So gunslingers and snipers are no more exact mirrors in 1.2 ?

[Shoogli]

Since one (the gunslinger) can use 2 crit-crafted orange guns while the other (sniper) can't ?

 

Or are they adding orange knives for snipers ?

 

And if they are, can the operatives use them too ?

 

And if so, what about scoundrels ?

 

Or am I missing something ?

[Aaoogaa]

Since one (the gunslinger) can use 2 crit-crafted orange guns while the other (sniper) can't ?

 

Or are they adding orange knives for snipers ?

 

And if they are, can the operatives use them too ?

 

And if so, what about scoundrels ?

 

Or am I missing something ?

 

They were never true mirrors...one needed accuracy and the other didn't previous to 1.2.

[Shoogli]

They were never true mirrors...one needed accuracy and the other didn't previous to 1.2.

 

So that would explain one is given another stat boost then ?

 

EDIT : I don't know those 2 classes very well, would it be the gunslinger needing more accuracy probably because of dual wield ?

Edited March 24, 2012 by Shoogli

[Threskov]

And since stats value didnt change save expertise, gunslinger apparently still need accuracy.

 

They said during guild summit that stats value would change, but eh, as usual, nothing changed.

[leojreimroc]

So you're complaining about 1 class will have an augment slot more?

 

Whoopty doo

[Shoogli]

So you're complaining about 1 class will have an augment slot more?

 

Whoopty doo

 

I complain where again ? I'm asking *questions* since there is a lot of confusion these days about what is moddable or not, what is craftable or not, what can be augmented or not.

 

I'm asking questions because I feel there is something that has been overlooked.

 

Again : point me to where I complain !

 

My main isn't either a sniper (I don't even play empire, yet) or a gunslinger...

 

Try again...

[Miaxi]

Flamebait thread:

"So they are not mirrors after all, eh, Bioware?!"

 

Information request thread:

"Can vibroknives have augment slots?"

 

Learn to ask correctly.

 

PS: The answer is yes, crit crafted vibroknives have an augment slot.

[Shoogli]

Learn to ask correctly.

 

PS: The answer is yes, crit crafted vibroknives have an augment slot.

 

The question wasn't if vibroknives can be crit-crafted but if they could have moddable/upgradable versions :

 

Learn to answer correctly.

[rkopczak]

The question wasn't if vibroknives can be crit-crafted but if they could have moddable/upgradable versions :

 

Learn to answer correctly.

 

you can only crit craft, aka put augment slot in orange/moddable gear. Think.

[Shoogli]

you can only crit craft, aka put augment slot in orange/moddable gear. Think.

 

Eeeeer no, you can crit craft greens, blues and purples (exceptional, mastercraft, etc..) and have an augment slots in those as well :

 

*You* think...

[Iandayen]

Eeeeer no, you can crit craft greens, blues and purples (exceptional, mastercraft, etc..) and have an augment slots in those as well :

 

*You* think...

 

Ding Ding.

 

We have a winner.

 

There are no orange moddable knives in game currently - nor are there shields/generators for that matter.

 

Not sure if there are in 1.2 - I am on the PTR but sadly I am biochem, not armstech or artificer.

[gluefoot]

Since one (the gunslinger) can use 2 crit-crafted orange guns while the other (sniper) can't ?

 

Or are they adding orange knives for snipers ?

 

And if they are, can the operatives use them too ?

 

And if so, what about scoundrels ?

 

Or am I missing something ?

 

The same could be said for Commandos and Mercs.

 

Commando's don't have fully modable power generators. We will get an augment slot. The only reason why they have oranges is for appearance. Do you see your knife change when you get a new one? No, just like we don't see any change in our power generators if we get a new one.

 

I know it is an imbalance, but the stats will work out the same. It's really nothing to be complaining about. Bioware took this into account and is changing stats so they will be balanced.

[Shoogli]

The only reason why they have oranges is for appearance. Do you see your knife change when you get a new one? No, just like we don't see any change in our power generators if we get a new one.

 

Yes this is what I thought too before I changed my mind. I totally agree that the purpose of orange would/should be for appearance, which is in theory.

But then, the way the game may "work" at end game, with removable mods on all end game purple, it does mean it is easier to upgrade and maintain a gunslinger OH with an augment slot than it is for non appearance items (shields, knives, etc...) depending on what is available for such crafted pieces (thus having an augment) compared to drops. See what I mean ?

 

I know it is an imbalance, but the stats will work out the same. It's really nothing to be complaining about. Bioware took this into account and is changing stats so they will be balanced.

 

Yes that is what I hope as well, I only raised the question in case it's an issue that was overlooked.

[Xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]

you can only crit craft, aka put augment slot in orange/moddable gear. Think.

 

Lol, learn the crafting system before commenting. THINK.

[Bartes]

will we be able to rip mods/barrels/stuff from PvP weapons in 1.2? Coz even now, only PvE weapons have some stuff extractable (not barrel) so fully customising your gun, unless you have lvl 50 orange one, is impossible.

 

I would love to have crafted moddable guns with augment slots and with PvP gun mods inside.

[Sabredance]

I wish Sniper and Gunslinger would be less of a mirror

 

so a Gunslinger would actually feel like a Gunslinger and not like a Sniper

 

with two Peashooters.

[Psiwolf]

you can only crit craft, aka put augment slot in orange/moddable gear. Think.

 

Eeeeer no, you can crit craft greens, blues and purples (exceptional, mastercraft, etc..) and have an augment slots in those as well :

 

*You* think...

