retro and very painful these days."

 

 

 

Very painful.

 

While leveling I would venture to say it is damn near impossible to find a group for heroics, without investing at least an hours worth of wasted time.

 

Look here ------> http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=279017

 

Also just a point on what was stated, the fact that the community isnt strong for some people yet ( myself i have a vast network of friends both sides on my server from grouping and playing with people) maybe due to the behavour and trends from previous games that made people lose the feel of community or desire to actualy be friendly and randomly group and help others whilst leveling and general day to day play.

Edited March 27, 2012 by Shingara

[Exoddos]

This game is set to fail leave it at that. We all know in which direction the game is heading.. At least we want to pretend that we know. Fact is people will argue and say "no no" you don't know..When in a sub reality to there reality..We do know! WoW was horrible at launch..server crashes everything was insanely over priced..In order to get a mount at level 40 you had to sell your first born. Just to train you had to sell your wife or your soul to whatever deity you believe in...

 

It was 8 years ago wow came out but it has refined it's system over and over and that's because there fan base complained and complained and well you get the picture. The problem with this game is it's not just Bioware..It's EA!..Fact is "WARNING WARING" Personal opinion here..EA is horrible at MMO's I.E Warhammer/LOTR... Now with this SWOTR they seem to have fixed things that the other two games needed.Yet the saying goes "a little bit to late" It's 2012 and fact is consumers. Who have played other MMO'S outside of WoW or Warhammer or LOTR...I.E Daoc/Asherons/EQ/DDO/Ultima/Ragnarok etc...Have a expectation of what games of this century should be like. If I was able to do awesome World PvP in DAOC why can't I have it in a game in 2012? If I had a kick butt crafting system in DAOC why can't I have that now? Once again you can see where I'm going with this.

 

Now all the Buzz is Games like Guild Wars-2 and Tera..They could be the best game to hit the mainstream in almost a decade..Some want to hope that this is the case.Those who watch the You Tube videos read the forums of these games are bombarded with "This game is the best ever rawr my opinion is word!"When in the end it all comes down to "YOU" The consumer..

 

Blizzard didn't make a great game "Us the consumers made it the game we wanted" Bioware/EA didn't make a great game..They made a game that "US"the consumers said we wanted instead of WoW...So in the end your choice is all that maters stick it threw like many did in wow..or go to another game let this one become F2P and join the many others who have fallen prey to EA/Origin system...(Worst system ever).So stay or go Bioware made there money and then some with almost 2.5mill sold world wide @ $60-150.00*X currency of that country=Blood diamonds...So you make the choice..I for one cancelled my sub do to the lack of end game content the insane hacking/lag/and really really bad pvp currency systems. I would rather spend my $15.00 a month putting it away for my 2 year old daughter then give it to a game company that just made another flop<My personal opinion so please keep the QQ to yourself.

[Antipodes]

If you're expecting a new game with as many features/content as WoW at launch, you're going to be disappointed. It's simply not realistic.

 

Now compare SWTOR with 99% of other new game releases and you'll find it has leagues more features/content.

 

Exit question: how many games have more features/content than WoW?

Edited March 28, 2012 by Antipodes

[Vespai]

Another thing that's been around since ANH is defection. Han Solo, for instance, started life as an Imperial Navel officer before becoming a smuggler.

 

They could have opted for the EQ2 approach. Start in one faction and through the course of play get the option to move to the other faction based on moral alignment.

 

Never heard of a Jedi falling to the darkside and joining a galactic empire?

 

I really like the idea of a faction change, especially if players get a new storyline to do something like that....( maybe in an expansion?)

[Hempboy]

If you're expecting a new game with as many features/content as WoW at launch, you're going to be disappointed. It's simply not realistic.

 

Now compare SWTOR with 99% of other new game releases and you'll find it has leagues more features/content.

 

Exit question: how many games have more features/content than WoW?

 

Which 99% of the other MMOs are missing MORE features than SWTOR at launch in 2011-2012? Name 10 of them and I buy you TETA online for free.

 

WOW is currently unbeatable ay 8700 quests, but they had 8 years, fine, they win hands down, none of the new MMOs can compete.

 

Tera had 1700 unique quests at launch, how many does swtor have?

 

SWTOR isn't even an MMO, where are the players??? how many do you see in Illum? you can queue for PVP but NOT flashpoints? really? Republic/empire quests are in DIFFERENT areas? really? how do you gank opposing faction if you dont see them questing?

 

The point is, WOW raised the bar, basic features like guild banks, dual spec, LFG tools, macros, UI customizations, combat logs, gear appearnce customizations, should have been available at launch but is not... and they are looking into it for 1.2... really BW? how many months has it been now? Once can only assume the ideas were only ideas to BW at launch and they spent the last couple months working to bring them online... now the question is... why weren't essential features present at launch?

