Delavager Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 Some clueless CSR (who is not the devs) said so. Since it was fixed, it was obviously UNINTENDED BY THE DEVELOPERS, the definition of an exploit. Rationalize more. This will be fixed eventually too. And the only "whiny, sniveling, moron" at that point will be you. Why do you think this is an exploit? Instead of just saying "It's an exploit"...say "It's an exploit because..." Everybody saying "It's an exploit and will be changed" is just blowing smoke up ppls's *****es. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunslinger Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 I will be utilizing this from the defender side now that I know it is possible. with the sprint buff on the defender side, I can get across and help defend better if I can get respawned and into the fight before the attackers can get the force fields down. question: can the door be planted if the force fields are still up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 (edited) Why do you think this is an exploit? Instead of just saying "It's an exploit"...say "It's an exploit because..." Everybody saying "It's an exploit and will be changed" is just blowing smoke up ppls's *****es. Two specific classes can circumvent an entire section of the stage and jump cap with no available counter. Leap classes are a different story. A Guardian can only jump the gap if there's someone on the other side to jump onto. Which means they can't simply run over to a door and cap - they have to deal with the person they leapt to. In this case, Inq/Consulars can jump the bridge and cap the next door while people are still stuck in the spawn, which circumvents the timing mechanics Bioware designed for the spawn point. It should take >20 seconds for someone to lower the bridge and place a bomb on the next door, and as such, the spawn door has a timer about that long. (A Guardian jumping over, killing the person they jumped to, then placing a bomb takes at least this long as well) This ruins that timing. It's pretty obvious that it is an exploit. Use some common sense. Edited February 21, 2012 by EternalFinality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khadroth Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 question: can the door be planted if the force fields are still up? Yes. Honestly this isn't an exploit because you still have to solo defend the bomb for 20 seconds, GL with that given that anyone who dies will be respawning over there or already waiting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 Yes. Honestly this isn't an exploit because you still have to solo defend the bomb for 20 seconds, GL with that given that anyone who dies will be respawning over there or already waiting. It takes you ~12 seconds to jump the gap, grab the speed buff, run to a door, and place a bomb. It takes 10 seconds for the people behind you to lower the bridge. They'll be there by the time you have to deal with people from the spawn. A shadow would just stealth and interrupt at the last moment, and a Sorc can bubble, spam dots, interrupt from range and go for the health around the corner. Easy to defend even for a short while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunslinger Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 Yes. Honestly this isn't an exploit because you still have to solo defend the bomb for 20 seconds, GL with that given that anyone who dies will be respawning over there or already waiting. yeah, i figured it would have to be really bad luck if the defenders who are respawning get the absolute worst gate timing to be unable to either interrupt or reverse the plant. heck, there are multiple options even in a 1v1 setup to give yourself enough time to disarm. e.g.- hit your stun, make them use stun break. then hit your longer stun and disarm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khadroth Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 It takes you ~12 seconds to jump the gap, grab the speed buff, run to a door, and place a bomb. It takes 10 seconds for the people behind you to lower the bridge. They'll be there by the time you have to deal with people from the spawn. A shadow would just stealth and interrupt at the last moment, and a Sorc can bubble, spam dots, interrupt from range and go for the health around the corner. Easy to defend even for a short while. If so then it's wellplayed and luckily timed. Otherwise you're operating under the assumpion that there's nothing stopping anyone from extending the bridge (in which case the gap jump really didn't matter as it's now the same as a stealth tap), and that no one is waiting or ready to defend on the other side. Personally I know the few times I've seen it happen... I SAW IT HAPPEN, and thus know to defend the doors and say something in chat. Even if that is the case, are you calling it an exploit when you can drop the shields and arm the bomb on the 3rd area before the respawn gate opens? It's the same deal, you're just angry that someone can plant the bomb faster than your team's failure to react. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 yeah, i figured it would have to be really bad luck if the defenders who are respawning get the absolute worst gate timing to be unable to either interrupt or reverse the plant. heck, there are multiple options even in a 1v1 setup to give yourself enough time to disarm. e.g.- hit your stun, make them use stun break. then hit your longer stun and disarm. This is what actually happens: You plant the bomb, back away from the door a bit (if you're ranged). 