SWTOR vs SWG

[rossonja]

One thing I most sorely miss from SWG was the community. That game had a very strong sense of community, which gave rise to much more world-PVP and social interaction. I have a theory as to why, and it has to do with the underlying systems involved.

 

In the structure of SWG, you had a sense of ownership. My town, my house, my ship, my character. The reason you had the sense of ownership is because you had to work to get these things. You had to drop the credits, know the right people, or spend the time gathering the resources to build these things yourself.

 

With the advent of cities, came a stronger community structure over-top of the interdependency that already existed between players (Remember primarily that you were limited to 1 and later only 2 characters per server). People would buy their gear from other players, gets buffs from entertainers and doctors, etc..

 

In TOR it's very different. There's really no sense of community and zero incentive to form one. It's little more than a directionless mob of individuals as opposed to a focused community. The occasional guild forms, sure, but that's where it ends. There's no sense of ownership because no work was involved in acquiring the virtual property.

 

Now on to world PVP and the sense of ownership. The theory I have there is the psychology of the players and the events that are presented. It's one thing if the Imperial Fleet/Orgrimmar is attacked (As an example). Most would simply say "Not my problem."

 

It's another if it were one of the player cities on SWG. It goes from "Not my problem" to "Hell no, that's my neighborhood!"

 

When you create a sense of ownership of virtual property and community through the game's structure, you create a psychological need to defend said property.

 

Well put. The ownership was a great thing. There were alot of complexities to the game as well. I guess I can see why, to some, it just wasn't their game.(Thinking Doc Holliday says this best in Tombstone )

[Nippon]

-a ton of different professions/specs you could choose to be a Individual

-Player housing, custom furniture housing design.

-Politics and player cities.

-Socialism

-Player bounty system

-Actual Space

-Elite class: Jedi (hardcores and elite players could hologrind to play)

-OPEN WORLD pvp

-Cantinas where full of players

-Kind players (no WoW kiddies)

 

where as SWTOR has this:

-Railed leveling system, choose 8 Classes.

-One-click crafting (companion)

-Wzs' hardly any good open world PvP

-Endgame raiding.

-Cutscene decisions.

-all the wow kiddies.

Oh, don't forget the lack of seeing enemy players, lack of grouping, and railed space...REALLY?

 

In a word....

 

This

[Dregorex]

i like SWG by the way is not dead a company in chicago has a server up and running its still mostly testing stage but its alive and kicking its now SWGMU.i like it do to the fact i can be what i want unlike SWTOR your a fighter take the smuggler it dont smuggle anything its a bounty hunter for the Republic.i wasted 75 dollers oh this game if they change the smuggler and make it a real smuggler by having it raise in rank by trading then ill be back if not $75 down the crapper in my book

[rossonja]

Oh yes, on the SWG there was sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo much drama and QQing and trolling. It was entertaining though..

 

Trolling, exploiting, and QQing were very populous in SWG. That is for sure. Also forgot to mention player bounty systems; Well, basically every profession had their own perks and special side missions with BHs and Smugs getting pretty unique ones. Can't forget my 1337 dps saber!

 

I would like to see where these statistics are for how many subscriptions you say there were at "x" time for myself. I am not yet doubting this evidence you have proposed.

 

I played on the Naritus server before free transfers were first offered. It was absolutely dead and I struggled often to find anything to do other than pvp(which only happened at night time). Once transfers were offered, we transferred to Flurry. As I remember Flurry, Bria, Euro-Chaimeara, Starsider, and Bloodfin were very populous servers after the transfers took place. The game did very well and many people came back. Time went by, lost of people left, more transfers happened. By the end, only Flurry, Starsider, and maybe one other were really populous. I mean even after the announcement of SWG's untimely demise, many people continued to play(doing all the things they always wanted to etc). Sony did what they do best by giving everything away for free in the last months which I indulged upon, myself:cool: Every aspect of the game bumped on for awhile. The last month were pretty desolate, but the bigger guilds with the diehard SWGers stuck around til the very end.

 

So for my part, other than the end of Naritus, my original server and the end of the game, there were not many dull moments. You could say the top 5 guilds from both factions which contained the majority of players at the end and throw them on one server and keep it running for much, much longer than they did. All the well-known, hard-core players would have stuck around for awhile.