 

Wow, you got owned. I declare the winner of this thread to be Shoogli.

Edited March 24, 2012 by Psiwolf

[goulet]

i think the long answer short its, duel wielding classes will have a slight advantage to non duel wielding ones, due to the ability to equip 2 orange items vs 1 and an purple oh. the ability to mod an item vs add an augment to an item gives the advantage to the 2 orange. Mods give you more control in stat design then a nod modded item.

 

I think another question is how does this affect non duel wielding classes ability to gear up, in particular regard to offhand items. To get an augment slot you need to get the item from the crafter, which means crafting will have to paly a more pivotal role in off hand advancement. Unless youre going to add augmented pve drops. You're also more dependent on the drop then duel wielding is on mods. You can pull the mods from any item, the only weapon specific one is the color crystal, all others you could technically just pull out of armor drops.

 

Of course it could just be a fix as simple as making offhands (non weapon) have mod slots.

[Edwardacly]

Wow, you got owned. I declare the winner of this thread to be Shoogli.

Lol, learn the crafting system before commenting. THINK.

No, you all learn to read the patch notes before posting nosense

 

The [Exceptional], [Advanced], [superior], and [Mastercraft] suffixes have been removed from crafted item names. [Augmented] will be appended as a suffix to crafted items that were a critical success.

[Shoogli]

No, you all learn to read the patch notes before posting nosense

 

They didn't post "nosense" so instead you DO need to read the patch notes yourself *better* :

 

Greens/Blues/Purples will STILL be crit crafted and have augments, it just is : instead of being called mastercraft or whatever they'll be called augmented...

Edited March 24, 2012 by Shoogli

[Edwardacly]

They didn't post "nosense" so instead you DO need to read the patch notes yourself *better* :

 

Greens/Blues/Purples will STILL be crit crafted and have augments, it just is : instead of being called mastercraft or whatever they'll be called augmented...

 

again, read the patch notes before posting, or at least post your question without QQ.

 

Armstech

New schematics to create Custom (orange) ranged and melee weapons have been added.

 

That mean that yes, you will have orange vibroknives

[Shoogli]

again, read the patch notes before posting, or at least post your question without QQ.

 

I QQ where ?

 

I'll say it again, my main isn't a gunslinger, nor a sniper.

 

You called the other posters saying "nosense" whereas they were pointing a mistake at someone who indeed did a mistake.

 

I have read the patch notes and nowhere do they say that critting to get an augment on greens/blues/purples has been removed, it's only a name change :

 

*You* go read the patch notes again, thank you...

 

That mean that yes, you will have orange vibroknives

 

Oh really... If it's *really* the case then it's fine.

But the way it's worded I still have doubts, and this is precisely why I'm raising the question.

[Jaxtaro]

again, read the patch notes before posting, or at least post your question without QQ.

 

That mean that yes, you will have orange vibroknives

 

Since you provided such a glorious example, I'm going to give you a small lesson in logical fallacies:

 

This is a classic, near textbook example of a "Composition Fallacy", a failure in logic that says basically:

 

If some members of a group have a trait.

Then all members of that group have that trait.

 

The way you fell into this trap was like this:

 

Patch notes say "New schematics to create Custom (orange) ranged and melee weapons have been added"

 

Vibroknives are a melee weapon

 

Therefore vibroknives will have been added to create orange versions.

 

While it CAN be true, it can ALSO be true that new Saber and Vibrosword weapon schematics will be added, without violating the statement. The statement does not say "All melee weapons", it only says "melee weapons" and 2 melee weapons is all it takes to make the statement true.

 

So, unless it specifically states "all melee weapons", or "vibroknives", then the question remains perfectly legitimate.

[Psiwolf]

since you provided such a glorious example, i'm going to give you a small lesson in logical fallacies:

 

This is a classic, near textbook example of a "composition fallacy", a failure in logic that says basically:

 

if some members of a group have a trait.

Then all members of that group have that trait.

 

the way you fell into this trap was like this:

 

patch notes say "new schematics to create custom (orange) ranged and melee weapons have been added"

 

vibroknives are a melee weapon

 

therefore vibroknives will have been added to create orange versions.

 

while it can be true, it can also be true that new saber and vibrosword weapon schematics will be added, without violating the statement. The statement does not say "all melee weapons", it only says "melee weapons" and 2 melee weapons is all it takes to make the statement true.

 

So, unless it specifically states "all melee weapons", or "vibroknives", then the question remains perfectly legitimate.

 

nooo the logic!! It burnssssss!!!!!!111111111

[Shoogli]

So, unless it specifically states "all melee weapons", or "vibroknives", then the question remains perfectly legitimate.

 

Thanks a lot, that's what I think as well. And I'll add this is also to fill all the gaps for techblades and techstaves (to derail my own thread a bit i do wonder if there will now be aim hilts ).

 

-----

 

To all conspiracy, trolls, and l2-maniac posters :

 

This isn't a thread to lobby for orange non-showing OHs : it's to ask a legitimate question if something has been overlooked or not, and it could be the case it hasn't been overlooked, depending on how stats and mechanics are changing, or as someone pointed at earlier : the accuracy difference.

 

*Also* we do now know that augments will be able to be fixed on existing gear in a patch later than 1.2, we still however don't know if this will be the case also for non-showing OHs (knives, shotguns, focus, shields, etc...).

Edited March 24, 2012 by Shoogli