Jesmcalli Posted March 3, 2012 Author Share Posted March 3, 2012 (edited) I completely disagree. Playing melee as well and the trick is not to get targeted right away. If so, you need to look for LoS opportunities and/or use your cc to even the odds. Yes it's better to have a healer or a tank guarding you, but that's not always the case. And it DOES help your team to LoS, because a dead melee dps doesn't do any dmg and your enemies will have to switch to other players, meaning you can get back in the fight. What you are portraiting here is the situation I see alot of melee do: rush in and try to zerg the 4-8 oppenents standing there blowing all their cd's, die within 7 secs and start cursing in ops chat for not getting any heals ot help. Patience is a virtue in that regard. Moving in and out of the fight will save you alot of dmg on yourself while still damaging your opponents. A ranged dps will mostly have to cast his abilities, so it will give you enough time to either interrupt, cc and/or run into LoS, run out of LoS and do some more dmg. You might not kill them very fast, but then again they won't kill you either... No, I don't jump into 4-8 opponents. It's when you're on the outskirts of a battle perhaps trying to take on 1 target, and still getting gibbed in a heartbeat due to still being well within range of 4-6 ranged players. The problem is ranged has much more time on target than melee. With the plethora of CC in this game, you spend a good portion of your playtime stunned, rooted, snared or flying through the air and then you're dead. Pile on top of that guard and nigh invincibility when receiving heals and it's all uphill. A decently geared ranged player can facetank melee while waiting on CDs for gapmakers, and that should not be the case. Yes, I know that melee ( mostly ) has some sort of gap closer, but if you wait for the knockback to use it, chances are you've eaten significant amounts of damage while en route to your target, even with defensive CDs. This doesn't factor in other CCs, damage sources from other ranged just tab targeting away, safely out of reach. Spending your time pillar humping/stealthing etc isn't helping your team and it isn't taking the objective. Edited March 3, 2012 by Jesmcalli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fungihoujo Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Oh look, bad melee classes that don't know how to team play complaining. Try remembering this is a team game- get a tank to guard you, a healer to heal you- BAM, marauders are most OP class in the game by a long shot. It's not BW's fault you don't play to your class's strengths, and no, the game should never be balanced around bads, that just makes the game terrible. Good players already are all rerolling marauders because of how OP there are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesmcalli Posted March 3, 2012 Author Share Posted March 3, 2012 Oh look, bad melee classes that don't know how to team play complaining. Try remembering this is a team game- get a tank to guard you, a healer to heal you- BAM, marauders are most OP class in the game by a long shot. It's not BW's fault you don't play to your class's strengths, and no, the game should never be balanced around bads, that just makes the game terrible. Good players already are all rerolling marauders because of how OP there are. You can't make a tank guard you, or a healer heal you, as much as you'd like it. Being an elitist clown doesn't further your point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triangulate Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 (edited) I have been playing MMO's for a long long time and i was in a conversation with a dev of "ANOTHER" game about a bug. We got to talking about various things and the issue of range vs melee came up. He told me that if 100 people where playing a game, only 30 would have a descent internet connecion and out of that 30 only 15 would have a good computer. Out of the 15 only 1-3 would have the skill needed to be able to realy play melee well... i mean realy well btw. That is why most of the population seem to favour playing ranged classes where reaction times and lag etc. aren't as big of an issue as it is in melee. The ones that persevere with melee are the ones you see on the forums QQ'ing and asking for nerfs to everything and his cat. Edited March 3, 2012 by triangulate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fungihoujo Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 You can't make a tank guard you, or a healer heal you, as much as you'd like it. Being an elitist clown doesn't further your point. Uh... yeah, you can, it's called grouping with friends/premades- and as rated pvp is coming out, it's what's going to be happening- and it's what the game will be balancing around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 As long as roots is unaffected by resolve, ranged will always be king in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nschlan Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 As long as the melee don't have brains, ranged will be superior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesmcalli Posted March 3, 2012 Author Share Posted March 3, 2012 Uh... yeah, you can, it's called grouping with friends/premades- and as rated pvp is coming out, it's what's going to be happening- and it's what the game will be balancing around. So, premade or go home huh? No PUGging allowed if you're melee? That's total nonsense. In rateds, I can understand the need for premades, but making it more or less required to be effective as a melee is garbage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maradigamer Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 So, premade or go home huh? No PUGging allowed if you're melee? That's total nonsense. In rateds, I can understand the need for premades, but making it more or less required to be effective as a melee is garbage. I do think you have to be exceptional as a melee player to do well without support. Maybe an operative or assassin picking their fights can do well on the numbers, and certainly can contribute by being in the right place at the right time on the right target, but melee in general is tough. Unless you're playing musical shields with a tank spec on your team, that's always appreciated. But you won't be killing much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shlamorel Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Yeah, because I have any influence on whether or not the opposing team's ranged decided to focus me. Sure, I suppose I could pillarhump/stealth, but that doesn't do my team much good does it? Point being, melee is always out in the open, in the thick of it. With ranged how it is now, it's pretty much suicide unless you have guard and a healer on you. I could be wrong, but in different words I believe what he was trying to say to you was this: If you are being cc'd from "multiple sources", that implies that you are alone against multiple people, in which case it is understandable that you are being cc'd and unable to do effective damage. However, if it is you and multiple teammates vs. multiple enemies, I would think that if you are getting CC'd from multiple sources then that means your teammates are free to kill the enemy. If this is the case, it can certainly be frustrating, but you are at least serving a purpose of being guinea pig so your team can win the immediate battle. My only suggestion I can come up with is to wait a moment before charging in so that CC's are on cooldown, or try to play with a healer who can dispel CC from