[lordkains]

here is some sub info i came across http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-2.png

hope that helps.

Edited March 23, 2012 by lordkains

[Bluerodian]

Fixed it. ^

 

If there is ANYTHING from SWG I don't miss is its very "social" community. You gotta love all the senseless drama PvPers and Roleplayers made especially when they showed their true colors in the game's final days.

 

Personally, I never ran in to any more drama or QQ in SWG than I do in any other MMO, this one included. The only drama that showed up in the final days was between people trying to keep the game going despite the inevitable, and those either telling them to let it go (Which was pointless) and those vehemently glad that it was being shut down.

 

Otherwise, QQ and drama is nothing new or specific to SWG.

[Kaoci]

the only thing i will say on this subject is that bioware, ea and Lucast arts ripped Sony off and the fans of SWG off one even though the combat stuff changed and game changed SWG offerd more in it than tor does and even though it had less graphics gave me more freedom and fun than tor has.

 

All SOE had to do was say to LA ok we tryed ur way with the Combat and game changing now we want to add more old stuff in since it was LA who demanded the change in first place.

 

But Lucast Arts being morons as they are decide to back a game that wasnt even released based on this may beat up wow more than swg.

 

Also i didnt get why LA couldnt have 2 star wars games.

 

 

but TOR has good things but problem with it is there is alot of OLD SWG players who thought this would be the new SWG for them and it isnt the only thing it has going for it is Story and maybay just maybay classes but they Lack on alot.

 

For example tor is a themepark mmorpg that makes you do there game there way not yours.

 

TOR kind of bluffed on the stuff they were trying to sell as points such as Heroic Combat the combat in this game i have seen better and one game for that in melee wise and range was Age of Conan being the game it self had issues but was more Heroic than tor.

 

TOR saying you can face more than 1 mob on easily is a lie i see my self at time strugling when it comes to class quests where i got 3 strong mobs on me who outdamage my healing companions heals.

 

Tor saying it had a different story when you played a different class yes that is Different class story but again has issue like wow that they kind of made people think they fixed where you are doing the same side quests over and over and over again every time you switch to a new character.

 

TOR saying there is dynamic voice well considering i noticed on my BH most the things he says are always the same as something in the past.

 

Also TOR LEFT alot out of the game that should have been in launch and changed so much in the game before it was out of beta and made it kind of dull.

 

EG changing mods to weapons use to be more dynamic and your weapon changed look now all u seem to do is pick one that is ok looking and upgrade it from crappy ones and nothing looks wise change.

 

TOR said companions are not like pets there More important. Not really since the only thing they can be used for is flashpoints if group isnt full or story quest since world pvp areas block them off and pvp warzones allows no companions so pretty much makes me think Pets would have been better since you could use them in these things without even filling out the group such as say Necromancer in AOC could have 4 ranged pets or 8 Melee Pets which didnt take 8 spots in my group.

 

ALSO 5 companions are useless to have unless you want to spend time in making or buying armour for them since if you do it quest wise you can only gear one of them if you want them to be the slightest bit useful.

 

Also Bioware said dont rush your class stuff and enjoy the game me being a moron and doing this after me knowing i could have 50 a few weeks after beta to now find i am far behind in pvp valor ranks that i just get pwnd since i dont have Battle Master.

 

Also TOR said the Collectors Store will offer unique companion looks and social items there is 1 companion upgrade for each class and 1 set of armour and 1 pet in it feel little bit ripped off.

 

what tor does beat swg is that the quests are more fun to do since can choose how convo goes and story ends up.

 

also it has better graphics but on planet sizes so on SWG beats it far down and the amount of planets tor has doesnt work up to planets swg has that was actually useful in visiting.

 

Also lets be honest the character customisation SUCKED balls instead of giving us 5 choices let us use sliders on creating characters eg weight 5 choices no give me a slider so i can pick thanks.

 

People say tor hasnt been out as long as WOW so cant expect it to have the same stuff Your guys are completly wrong reason why there are games that came out after wow that had the same stuff as wow and more. TOR has been in make for what 3 or 4 years they should have if not as much but close to tor has id say maybay 1 Quater of which wow had to offer us and its a really scary thought to me that i remember paying all the money i had for a collctors eddition of Star Trek Online and enjoyed beta and then few months down line got fed up with it.

