Sarfux Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 I said true purists. Purists base stuff only directly from George Lucas which in this case means movies I-VI. Tell me in these movies which Jedi is a Dark Jedi? From what I recall of movies I-VI the two I know of become known as Darth Sidious and Darth Vader. No Jedi I know of can use force lightning or Force Choke. I don't agree with this view just stating it as an example. I can accept no color restrictions and prefer this option. I would even accept, though grudgingly, Jedi green/blue and Sith red. I hate the alignment restriction as it makes zero sense. My favorite movies are IV-VI. I can tolerate II and III. Tor is roughly 3000 Years before the movies so canon from the movies is irrelevant. Again Bioware had no intentions of adding the color restrictions based on Devs interviews during beta. They also said there would be hundreds of colors many that have never been seen in the movies. They caved and are caving again! Bioware seems to to go with the majority on issues without any independent thought. My theory on lack of colors is they did not have time to get them in. that's what ya do to make a popular game. Listen to the masses of the casuals who complain. If you want to survive, especially in the mmo world..you have to or else the players will get INSTANTLY turned off "WHAT!!? I HAVE TO BE DARK I TO USE THIS!? LAAAMMEE IM GOING BACK TO WOW!!" Now that crap will be gone and players will get to choose what they want.. SWTOR is about choice and the more we go down the road, the more decisions we will be getting to make with less restrictions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vecke Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 the kind of crystal you have has NO effect on who you fight for. It is a reflection of personal preference and who YOU are. In the movies, you saw light with blue, yellow, all those "good" colors and saw bad with red...the "bad" colors I think it's step in the right direction of giving players what THEY want. They continue doing things like this, this game will just go nowhere but up This might have just been a typo, but point of clarification, there were no yellow sabers in the movies. Only blue/green for good and red for bad. And purple, which is only bad in the game but the only person to ever use one in the movie was good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlazingShadow Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 First of all, the idea of red being the "bad guy color" is nothing short of ridiculous and is due to NEWER star wars videogames / media. Ex: Jedi Power Battles (1999 PlayStation/Dreamcast) Adi Galia (clearly a lightside jedi) uses a red saber, Plo Kun uses an orange lightsaber Obi-Wan (2002 Xbox) Adi Galia uses a blue lightsaber, Plo Kun uses a blue lightsaber Second of all, diversity is the spice of life, and if you're trying to have appearance choices restricted because they "break immersion", then, well, I'd suggest and say something that would very likely get me a warning on these forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Scythe Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 that's what ya do to make a popular game. Listen to the masses of the casuals who complain. If you want to survive, especially in the mmo world..you have to or else the players will get INSTANTLY turned off "WHAT!!? I HAVE TO BE DARK I TO USE THIS!? LAAAMMEE IM GOING BACK TO WOW!!" Now that crap will be gone and players will get to choose what they want.. SWTOR is about choice and the more we go down the road, the more decisions we will be getting to make with less restrictions. Yes but listening to morons can be dangerous if 80% of the people here want Panda's or light axes you would be okay with that? There are people who wanted WOW weapons in this game. Check out a few of the peoples signatures of some of the dumbest suggestions you ever heard. FYI I think the restrictions should be gone I thought they were dumb in the first place and should never have been implemented because a slightly larger group wanted them. People only post when they hate something not when they like it!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valketh Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Darth Vader + Red Saber = Freaking Awesome nuff said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDTC Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 a jedi could use a red saber and a sith could use a green saber anyway, so why the kvetching? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peacenote Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Is Palpatine going to give up his back up sabers? No. lol. And this gets back to the lore point that sabers are MOST effective for those who constructed them. (and yes, people of all persuasions can pick and use a saber, but not as effectively). So why would Anakin choose to discard the saber he was, at that time, attuned with? Point is, he eventually took a red saber, as every darkside force user does. This is an issue I don't care too much about either way, but this statement really resonated to me as something that makes sense. It completely would fit in with the fact that while MOST light or dark side folks use a certain color, sometimes they do not. It might be because that weapon was handy or because they choose to use a weapon because they (like many game players) care about how it looks! And it aligns with other types of lore as well (such as in Harry Potter where you can use other people's wand but are most effective with your own). Therefore I think it would make the most sense to have some neutral colors, and some dark and light colors. Dark and light colors could be used by the opposite alignments but would result in a slight stat decrease. They also would have slightly better stats than the neutral colors when they are used by characters with the proper alignment. The other thing I'd like to point out is that movies (along with TV shows) are subject to bloopers! I think what make sense as far as lore is what happens most of the time. If there's one exception you don't know for sure if it was on purpose or by mistake unless the creators speak about it, and even then do you REALLY know if they are telling the truth? I really do wish sometimes game developers would think things through before implementation and