5 people drop from the spawn, turn left. You interrupt the first person going for the door, then get stunned and/or cc'd by 4 people at once, instantly filling resolve. You use your CC breaker and defensive cooldowns and hold the door until help arrives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 (edited) If so then it's wellplayed and luckily timed. Otherwise you're operating under the assumpion that there's nothing stopping anyone from extending the bridge (in which case the gap jump really didn't matter as it's now the same as a stealth tap), and that no one is waiting or ready to defend on the other side. Personally I know the few times I've seen it happen... I SAW IT HAPPEN, and thus know to defend the doors and say something in chat. Even if that is the case, are you calling it an exploit when you can drop the shields and arm the bomb on the 3rd area before the respawn gate opens? It's the same deal, you're just angry that someone can plant the bomb faster than your team's failure to react. A REALLY pro exploit team wouldn't kill anyone after the first door and just delay while they jump the gap and plant the bomb without the defenders being able to get over there in time at all. Unless the defenders had their own exploit gap jumpers follow. And it's not the same deal with the third door, because if you die soon after the second door opens you are guaranteed to get out of the spawn in time. What happens is that if they don't kill anyone for a while as someone is lowering the force fields, then start killing people the timing may work out. That's strategy (or luck). With the gap jump you screw the timing on the second door. Someone who dies right after the door comes down and spawns in the second room can be locked in while someone jumps the gap. Edited February 21, 2012 by EternalFinality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khadroth Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 A REALLY pro exploit team wouldn't kill anyone after the first door and just delay while they jump the gap and plant the bomb without the defenders being able to get over there in time at all. Unless the defenders had their own exploit gap jumpers follow. And it's not the same deal with the third door, because if you die soon after the second door opens you are guaranteed to get out of the spawn in time. What happens is that if they don't kill anyone for a while as someone is lowering the force fields, then start killing people the timing may work out. That's strategy (or luck). With the gap jump you screw the timing on the second door. Someone who dies right after the door comes down and spawns in the second room can be locked in while someone jumps the gap. If they dominate you in such a way then you were going to lose anyways. I mean seriously? They somehow all coordinate to stop you but not kill you while 1 guy goes and perfectly nails the jump without any interference. Yea you were seriously outgeared and outcoordinated. With that logic, using rescue on someone in the pit to score is clearly pro-exploitation too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirolos Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 A REALLY pro exploit team wouldn't kill anyone after the first door and just delay while they jump the gap and plant the bomb without the defenders being able to get over there in time at all. . That sounds like a great disney movie you watched.. Can i borrow it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainInsano Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 Some people (read: Assassins who are exploiting this oversight) will defend anything. There's no way it's fair for 1 class to have the ability to circumvent an entire Warzone mechanic. The speed buff was placed on the defender's side, which meant BW intended for 1 defender to be able to jump back after dying and stall for a bit longer on the bridge. At least the leap classes have to have someone to jump to in order to cross the gap, which means they have to kill someone before planting the bomb. An Assassin/Shadow who can stealth makes the entire match cheese when they do this and puts the other team at the mercy of spawn times (if they even die). It's also trivial for an Inquisitor to defend a bomb plant for a few seconds if they absolutely have to to ensure a cap. Not exactly compelling competitive gameplay and it will be changed just like the Huttball spawn pulling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 That sounds like a great disney movie you watched.. Can i borrow it? Speed 4 - Voidstar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khadroth Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 Some people (read: Assassins who are exploiting this oversight) will defend anything. There's no way it's fair for 1 class to have the ability to circumvent an entire Warzone mechanic. The speed buff was placed on the defender's side, which meant BW intended for 1 defender to be able to jump back after dying and stall for a bit longer on the bridge. At least the leap classes have to have someone to jump to in order to cross the gap, which means they have to kill someone before planting the bomb. An Assassin/Shadow who can stealth makes the entire match cheese when they do this and puts the other team at the mercy of spawn times (if they even die). It's also trivial for an Inquisitor to defend a bomb plant for a few seconds if they absolutely have to to ensure a cap. Not exactly compelling competitive gameplay and it will be changed just like the Huttball spawn pulling. Except that he can't circumvent the entire Warzone mechanic... It's completely preventable, so if it happens it's your fault for letting it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 (edited) If they dominate you in such a way then you were going to lose anyways. I mean seriously? They somehow all coordinate to stop you but not kill you while 1 guy goes and perfectly nails the jump without any interference. Yea you were seriously outgeared and outcoordinated. With that logic, using rescue on someone in the pit to score is clearly pro-exploitation too. As the video has shown us - it's not hard to jump the gap. Any old Sorc or Assassin can do it, and there's no shortage of those. It's completely preventable No. No it's not. It's just as preventable as pulling people onto the Huttball ledge. Edited February 21, 2012 by EternalFinality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khadroth Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 As the video has shown us - it's not hard to jump the gap. Any old Sorc or Assassin can do it, and there's no shortage of those. No. No it's not. It's just as preventable as pulling people onto the Huttball ledge. Rofl, you can not do it at will, it requires a good deal of timing luck. I've