 

Bioware have been kind of lazy on the content given to us on launch day yes i understand there alot to program in planet wise but they had 4 years and have alot better technology than wow did 7 or so years ago.

 

By the way i dont mean ohh hundreds of raids and flashpoints tor gave us enough i mean eg no fishing in game no swimming in game, Not being able to sit or interact with many social objects such as seats or even lay down on beds. Ships cant even be upgraded looks wise and the fact that tor has a loading screen just about as long as an average sized patch takes to load up is a joke and i got a pretty fast broadband and an alienware laptop.

 

Also fact that tor came out and game us an instanced style gameplay which doesnt work really amuses me for example this game has instances so i could be on corelia one and my gf on corelia 2 when it should have been done how age of conans was where it gave us 1 instance when that was becoming full it autmactially opened another instance up so the first instance didnt lag and also the fact that people could switch about. Also i dont see why the game doesnt get rid of instancing since the main story lines are phased so people cant gank while there and camps are pretty much unattackable since there are big nasty droids destroying people.

 

3rd TOR hasnt even added in anything for guilds yet which is disapointing expecially after the pre beta guild creating and making allies and it always seems to want to load a new area for example i complete say Hutta then i need to go to shuttle i then have to load a new screen for imperial fleet docking bay then head to lift then another screen for lift to transport me why its dum they should be able to change that.

 

So long story straight if i had choice of SWG after the combat change over tor id take swg since i preferd it and hate LA for forcing swg to close.

[Kaoci]

BTW mefit SWG was still making money it still had subs and it wasnt loosing money the reason LA closed the game was because they didnt want TOR getting any compitition and i got a feeling bioware or EA forced them to because before the close LA said ye we want to keep SWG going no reason why cant have 2 star wars games then couple weeks later ok SWG coming down and 5 days later SWTOR coming out little bit fishy i think and lets be honest SWG was more fun that tor if you knew how to actually play the game

[mefit]

i like SWG by the way is not dead a company in chicago has a server up and running its still mostly testing stage but its alive and kicking its now SWGMU.i like it do to the fact i can be what i want unlike SWTOR your a fighter take the smuggler it dont smuggle anything its a bounty hunter for the Republic.i wasted 75 dollers oh this game if they change the smuggler and make it a real smuggler by having it raise in rank by trading then ill be back if not $75 down the crapper in my book

 

I am just going to point out the fact that a company is bringing back SWG and owns no rights to it and is doing it without lawsuits from either SOE or LucasArts should show you that SOE could have kept it open if they wanted to ..............lol

 

I honestly think SWG players just have no understanding of the world outside of their ingame SWG reality whatsoever!

 

I know the feeling of wasting money on a game , I payed 50+ tax on StarWars Galaxies when it came out and 15 for the next month that I did not play ! Oh well , hey thankyou for spending you money here

[Kaoci]

I am just going to point out the fact that a company is bringing back SWG and owns no rights to it and is doing it without lawsuits from either SOE or LucasArts should show you that SOE could have kept it open if they wanted to ..............lol

 

I honestly think SWG players just have no understanding of the world outside of their ingame SWG reality whatsoever!

 

I know the feeling of wasting money on a game , I payed 50+ tax on StarWars Galaxies when it came out and 15 for the next month that I did not play ! Oh well , hey thankyou for spending you money here

 

Actually wrong here the EMG is only allowed to be open since SOE were upset they couldnt keep real thing SOE tryed hard to keep the game live but was forced to shut down due to licescing for example lets put this way they had like 2 people working on the game and the game put out more content than what some games today do.

[mefit]

the only thing i will say on this subject is that bioware, ea and Lucast arts ripped Sony off and the fans of SWG off one even though the combat stuff changed and game changed SWG offerd more in it than tor does and even though it had less graphics gave me more freedom and fun than tor has.

Ripped Sony off ? LMAO Wow the things you guys say lol.

 

All SOE had to do was say to LA ok we tryed ur way with the Combat and game changing now we want to add more old stuff in since it was LA who demanded the change in first place.

