Niconogood Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 Sporting a valor 69 commando in full BM/rakata (optimized PvP) gear, currently in a hybrid spec (strongest 1v1) spec, I can beat most (evengeared, wellplayed) classes pretty handily.. EXCEPT vans/PTs. Given they play good I just have NO way to beat them. Between their insane amounts of interrupt/pulls and damage + damage mitigation, commandos just dont have any abilities in their arsenal to beat this class. If anyone have found a way, please enlighten me, cause atm im pretty pissed off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethroin Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 (edited) Same way you beat Tank-Hybrid assassins, and DoT spec Marauders: you don't. This is not a 1v1 game. If you want to come close to beating an assualt spec you have to cleanse DoTs to deny them HIB. This will not prevent its use but rather make it less frequent and more costly. You will probably still die to Ion Pulse spam while getting interrupted. You could try fake casting (start and cast and move to stop it) this may trigger a wasted interrupt from the vanguard. If nothing else he used an ammo and cant interrupt the next spell without using a stun CD (they have 2, 1 PBAE and Cryo Grenade). Edited March 1, 2012 by Hethroin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulldogs_Rule Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 Sporting a valor 69 commando in full BM/rakata (optimized PvP) gear, currently in a hybrid spec (strongest 1v1) spec, I can beat most (evengeared, wellplayed) classes pretty handily.. EXCEPT vans/PTs. Given they play good I just have NO way to beat them. Between their insane amounts of interrupt/pulls and damage + damage mitigation, commandos just dont have any abilities in their arsenal to beat this class. If anyone have found a way, please enlighten me, cause atm im pretty pissed off. That's funny, because as a fully geared shield specialist vanguard I have the same problem with commandos. Between the knockbacks, and the damn grav round doesn't pop my shield they keep me just out of the 4 meter range but within the 10 meter range that doesn't allow storm or harpoon. At that range I can't use riot strike or stockstrike (my biggest dps+ion cell sets up for hib my second biggest dps) meaning I just get grav rounded to death at that f-ing medium range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethroin Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 That's funny, because as a fully geared shield specialist vanguard I have the same problem with commandos. Between the knockbacks, and the damn grav round doesn't pop my shield they keep me just out of the 4 meter range but within the 10 meter range that doesn't allow storm or harpoon. At that range I can't use riot strike or stockstrike (my biggest dps+ion cell sets up for hib my second biggest dps) meaning I just get grav rounded to death at that f-ing medium range. I am fairly certain that the question is on fighting Assault or Hybrid specs in DPS gear who gain 50 - 100% damage while losing maybe 18% armor-worth of mitigation against Grav Round when compared to a tank-geared tank-spec. If they are punting you to 9m so that you cannot Storm, walk 1m in the opposite direction and Storm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbstealer Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 That's funny, because as a fully geared shield specialist vanguard I have the same problem with commandos. Between the knockbacks, and the damn grav round doesn't pop my shield they keep me just out of the 4 meter range but within the 10 meter range that doesn't allow storm or harpoon. At that range I can't use riot strike or stockstrike (my biggest dps+ion cell sets up for hib my second biggest dps) meaning I just get grav rounded to death at that f-ing medium range. i lol'd it never occured to you to just run away from him and pull him close? how do you get to max level without learning how to use the abilities given to you? also, commandos need to stand still to do any real damage so you should be able to catch them when they do. This is up there with guardians complaining about being kited. thats right, a class with a base charge and talented free aoe snare is getting kited. half the issues i see on the forums are l2p issues masked as "x is impossible to beat with y" even tho x has all the tools needed to beat y. the only class i have any issues against as a vanguard is a properly played mara. they just hit too hard too fast for me to overcome. key word in that last sentence was "PROPERLY", bad mara die just like everyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhavim Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 (edited) Sporting a valor 69 commando in full BM/rakata (optimized PvP) gear, currently in a hybrid spec (strongest 1v1) spec funny, my full gunnery spec commando in full columni has no problems beating even those 20k health powertechs, sometimes you just need brute damage to kill people... also i tend to try to keep them knocked back as much as i can, stockstrike their channels (if they cast any) and conc. charge followed by full auto for some free damage. also, as soon as they get close again, i usually give them something to interrupt, usually a heal so i dont throw away ammo, and as soon as they interrupt, grav round their asses. just a quick edit: despite what i said, they ARE hard to kill, unless i blow every cooldown (and an instant cast heal, medpack and adrenals) i'll usually kiss the floor. and the grapple into fire doesnt count. Edited March 1, 2012 by Rhavim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niconogood Posted March 1, 2012 Author Share Posted March 1, 2012 The biggest problem is their interrupts and ability to grapple. Melees you can pretty much just blow away with conc. charge to get a breather. Vans will just instapull you to them back in melee, which also will interrupt your casting. And then keep bashing and interrupting you.. Basically the ultimate counter to commandos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soultyr Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 (edited) I do not have as much experience as you with commando but below is my suggestion. A hybrid build taking the additional throwback to keep them at range but not as far to get harpooned. http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#800ZMIkbRMdokZbIbrzh.1 Progression of battle would be 1) Fire dot 2) Plasma grenade (the interupt would probably be here) 3) grav round x2 (if interupted go on to the next, it wont matter to much) 4) sticky (for added burst though not necessary) 5) bolt 6) full auto maybe proc with bolt again. 7) hammer shot because your probably out of ammo, though they are probably dead or running (use armor penetration that way you can get the most out of boltx2) Build would run out of ammo quick though, I think this progression would hit like a cruise boat. Edited March 1, 2012 by Soultyr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easpeak Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 As a Combat Medic: I run away. In fact there are quite a few professions that I just run away from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaoogaa Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 As a Combat Medic: I run away. In fact there are quite a few professions that I just run away from. We call it kiting...Commandos never run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
