Vanguard/Powertech Most OP class in the game

[Alwaysx]

You do realize that armor damage reduction ONLY reduces the damage from kinetic and energy attacks? Nearly every class gets abilities that do internal or elemental which completely bypass armor mitigation, the exceptions being Agents/Smugglers who tend to have a lot of kinetic abilities. It's even worse for "tanks" in pvp, since their shield is pratically useless due to all of the force/tech ablities.

 

The difference between light, medium, and heavy armor is 5-10%, which amounts to nothing in PVP. If you're an operative and going after a tank of any class, then learn how to play and pick your targets better.

5-10% doesn't amount to "nothing" in PvP. If so, then surely that 10% from Expertise is negligible. All I'm saying is that they're more tanky than light/medium-armor classes. A huge % of DPS from the majority of classes uses Kinetic/Energy attacks and just because every class has internal/elemental attacks doesn't mean that they'll only be using them for any efficient DPS rotation.

 

There's no reason to argue against the fact that heavy-armor classes are more tanky than medium/light-armor classes. In no way am I saying that it's OP; it's just a statement. Relax.

Edited March 5, 2012 by Alwaysx

[generalsanmai]

Easy way to counter a Pyro Powertech, keep us at range. We have one gap closer on a 45 second cooldown. That's it. If we aren't in melee (10-4m) we can't make good use of Railshot procs or other such abilities so we have to rely on 15 sec cooldowns and our basic attack to do damage.

 

Problem people have with PTs is they try to go toe to toe with them, that's just asking for you to lose most of the times for MOST ACs. Sins being our direct counter, Maras if we fumble when we stun them. Good snipers are a pain too, but those are few and far between. (I think the server we are on probably has many 1 sniper I hate going up against since it's a 50/50 I'll win )

 

Sorcs actually are the easiest class for us to beat which doesn't help you =/

 

On the plus side, in a group setting, as was stated multiple times, we are very squishy and have no way to remove our selves from combat or get away if things get rough (as our defensive cooldowns are terrible). Marks us, Focus us, we are useless. Problem solved.

 

 

Excellent post, QFT. I love it when players just stand there when I close in on them thinking they can take me. A friend of mine is a geared assassin, and he beats me 50% of the time. Good marauders can also beat my Pyro, sometimes, but fortunately 99% of marauders/sentinels are horrible.

[Torcer]

That would not get you the 31/31/31 lol.... nice try

 

 

 

solution add 9.

 

Barbie was right after all.

[Omfitness]

This isn't really up for debate. Any rational person will admit Pyro damage is out of control in PvP. This burst is absolutely and utterly retarded. I have had back to back 4500-5k crits on me in full champ gear. A BM Pyro-Powertech is nearly impossible to kill and can burst someone dead within a few globals.

 

Anyone that tries to pretend the burst doesn't needs to get toned down has no idea what they are talking about or are blatantly lying in hope devs don't notice the problem.

 

I completey agree!!!

[dirtyboxer]

I completey agree!!!

 

Lol way to resurrect a 3 month old post. Desperate much?

[Kehtal]

I typed out this long and detailed response about how the OP is wrong about everything.

 

 

Everything.

 

 

But then I realized that he's just trolling.

 

 

Edit: Yeah, I now realize this is a three month old thread. Got trolled.

Edited June 26, 2012 by Kehtal

[SajPl]

This isn't really up for debate. Any rational person will admit Pyro damage is out of control in PvP. This burst is absolutely and utterly retarded. I have had back to back 4500-5k crits on me in full champ gear. A BM Pyro-Powertech is nearly impossible to kill and can burst someone dead within a few globals.

 

Anyone that tries to pretend the burst doesn't needs to get toned down has no idea what they are talking about or are blatantly lying in hope devs don't notice the problem.

 

Yes I have been stunned 3 times by an infiltration shadow while being bombarded by 7k projects and 5k force breeches ...