Before NGE was horrible and after was just a hair better , it shows no one but a select few people liked playing dead games .

 

But Lucast Arts being morons as they are decide to back a game that wasnt even released based on this may beat up wow more than swg.

Bioware starting making TOR 5 years before TOR came out, SWG had 5 years to show some kinda results but never did . Neither SOE or LA wanted to continue the game or SOE would have put up a fight . They did after all dump hundreds of thousands of dollars in making SWG after all.

 

Also i didnt get why LA couldnt have 2 star wars games.

Because they have a better client base with CloneWars than they ever did with SWG , even though CloneWars is cheap , it is making them MONEY !

 

but TOR has good things but problem with it is there is alot of OLD SWG players who thought this would be the new SWG for them and it isnt the only thing it has going for it is Story and maybay just maybay classes but they Lack on alot.

Whoes fault is this you guys never read anything for the last 3 years about TOR ? TOR was announced as it is now , a casual gamers MMO . NOTHING SAID SANDBOX lol.

 

For example tor is a themepark mmorpg that makes you do there game there way not yours.

Most MMOs are like this , I play my Assassin how I like. I am given 3 trees of skills to pick from and I pick the skills I like over any Set skills . Matter of fact TOR gives you options that are more than basicly any MMO alive on the market today. Yes SWG allowed you to do what you wanted but really there was a alot of bad players in this as well .

 

TOR kind of bluffed on the stuff they were trying to sell as points such as Heroic Combat the combat in this game i have seen better and one game for that in melee wise and range was Age of Conan being the game it self had issues but was more Heroic than tor.

If you hate TOR why pay to play it ? Seems to me you should be upset at yourself , because you are just making yourself angry lol.

 

TOR saying you can face more than 1 mob on easily is a lie i see my self at time strugling when it comes to class quests where i got 3 strong mobs on me who outdamage my healing companions heals.

Dude your a horrible gamer then , I killed 2-4 Strong Mobs easy and alot of times I can Solo Elites my level . Maybe SWG was easymode lol . Not what I rememebered SWG to be but I did here NGE brought in alot of Bad players and easy mode

 

Tor saying it had a different story when you played a different class yes that is Different class story but again has issue like wow that they kind of made people think they fixed where you are doing the same side quests over and over and over again every time you switch to a new character.

Main Class story is different for basic classes , there are times in all quest you can change things that won't be the same twice . Like killing a character that you could have kept alive . In my Inquisitors Class quest I killed the Sithpureblood who ran a cult and gave it to two humans to run , and later on I go back to check on them and they still are apart of the story . I could have kept the pureblood alive and he would be in their place and so on.

 

TOR saying there is dynamic voice well considering i noticed on my BH most the things he says are always the same as something in the past.

There are some quotes and answers that are repeats , I notice it but it doesn't kill my game for me . Really I find alot of people in real life repeat the same things over and over like you SWG people for example !

 

Also TOR LEFT alot out of the game that should have been in launch and changed so much in the game before it was out of beta and made it kind of dull.

I mean if you are playing a game you dislike and find dull but could be playing other games on the Market , what does that say about you ? Someone forcing you to play SWTOR ? Are you locked in a room taped to a chair looking at a monitor?

 

EG changing mods to weapons use to be more dynamic and your weapon changed look now all u seem to do is pick one that is ok looking and upgrade it from crappy ones and nothing looks wise change.

I have many weapon looks to pick from , I think more will come later . The game is not even half a year old and you are thinking its going to be like a game that had 8 years to get all the content it had . I remember launch for SWG and up till a year later it did not have all those nice crafts and gear looks as you think . Matter of fact SWG was basic like most MMOs that just come out , it takes time .

 

TOR said companions are not like pets there More important. Not really since the only thing they can be used for is flashpoints if group isnt full or story quest since world pvp areas block them off and pvp warzones allows no companions so pretty much makes me think Pets would have been better since you could use them in these things without even filling out the group such as say Necromancer in AOC could have 4 ranged pets or 8 Melee Pets which didnt take 8 spots in my group.

Companions have stories

They help in quest

They craft

and can help in PvP

Yea they are just like pets ?!? LOL WHATEVER !