Edited March 28, 2012 by Hempboy

[Starglide]

Agree and WoW is handing out free 80's like candy. That tells me the big dog is scared of the new big kid on the block.

 

Or tells you that their marketing department is genius by having things that will bring consumers back pre and post MOP.

 

Blizzard doesn't give then people complain they don't get anything for being loyal and referring.

 

Blizzard implements incentive for said players and people say they're desperate.

 

These catch 22 arguments people pull out of hats at an attempt to sound knowledgable about the subject further hurts the overall stereotype of this community.

 

Facts are facts... Blizzard has fixed its gouge in subscriptions at Christmas time only lose 100k that quarter and gained over a full fiscal through their scrolls program. While MOP gets even more hype from TESTERS that haven't even gotten to the new zones yet because it is THAT amazing.

 

Let's not forget the expansion has more content than 2 SWTORs.

 

Sorry, but the giant just pooped all over the industry again. I tried new games in hopes something else could grab my attention, including waiting for TOR for 5 years.

 

I'm done fighting it. Forums are filled with developers chatting, information is flooded, honest and say what you will, but Blizzard is notorious for delivering on consumer feedback.

 

Im back in the WoW train and couldn't be more happy.

[Saltydogg]

Agree and WoW is handing out free 80's like candy. That tells me the big dog is scared of the new big kid on the block.

 

What are the scared of? This game from a pvp aspect is garbage. The pve is easy mode and the carrot on the stick is gone. Resolve system is laughable. At least in WoW they didnt have every class with a stun lock or snare. Further more they are gimping healing for commandos and Bh's next patch. So who's bright idea was it to gimp the only other viable healer. This game is sinking faster than Warhammer did. My population has dropped 80 percent since launch. Long time gamers have quit due to BW ignoring seriously broken stuff, yet adding in a carrot like the legacy system. Seriously this will become just like Warhammer. They had 1.5 million subs after launch. one year later they were down to 8 servers in the US. Now they are down to one. Remember Jeff Hickman and Andy are behind this project so dont be upset when you dont see anything changed in the near future to really fix this game

[noodlehaus]

Or tells you that their marketing department is genius by having things that will bring consumers back pre and post MOP.

 

Blizzard doesn't give then people complain they don't get anything for being loyal and referring.

 

Blizzard implements incentive for said players and people say they're desperate.

 

These catch 22 arguments people pull out of hats at an attempt to sound knowledgable about the subject further hurts the overall stereotype of this community.

 

Facts are facts... Blizzard has fixed its gouge in subscriptions at Christmas time only lose 100k that quarter and gained over a full fiscal through their scrolls program. While MOP gets even more hype from TESTERS that haven't even gotten to the new zones yet because it is THAT amazing.

 

Let's not forget the expansion has more content than 2 SWTORs.

 

Sorry, but the giant just pooped all over the industry again. I tried new games in hopes something else could grab my attention, including waiting for TOR for 5 years.

 

I'm done fighting it. Forums are filled with developers chatting, information is flooded, honest and say what you will, but Blizzard is notorious for delivering on consumer feedback.

 

Im back in the WoW train and couldn't be more happy.

 

oh hai there! nice of you to sit next to me on the wow train!

 

but yeah, swtor has a LOT of catching up to do.

[Keadil]

Blizzard has never gotten a single thing right. Just because they convinced a lot of people to play a bad game doesn't make them talented. All they ever did was strip every popular feature before them from every game and claim it as their own. They have the absolute worst art style in the history of gaming, yet somehow convince people to continue with their boring, monotonous gameplay. They are garbage, and will never achieve anything else. They are proof positive that 10 million people actually can be wrong...

[noodlehaus]

Blizzard has never gotten a single thing right. Just because they convinced a lot of people to play a bad game doesn't make them talented. All they ever did was strip every popular feature before them from every game and claim it as their own. They have the absolute worst art style in the history of gaming, yet somehow convince people to continue with their boring, monotonous gameplay. They are garbage, and will never achieve anything else. They are proof positive that 10 million people actually can be wrong...

 

lol i see what you did there.

[IGX_]

Or tells you that their marketing department is genius by having things that will bring consumers back pre and post MOP.

 

 

or they're just desperate

 

which they are.

[flyersfan]

I disagree with OP. I think the game is fine and was fine at launch. The biggest thing mentioned in the OP was a "dungeon finder," which I really don't find to be that necessary. I'd have liked more guild features rather than a green friends list, but they're adding to the guild system now.

 

Edit: I also don't want BioWare to compete with WoW. I want BioWare to make the game better through its own improvements and implementations. I couldn't care less want WoW is doing.

Edited March 28, 2012 by flyersfan