Bio says no to macros at Guild Summit.

[NotDonnaReed]

we dont need 35 keybinds.

 

Amen.

[ferroz]

If a macro is going to manage my cooldowns for me, that is one less thing I need to manage - therfor, optimizing my performance.

No, if it manages the cooldowns for you, that doesn't actually optimize your performance. It doesn't even necessarily make your performance better. It just manages the cooldowns; managing cooldowns != managing cooldowns in an optimal fashion. In this case; it would be using them as soon as cooldown is up (which isn't optimal for any classes as far as I'm aware).

 

As I said above (slightly modified so that you're clear that I'm talking about the macros that you are talking about): if a macro like manages your cooldowns and allows you to just keyboard mash and have an optimal performance... then the macro isn't the thing making the game easy... the designers are. The macro just reduces RSI's at that point because the system is mind-numbingly easy.

[Mkats]

It was pretty much said that there will be no macros anytime soon if ever at the guild summit. It seems part of the Dev team hates macros and does not want them in game.

 

But, they did say there will be some things in game that will help healers and such. What that means who knows they did not explain it very well.

Which i think this is a good thing.

 

Bioware says no to facerolling.

[Pythoris]

Bioware says no to facerolling.

 

So, BW says a definate "no" to combat macros.

 

My response.

 

 

 

[ferroz]

Bioware says no to facerolling*.

 

*unless you use your official swtor keyboard macros

[Reevax]

*unless you use your official swtor keyboard macros

 

 

Yeah I find this super funny.

 

NO COMBAT MACROS!!!!! EVER!!!! DEVS OPPOSE THEM!!! THEY BREAK THE GAME

 

PS: We here by support the use a the SWTOR keyboard that allows the creation of combat macros.

[Frostvein]

Yeah I find this super funny.

 

NO COMBAT MACROS!!!!! EVER!!!! DEVS OPPOSE THEM!!! THEY BREAK THE GAME

 

PS: We here by support the use a the SWTOR keyboard that allows the creation of combat macros.

 

I'd love to see the devs address this hypocrisy directly.

[weezdajuice]

Macros are like luxury cars. Nice to have, but not absolutely necessary.

[Jaenette]

Yeah I find this super funny.

 

NO COMBAT MACROS!!!!! EVER!!!! DEVS OPPOSE THEM!!! THEY BREAK THE GAME

 

PS: We here by support the use a the SWTOR keyboard that allows the creation of combat macros.

 

Oh man..if that's true..which I'm guessing it is probably is. That's pretty f'ed up.

[Reevax]

I'd love to see the devs address this hypocrisy directly.

 

You know they wont but we can probably safely guess that the EA Suits are the ones who endorsed the Keyboard, overriding what the Devs wanted.

[weezdajuice]

You know they wont but we can probably safely guess that the EA Suits are the ones who endorsed the Keyboard, overriding what the Devs wanted.

 

lets just liquidate EA, and then hand the money over to Bioware and force them to remake dragon age 2 correctly!

[Frostvein]

You know they wont but we can probably safely guess that the EA Suits are the ones who endorsed the Keyboard, overriding what the Devs wanted.

 

Probably.

 

Its fine, my G110 makes macros just fine. Just a pain in the *** to set them up.

[Chewpaco]

No, if it manages the cooldowns for you, that doesn't actually optimize your performance. It doesn't even necessarily make your performance better. It just manages the cooldowns; managing cooldowns != managing cooldowns in an optimal fashion. In this case; it would be using them as soon as cooldown is up (which isn't optimal for any classes as far as I'm aware).

 

As I said above (slightly modified so that you're clear that I'm talking about the macros that you are talking about): if a macro like manages your cooldowns and allows you to just keyboard mash and have an optimal performance... then the macro isn't the thing making the game easy... the designers are. The macro just reduces RSI's at that point because the system is mind-numbingly easy.

 

As far as I am concerned, the game already manages cooldowns for me through the UI.

 

I can clearly see on my screen - on my hotbars, when a skill is available for use, and when it is not. When a relic or an adrenal is available, and when it is not. If it is darkened out, I can't use it, if it available - it is in its' full graphical state.

 

How much easier does this need to be made?

 

What else is there to manage?