Btw you can get Pets in TOR, or have you not had someone show you seeing how you don't seem able to find things on your own !

 

ALSO 5 companions are useless to have unless you want to spend time in making or buying armour for them since if you do it quest wise you can only gear one of them if you want them to be the slightest bit useful.

Companions craft and gather , 5 of them are more useful to those who know how to play their game but to those who don't I guess they would seem wasted .

Not to mention each companion works different and has different uses , maybe you should play more before making it seem you are not playing TOR at all lol .

 

Also Bioware said dont rush your class stuff and enjoy the game me being a moron and doing this after me knowing i could have 50 a few weeks after beta to now find i am far behind in pvp valor ranks that i just get pwnd since i dont have Battle Master.

Really did you play SWG ? SWG gave you nothing if you didn't work for it . Why should you be able to take on a battlemaster player without working on it ?

I would agree Battlemaster is a grind but thats what makes it rewarding .

 

Also TOR said the Collectors Store will offer unique companion looks and social items there is 1 companion upgrade for each class and 1 set of armour and 1 pet in it feel little bit ripped off.

With more to come , you can't have everything in the first day , week, month , or year . I will be the first to agree TOR allows players to get things alittle fast .

 

what tor does beat swg is that the quests are more fun to do since can choose how convo goes and story ends up.

More quest , more story . WHat I like !

 

also it has better graphics but on planet sizes so on SWG beats it far down and the amount of planets tor has doesnt work up to planets swg has that was actually useful in visiting.

SWG had years to get all those planets . It was a sandbox game, they cost more to keep going than normal MMOs . If SWG was a Blocked Area game like TOR , WOW , Aion .....ect ect , SWG would probably be F2P right now and not closed Down.

 

Also lets be honest the character customisation SUCKED balls instead of giving us 5 choices let us use sliders on creating characters eg weight 5 choices no give me a slider so i can pick thanks.

I will agree here but to be honest , if you had read about TOR before it came out you would not be suprised.

 

 

People say tor hasnt been out as long as WOW so cant expect it to have the same stuff Your guys are completly wrong reason why there are games that came out after wow that had the same stuff as wow and more. TOR has been in make for what 3 or 4 years they should have if not as much but close to tor has id say maybay 1 Quater of which wow had to offer us and its a really scary thought to me that i remember paying all the money i had for a collctors eddition of Star Trek Online and enjoyed beta and then few months down line got fed up with it.

You can live in your world , but its a fact that no MMO comes out with the content of a game thats been out 5 to beyond years , you are silly and not realistic in thinking so . Believe what you want , STO and I have a active account to this game ("F2P now btw") took time for the stuff it has , I compare TOR to it all the time as it is ran almost the same in content point of view. STO has player created content like SWG but it doesn't reply on it as there is alot of story in STO. I got my RA in a Week and had fun doing it . Love my ship and love my character . I would not want TOR to be like STO and the other way around . Thats me though !

 

 

 

Bioware have been kind of lazy on the content given to us on launch day yes i understand there alot to program in planet wise but they had 4 years and have alot better technology than wow did 7 or so years ago.

TOR has Endgame , it has a PvP system but people rely on WarZones instead of going to PvP zones , it has Flashpoints and operations . Your probably maybe you have no Endgame Guild, I dont have one either but I still manage to get groups .

 

By the way i dont mean ohh hundreds of raids and flashpoints tor gave us enough i mean eg no fishing in game no swimming in game, Not being able to sit or interact with many social objects such as seats or even lay down on beds. Ships cant even be upgraded looks wise and the fact that tor has a loading screen just about as long as an average sized patch takes to load up is a joke and i got a pretty fast broadband and an alienware laptop.

TOR has a year of content coming to us every month and so on for the next year, you can't have it all in 1 day. To be honest I see the same things you post on every new MMO since forum communities became important to games .

 

Also fact that tor came out and game us an instanced style gameplay which doesnt work really amuses me for example this game has instances so i could be on corelia one and my gf on corelia 2 when it should have been done how age of conans was where it gave us 1 instance when that was becoming full it autmactially opened another instance up so the first instance didnt lag and also the fact that people could switch about. Also i dont see why the game doesnt get rid of instancing since the main story lines are phased so people cant gank while there and camps are pretty much unattackable since there are big nasty droids destroying people.