 

On a side not atm tanksins are the OP 31/31/31 spec, they have :

cc immunity (resilience) along with force and tech immunity - vanguard tactics tree

speedbuff - tactics tree

are tanks - shield spec tree

high damage - assault specialist (pyro) tree

Add to that self healing and a lot of control, slow, second aoe slow, stun, second stun, pull, there you have an op class.

Edited June 26, 2012 by SajPl

[Vaipyr]

Yes it is.

 

Strengths:

- Most utility in the game (tied with sorc), ie. leap (specced) and pull (which in itself is insane),

- Most amounts of interrupts in the game.

- One of the toughest and arguably the toughest class in the game when it comes to defensive CDs and damage mitigation.

- Best AoE ability in the game

- Excellent ranged damage capabilities

- Excellent melee damage capabilities

- One of the best burst capabilities in the game as assault/pyro

- One of the highest sustainable DpS over time

 

Weaknesses:

- Umm.. None

 

I cant really see how a wellgeared PT/Van would be able to lose a duel EVER.

 

They should at least remove harpoon/grapple from the game. That would at least make Ilum remotely playable again, making it be about tactics, teamwork and postioning, and not only be about which blob got the most amount of PTs/Vans and are able to fish the fastest. Harpoon is the prime reason Ilum is broken atm.

 

How do you people keep getting access to 31/31/31 spec's?!?!?

 

No matter what I do I can only seem to allocate 31 points TOTAL..... I'm submitting a bug report, my game must be broken and I'm tired of being short-changed by 62 talent points.

[dirtyboxer]

this thread is 3 months old, let it die.

[AnAcuteAngle]

Yes it is.

 

Strengths:

- Most utility in the game (tied with sorc), ie. leap (specced) and pull (which in itself is insane),

- Most amounts of interrupts in the game.

- One of the toughest and arguably the toughest class in the game when it comes to defensive CDs and damage mitigation.

- Best AoE ability in the game

- Excellent ranged damage capabilities

- Excellent melee damage capabilities

- One of the best burst capabilities in the game as assault/pyro

- One of the highest sustainable DpS over time

 

Weaknesses:

- Umm.. None

 

I cant really see how a wellgeared PT/Van would be able to lose a duel EVER.

 

They should at least remove harpoon/grapple from the game. That would at least make Ilum remotely playable again, making it be about tactics, teamwork and postioning, and not only be about which blob got the most amount of PTs/Vans and are able to fish the fastest. Harpoon is the prime reason Ilum is broken atm.

 

Hahahaha. Most utility in game. I laughed at this.

 

Leap? That's Shield Tech spec, buddy. No one even complains about that. Why? Because it's underpowered as of right now.

 

You have to be kidding, so EVERY spec of the PT is OP?

 

You clearly haven't done your research. L2P. Don't listen to OP.

 

-HEY GUYS. I'M GOING TO WHINE ABOUT EVERY SPEC AN AC HAS, EVEN THOUGH THEY CAN'T SPEC INTO ALL OF THEM AT ONCE-

 

And on that note, Pyro is our only decent spec. We don't get 'Leap' as you like to call it.

 

Best AOE's. - Wrong. Look at a Sorc.

Great Range DPS - Wrong. Look at a Sniper.

Great Survivability - Wrong. Look at Assasins.

 

Someone needs to stop QQing. I'm seriously tired of everyone who can't play this game complaining about Pyros.

 

We're a DPS machine. That's it. No utility. No defensive capabilities.

 

Hell, I can't even solo a healer.

 

And I'm broken? Really?

[Jetflair]

Hahahaha. Most utility in game. I laughed at this.

 

Leap? That's Shield Tech spec, buddy. No one even complains about that. Why? Because it's underpowered as of right now.

 

 

I don't think its underpowered. People just don't play it a lot which I wonder a lot. You get same amount of damage in lot lower speed than lets say Pyro but you will survive twice as along. It will grind down most of sages/Inquisitors to their dismay.

 

Not blazing fast but it gets there for sure.

 

Its much better than people anticipate if they spec wisely the talents. Besides it has great utility and mobility.

[Theology]

So many bads spewing mis-information in this thread, it's truely mind boggling.