[Reevax]

Oh man..if that's true..which I'm guessing it is probably is. That's pretty f'ed up.

 

It has SWTOR all over it and a fancy macro building interface. Razer would get sued if EA did not support the product.

 

So NO COMBAT MACROS, THEY DESTROY THE GAME AND GIVE PEOPLE AN UNFAIR ADVANTAGE!!!!!!

 

unless you buy the SWTOR keyboard

[ferroz]

As far as I am concerned, the game already manages cooldowns for me through the UI.

You're the one that said that the macro was managing it... did you change your mind?

 

As it is, this sounds like you're saying that macros don't change anything.

 

How much easier does this need to be made?

In this case: macros don't make it easier; we're talking about a hypothetical system that is so mind-numbingly simple that a macro can actually produce an optimal output, so they don't change the difficulty at all. They just reduce RSI's. Edited March 28, 2012 by ferroz

[Chewpaco]

You're the one that said that the macro was managing it... did you change your mind?

 

As it is, this sounds like you're saying that macros don't change anything.

 

In this case: macros don't make it easier; we're talking about a hypothetical system that is so mind-numbingly simple that a macro can actually produce an optimal output, so they don't change the difficulty at all. They just reduce RSI's.

 

No - I didnt change my mind.

 

What I am saying, is that people that need macros to take additional steps in managing these CD's - want a level of AUTOMATION that macro's provide.

 

The AUTOMATION that they want, is to eliminate a decision that they need to make and be aware of.

 

Project on my Sage has a 6 second cooldown. It is instant cast, and hits for the highest amount. I want to use this ability as a DPS class as often as I can, and as timely as I can.

 

Should I be able to macro this skill with another attack ability, so that if the CD on this skill is not yet up, it will revert to a secondary skill? Press the same button after the GCD expires, and now it fires off?

 

No I should not be able to do this. This sort of automation, eliminates decision making, by managing CD's.

 

/#supressmacrofailures

/cast <Project>

/cast <Mind Crush>

/cast <Telekinetik Throw>

 

2 skills that have longer CD's listed first, the last spell with just the GCD. Hit the same button, and whatever is not on CD fires off.

 

Eliminates decision making. Cuts the keybinds down to 1/3 of what i needed. I have less to remember now because of it. This macro never makes a mistake.

 

When either of those first 2 skills are available, I want to use them. This optimizes my performance.

[netskink]

what is allowable on hardware macro? Anything which does not use loops or delays?

[Frostvein]

what is allowable on hardware macro? Anything which does not use loops or delays?

 

It is a pretty grey area.

[ISTrick]

Thank god for no combat macros. Love you Bioware!

Big time..

 

 

 

 

... can always knock together my own macros but yay for this!!

[Frostvein]

Big time..

 

 

 

 

... can always knock together my own macros but yay for this!!

 

err....so you are glad they didn't include macros in the game, but you have no problem making them on your own machine for personal use?

[cipher_nemo]

what is allowable on hardware macro? Anything which does not use loops or delays?

 

By "hardware macro", I assume you mean macro keyboards? If so, they're not really hardware-based, since all macros are still recorded and executed via software. If you meant macro keyboards, then nope, they can use loops and delays in their software.

 

Limitations...

1. No programming logic. For example, you can't insert any programming logic such as if statements and for loops. Macro keyboards typically have sequential line-by-line macro playback.
   
2. Inability to accept interaction. The software is unable to accept input from the user when playing back the macro. It just plays from beginning to end.
   
3. They typically don't record mouse movement/clicks in their software. That would have to be separate. Even mice with macro software don't usually record mouse movements.
   
4. Some don't allow regular key remapping, others do.
   

 

For all of those reasons and more, software-based macro/scripting software is much more powerful (ie: AutoHotkey).

[netskink]

By "hardware macro",....

 

Hi thanks for your response. Let me rephrase it. The other guy said its a grey issue. That is a very true statement for me as well.

 

Here is what the terms of conduct say about macros:

 

"You may not use macros, add-ons or other stored rapid keystrokes, "dupes," "cheats" or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate."

 

That is not what I what people seem to want, so we can ignore this one.

 

"Use or distribute “auto” software programs, “macro” software programs or other “cheat utility” software program or applications."