STO has instances gameplay and that is what it relies on fulltime for gameplay, I mean it was said TOR was going to do this and you just must have no read anything before rushing to get the game .

 

3rd TOR hasnt even added in anything for guilds yet which is disapointing expecially after the pre beta guild creating and making allies and it always seems to want to load a new area for example i complete say Hutta then i need to go to shuttle i then have to load a new screen for imperial fleet docking bay then head to lift then another screen for lift to transport me why its dum they should be able to change that.

Guild stuff is coming , stuff takes time and no game honestly had great guild content at launch , not even GUILD wars lol

 

So long story straight if i had choice of SWG after the combat change over tor id take swg since i preferd it and hate LA for forcing swg to close.

It wasn't forced Closed because LA was trying to be evil, it was closed because they couldn't aford to be blind with teh profits it was not bringing in and how much it cost to keep it open.

LA sold rights to Bioware 5 years before SWG closed and SOE knew the whole time and did not warn you guys until the months before close. Heck SOE even denied SWG was ever going to close . You might want to ask why is that. I will tell you , they wanted to make some more money off it before it closed . If they would have told you guys 5 years ago , you might have all left and left a remander of 1k to 5 whole people . 10k players paying 15 a month is still worth 150k a month . It did not pay the cost for servers and hense why server transfers were 50 dollars to do.

 

Have a good night playing TOR , I know I will

[Kaoci]

Have a good night playing TOR , I know I will

 

1 i aint a terrible gamer since i find tor easy i was giving examples and ill read rest tomorrow but not all games are theme park in the MMO Business out of the mmos i played and i played a few they all been sandbox

[Aximand]

The fact that the Original Poster called the people defending TOR the "Biodrone defense force":

 

Finally someone with some sense posted here, damn Biodrone defense force is trying to ruin what could be a great discussion.

 

^Proof^Proof^Proof^Proof^Proof^Proof^Proof^Proof^

 

Already says that this thread was meant as nothing more than another "Bash TOR because I'm unhappy" thread.

Edited March 23, 2012 by Aximand

[Dedd]

They'd just have to make sure to avoid putting in the learning curve that EVE has, that pushes a lot of people away.

 

EVE has an easier learning curve than it used to and even before all that it wasn't that hard, you just followed the starter missions, unfortunately quite a few people decide to ignore those.

 

Leading to questions such as 'how do i fly my ship'

 

As for SWTOR & SWG .. I played SWG for god knows how long, had 2 cities and I think in the end crafting took up a good deal of my time which surprised me, I turned out to be quite good at supplying craft parts to the guild and friends. In return i got a bit of cash and help in space

 

From what I've seen of SWTOR so far (beta, headstart until now) SWG had a much better community even after all the fantastic changes they gave us ;-)

 

Sure the graphics were not as good but hell, I play Anarchy Online still sometimes and SWG graphics beat that. A game is not just graphics .. it needs a community as well and I mean SERVER community not GUILD.

 

Apologies if the caps offend anyone but a guild is a community sure but it's segregated from the whole .. SWTOR communtity seems to be in just guilds, general chat is pretty bare. That needs to be rectified because new players are just going to see 'Hutta 4' for example and just NPC chat with the rare pc chat even in double figures.

 

At the time it is set i'm sure they would have more than planet wide ability for chat ;-)

[Aximand]

EVE has an easier learning curve than it used to and even before all that it wasn't that hard, you just followed the starter missions, unfortunately quite a few people decide to ignore those.

 

Leading to questions such as 'how do i fly my ship'

 

As for SWTOR & SWG .. I played SWG for god knows how long, had 2 cities and I think in the end crafting took up a good deal of my time which surprised me, I turned out to be quite good at supplying craft parts to the guild and friends. In return i got a bit of cash and help in space

 

From what I've seen of SWTOR so far (beta, headstart until now) SWG had a much better community even after all the fantastic changes they gave us ;-)

 

Sure the graphics were not as good but hell, I play Anarchy Online still sometimes and SWG graphics beat that. A game is not just graphics .. it needs a community as well and I mean SERVER community not GUILD.