stick with those ideas in the face of criticism. If Bioware had a reason for restricting the colors, they should tell us why. If they didn't have a good reason, they should explain that it was an arbitrary choice which is why the change has been implemented. The reason people complain SO much about things in MMOs is because they get listened to! The environment has become fluid and ever-changing due to the constant adjustment resulting from client feedback. The companies are worried about subs and give in, but honestly I'd rather know the thoughts that went into the game design as there is an artistic component to designing the game that I'd rather stay consistent unless there is a good reason to change it. My last thought is that if this change will help crafters and the economy, I'm all for it. But since I don't pay that much attention to crystal colors (as I've already stated) and I'm not an artificer, I can only say I hope it will and cannot authoritatively comment on if it will for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wuredoind Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Hey jacko, if you knew anything about star wars you would know that color crystals are not faction specific and are more of a tradition and nothing else. go play kotor 2 jeez............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarfux Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Yes but listening to morons can be dangerous if 80% of the people here want Panda's or light axes you would be okay with that? There are people who wanted WOW weapons in this game. Check out a few of the peoples signatures of some of the dumbest suggestions you ever heard. FYI I think the restrictions should be gone I thought they were dumb in the first place and should never have been implemented because a slightly larger group wanted them. People only post when they hate something not when they like it!!! well..there are no pandas in Star Wars..so we are safe with that...and ewoks haven't been discovered yet..along with gungans. You are EXACLTY correct on people posting what they DONT like..NOT what they like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongGui Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 (edited) Color has-never-been-nor-will-it-ever-be restricted to morality. Lucas himself has confirmed that there is no direct link. The only lore basis for the restrictions was that, in the time of TPM, AotC etc., Sith couldn't get their hands on natural crystal supplies, and had to use synthetic crystals. Synth crystals (Luke used a synth crystal in RotJ, too, btw) are created by channeling the force through a forge. In the case of darksiders, this creates a crimson-red crystal... but not all synth crystals are red -- nor are all the sabers of Sith red. Certainly, the fact that the Sith in the TOR timeline favor purple just as much as red is proof of this. Frankly, the limits in TOR make absolutely no sense as implemented in the game. They neither preserve the 'look' of the films, nor do they have any basis in the lore. You would argue that color is tied to morality as if picking up a green or a blue saber as a darksider would cause it to explode in my hand. Even in the films, time and again we are shown that darksiders can use 'light' colors (Anakin/Vader with blue throughout Ep. III, Vader ignited Luke's green saber in Ep. VI). Similarly, lightsiders can use red... as in the case of Anakin picking up Dooku's saber to finish him off with. *** HI THAR. MY NAME IZ EXAR KUN, ONE OF THE MOST BAD-*** SITH LORDS OF ALL TIMES (YOU CAN TELL SINC I USE ALL CAPS TO POST). I'D JUS LIK 2 JUMP IN HERE AND POINT OUT DAT I USED A BLUE SABRE. TY. DATS ALL I WANTED. <3 TO MY HOMIES IN EMPIR. *** Thanks, Exar. Getting back on topic, the simple fact of the matter is, there is no canonical basis or otherwise for the current crystal restrictions. They were, quite literally, something Bioware conjured out of thin air. And, what's worse, they don't even preserve the look of the films, instead forcing many Jedi to abandon green/blue, and many Sith to forsake red. If you wanted to see more Sith using red, and more Jedi using green/blue as in the films, you should actually support dropping the restrictions. As it stands now, I believe you simply don't understand either the lore or the system we've got in game. -------------------------------- Just wanted to tack this on from later in the thread. This is how TOR's current restrictions would look if applied to Star Wars. *I take you now to the famous Temple Slaughter scene from Ep. III. Anakin is boldly walking up the Jedi Temple stairs, flanked by an army of clone troopers. He approaches the door, reaches into his robes, pulls out his blue saber, and prepares to ignite it when... ... nothing happens?* Clone trooper #1: Ruh-roh! Clone trooper #3: He's got er... troubles 'getting it up,' I guess? Clone trooper #1: Man, that's gotta create some tension in the sack with him and Padmomma or whatever. Clone trooper #2: Hehe... be quiet, I want to hear this. [Anakin COMM] Master, I have run into some issues. *The clones snicker.* [sidious COMM] What is it, my young apprentice? Are the Jedi dead? Is the temple aflame? [Anakin COMM] No, master my... lightsaber won't turn on. *More clone laughter.* [sidious COMM] Oh, I forgot to tell you. You can't use that lightsaber anymore because you're a bad guy now. Big oopsies on my part. Come back to my office and I'll give you a red crystal. *Anakin leaves in a huff.