 

Autokey is possibly what they are talking about here. So I figure use of that is prohibited.

 

Hardware devices such as keyboards or mice are not software so where do people get the bit about loops or delays? Doing a search of hardware, loops or logic does not show up in the terms of conduct.

[Frostvein]

Hi thanks for your response. Let me rephrase it. The other guy said its a grey issue. That is a very true statement for me as well.

 

Here is what the terms of conduct say about macros:

 

"You may not use macros, add-ons or other stored rapid keystrokes, "dupes," "cheats" or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate."

 

That is not what I what people seem to want, so we can ignore this one.

 

"Use or distribute “auto” software programs, “macro” software programs or other “cheat utility” software program or applications."

 

Autokey is possibly what they are talking about here. So I figure use of that is prohibited.

 

Hardware devices such as keyboards or mice are not software so where do people get the bit about loops or delays? Doing a search of hardware, loops or logic does not show up in the terms of conduct.

 

They left it ambiguous on purpose. They have this fancy keyboard that they licensed that does much of what you are looking for, so they can't go and ban people for using the software that comes with it.

 

 

My guess is that they know and don't care. As long as you aren't using a keyboard to stay logged in or to keep you from going AFK in Warzones they probably don't really care.

[cipher_nemo]

"You may not use macros, add-ons or other stored rapid keystrokes, "dupes," "cheats" or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate."

 

They don't want you running a script/macro to automate your character. That's understandable. In-game macros wouldn't do that. And they don't want you grinding for "items, currency, objects, [stats], rank or status" in this automatic fashion either. This statement doesn't restrict the use of macros, it just restricts the use of macros for this purpose.

 

"Use or distribute “auto” software programs, “macro” software programs or other “cheat utility” software program or applications."

 

This refers to people making their own scripted or macro software. This is the gray area. I can tell you want this statement was intended to address: the creation and distribution of power-leveling and credit-farming scripts. It was never intended to cover simple macros by the average MMO player. However, it could be construed to cover that as well since it said "use" of such software.

 

Hardware devices such as keyboards or mice are not software so where do people get the bit about loops or delays? Doing a search of hardware, loops or logic does not show up in the terms of conduct.

 

That's wrong. Macro keyboards use software to do their magic. It is not hardware-based. In fact, it is extremely rare to find a completely hardware-based macro keyboard. A cross-over example is my Logitech G9x mouse. It can store profiles (and thus macros) within its memory, so it's all contained within the mouse itself. However, it's still software that's saved to the hardware. For keyboards, the macros are usually 100% software based, so they're recorded with software, saved as software (eg: an XML file), and then played back with software.

 

And yes, the software for macro keyboards can add delays and use loops. But those loops are limited to the entire macro, not individual sections of it. My experience is with Logitech G15 and G19 software, so Razer, Corsair, and other macro keyboard manufacturers might offer even more functionality in their software.

[netskink]

 

...

 

That's wrong. Macro keyboards use software to do their magic. It is not hardware-based. In fact, it is extremely rare to find a completely hardware-based macro keyboard. A cross-over example is my Logitech G9x mouse. It can store profiles (and thus macros) within its memory, so it's all contained within the mouse itself. However, it's still software that's saved to the hardware. For keyboards, the macros are usually 100% software based, so they're recorded with software, saved as software (eg: an XML file), and then played back with software.

 

And yes, the software for macro keyboards can add delays and use loops. But those loops are limited to the entire macro, not individual sections of it. My experience is with Logitech G15 and G19 software, so Razer, Corsair, and other macro keyboard manufacturers might offer even more functionality in their software.

 

I used to use macro's in wow. I quit rift after a month once I realized the macros there were crap. I've hung in this game because I paid for two six month subscriptions. However, its getting near the end and I figured they would add them by this time. With that said, I would hate to get banned only to find they implemented something later.

 

I also play on a laptop and using a keyboard is not something I want to do. A mouse on the other hand is possible.

 

If in game you could at least do /use item or /use item-slot it would help. Macroing buff, set companion stance, mount would be great. Macroing procable abilites off the GCD timer would be great. However, I don't know if its allowed even with a mouse macro. Do they outright ban you for something that is grey or do they warn you first? Has anyone been warned? Banned?