[Yestreen]

They do excellent damage/burst.

 

However they do have a big weaknes: they can't really escape from combat because they dont have a sprint/vanish/immunity CD.

 

This makes their playstyle a "kill or be killed" dps race (unless they have a healer with them). Also, as a healer, I can tell you that if they are pyro you can gimp them pretty effectively by just cleansing their burns.

[BurningCourage]

guys come on stop defending assault and pyro cause i am gonna list why they are op.

1. Rail shot haveing stupid armor pen and doing huge dmg plus being able to use it every 6s with the proc which happens almost all the time and being 30m attack.

2. Their spamable elemental attack that has 100% chance to proc a burn that snares u for 2s when first applied then again after the second tick for another 2s and that burn can be reapplied with ease.

3. their grip is great utility which in my imo isnt completley op but really strong

4. their defensive cooldown. 25% dmg reduction for what 12s? pretty good but its not that is a super op defensive its that is up all the time 2min cooldown thats reduced by 3s every time u take dmg every 1.5s ? which means that baby is up all the time.

5. A ranged stun umm? what u mean their a melee class that can use a range stun riduclous.

6. even at range they can do some type of dmg if rail shot isnt up ie explosive round or explosive missile or unload and full auto yes its not their best attacks but their 30m so say they are rooted more than 10m way they can use one of those attacks or their stick grenade thing or their free attack that can proc snare burn.

7. an aoe stun that ensures ur team get an extra global not op initself but hey man just add the the utility

8. taunt umm u know they can taunt and reduce dmg done by other players right? and dont say its a waste of a global or anything cause its off the global cooldown and an aoe taunt so they can do awesome dmg and help lower the other teams dmg

9. interuppt ok not op but lets face it pyro and assult dont need to interuppt but if they do omg good luck living against them and again off the GCD so not a waste

10. the burns doing consitent dmg and lots of dmg when someone is in dispatch range yay i killed him i only have 8% left uh oh a dot ticking quick heals whoop crit i am dead

 

so anyone who defends them is a moron and hasnt played the class or is not aware of the other classes capiabitlties or doesnt want them getting nerfed imo making rail shot 10m range would help a ton and at least u could somewhat avoid it or making the extra amor pen in the other tree higher up

Edited July 25, 2012 by BurningCourage

[BurningCourage]

They do excellent damage/burst.

 

However they do have a big weaknes: they can't really escape from combat because they dont have a sprint/vanish/immunity CD.

 

This makes their playstyle a "kill or be killed" dps race (unless they have a healer with them). Also, as a healer, I can tell you that if they are pyro you can gimp them pretty effectively by just cleansing their burns.

 

as for that umm cleanse their burns great but one prob sorc/sages cant so wont work plus they can put it on faster than u can cleanse it their and the burn thats dangrouers is the snare burn which can be applied w/e the heck a powertech wants it instant cast 100% chance to apply off a good elemental dmging ability 3/18heat i believe ya good luck with cleanseing burns while they reapply in a global and still do dmg and rail shot u even if u sprint or get gripped away or leap away and as for an escape they really dont need one with all the other freaking utility they have. plus if they are gonna die they can spam attacks to do insane dmg before their death dont need to ever us a free attack if ur gonna die anyways why stay within max regen if ur not gonna live

Edited July 24, 2012 by BurningCourage

[KBSIP]

I would love to simultaneously access pyro or advanced prototype DPS alongside leaping from the shield tech tree, unfortunately that's impossible. We aren't guardians/juggernauts, bioware doesn't let powertechs stance dance to get access to cross utility.

[BurningCourage]

I would love to simultaneously access pyro or advanced prototype DPS alongside leaping from the shield tech tree, unfortunately that's impossible. We aren't guardians/juggernauts, bioware doesn't let powertechs stance dance to get access to cross utility.

u dont need the leap u have ranged attacks u can use to do dmg while running to them and ur free attack can proc a slow so u can catch up and do ur 10m attacks and if u go out of range again rail shot will be up and u have taunt for utility and grip and aoe stun and ranged stun and range to stop door caps w/e not being dependent off leap or saber throw being off cooldown u can still tuant in any stance so no more of this QQ about pyro not being op cause it is no question. and if u notice i didnt metion leaping at all in my previous post

[Rippeh]

hey we dont has undying rage. thats a weakness!