 

Apologies if the caps offend anyone but a guild is a community sure but it's segregated from the whole .. SWTOR communtity seems to be in just guilds, general chat is pretty bare. That needs to be rectified because new players are just going to see 'Hutta 4' for example and just NPC chat with the rare pc chat even in double figures.

 

At the time it is set i'm sure they would have more than planet wide ability for chat ;-)

 

One thing about community people need to realize is that it takes time to build up. I'm starting to see that on Canderous Ordo a little bit, people are starting to call out to each other on the Fleet, players are starting to recognize each other in Warzones a lot more, grudges and rivalries are starting to form a bit. I honestly think the only thing that could make it more prevalent is if BioWare opened up specific server forums (Have they already?) to individual servers. Server communities don't form over night, they need to mature and grow.

Edited March 23, 2012 by Aximand

[Aurrelio]

Hi there.

 

After removing a great many off-topic and otherwise inappropriate posts, this thread has been re-opened. Those wishing to continue participating in this discussion should review the forum Rules of Conduct if necessary. The Rules of Conduct are available here:

 

http://www.swtor.com/legalnotices/rulesofconduct

 

Please be aware that if this discussion proves itself unable to continue civilly and constructively, this thread could potentially be closed. With that in mind, if you feel a particular community member is trolling, please report that member's posts using the "Flag" feature, rather than responding rudely to him/her.

 

Please keep further participation in this discussion constructive, relevant, and on-topic.

 

Thank you for your understanding and cooperation in this matter.

[sharpeclaws]

I was an avid SWG player for 7 years, but given the lack of development on the game in terms of graphics immersion, I would not go back if SOE opened the game again for free!

 

To me SWTOR is pretty much everything I would have expected from a SWG 2, with the minor addition of the KOTOR style UI.

 

I too played SWG for a long time. The Combat upgrade ruined the game followed by the iconic crap. This game has great potential, but if you take the current graphics with the original SWG game play this game would be truely beast. I like this game don't get me wrong, but it could improve to a more free style game where crafting is more important feature. A hard core grinder had to spend alot of money buying new gear when thier stuff broke from wear and tear of battle. That made crafters important part of the economy. Man I hated it sometimes searching for the best materials sometimes for hours to get the best hauls, but it was worth the time in the quality gear that was made and was needed for true grinders. Man I missed the raids of PVP on Dant and Naboo where hundreds of players would flag and beat on each other all weekend. This game will improve Im sure we just have tio give it sometime.

[Dedd]

One thing about community people need to realize is that it takes time to build up. I'm starting to see that on Canderous Ordo a little bit, people are starting to call out to each other on the Fleet, players are starting to recognize each other in Warzones a lot more, grudges and rivalries are starting to form a bit. I honestly think the only thing that could make it more prevalent is if BioWare opened up specific server forums (Have they already?) to individual servers. Server communities don't form over night, they need to mature and grow.

 

Not really, in beta you could join and get into chat instantly .. every beta i've been in the best community has infact been during beta testing, waned a bit in headstart then the game was released ... lol

 

But if it picks up then great

[Aximand]

Not really, in beta you could join and get into chat instantly .. every beta i've been in the best community has infact been during beta testing, waned a bit in headstart then the game was released ... lol

 

But if it picks up then great

 

Beta is an extremely, extremely small community, especially TOR's beta community since they let way less people in than pretty much any other MMO in history relative to the size of the market. Compared to the number of people playing now, the players that actually tested the game is a drop in the ocean, its just not comparable. Of course a community is going to grow faster when you only have around a thousand people to talk to at any one time as compared to a million and a half.

[Dedd]

Beta is an extremely, extremely small community, especially TOR's beta community since they let way less people in than pretty much any other MMO in history relative to the size of the market. Compared to the number of people playing now, the players that actually tested the game is a drop in the ocean, its just not comparable. Of course a community is going to grow faster when you only have around a thousand people to talk to at any one time as compared to a million and a half.

 

So you should see more people talking in chat .. now that there are so many more than in beta when it was thousands

[Aximand]

So you should see more people talking in chat .. now that there are so many more than in beta when it was thousands

 

People talking in chat doesn't mean that its a community, that's just mindless chatter and trolling for the most part. I don't know what its like on your server, but the chat boxes on Canderous are almost never idle during peak hours and surprisingly little of it is "your mom" or Chuck Norris jokes.