germil Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 As a commando medic, I don't really have problems against vanguard ,or any other class to be honest (except healers). If you use a hybrid spec or full heal, the problematic is the same, try to heal early not to be in the red zone, fake cast (not that usefull in this game, but it can helps) and dispell. It is like in any other mmo with a healer, using defensive cooldown (stun, instant "sleep" etc..) not too late, to avoid being burst down. Some marauders can be a challenge, but even in this case, I don't see how a healer can be burst down by any class, if he is preemtive enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanyala Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 (edited) As an Assault Vanguard, if I'm in your face, you're going down - unless you're a medic. But if you're dps, there is nothing you could do to prevent me of killing you. The fake heal might delay it for unexperienced vangs, but I know I do more damage in the casting period than your unspecced heal would heal you. Edited March 2, 2012 by Tanyala Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweatbox Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 (edited) they key to beating a vanguard/pyrotech is distance.As AS spec First off hit them with insta concussive shot, force them to blow trinket, try to get distance use hammer shot to slow them down, if they grapple concussive charge and remember u always have cryo grenade. once you are at distance keep hammer shot and throw assault plastique and whatever else u can but do it straffing them dont ever stop. you should wear them down. If they get u close and you have no way to get distance u are ****ed,they put out too much dmg. i would also suggest u use your shield in the beginning and your hot as thats most likely where they will squeeze in most of their dmg. Once you get away keep pressure on,don't blow any knockbacks or stuns unless its a counter to what they do and you have a shot at winning. I have beaten a fair few PT's like this, have lost my fair share too though. Edited March 4, 2012 by sweatbox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KorroMan Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Sporting a valor 69 commando in full BM/rakata (optimized PvP) gear, currently in a hybrid spec (strongest 1v1) spec, I can beat most (evengeared, wellplayed) classes pretty handily.. EXCEPT vans/PTs. Given they play good I just have NO way to beat them. Between their insane amounts of interrupt/pulls and damage + damage mitigation, commandos just dont have any abilities in their arsenal to beat this class. If anyone have found a way, please enlighten me, cause atm im pretty pissed off. I'm 31 into AS commando so not sure if my thoughts will help, but hopefully so. I'll admit PT/Vanguard is a very hard matchup, but my method works reasonably well I think. Basically I keep my dots on them and constantly LOS. After you conc charge and they yank you, pop reactive shield to remove slows and then strafe away while constantly hammer shotting. What I find is that I can often keep my hammershot slow on them and maintain a good distance for a long while (until the cooldowns on their yank comes up the first time). During that time I'm trying to get near a fire hazard (as in huttball), or near a ledge. Then you can use your next conc charge to knock them into fire/green goop or push them off the ledge, at which point you can continue to keep dots and hammer shot while they run back up. If you're really conservative with los'ing you can avoid the yank pretty well. Anyhow, that's not a silver bullet, but there really isn't one. You just have to try and outlast them until you can take advantage of the environment or get backup from your teammates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maltra Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 (edited) I honestly don't think it's possible to beat a properly assault specced and played van/pt in a normal situation, no matter what spec you are. If they make mistakes, have worse gear or a combination of the two, maybe you have a chance if you're med/gunnery hybrid spec, ie you have up to trauma probe, grav round, stock knockbac and 15sec (with set bonus) ccharge, that is the best spec for commandos imo anyway. People saying that the key is cleansing the dots are out of their mind, it costs far less for them to apply them than for you to remove them, not an option. Exception made for the 11pts talent one, of course, but that's really not the key factor of your inevitable demise.. flame burst & punch + free ridiculously armor penetrating rail shots AND interrupts are. I have both a commando and a powertech btw, and i feel bad when i utterly destroy commandos with the latter, they're probably the easiest kill as a pt. Edited March 4, 2012 by Maltra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dejavy Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Same story. Had no chance against smart and geared PTs and VGs, saying nothing about marauders and sins. I have 65 valor Commando and still have no idea what melee class i can beat solo - none actually if we're talking about BM categories. BTW no matter what spec u have. In gunnery u have great opportunity to destroy snipers and mercs and sometimes poor skilled sorcs - it's true. My vanguard is 59 valor and i can admit that i don't feel a foe in mercs until they spam missiles in my back while i'm fighting with someone else. Well, maybe it's their (our) role in the game to terminate everything around until a fly starts scratching us in melee and making fearless commando run away. Today wanna give a chance to AS commando, but don't think it's worth spending time coz vanguard is better in it anyway. Poor poor commando, your only role is to heal and run away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karandor Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 You won't be able to beat any Ironfist spec VG/PT who has any idea what he is doing. Between grapple, charge, 2 stuns and a 6s CD on interrupt if you get more than 1 tracer missle/grav round off in a row the guy you're fighting is bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleFuzzy Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) As a Combat Medic: I run away. In fact there are quite a few professions that I just run away from. Quite agreed. I beat a dps PT by finding a friend to kill him while I try to keep a pillar between us. No one else shuts me down as effectively as they do. Edited March 5, 2012 by LittleFuzzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easpeak Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 We call it kiting...Commandos never run. Pardon me, sir, "tactical retreat" it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thermasilk Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 Stock Strike is your best friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshrus Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 As a combat medic all 1 vs 1 situation go. cyro gernade( they use cooldown), tech override concussive shot. Run away lol. For real though, cms can't burst at all its best avoiding a 1v1 conflict which is easy as a commando. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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