you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KhealThar Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 I have been playing MMO's for a long long time and i was in a conversation with a dev of "ANOTHER" game about a bug. We got to talking about various things and the issue of range vs melee came up. He told me that if 100 people where playing a game, only 30 would have a descent internet connecion and out of that 30 only 15 would have a good computer. Out of the 15 only 1-3 would have the skill needed to be able to realy play melee well... i mean realy well btw. That is why most of the population seem to favour playing ranged classes where reaction times and lag etc. aren't as big of an issue as it is in melee. The ones that persevere with melee are the ones you see on the forums QQ'ing and asking for nerfs to everything and his cat. Melee is not hard to play. You're not talking to a "dev" when you submit a ticket, you're talking to a customer rep that is most likely outsourced and has no idea how to play the game. Casters are difficult to play because you have to worry about your positioning so you don't get destroyed by every melee in the warzone, getting interrupted etc Melee is extremely easy to play, I've always played melee classes. You don't need the best computer/internet connection in the world to play melee. GW2 will not save you guys, Go check out mesmer/Elementalist videos. h3h3 cy@ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerothreat Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Oh look, bad melee classes that don't know how to team play complaining. Try remembering this is a team game- get a tank to guard you, a healer to heal you- BAM, marauders are most OP class in the game by a long shot. It's not BW's fault you don't play to your class's strengths, and no, the game should never be balanced around bads, that just makes the game terrible. Good players already are all rerolling marauders because of how OP there are. That is just bad logic. You can take the weakest class from any mmo, put a guard and heals on it and it will do well. Also please give me an example of a game that was balanced around "bads" as you say. That has never happened which makes your logic virtually nonexistent. Good players are rerolling marauders because they are op? I believe your definition of a good player is far off from what most people consider good. The only thing that made any sense was this is a team game, and you will do much better on a balanced team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iraqcombatvet Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Title says it all. There is a really good reason you see so many teams with nothing but BH/Trooper Sorc/Sages. Yes, this is probably the umpteenth thread on it, but after seeing warzone after warzone of nothing but TM and lightning spam, I am fed up. Ranged classes in general aren't punished nearly enough for staying in melee range. Yet, if I am melee within 30 meters of any ranged class, it's spam damage and CC from several different sources. Shut up please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knighty Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 I play a Sentinel, I've been playing since release, Ranged classes are not a problem to me, and I find them to be easier than Melee to kill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nschlan Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 I play a Sentinel, I've been playing since release, Ranged classes are not a problem to me, and I find them to be easier than Melee to kill. Took the words right out of my mouth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pvpingwithnoobs Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Lulz....melee...underpowered.... Huge lol, full BM here and still get hit for 5k+ crits from melee, not a lot u can do when you seem to be perms stunned. Oh well must be because they have way better gear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drduncan Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Gap closers...they exist for a reason. Tell that to my scoundrel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvarine Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 The problem with the current pvp system and ranged in general boils down to just how pathetically easy it is to play classes like troopers, Mercs, Sages/Sorcs and such. I'm only talking in relation to the dps specs and not the healing as they are two entirely different degrees of difficulty unless you're carried by a team. Playing the dps specs, a good player can literally put 5-6 hot keys on their bar and stomp people into the ground. There is virtually no skill required to be succesful playing them which is a huge part of why there are so many. Now you take the healing specs which literally use 20+ hot keys, or op's that have to use every ability, or mauraders, the degree of difficulty in them is leaps and bounds from one another. Until Bioware addresses the classes 1 by 1 and gets rid of these cookie cutter builds and 3-4 button pushers and put some skill into playing these classes, nothing will change. People play what is easy and sadly, these classes are king and so succesful that even the poorest player can look decent playing them. People tend to migrate to what's easy to play, and I'm afraid if it's not addressed sooner rather then later, pvp in general will be dead or just be pve'ers as guild wars will take every single pvp player that wants real pvp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nschlan Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Tell that to my scoundrel I hear you get Stealth and Chain CC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesmcalli Posted March 4, 2012 Author Share Posted March 4, 2012 Just finished a warzone where the other team had 5 BHs and 3 sorcs. We had a mix of sents/guards, a scrapper scoundrel and a sage thrown in. Want to guess who won? For one, this bolster system is the most horribly thought out, horribly executed PVP system I have ever seen. Period. Second, when a match can be called on who has more ranged, I'm sorry, but it needs looking at. PVP in this game is going to be the death of it unless they add more brackets ( sorry, having more HP doesn't make up for the fact that you may not have essential PVP abilities, or talents), and tweak how ranged is played. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedOmen Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 LOL! Range is favored???!!! Play a sniper then and see what is unfair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesmcalli Posted March 4, 2012 Author Share Posted March 4, 2012 LOL! Range is favored???!!! Play a sniper then and see what is unfair. So one ranged AC has it rough, and they're not as helpless as everyone makes them out to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
savionen Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 (edited) Huge lol, full BM here and still get hit for 5k+ crits from melee, not a lot u can do when you seem to be perms stunned. Oh well must be because they have way better gear Gotta hate those perma-stunning 5k critting melee, oh wait. Edited March 4, 2012 by savionen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redmarx Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Melee > ranged in PVP. By far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesmcalli Posted March 4, 2012 Author Share Posted March 4, 2012 Melee ( with guard and a dedicated healer > ranged in PVP. By far. Fixed it for ya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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