* Clone trooper #1: Ciggy break! AFK! Clone trooper #2: Hehe... stupid sith. Clone trooper #3: Shut up, dude... any more darkside points and you won't be able to use that blaster anymore. Best post I have read all month, agree totally Edit: FYI not a spoiler but long. Edited March 3, 2012 by LongGui Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminova Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 I'd almost forgotten about this one from the pre-quels: General Grievous using 4 light sabers of varied colors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karthannar Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 (edited) Oh lord, this argument again?! Not supported by lolore, restrictions don't make sense, etc, etc... Edited March 3, 2012 by Karthannar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRyllThing Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 (edited) I'm fine with the no color restrictions. However, just a heads up. My offhand on my Light I-II Sentinel is red, and has been since launch. Edited March 3, 2012 by TheRyllThing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrenMcGuire Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 (edited) The restrictions were a mess before launch and made it through to retail. The extended universe which is perhaps indulged in by maybe 5% (judging by book sales less than 0.05%) of people who like Star Wars is in direct contradiction of the films. For force users; sith mostly and eventually use red. Samuel L Jackson gets purple, and everyone else is blue or green. I totally agree that ranged weapon users should be free of restrictions. If those who don't care about George's Legacy are getting their way can those of us who do care please also get a classic color filter option or two. One with classic colours and one with solo exemption and everyone else (force users) with classic colours so we can have our Star Wars fantasy too. Edited March 3, 2012 by BrenMcGuire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Im kinda sad by this, i chose to play a sith war through on the light side and it was nice having the only blue/green sabre around. Now everyone is gonna have em. Almost made your light/dark choices trivial now. You shouldn't have expected huge game benefits from your role-playing choices in the first place. And BTW, your sig is dumb. Gen Xers aren't in power yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altyrell Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 And yet, TOR is set in the EU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Scythe Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 The restrictions were a mess before launch and made it through to retail. The extended universe which is perhaps indulged in by maybe 5% (judging by book sales less than 0.05%) of people who like Star Wars is in direct contradiction of the films. For force users; sith mostly and eventually use red. Samuel L Jackson gets purple, and everyone else is blue or green. I totally agree that ranged weapon users should be free of restrictions. If those who don't care about George's Legacy are getting their way can those of us who do care please also get a classic color filter option or two. One with classic colours and one with solo exemption and everyone else (force users) with classic colours so we can have our Star Wars fantasy too. Ummm Dude Have you not read the posts it has been said George himself has stated that color of sabers do not matter! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrenMcGuire Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 And yet, TOR is set in the EU I don't disagree... The story portion of the game is a homage to the films as well as their own work. But your missing the entire point. With a MMO you want to appeal to as many customers as possible! Especially this one where George Lucas takes 1/3 of all income. This isn't a case of choosing between one set of customers or another, both can co-exist. We just need a filter and if George lucas is getting 1/3rd of my money, I want a Star Wars product that looks like the films. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altyrell Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 I want a Star Wars product that looks like the films. Then, technically this isn't the Game. Plus, I would want a Star Wars product that looks like Star Wars as a whole, which is what this Game is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrenMcGuire Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Ummm Dude Have you not read the posts it has been said George himself has stated that color of sabers do not matter! Not true. GL: blue and green for "good guys" and red for "bad guys." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminova Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Not true. GL: blue and green for "good guys" and red for "bad guys." Which had nothing to do with their morality which is all that LS/DS amounts to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrenMcGuire Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Then, technically this isn't the Game. Plus, I would want a Star Wars product that looks like Star Wars as a whole, which is what this Game is. Looks like Star Wars, has great Star Wars-y stories, but once other people are involved with no restrictions; it's no longer looks like the Star Wars I, and many others love. There's no point in arguing either. Colour filter option(s) will give everyone what they want! Everyone wins! It would be nice if BioWare introduced these features in tandem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vecke Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 I don't disagree... The story portion of the game is a homage to the films as well as their own work. But your missing the entire point. With a MMO you want to appeal to as many customers as possible! Especially this one where George Lucas takes 1/3 of all income. This isn't a case of choosing between one set of customers or another, both can co-exist. We just need a filter and if George lucas is getting 1/3rd of my money, I want a Star Wars product that looks like the films. Would you want that filter to be based on whether or not those other players are good or evil, or on whether they're Republic or Empire? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrenMcGuire Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Which had nothing to do with their morality which is all that LS/DS amounts to. No. Classically the colours for force users represent a distiction in faction, not morality. Red is clearly Sith. When we choose what side to play in SWTOR we can't ever cross over so it doesn't ever make sense to wear the enemy's colours and pretend to be something that character will never be, especially when the jedi/dark council is watching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrenMcGuire Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Would you want that filter to be based on whether or not those other players are good or evil, or on whether they're Republic or Empire? Faction. No-one should be wearing the enemy team colours infront of the boss(es). Also good for pvp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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