[KBSIP]

u dont need the leap u have ranged attacks u can use to do dmg while running to them and ur free attack can proc a slow so u can catch up and do ur 10m attacks and if u go out of range again rail shot will be up and u have taunt for utility and grip and aoe stun and ranged stun and range to stop door caps w/e not being dependent off leap or saber throw being off cooldown u can still tuant in any stance so no more of this QQ about pyro not being op cause it is no question. and if u notice i didnt metion leaping at all in my previous post

 

the fact is that people are whining on here and posting blatant misinformation. Given their lack of knowledge of the class I'd be willing to assume these are also the guys who get nailed by a far off sniper at the same time as a PT/mara lands a killing blow and QQ's about how quick they died.

 

The fact is that the vast majority of the whining on here is fueled by misinformation, and a lack of will on the part of the complainers to adjust their playstyle or strategy to deal with the threat pyros represent. A lone operative healer can be just as influential and frustrating in PVP if the players he's fighting refuse to adjust their strategy to deal with the class. Mercenaries can absolutely dominate in PVP against people who refuse to close the gap with them. Tanks can keep a healer up near indefinitely if people aren't willing to adjust targeting when taunted while swapping back for crucial interrupts.

 

L2P is often considered an invalid excuse, but given the average caliber of your level 50 player when the classes are all easy to learn and fairly easy to master, its a legitimate response. Pyro's chewing through you because you aren't getting healed and he's not getting taunted or peel-stunned? L2P. Operative healer propping up a trio of DPS/tanks holding a node against 5-6 of you because you only chain in one at a time, or all attack different targets while they focus fire? L2P. Marauder running through your lines to attack your healers/RDPS unmolested? L2P.

 

hell, the sheer lack of awareness of positioning by most teams in pugs is such that I can regularly wrap around one of the side nodes in the civil war and pick off 1-2 of the enemy healers before they even know im there, because they aren't paying attention to ops frames and no one is keeping their eyes on the other possible avenue of attack. This is, yet again, a L2P issue.

 

My god, most pyros aren't even that good. I see many in combat tech sets, or finishing the game with 0 protection. the two taunts add a whopping 2 buttons to your series of used abilities, and are off the GCD. there is absolutely no excuse not to use them liberally, and only a marginal excuse of lack of experience on whether or not you use them in the most effective manner.

 

The same goes for sentinels. The number of them that sit there with me at 6 meters ineffectually trying to hit me without looking at their range meter is pathetic, and highlights that all classes, especially FOTM ones, have severe weaknesses that a strong player will exploit.

 

hell, even the response time on operative healers, the strongest healers in PVP atm, are so slow in some cases that they don't bother to heal themselves until they're almost dead, and this is outside my burst window. no, I'm ticking them down with rapid shots or a spaced out burst to keep heat low and they just sit there and take it, and by the time they bother to start reacting (not including their ignorant team mates) 5-7 seconds later, I'm able to simply stun them and finish off the burst because they weren't being attentive.

 

I'll be honest here, the only classes I feel truly lack to tools to be effective in their play styles are mercenary DPS, and sorcerer healers. that being said, both can thrive in a vacuum. The lack of ability to thrive outside of their specific utility windows even when ignored belongs to concealment operative DPS. they have too much uptime when they're waiting to drop combat if they're trying to go in for another stealth burst, and the DPS outside of stealth burst is too low to be viable in a team fight.