Edited March 23, 2012 by Aximand

[dazednconfuzed]

One thing I most sorely miss from SWG was the community. That game had a very strong sense of community, which gave rise to much more world-PVP and social interaction. I have a theory as to why, and it has to do with the underlying systems involved.

 

In the structure of SWG, you had a sense of ownership. My town, my house, my ship, my character. The reason you had the sense of ownership is because you had to work to get these things. You had to drop the credits, know the right people, or spend the time gathering the resources to build these things yourself.

 

With the advent of cities, came a stronger community structure over-top of the interdependency that already existed between players (Remember primarily that you were limited to 1 and later only 2 characters per server). People would buy their gear from other players, gets buffs from entertainers and doctors, etc..

 

In TOR it's very different. There's really no sense of community and zero incentive to form one. It's little more than a directionless mob of individuals as opposed to a focused community. The occasional guild forms, sure, but that's where it ends. There's no sense of ownership because no work was involved in acquiring the virtual property.

 

Now on to world PVP and the sense of ownership. The theory I have there is the psychology of the players and the events that are presented. It's one thing if the Imperial Fleet/Orgrimmar is attacked (As an example). Most would simply say "Not my problem."

 

It's another if it were one of the player cities on SWG. It goes from "Not my problem" to "Hell no, that's my neighborhood!"

 

When you create a sense of ownership of virtual property and community through the game's structure, you create a psychological need to defend said property.

 

Well said, little green guy (or blue as the case may be).

 

The community in SWG was amazing, and it did lead on to some brilliant moments, both PvE and PvP. Does no-one else remember the 20 man groups hunting Krayt Dragons?

[Aximand]

Well said, little green guy (or blue as the case may be).

 

The community in SWG was amazing, and it did lead on to some brilliant moments, both PvE and PvP. Does no-one else remember the 20 man groups hunting Krayt Dragons?

 

That's not really an amazing example of community, to be honest. That happens in all MMO's that have a world boss of some fashion. I could tell you stories of groups of eighty people or more storming capital cities or grouping together to take down world bosses in Vanilla WoW. That's not community, that's just the desire to **** **** up on a massive scale.

Edited March 23, 2012 by Aximand

[dazednconfuzed]

That's not really an amazing example of community, to be honest. That happens in all MMO's that have a world boss of some fashion. I could tell you stories of groups of eighty people or more storming capital cities or grouping together to take down world bosses in Vanilla WoW. That's not community, that's just the desire to **** **** up on a massive scale.

 

No, no, I know what you are saying, and I agree with you. It's just every time I think of the SWG community, I also think about the excellent PUG groups I was in for various things. Although I never joined a group of 80, I was also part of massive groups in WoW for storming the capital cities.

 

I think what helped the community in SWG was the fact that if you wanted to be able to understand each other, you needed to have someone teach you how to understand a language. If you wanted to learn a new skill, your best option was for a fellow player to teach you. At times, this even led to people having an ongoing Master/Apprentice type relationship. If you needed new gear, you went to a player. If you were selling gear, you sold to a player. Just about everything in that game revolved around community, and that is what made for a great community

[Aximand]

No, no, I know what you are saying, and I agree with you. It's just every time I think of the SWG community, I also think about the excellent PUG groups I was in for various things. Although I never joined a group of 80, I was also part of massive groups in WoW for storming the capital cities.

 

I think what helped the community in SWG was the fact that if you wanted to be able to understand each other, you needed to have someone teach you how to understand a language. If you wanted to learn a new skill, your best option was for a fellow player to teach you. At times, this even led to people having an ongoing Master/Apprentice type relationship. If you needed new gear, you went to a player. If you were selling gear, you sold to a player. Just about everything in that game revolved around community, and that is what made for a great community

 

That's a much better example than hunting Krayt Dragons.

 

Though most of the time I see people complaining about the lack of social interaction in TOR, I can't help but ask if they've tried to interact with other people. One thing that TOR did right, I think, is that they don't force you to do anything with other people, its completely option on all fronts. If someone wants to be social, the tools are all there, you just need to learn to use them.