tried it a multitude of times myself, sometimes it works, sometimes it fails, but the vast majority of the time I'm interfered with by someone with half a brain. And even in the off chance I do make it across there's generally someone waiting unless i pulled it off in the first 5 or so seconds of making it to the bridge area. Seriously, show me a scenario in which it's completely unpreventable. The only way is if the person is far ahead of the enemy team, which means the enemy team is getting schooled anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirolos Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 Seriously, show me a scenario in which it's completely unpreventable. The only way is if the person is far ahead of the enemy team, which means the enemy team is getting schooled anyways. Or they are a bunch of bads playing team death match in the hallway.. I hate it when my team does that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khadroth Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 Or they are a bunch of bads playing team death match in the hallway.. I hate it when my team does that Which also means they aren't stopping the bridge tap, clearly an exploit too lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olagaton Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 (edited) Actually it is preventable. Very easily, actually. I try to jump across all the time on my toons. When I'm on defense, I nullify that strategy very easily. To those thinking it's an exploit, use your brains to figure out how to stop a legitimate strategy before crying wolf. Calling this use of an Inquisitor/Counselor skill an exploit is just like calling healing an exploit, or DPS for healer/dps classes. Edited February 21, 2012 by olagaton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 Rofl, you can not do it at will, it requires a good deal of timing luck. I've tried it a multitude of times myself, sometimes it works, sometimes it fails, but the vast majority of the time I'm interfered with by someone with half a brain. So you have a bad computer and can't make simple platform maneuvers. K. Got it. And even in the off chance I do make it across there's generally someone waiting unless i pulled it off in the first 5 or so seconds of making it to the bridge area. Just watch the video. Run straight down, dash, jump, bomb. I don't even need to draw up a hypothetical situation. The evidence speaks for itself. Seriously, show me a scenario in which it's completely unpreventable. The only way is if the person is far ahead of the enemy team, which means the enemy team is getting schooled anyways. Not true, people typically group by the door with the bomb on it, so just go down the door on the other side. I do it all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khadroth Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 (edited) So you have a bad computer and can't make simple platform maneuvers. K. Got it. Like I said, I've done it. But you can't do it every time, if you think/claim you can, you're flat out lying. Just watch the video. Run straight down, dash, jump, bomb. I don't even need to draw up a hypothetical situation. The evidence speaks for itself. The evidence showing how it could have been easily prevented? Are you trying to prove my point for me? K. Got it. Not true, people typically group by the door with the bomb on it, so just go down the door on the other side. I do it all the time. Not true, you still have to move to the middle to make the jump, it's entirely preventable. And if it's so easy to do just what you describe, why didn't you just tap the bridge control and remove the chance of fall death from the equation? You're now making a case for winning tactics rather than making it sound like an exploit lol. Edited February 21, 2012 by Khadroth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gryhmr Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 They jumped the gap. Its not an exploit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 (edited) Not true, you still have to move to the middle to make the jump, it's entirely preventable. How many voidstar games have you played? The side with the people on it is a cluster**** of aoe, slows, and CC. I'll make it to the middle before anyone gets down the hallway on the other side easily. And if it's so easy to do just what you describe, why didn't you just tap the bridge control and remove the chance of fall death from the equation? The whole point of jumping the gap is SPEED. Why wait 10 more seconds when I can exploit to skip it? Edited February 21, 2012 by EternalFinality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khadroth Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 (edited) How many voidstar games have you played? The side with the people on it is a cluster**** of aoe, slows, and CC. I'll make it to the middle before anyone gets down the hallway on the other side easily. Again what's to stop anyone from doing just that and tapping the bridge? You know it's a perfectly legitimate tactic. If no one's there, then congrats, the other team is fail. The whole point of jumping the gap is SPEED. Why wait 10 more seconds when I can exploit to skip it? Because you might fail, it's a risk/reward scenario requiring a perfect storm of conditions, not an exploit. Edited February 21, 2012 by Khadroth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yukirshiro Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 (edited) It's bad game design. But it looks like it's intentional with the placement of the speed buff on the defender's side. I think the sad truth is that BW's zone designers are actually so clueless they didn't know BW's class designers gave a class a sprint ability. So they figured they had found a clever way to let the defenders get back without the attackers being able to jump the gap. More evidence BW PVP designers have no clue at all. edit: Or just all play sorcs. Given how they seemingly intentionally allowed sorcs all sorts of class-specific huttball advantages, too. Edited February 21, 2012 by yukirshiro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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