[KBSIP]

u dont need the leap u have ranged attacks u can use to do dmg while running to them and ur free attack can proc a slow so u can catch up and do ur 10m attacks and if u go out of range again rail shot will be up and u have taunt for utility and grip and aoe stun and ranged stun and range to stop door caps w/e not being dependent off leap or saber throw being off cooldown u can still tuant in any stance so no more of this QQ about pyro not being op cause it is no question. and if u notice i didnt metion leaping at all in my previous post

 

what class are you playing that you simply cannot handle a pyro, and why are you playing 1v1 in an 8v8 warzone? the only class I can think of that is legitimately FUBAR is stealth classes caught before their openers, which is a flaw in their class design as far as PVP is concerned given how friggin easy it is to detect them.

[BurningCourage]

what class are you playing that you simply cannot handle a pyro, and why are you playing 1v1 in an 8v8 warzone? the only class I can think of that is legitimately FUBAR is stealth classes caught before their openers, which is a flaw in their class design as far as PVP is concerned given how friggin easy it is to detect them.

 

I never said that they are simply just stronger than the other class's. Overpowerd look at my reasoning above like come on and l2p peel u know what i do peel and it doesnt matter cause they can simply kill u so fast that the whole team has to attack him just to kill him so he doesnt go around 3 shotting everyone which u dont have to do against any other class. the powertech not having surviabilty is a lie their cooldown is off cooldown so much so thats not there issue utility not issue for them their burst is insane like thier overpowerd no question about it give me and ACUTAL Reason saying they arent not just going around say no no no no just cause u cant beat em makes op? thats not what i said. give me actual reasons real reasons that their arent op can u argue every thing i listed about what they can do?

[BurningCourage]

another thing about them also is they have no casted abilties and all thier attacks are almost all 10m or more their 30m attacks exlcuding rail shot isnt great dmg but its still dmg they can do at a range so its easy to go in 10m pop out of 10m rail shot sticky greande thing go back in 10m hit them with ur elemental attack that auto slows them like so u cant kite them? ok can u interuppt some of thier dmg? no well *** do u do then

[FalcoLombardi]

Pyro isn't a tank tree; its a DPS tree.

Vanguards/Powertechs aren't tanks unless they spec as tanks.

 

Pyro isn't a tank tree; its a DPS tree.

Vanguards/Powertechs aren't tanks unless they spec as tanks.

 

Pyro isn't a tank tree; its a DPS tree.

Vanguards/Powertechs aren't tanks unless they spec as tanks.

 

Pyro isn't a tank tree; its a DPS tree.

Vanguards/Powertechs aren't tanks unless they spec as tanks.

 

Pyro isn't a tank tree; its a DPS tree.

Vanguards/Powertechs aren't tanks unless they spec as tanks.

 

Pyro isn't a tank tree; its a DPS tree.

Vanguards/Powertechs aren't tanks unless they spec as tanks.

 

Pyro isn't a tank tree; its a DPS tree.

Vanguards/Powertechs aren't tanks unless they spec as tanks.

 

...So, what are you trying to say....?

[marcusbjol]

another thing about them also is they have no casted abilties and all thier attacks are almost all 10m or more their 30m attacks exlcuding rail shot isnt great dmg but its still dmg they can do at a range so its easy to go in 10m pop out of 10m rail shot sticky greande thing go back in 10m hit them with ur elemental attack that auto slows them like so u cant kite them? ok can u interuppt some of thier dmg? no well *** do u do then

 

You may want to learn about the class before you criticize it so much.

 

HiB/RS requires a DoT to work: Ops/Scoundrels can cleanse them.

IR/(dont play a PT) is a 30m DoT. It is pretty inefficient (low damage 2 ammo), really only used to set up a HiB/RS from range.

AP/TD (or the Sticky Grenade) is a 30m with a delay.

 

So... if I am 30m away, I do a AP, IR, HiB (If I am very lucky and the other guy is not geared 10k damage)... and then....

HS (basic attack)... Full Auto is iffy (channeled attack that doesnt do all that much more than HS).

 

Every other class has some ability to snare as well... so, use it if they are kiting you. If you are a JK, leap then use it. Consular/Scoundrels have it at range.

[Tatebomb]

...So, what are you trying to say....?

 

Pretty sure he's saying Mara/sent is OP. or nerf ops again.